ArmyBengal Posted March 19, 2023 Report Share Posted March 19, 2023 The CBA doesn’t forbid fully guaranteed contracts (Duh Watson) but it also doesn’t demand them either. Teams have the ability to decide for themselves if they want to or not. Right now, they decide they don’t want to. While I agree collusion occurs and it may very well be happening here to a degree, there’s nothing saying they have to hand him what he’s looking for. There are plenty of free agents that have high contract demands that don’t get met. Is it collusion that no one has signed the safety from the Eagles or is that fucker just asking too much and the teams are passing? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 19, 2023 Report Share Posted March 19, 2023 2 hours ago, COB said: Kaepernick was the most egregious example of collusion. By demanding a fully guaranteed deal Lamar has handed the owners just enough for them to have plausible deniability. The owners couldn’t even deny it with Kaepernick. They quietly paid him off. If I were Lamar’s agent I’d target several teams, wait until there is a week left in his offer window, then notify them I’ve moved off fully guaranteed deal, let the offers roll in. I’d also let the Ravens know you’d better not match it, I have no interest or intent to play in Baltimore ever again. He’ll end up with the second most guaranteed money ever (behind Watson), and with enough money that he won’t even know what to do with it all. To sun it all up, more than anything, Lamar just needs an agent. Kaepernick was also a complete tool bag that wanted to be an activist more than a football player. He turned down contracts offers and completely didn’t think through his approach in taking a stand for something he believed in. I fucking hate that guy. HATE… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COB Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 The safety we wanted from Philly, Gardner-Johnson, signed with Detroit, 1 year, 8 million. The Lions trying to challenge our status as the regional capital of the prove-it deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 There was something going on in that Ravens organization this past year. I think Lamar tanked. No matter how you view it the past 2 years the Bengals have played 3 games vs. Ravens with playoffs or season on the line and all 3 featured a back up QB. I'm surprised a team hasn't been rumored to be preparing an offer sheet but if they are calling Lamar and being told 100% or nothing then I can see why that process doesn't go very far. Also with the right to match, some teams maybe leary of doing the Ravens work for them. The biggest legal term would be bid rigging or suppression but there's a number of teams that have QBs already and there are a number of 1st round QBs. Then you had competition from other NFL vet QBs. So its kinda hard to say that's what is happening. With 2 first round picks plus huge contract being the price to enter. Plus the Raven could just match. Plus Lamar tanked (IMO). There's 3-5 first round QBs. Aaron Rodgers and Derek Car that have several things over Lamar. Of course Aaron Rodgers is kinda goofy and old so I'm not sure why the Jets aren't taking a look at Jackson. I hope he plays on that tag or holds out. Creates a bunch of drama this entire season for them. Leaves and the Ravens get pennies on the dollar for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 So it got me wondering about each team and their QB situation. By "set" I'm thinking they either have their guy or wouldn't move on from what they have. AFC East- Bills and Dolphins are set. The Pats have Mac Jones they won't give up on right now (I think they should) and the Jets are going after Rodgers. I wouldn't guess either the Pats or Jets would give 2 first rounders. AFC North- Outside of the Ravens, everyone else is set. AFC South- Titans and Jags are set. Both the Texans and Colts are looking for a QB, but are sitting at the top of the pecking order to get one (#2 and #4). Question is, do they feel the draft is the better way to go considering you can get a QB for 5 years on the cheap and not give up a single pick to do it, let alone first round picks? I'm guessing the draft there. AFC West- Chiefs, Chargers and Broncos are set and the Raiders just got Garappolo. So no one I'm assuming. NFC East- Eagles, Cowboys and Giants are set, with the Commanders being in play and picking #16, but from all accounts are hurting from a cap space concern. That may have or will change. Plus that front office is a fucking nightmare that is looking to sell the team. NFC North- I don't think the Bears and Vikings are moving off of Fields and Cousins respectively (I could be wrong). Goff is signed with the Lions through 2024. Will the Packers go with Love after Rodgers leaves. I'm guessing yes. NFC South- The Saints and Falcons appear set to roll with Carr and Ridder respectively. The Falcons seem ok with Mayfield as their week one starter. The Panthers just traded up to #1 so we know how that ends... QB. NFC West- I don't think any of these teams (49er's, Seahawks, Rams and Cardinals) are moving off of their starters. So, by the way I'm looking at this I would say there are 2-5 teams total who actually "might" consider this with the Commanders leading the way. That's kind of slim pickings for Jackson. The points about giving up 2 first rounders, paying him top of the market, cap space concerns, and the Ravens being able to match are all really good considerations. That's why I don't really see the collusion aspect of things. Teams simply don't move off the