Andy Dalton Sucks!

[ShulaSteakhouse]

And watching the QB I wanted, Kaepernick, lead SF to win over Rogers and GB on the road makes my head ache even more.

OK, blow it up. They have the talent to withstand giving away most of their draft to go get Bridgewater. QB is now the key. Cannot expect Dalton to improve enough to win games under pressure like today. He's just not good enough. He doesn't read defenses, recognize and adjust. He does not have enough arm, touch or technique. He is not going to grow to be Brees or Rogers.

Giving him one more year compromises the potential of the other elite players on this team. It's not easy, and its not "nice" but it's football and it's a business.

Time to be bold and get the final, biggest and most important component in this machine. The current QB part does not yield enough.

+1

Dalton's gotta tough road ahead of him with the fans, maybe some of the media, but for the most part people are going to be calling for his proverbial head with every mistake he makes now, boo'ing etc.., He has a monkey on his back so big, not sure how he's going to handle it.

All of the die-hard apologists I know have jumped ship on him after today.

The guy threw for 34 TD's and turned it over 27 times. That's terrible. Not good enough...again.

[kingwilly]

Trade day one and day two for the #1 pick and get Bridgewater.

That's about all I care to contribute here today.

Dalton can't be the QB any more. No.

As frustrating as it was and as emotional as we are, the QB situation is NOT going to change, per Marvin, and Marvin will stay.

For me, it's a hobby and a sport. I will NOT change teams just because we haven't won a playoff game.

I am NOT a fair weather fan, or a bandwagon fan!

I will follow personnel changes as they occur in the offseason, the draft, and the OTAs, and root for the Reds in April.

I try to stay positive whenever I want to throw a pity party for myself about anything! What helps me is I try to look at someone, something, or a situation that is much worse than mine!

I was a Browns fan until the Bengals came to town in 1968, and my dad and I switched to the Bengals. I could very well still be a Browns fan! :eek:/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>

Sure. That's fine.

Part of what happens on this board is criticism and debate on all manner of team items. Players, coaches, schemes, draft, blah blah blah.

I only see a few emotional fans tossing in the proverbial towel but they'll be back. Few bandwagon fans on this board, have a look at most of the join dates. Mine is August of 2003.

Anyone can find solace in a situation worse than theirs. That's a defeatist loser attitude. Sorry. Heck, we could dead so at least we have that.

The speculation of what happens next is something I really enjoy. Confronting the reality with Dalton must be done. It's the management that has to do it, and its something which most of us here will be watching very closely. I have my thoughts on how they can get over the hump. I'd love to hear yours, and its not to simply point North and say "at least we are not Cleveland" cause that's no solution at all.

First of all it's not a defeatist attitude, because I'll be darn if I'm going to let a football game or team be my number one priority and dictate my life!

Having an opinion on what should be done and not done, changes in personnel, players, strategies etc is fine and expected.

But I also know that regardless of 'what' I think, or 'what' you think, will have no bearing whatsoever on what is truly done, unless you have the inside with management, because I can tell you that I do not!

So, bottom line is, what difference does it make what you or I think, because it won't change a thing!

(BTW nobody dies, our bodies shut down, but we will all live forever in one of two places, so being dead can either be the best or the worst.......just saying)

Bud, I hate to break it to you but it truly is a defeatist attitude to cow to the ill fortunes of another town as panacea to ills of this one. Sports (at least we r not Cleveland), politics (at least we don't live in Russia), or work (at least we don't work in a Congolese diamond mine).

I won't apologize for demanding excellence. I follow my home team loyally, religiously. I bust my ass working at the job I do, and before that I worked like an animal in a sport that has not footing in the US but thrives elsewhere. I know what it takes to make it, to be great, to succeed based on nothing more than the simple recipe of hard work + decent natural ability + perseverance.

However, I also have learned the lessons of limits and capacities. There are times, after sufficient time and effort, chances and latitude, that decisions about what's next are made. I stopped my sport after 8 years, plateauing and failing to progress. Time was up. In NFL football, players don't get 8 years, in fact the 3 that Dalton's had has been generous and forgiving. Forgiving the usual growing pains, Dalton has progressed though not enough to warrant a position of unchallenged control of the offense.

Looking forward, it's the common burden of all sports fans to wish for the best, cheer their team and defend against the critics who pour cold water on the hopes of the loyal. To be patient yet demanding, loyal yet uncompromising, and push for the results known possible through ways seen by intimate examination is our role. I'm a realist, fueled by my own athletic experience, success and disappointment balanced by our outside, limited view of this team. We don't know all, see all and we don't have the info to fully grasp the mechanics of the team.

