ArmyBengal Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 I have felt the same way about Higgins. If they are thinking they are competing for the Super Bowl in 2024, tagging him is a no brainer. I think they will be... I would take winning the Super Bowl with Tee and getting a 3rd round comp pick when he leaves. Tag and trade would certainly net more than a 3rd round comp pick, but trying to predict the outcome of that compensation is challenging at best. Ok, so they get picks or maybe a combination of a player and pick(s). There's no guarantee any of those work out in the future. WR is already a certainty in the draft. Tee leaving almost guarantees a 1st or 2nd rounder being used to replace him. I wasn't able to find much about tag and trade deals, but much like a premier player leaving in free agency, the team they leave typically feels it. Hell, look at the Bengals losing Jessie Bates. Despite a first round pick and an emerging rookie last year, our safety play has declined since the days of Bates and Bell roaming the secondary. FWIW, I just don't think there's any way in hell Tee doesn't get tagged. I also don't think there will be much effort to trade him either. Some team would have to blow them away with an offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 Traditional trades with Franchise tag don't happen very often. Alternate trades in which the teams come together for less than 2 firsts have happened multiple times. Higgins is worth a top 15 pick, IMO. Its not worth trading him for anything less. If you use that trade value chart that's multiple 2nd or various other picks. Why? 1st - There have been a lot of WRs taken top 35 since Tee was drafted. Less than 50% have a singular 1,000 yard season. 2nd - A great play, slightly bad throw robbed Higgins of 100+ yard day and the Bengals a return trip to Superbowl. Despite the O-line once again killing multiple drives with 5 sacks and whole bunch of pressures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 Not sure why I haven't seen things through the lens of restarting things with a rookie deal more often. That being said, I pay attention to the Justin Fields situation in Chicago pretty closely. A big part of that conversation isn't really that Williams is or isn't better than Fields, but that even if it's close, starting that clock over again with Williams on a rookie deal is very valuable. It being a first round they can control for the next 5 years is even more so. In Higgins case, getting a first round pick for Higgins would have to be considered a fairly big win for the Bengals. Not saying that would or wouldn't happen, but there's the starting the clock over, having the extra season of control and then looking at the WR class to make an attempt at replacing Higgins with. Guys like Keon Coleman and Brian Thomas, both 6'4 and thought to go later in the first would be targets I could live with in that scenario. Even a Xavier Worthy or Troy Franklin 6'2 and 6'3 respectively are at least options worth considering. Still don't think they move him regardless... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 For what it's worth, even if they keep Higgins, I probably wouldn't take much issue with draft Brian Thomas in the first. That dude really looks the part of what Higgins brings to the offense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted February 22 Author Report Share Posted February 22 KC signs punt god. https://www.nfl.com/news/free-agent-punter-matt-araiza-signing-with-super-bowl-champion-kansas-city-chiefs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 Nope we couldn’t have used him… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 Here’s the other thought I had about our needs vs free agent availability… When looking at the free agent OT’s, it’s pretty slim without true upgrades to what we had with Jonah. That’s part of the reason I still say OT early. However, when looking at the DT free agents, there are some impact players I would jump for joy adding. As much as I love Tee, I don’t think the team gets better paying him 25 million per year. Not with Chase and of course Burrow, who should make other WR’s better. But, you put that money into another top end interior pass rusher and I just think it’s a bigger overall impact. Of course I could be wrong but that’s where I am today. Thoughts and ideas subject to change… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 On the day free agency opened up and Whitworth walked into UFA. How much was he worth? Thinking they had two highly regarded tackles. A very good OL development record. How much was Whit worth a couple years later? I'd say Whitworth's "fan" value grew 100X in that period? How much was J. Joe worth the day he signed with Houston? How much was he worth a couple years later when Zimmer had an entire secondary of former No. 1 draft picks balling out? His "fan" value shrunk. The value "fans" place on paying or not paying Tee is and always be based on hindsight. How Tee is going to perform after extension? How well they can replace him? Unfortunately the tag is due before anyone is going to know. So I say tag. Extend if possible. Losing Housh, First derailed his career (he's admitted that), derailed Palmer's to the point he went crybaby. Then cost himself the chance to throw to AJ Green and play with Zimmer's D. If Andy D was Qbing those teams to the playoffs. They'd be significantly better with Palmer. Keep elite talent when you have the chance. Takeo Spikes never played in the playoffs. Forced himself out of his best situation. Dillon threw his pads in the stands and got a Superbowl ring. Judgement will always be based on things that aren't known at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 I love Tee and would have no concern if the team extends him. For the record, I think there is a part to him playing alongside Chase and Boyd that gets diminished. I would hope if he leaves that he goes on to have a great career. Although, I also wouldn’t be surprised if his numbers were not as good with a new team if they don’t have the QB and WR talent he’s played with here. Nothing but love for Tee !