starters they have invested time and money into very often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 That the falcons are “set” (per the falcons) with Ridder is lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 McKinnon - is a RB I would like the Bengals to pursue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 6 minutes ago, membengal said: That the falcons are “set” (per the falcons) with Ridder is lol. Oh don't get me wrong Mem. I'm only talking about what the teams appear to be doing or saying. It has nothing to do with what I would want as a fan. Again, there are more factors involved then simply saying a team should do this or that. Salary cap implications in the time of the rookie wage scale are huge. The Bengals have benefitted MASSIVELY by not having to pay Burrow these last few years. It allows teams to continue building around their QB for years to come without giving up the farm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 The what they are doing or saying would be the collusion part, army. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 Falcons at first glance seem like a good fit for Lamar and maybe he is. However they have 81m under in 2024 with 43 players signed. Not sure if they have any major players to extend but in comparison we know the Bengals are facing a tough 2024 off season with $109m under with just 29 signed. However that includes $29m for Joe Burrow (they assume his 5th option) so that's a huge benefit. Falcons will have to find or work around the cap for Jackson that should be in the $40-50m range per year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 22 minutes ago, membengal said: The what they are doing or saying would be the collusion part, army. No. That's not collusion. Collusion is a majority of owners regardless of QB situation get together and decided only X percent or less guaranteed should be offered. The fact the Browns already have given 100% and the Vikings too. Shoot down any thought of collusion league wide. The reason for this is simply the CBA process. As Army pointed out there are multiple teams with legit reasons why they would not contact Lamar Jackson and his individual "bid" requirements. There have been new QB contracts that didn't have his requirement. Carr, Jones, didn't require 100% guarantees. As far as we know Burrow isn't asking for it either. Collusion isn't based on your opinion of the Atlanta Falcons QB situation or hierarchy of league QBs. As I have pointed out the Bengals projected cap room has X amount already ear marked for Burrow where as a new mega deal for Jackson on any team other than the Ravens would have to figure a way to deal with it. That is a major factor in determining pursuit of Jackson not even factoring draft capital and Lamar's problems. It looks like he can't stay healthy or IMO he quit on his team. He doesn't read defenses all that great and doesn't have great touch on his throws. Lou when Lamar dares play against the Bengals dares him to throw it. There's a bunch a reasons why you want Lamar Jackson to QB your team and there's a bunch of reason's why you don't want to lock into him 100% no way out. I would love to see Jackson to return to Baltimore with a chip on his shoulder and they get away from his strengths. Over a 17 game season he isn't a Joe Burrow or whatever high end passer you want to compare him to. Everyone can see that. Lamar Jackson is a beast to deal with when he's running. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 Scharping resigned. With Ford in the fold there's going to competition for depth at those interior spots. What do they usually keep 10 total? 4 tackles, 2 true centers, 4 guards? Bengals are putting in 2 former 2nd round picks to compete for back up roles. Not bad, IMO, entering TC. There's probably a few teams that have Scharping's penciled in as starters starting TC. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted March 20, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 21 minutes ago, AMPHAR said: Scharping resigned. Championship! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stripes Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 1 hour ago, AMPHAR said: No. That's not collusion. Collusion is a majority of owners regardless of QB situation get together and decided only X percent or less guaranteed should be offered. The fact the Browns already have given 100% and the Vikings too. Shoot down any thought of collusion league wide. The reason for this is simply the CBA process. Two teams out of 32 teams do not disprove collusion when your own definition calls for a "majority". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 33 minutes ago, Stripes said: Two teams out of 32 teams do not disprove collusion when your own definition calls for a "majority". yet 1 QB doesn't get 100% guarantee contact the league is colluding? There's no need to disprove it. Vikings/Browns show he wasn't available at the right time for those bidders. If a mandate was given why didn't they follow? This does not include any consideration of the Franchise Tag requirement which the players accept in their CBA. There is also no reasonable expectation that QBs should expect 100% guaranteed contracts. There are recent deals without those players asking for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 11 minutes ago, Stripes said: Two teams out of 32 teams do not disprove collusion when your own definition calls for a "majority". The silence and outright refusal to talk to a TWENTY FIVE YEAR OLD ONE TIME QB MVP is deafening. Lamar Jackson isn't even