So where does it leave us? Pipe down and be glad we don't change QBs so regularly as in old.. Cite Klinger, Mitchell, Blake, Akili. Kitna.. Be glad we don't live in Detroit or Cleveland or St. Louis? No. F that.

Demand more. Sports has a role, yes. But here is where our demands are made. No one thinks our words impact anything to do with the team. All the better, to vent am idea or float a crazy notion. Not passively retract the iron and motion that since nothing will change why bother.. Wow.

End of rant. A decade of words, thoughts, reactions and ideas dumped here. All to my fellow Bengals blokes who also grind along. Not gonna stop because, hey, we don't live in Cleveland.

[membengal]

Yeah, I'm done with him. The bad decision making is too hard to stomach. No situational awareness. Not enough ball security.

How can anyone ever trust him? His teammates? The coaches? The fans?

In a perfect world, they aggressively move up in the draft and look to put a Bridgewater or Manziel into this offense. In this one? They probably sign him to an extention on the cheap and we hope someday he will stop sucking when the lights get bright.

This sucks.

[membengal]

He's more than serviceable, I would think.

But again, I yield to your hate. The narrative around dalton continues to be a bit disconnected from reality.

Reality just got connected.

Pretty much. I yield.

[membengal]

Agreed Willy, hard decisions have to be made.

If the FO refuses to make them, we are in for a slow decline until a 3 or 4 win season forces the changes that should be made now. I don't want them to go that route, though history indicates they will.

This.

[gregcook68]

Trade day one and day two for the #1 pick and get Bridgewater.

That's about all I care to contribute here today.

Dalton can't be the QB any more. No.

As frustrating as it was and as emotional as we are, the QB situation is NOT going to change, per Marvin, and Marvin will stay.

For me, it's a hobby and a sport. I will NOT change teams just because we haven't won a playoff game.

I am NOT a fair weather fan, or a bandwagon fan!

I will follow personnel changes as they occur in the offseason, the draft, and the OTAs, and root for the Reds in April.

I try to stay positive whenever I want to throw a pity party for myself about anything! What helps me is I try to look at someone, something, or a situation that is much worse than mine!

I was a Browns fan until the Bengals came to town in 1968, and my dad and I switched to the Bengals. I could very well still be a Browns fan! :eek:/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>

Sure. That's fine.

Part of what happens on this board is criticism and debate on all manner of team items. Players, coaches, schemes, draft, blah blah blah.

I only see a few emotional fans tossing in the proverbial towel but they'll be back. Few bandwagon fans on this board, have a look at most of the join dates. Mine is August of 2003.

Anyone can find solace in a situation worse than theirs. That's a defeatist loser attitude. Sorry. Heck, we could dead so at least we have that.

The speculation of what happens next is something I really enjoy. Confronting the reality with Dalton must be done. It's the management that has to do it, and its something which most of us here will be watching very closely. I have my thoughts on how they can get over the hump. I'd love to hear yours, and its not to simply point North and say "at least we are not Cleveland" cause that's no solution at all.

First of all it's not a defeatist attitude, because I'll be darn if I'm going to let a football game or team be my number one priority and dictate my life!

Having an opinion on what should be done and not done, changes in personnel, players, strategies etc is fine and expected.

But I also know that regardless of 'what' I think, or 'what' you think, will have no bearing whatsoever on what is truly done, unless you have the inside with management, because I can tell you that I do not!

So, bottom line is, what difference does it make what you or I think, because it won't change a thing!

(BTW nobody dies, our bodies shut down, but we will all live forever in one of two places, so being dead can either be the best or the worst.......just saying)

Bud, I hate to break it to you but it truly is a defeatist attitude to cow to the ill fortunes of another town as panacea to ills of this one. Sports (at least we r not Cleveland), politics (at least we don't live in Russia), or work (at least we don't work in a Congolese diamond mine).

I won't apologize for demanding excellence. I follow my home team loyally, religiously. I bust my ass working at the job I do, and before that I worked like an animal in a sport that has not footing in the US but thrives elsewhere. I know what it takes to make it, to be great, to succeed based on nothing more than the simple recipe of hard work + decent natural ability + perseverance.

However, I also have learned the lessons of limits and capacities. There are times, after sufficient time and effort, chances and latitude, that decisions about what's next are made. I stopped my sport after 8 years, plateauing and failing to progress. Time was up. In NFL football, players don't get 8 years, in fact the 3 that Dalton's had has been generous and forgiving. Forgiving the usual growing pains, Dalton has progressed though not enough to warrant a position of unchallenged control of the offense.