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted February 23 Author Report Share Posted February 23 All I know is that the cries of the cut Joe Mixon chorus appear to be growing louder by the day. I continue to hope they will be disappointed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted February 23 Report Share Posted February 23 I wouldn't have minded seeing him go last year if they were going to pay him what he was due to make. Then they went and did something I don't think they've ever done and reconstructed his contract. At that point I was totally good with bringing him back and it ended up working out well for 2023. Now, this year they have to relook it. Do they feel he's worth the 8.85 million or do they cut him and save a little over 6 million? I'm good with his current salary and would have no issues with him being back. Who takes his place? Brown? Ok, who takes his? If they let Mixon go, they have to get more help at the RB spot one way or another. I'd rather them just keep him. He appears to want to continue playing for the Bengals and may actually be willing to take another pay cut to make that happen. Again, I would rather him stick around. Just let Brown spell him more than in 2023. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted February 28 Report Share Posted February 28 There's a lot of smoke about cutting Joe Mixon. So I guess it could plausible. A couple points that make it seem questionable. He COUNTS $8.85 against the cap but is only getting PAID $5.7m which includes a roster bonus AND incentives. Then he's off the books for 2025. So 1st can it actually be done to replace or upgrade his production for less than $6m with incentives? In Free Agency? For a singular year? 2nd? Why? They placed the tag on Higgins and still have $50m. Why create an immediate need when you don't have to? Just eat the $3m roster bonus if the upgrade is sitting there after the draft. I would think most backs signing in the first week of Free Agency are going to cost more than $6m cash and probably have cap ramifications beyond the 2024 season. I could easily see them drafting a back to pair with Brown and Mixon. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stripes Posted February 28 Report Share Posted February 28 https://nflpa.com/nfl-player-team-report-cards-2024 NFLPA report cards are back. Oof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted February 28 Author Report Share Posted February 28 The locker room is being gutted and redone so that D+ should be better. https://www.bengals.com/news/upgrades-paycor-stadium-locker-room-field-2024-season The daycare and food stuff seems like a private sector partnership opportunity if someone down in marketing pulled their head out of their butt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 4 hours ago, AMPHAR said: There's a lot of smoke about cutting Joe Mixon. So I guess it could plausible. A couple points that make it seem questionable. He COUNTS $8.85 against the cap but is only getting PAID $5.7m which includes a roster bonus AND incentives. Then he's off the books for 2025. So 1st can it actually be done to replace or upgrade his production for less than $6m with incentives? In Free Agency? For a singular year? 2nd? Why? They placed the tag on Higgins and still have $50m. Why create an immediate need when you don't have to? Just eat the $3m roster bonus if the upgrade is sitting there after the draft. I would think most backs signing in the first week of Free Agency are going to cost more than $6m cash and probably have cap ramifications beyond the 2024 season. I could easily see them drafting a back to pair with Brown and Mixon. Couldn’t agree more. Here’s my thought. The cap just went up by 30 million dollars. So that covers both Tee and Mixon for 2024 with money no team expected to be there. At least not THAT much. So yeah, again… why? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted February 29 Author Report Share Posted February 29 I got 99 problems with the offense and Joe Mixon ain’t one of them. I get the arguments, and if you want to hear them all, pro and anti, Goodberry and Zim Whodey went at it hammer and tongs yesterday here, as well as Tee’s tag. But at the end of the day, we have holes at RT, slot receiver, TE and the backup RB spots, and question marks on the interior OL, AND we are operating on the assumption that Tee’s injury-filled 2023 was a fluke and not a sign of bad thing ahead. So my interest level in cutting Mixon is less than zero. I agree that if we get into this spring and all the other spots have been addressed and there’s a clear opportunity to upgrade, eat the roster bonus and move on. But right now? No. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 Seriously, there are many more concerns than Mixon and his salary for 2024. Just spitballing positions of more importance to me and it would probably be easier to list the ones that aren’t. QB, K Damn near every other position on this roster could be upgraded via free agency and/or the draft. Any position on both lines? YES Tight ends and receivers? YES Linebacking corps? YES Corners and safeties? YES Punter? YES Cutting Mixon to save 8 million that was covered by the increase in salary cap, while creating a new need that wasn’t there, without a true plan? FUCK NO !! Now if you are telling me they plan on bringing in an upgrade to Mixon for less, then we are talking. Only problem is… that ain’t fucking happening. Jacobs? Ekeler? Barkley? Nope, not for 8 million… 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stripes Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 8 hours ago, HoosierCat said: The locker room is being gutted and redone so that D+ should be better. https://www.bengals.com/news/upgrades-paycor-stadium-locker-room-field-2024-season The daycare and food stuff seems like a private sector partnership opportunity if someone down in marketing pulled their head out of their butt. Yes, I am optimistic about that. I can't help but be annoyed by silly things like a dietician the team hates (hire someone full time already) and a bunch of busted toilets/showers. This stuff probably isn't a big deal, and it doesn't seem to correlate with winning (the Chiefs came out worse). But it may impact free agent impressions. The problems for player families should be so easily fixed if someone decides to give a crap -- two years in a row of that F- is frustrating. Name a point of contact. Give them a space in the stadium on game day. (I'm complaining to the wind, ignore me) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 I’m with you Stripes, while it may not equate winning, it’s concern enough that players are commenting about it. As a multi billion dollar organization, these items should not be problematic to correct. If they are… shame. Maybe Mike has another grandchild he can find to head this up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 NFLPA bitch list. Who cares? I'll apply for the dietician job. Yes, that candy bar you are eating. That's bad. Smoothie bar manager. Somehow players believe their family is entitled to an all inclusive when they go to paycor. Just know in some shape or form this comes out of your pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted February 29 Author Report Share Posted February 29 Interesting. I’d be for it. Quote Six NFL teams plan to submit a proposal to the league that will push the NFL trade deadline from Week 8 to Week 10. The Browns, Commanders, Eagles, Jets, Lions and 49ers are set to propose a later trade deadline that would, in effect, lead to an increase in trades in the NFL and, in reality, heighten drama and intrigue in the league. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/six-teams-to-submit-proposal-to-push-back-nfl-trade-deadline-from-week-8-to-week-10/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COB Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 That family thing is the strangest facet of these team surveys. If you want your wife and kids to get some sort of royalty treatment on game day, put it in your contract. Otherwise stfu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 Was looking at what exactly those graded areas are. Come the fuck on. These are such easy fixes, it's not even funny. A place for the football families to gather together to get out of the elements if needed? Daycare to watch the players kiddos during game days? A place for the families to gather after the games that isn't a tent? A family representative they can reach out to or that coordinates communication to the families? While none of these affect me personally and I don't really care about the outcomes (Since I don't work for them) I could fix each and every one of these concerns in less than a week, without any challenging concerns. I don't see it as asking for special treatment, they are simply asking for the same thing the majority of teams in the league provide their families. And why wouldn't you want to do that exactly, besides a little money? You want to build a cohesive, family like environment, that is there for each other so the players can focus on what they are getting paid millions to do. That and come free agency time for their player, you don't think the spouses are sharing their thoughts on the team, city, accommodations, etc? What about the spouses talking to other spouses of potential free agents the team would like to bring in? Some may say, who gives a shit, but these are simple fixes. I was serious, I could fix that shit in no time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted February 29 Author Report Share Posted February 29 1 hour ago, ArmyBengal said: Was looking at what exactly those graded areas are. Come the fuck on. These are such easy fixes, it's not even funny. A place for the football families to gather together to get out of the elements if needed? Daycare to watch the players kiddos during game days? A place for the families to gather after the games that isn't a tent? A family representative they can reach out to or that coordinates communication to the families? Some may say, who gives a shit, but these are simple fixes. I was serious, I could fix that shit in no time. I mean, yeah. 1 is a designated spot in PBS, 2-3 are the bubble and 4 is someone with, y’know, a phone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMPHAR Posted February 29 Report Share Posted February 29 Who gives a shit? Drop them off at Burrow's new 80,000 room house. Daycare isn't an easy fix. Next year's survey will be highlighting one of kids getting fingered by a child care provider or whatever. Yeah just let section 151 row 9 watch the kids. The easy fix is tell the player to STFU and pay for child care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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