worth talking to, if you are the Falcons, or Lions, or Colts, or Texans,, or Jets, or Bucs, or before they signed JimmyG, the Raiders? Really, NOT EVEN A CALL? Okey dokey. This is gonna be the easiest collusion case ever. It is clearly orchestrated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 12 minutes ago, membengal said: The silence and outright refusal to talk to a TWENTY FIVE YEAR OLD ONE TIME QB MVP is deafening. Lamar Jackson isn't even worth talking to, if you are the Falcons, or Lions, or Colts, or Texans,, or Jets, or Bucs, or before they signed JimmyG, the Raiders? Really, NOT EVEN A CALL? Okey dokey. This is gonna be the easiest collusion case ever. It is clearly orchestrated. lol, deafening. So top 5 drafting teams should be offering up that pick + plus another one + $50m per year or its colluding? Okey dokey, lol. WTF? Again your opinion on individual team's QB situation or the league's hierarchy of QBs doesn't suggest collusion the fact you included top 5 drafting teams shows how weak the point is and how strong Army's original point was. Anyway. Bengals signed Scharping. No collusion for guards. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 2 hours ago, membengal said: The what they are doing or saying would be the collusion part, army. My point in that is, for example... The Falcons are saying they are good with Ridder. While I think they are crazy personally for taking that approach, there may be more reasons for saying that than simply because they are pushing back against guaranteed contracts. I also acknowledge that could be the case. However, the Falcons did invest a 3rd round pick in him and it isn't like the guy is a total bust at this point in starting 4 games. If they want to (I guess they would) try to build around him, they wouldn't in and of itself, be wrong. They do have cap space to add a contract of Jackson's like. Maybe that's simply not their philosophy in giving up the picks, as they want to build through the draft and 2 first rounders are big. Also, if they are going to put in all this work to get him, what's it going to take for the Ravens to not match that deal? If the Ravens decide to match, now they have a QB that may be pissed (like Williams) in trying to bring in someone to take his job. That lets Ridder know how they feel about him. All that being said, I think they would crazy to NOT consider Jackson, but my thoughts aren't a consideration. That and I have no idea how the Falcons approach shit. Again, I'm not saying it's not collusion. I'm saying there are many reasons outside of that, which would keep a team from pulling the trigger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJJackson Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 I hope someday that Perine and Bell explain why they chose to leave for such relativly small contacts on teams with no playoff prospects, when they could have had the same pay here with better prospects Bates I get Hurst I sorta get Not Perine or Bell really bummed about these two, and Hurst Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 From all accounts, Perine wanted a change of scenery. Maybe he likes mountain views and smoking weed legally in the off season ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJJackson Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 I think thats a media answer.....I dont think its the actual answer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 Maybe he thinks Joe Burrow is a dick ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted March 20, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 16 minutes ago, TJJackson said: I hope someday that Perine and Bell explain why they chose to leave for such relativly small contacts on teams with no playoff prospects, when they could have had the same pay here with better prospects Bates I get Hurst I sorta get Not Perine or Bell really bummed about these two, and Hurst "Small" is relative. Perine is a 28-year-old RB who after seven years in the league had made a total of about $4.6 million. Not a year. Total lifetime earnings to date. Last year's one-year deal in Cincy was actually his first contract that was (just) over $1 million. Winning is nice, but a 28-year-old RB isn't long for the league. Denver offered him $3 million guaranteed, plus $1.5 million in salary this year. So he is set to double his lifetime earnings in a single season. And if he sticks for 2024 he collects another $3 million. Not a hard choice. Same is true for Bell re age. 29 years old, likely his last chance for a big bite at the apple and Caroline comes calling with $13 million guaranteed and $22.5 million overall. You may call that small but he's the 21st-highest paid safety in the league now, so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted March 20, 2023 Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 Bengals had $4.5m on the table for Perine? $7m for Hurst? I would find that surprising considering they let CJ walk last year for a slightly more amount and cut Gio with about the same amount. My guess is Bell and Pratt were earmarked for the same amount and it came down to who wanted it first then the Bengals planned to back fill whatever spot that was open for less. Denver/Panthers have playoff prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted March 20, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2023 18 minutes ago, ArmyBengal said: Maybe he thinks Joe Burrow is a dick ?? He is absolutely Big Dick Joe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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