Looking forward, it's the common burden of all sports fans to wish for the best, cheer their team and defend against the critics who pour cold water on the hopes of the loyal. To be patient yet demanding, loyal yet uncompromising, and push for the results known possible through ways seen by intimate examination is our role. I'm a realist, fueled by my own athletic experience, success and disappointment balanced by our outside, limited view of this team. We don't know all, see all and we don't have the info to fully grasp the mechanics of the team.

So where does it leave us? Pipe down and be glad we don't change QBs so regularly as in old.. Cite Klinger, Mitchell, Blake, Akili. Kitna.. Be glad we don't live in Detroit or Cleveland or St. Louis? No. F that.

Demand more. Sports has a role, yes. But here is where our demands are made. No one thinks our words impact anything to do with the team. All the better, to vent am idea or float a crazy notion. Not passively retract the iron and motion that since nothing will change why bother.. Wow.

End of rant. A decade of words, thoughts, reactions and ideas dumped here. All to my fellow Bengals blokes who also grind along. Not gonna stop because, hey, we don't live in Cleveland.

You can rant and call names and demand excellence and ridicule others who don't agree with you, until the cows come home, but the reality of all that is, unless you know someone on the 'inside' who has an influential voice, it doesn't mean a thing and won't change whatever the organization wants to do!

THAT, my friend, is non-debatable!!

Yes, I will be kept abreast, through push notifications, on what transpires with trades, coaches contracts, FAs, player contracts, and draft day. I will continue to go to the games I can here in Florida, they play at Tampa Bay next year. I will continue to watch all the games I can, and root for them just like I have since their beginning.

If that's your definition of a defeatist attitude then you probably should think about rearranging your life priorities.

But now, the season is over, I will mildly follow the playoffs and then get prepared to follow and root for the Red.

Until next year....................WHO DEY FOREVER!!!

[ArmyBengal]

No Volcom, I wouldn't think of acting out in any shape, form or fashion.

Punching him in the face is simply frustration and I don't even hate him to be quite honest.

Truth be told, I feel sorry for him.

Will anything short of a Super Bowl be good enough in the eyes of almost anyone ??

He's in for more heat than I would venture most would be willing to endure.

He's not the only part of what went wrong yesterday, but he's certainly part of it for sure.

He deserves all the bashing he's going to get.

[COB]

Trade day one and day two for the #1 pick and get Bridgewater.

That's about all I care to contribute here today.

Dalton can't be the QB any more. No.

As frustrating as it was and as emotional as we are, the QB situation is NOT going to change, per Marvin, and Marvin will stay.

For me, it's a hobby and a sport. I will NOT change teams just because we haven't won a playoff game.

I am NOT a fair weather fan, or a bandwagon fan!

I will follow personnel changes as they occur in the offseason, the draft, and the OTAs, and root for the Reds in April.

I try to stay positive whenever I want to throw a pity party for myself about anything! What helps me is I try to look at someone, something, or a situation that is much worse than mine!

I was a Browns fan until the Bengals came to town in 1968, and my dad and I switched to the Bengals. I could very well still be a Browns fan! :eek:/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>

Sure. That's fine.

Part of what happens on this board is criticism and debate on all manner of team items. Players, coaches, schemes, draft, blah blah blah.

I only see a few emotional fans tossing in the proverbial towel but they'll be back. Few bandwagon fans on this board, have a look at most of the join dates. Mine is August of 2003.

Anyone can find solace in a situation worse than theirs. That's a defeatist loser attitude. Sorry. Heck, we could dead so at least we have that.

The speculation of what happens next is something I really enjoy. Confronting the reality with Dalton must be done. It's the management that has to do it, and its something which most of us here will be watching very closely. I have my thoughts on how they can get over the hump. I'd love to hear yours, and its not to simply point North and say "at least we are not Cleveland" cause that's no solution at all.

First of all it's not a defeatist attitude, because I'll be darn if I'm going to let a football game or team be my number one priority and dictate my life!

Having an opinion on what should be done and not done, changes in personnel, players, strategies etc is fine and expected.

But I also know that regardless of 'what' I think, or 'what' you think, will have no bearing whatsoever on what is truly done, unless you have the inside with management, because I can tell you that I do not!

So, bottom line is, what difference does it make what you or I think, because it won't change a thing!

(BTW nobody dies, our bodies shut down, but we will all live forever in one of two places, so being dead can either be the best or the worst.......just saying)

Bud, I hate to break it to you but it truly is a defeatist attitude to cow to the ill fortunes of another town as panacea to ills of this one. Sports (at least we r not Cleveland), politics (at least we don't live in Russia), or work (at least we don't work in a Congolese diamond mine).

I won't apologize for demanding excellence. I follow my home team loyally, religiously. I bust my ass working at the job I do, and before that I worked like an animal in a sport that has not footing in the US but thrives elsewhere. I know what it takes to make it, to be great, to succeed based on nothing more than the simple recipe of hard work + decent natural ability + perseverance.

However, I also have learned the lessons of limits and capacities. There are times, after sufficient time and effort, chances and latitude, that decisions about what's next are made. I stopped my sport after 8 years, plateauing and failing to progress. Time was up. In NFL football, players don't get 8 years, in fact the 3 that Dalton's had has been generous and forgiving. Forgiving the usual growing pains, Dalton has progressed though not enough to warrant a position of unchallenged control of the offense.

Looking forward, it's the common burden of all sports fans to wish for the best, cheer their team and defend against the critics who pour cold water on the hopes of the loyal. To be patient yet demanding, loyal yet uncompromising, and push for the results known possible through ways seen by intimate examination is our role. I'm a realist, fueled by my own athletic experience, success and disappointment balanced by our outside, limited view of this team. We don't know all, see all and we don't have the info to fully grasp the mechanics of the team.

So where does it leave us? Pipe down and be glad we don't change QBs so regularly as in old.. Cite Klinger, Mitchell, Blake, Akili. Kitna.. Be glad we don't live in Detroit or Cleveland or St. Louis? No. F that.

Demand more. Sports has a role, yes. But here is where our demands are made. No one thinks our words impact anything to do with the team. All the better, to vent am idea or float a crazy notion. Not passively retract the iron and motion that since nothing will change why bother.. Wow.

End of rant. A decade of words, thoughts, reactions and ideas dumped here. All to my fellow Bengals blokes who also grind along. Not gonna stop because, hey, we don't live in Cleveland.

You can rant and call names and demand excellence and ridicule others who don't agree with you, until the cows come home, but the reality of all that is, unless you know someone on the 'inside' who has an influential voice, it doesn't mean a thing and won't change whatever the organization wants to do!

THAT, my friend, is non-debatable!!

Yes, I will be kept abreast, through push notifications, on what transpires with trades, coaches contracts, FAs, player contracts, and draft day. I will continue to go to the games I can here in Florida, they play at Tampa Bay next year. I will continue to watch all the games I can, and root for them just like I have since their beginning.

If that's your definition of a defeatist attitude then you probably should think about rearranging your life priorities.

But now, the season is over, I will mildly follow the playoffs and then get prepared to follow and root for the Red.

Until next year....................WHO DEY FOREVER!!!

No one's ridiculing you or anyone else. Also, talks about draft picks and personel moves are fun, we aren't making them with any expectation that the FO is somehow listening. We just like talking about the Bengals.

Dalton has turned out to be a ten foot ladder. The playoffs are a twelve foot wall. We've tried to climb a twelve foot wall with a ten foot ladder three times and failed each time. Need a new ladder.

[ArmyBengal]

Dalton has turned out to be a ten foot ladder. The playoffs are a twelve foot wall. We've tried to climb a twelve foot wall with a ten foot ladder three times and failed each time. Need a new ladder.

Yeah, that made me smile.

Thanks COB.

[gregcook68]

Trade day one and day two for the #1 pick and get Bridgewater.

That's about all I care to contribute here today.

Dalton can't be the QB any more. No.

As frustrating as it was and as emotional as we are, the QB situation is NOT going to change, per Marvin, and Marvin will stay.

For me, it's a hobby and a sport. I will NOT change teams just because we haven't won a playoff game.

I am NOT a fair weather fan, or a bandwagon fan!

I will follow personnel changes as they occur in the offseason, the draft, and the OTAs, and root for the Reds in April.

I try to stay positive whenever I want to throw a pity party for myself about anything! What helps me is I try to look at someone, something, or a situation that is much worse than mine!

I was a Browns fan until the Bengals came to town in 1968, and my dad and I switched to the Bengals. I could very well still be a Browns fan! :eek:/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>/>

Sure. That's fine.

Part of what happens on this board is criticism and debate on all manner of team items. Players, coaches, schemes, draft, blah blah blah.

I only see a few emotional fans tossing in the proverbial towel but they'll be back. Few bandwagon fans on this board, have a look at most of the join dates. Mine is August of 2003.

Anyone can find solace in a situation worse than theirs. That's a defeatist loser attitude. Sorry. Heck, we could dead so at least we have that.

The speculation of what happens next is something I really enjoy. Confronting the reality with Dalton must be done. It's the management that has to do it, and its something which most of us here will be watching very closely. I have my thoughts on how they can get over the hump. I'd love to hear yours, and its not to simply point North and say "at least we are not Cleveland" cause that's no solution at all.

First of all it's not a defeatist attitude, because I'll be darn if I'm going to let a football game or team be my number one priority and dictate my life!

Having an opinion on what should be done and not done, changes in personnel, players, strategies etc is fine and expected.

But I also know that regardless of 'what' I think, or 'what' you think, will have no bearing whatsoever on what is truly done, unless you have the inside with management, because I can tell you that I do not!

So, bottom line is, what difference does it make what you or I think, because it won't change a thing!

(BTW nobody dies, our bodies shut down, but we will all live forever in one of two places, so being dead can either be the best or the worst.......just saying)

Bud, I hate to break it to you but it truly is a defeatist attitude to cow to the ill fortunes of another town as panacea to ills of this one. Sports (at least we r not Cleveland), politics (at least we don't live in Russia), or work (at least we don't work in a Congolese diamond mine).

I won't apologize for demanding excellence. I follow my home team loyally, religiously. I bust my ass working at the job I do, and before that I worked like an animal in a sport that has not footing in the US but thrives elsewhere. I know what it takes to make it, to be great, to succeed based on nothing more than the simple recipe of hard work + decent natural ability + perseverance.

However, I also have learned the lessons of limits and capacities. There are times, after sufficient time and effort, chances and latitude, that decisions about what's next are made. I stopped my sport after 8 years, plateauing and failing to progress. Time was up. In NFL football, players don't get 8 years, in fact the 3 that Dalton's had has been generous and forgiving. Forgiving the usual growing pains, Dalton has progressed though not enough to warrant a position of unchallenged control of the offense.

Looking forward, it's the common burden of all sports fans to wish for the best, cheer their team and defend against the critics who pour cold water on the hopes of the loyal. To be patient yet demanding, loyal yet uncompromising, and push for the results known possible through ways seen by intimate examination is our role. I'm a realist, fueled by my own athletic experience, success and disappointment balanced by our outside, limited view of this team. We don't know all, see all and we don't have the info to fully grasp the mechanics of the team.

So where does it leave us? Pipe down and be glad we don't change QBs so regularly as in old.. Cite Klinger, Mitchell, Blake, Akili. Kitna.. Be glad we don't live in Detroit or Cleveland or St. Louis? No. F that.

Demand more. Sports has a role, yes. But here is where our demands are made. No one thinks our words impact anything to do with the team. All the better, to vent am idea or float a crazy notion. Not passively retract the iron and motion that since nothing will change why bother.. Wow.

End of rant. A decade of words, thoughts, reactions and ideas dumped here. All to my fellow Bengals blokes who also grind along. Not gonna stop because, hey, we don't live in Cleveland.

You can rant and call names and demand excellence and ridicule others who don't agree with you, until the cows come home, but the reality of all that is, unless you know someone on the 'inside' who has an influential voice, it doesn't mean a thing and won't change whatever the organization wants to do!

THAT, my friend, is non-debatable!!

Yes, I will be kept abreast, through push notifications, on what transpires with trades, coaches contracts, FAs, player contracts, and draft day. I will continue to go to the games I can here in Florida, they play at Tampa Bay next year. I will continue to watch all the games I can, and root for them just like I have since their beginning.

If that's your definition of a defeatist attitude then you probably should think about rearranging your life priorities.

But now, the season is over, I will mildly follow the playoffs and then get prepared to follow and root for the Red.

Until next year....................WHO DEY FOREVER!!!

No one's ridiculing you or anyone else. Also, talks about draft picks and personel moves are fun, we aren't making them with any expectation that the FO is somehow listening. We just like talking about the Bengals.

Dalton has turned out to be a ten foot ladder. The playoffs are a twelve foot wall. We've tried to climb a twelve foot wall with a ten foot ladder three times and failed each time. Need a new ladder.

You have not ridiculed sir, and I think you understand. But it was ridicule calling it a defeatist attitude and stupid! I was giving MY opinion on how I see things. Did not insinuate, that others are expected to see things as I do.

When someone calls my perspective defeatist and stupid, then I have to point out the reality of this; you can demand your definition of excellence but you'll never get it unless it just happens to line up with their decisions, opinions, and strategies. They are going to do what they feel is right. If a person wants to get all riled up and be upset with the Bengals, because they AREN'T doing what you think they should do, then that's up to them.

I join in on discussions as far as strategy and what I'd like to see and so forth, but for ME, not anyone else, just ME, to make demands is pointless!

I either go with the flow, follow, and root for the Bengals based on the decisions management DOES make, or I change teams, or just stop following football as closely, as I did throughout most of the 90s.

[kingwilly]

Mr. GregCook68,

I didn't say you were stupid. If that's how you took it, then perhaps you need to more slowly and precisely read what I wrote.

Failing that, simply saying since we don't have an inside line to management that nothing we write will change anything is your end all argument, and, heck there's more to life so let's all just move on. If so, you've missed why folks around here post their screeds.

People are not generally here to "aw-shucks we lost, better luck next time", at least I'm not.

Go on your way from this thread. I've certainly spent more than enough time typing these words, and from the looks of your responses I'm not sure you are getting me. And that's cool. It's not my aim to rile you up or make you feel slighted or insulted. But I'm gonna write what I like and it's up to you to fully read it, or simply ignore it, rather than come back with how stupid I said you were or how I insulted you. Sorry, didn't do that.

Back to football, seems Dalton is taking his medicine well based on his post game quotes, and the team has his back in the sense they project themselves as a unit, not one man, who lost the game. That's impressive.

[ArmyBengal]

Dalton is going to need the thickness of armadillo skin if he is going to keep the amount of heat he's going to get from getting to him.

I'm rooting for him. I really am, but i'm not as optimistic moving forward.

[gregcook68]

Mr. GregCook68,

I didn't say you were stupid. If that's how you took it, then perhaps you need to more slowly and precisely read what I wrote.

Failing that, simply saying since we don't have an inside line to management that nothing we write will change anything is your end all argument, and, heck there's more to life so let's all just move on. If so, you've missed why folks around here post their screeds.

People are not generally here to "aw-shucks we lost, better luck next time", at least I'm not.

Go on your way from this thread. I've certainly spent more than enough time typing these words, and from the looks of your responses I'm not sure you are getting me. And that's cool. It's not my aim to rile you up or make you feel slighted or insulted. But I'm gonna write what I like and it's up to you to fully read it, or simply ignore it, rather than come back with how stupid I said you were or how I insulted you. Sorry, didn't do that.

Back to football, seems Dalton is taking his medicine well based on his post game quotes, and the team has his back in the sense they project themselves as a unit, not one man, who lost the game. That's impressive.

King, YOU read threads better, I did not mention your name anywhere in that thread or insinuate you whatsoever. Yes, you said I had a defeatist loser attitude.

If that's the way you see it, so be it, but I would never criticize your attitude AND DISCUSSION in here on strategies and opinions on staff, team members, fans etc, are WHAT these forums are for.

I was calling out the folk here that DEMAND this and DEMAND that, and if this isn't done then by George I'm outta here etc.

I demanded that my son follow the discipline I setup for him growing up. I demanded that he followed some rules when he got his driver's license, etc. I can DEMAND those things, because I had control over not whether or not he broke them, but the consequences and decisions if they WERE broken!

I am addressing this to the ones who criticize MY attitude and DEMAND. You can't demand something you have no control over! Very simple logic here!

AGAIN, for those that are demanding, but not LEAVING the team, how do we get it done???

[Sea Ray]

Dalton is going to need the thickness of armadillo skin if he is going to keep the amount of heat he's going to get from getting to him.

I'm rooting for him. I really am, but i'm not as optimistic moving forward.

There's only so much Dalton can do with what God's given him. He doesn't have a strong arm, a tall body or quick feet. On top of all that, I don't think he's as accurate as was his billing coming out of college? Do any of you see that differently?

I don't need Aaron Rodgers back there but if we just got a QB who's 6'5" with a stronger arm, at the very least we'll see fewer batted down passes and fewer underthrown AJ Green TD passes.

I don't know if this will ever be proven true but IMO if we did stick a QB with those attributes in there, we'd soon see that this offense is so talented that any avg QB could put up the results that Dalton did if given the reps and off season coaching. Maybe I'm being unfair to him but I think most NFL QBs could have taken this talented team to 11-5 this year. A 2nd string guy nearly beat the Chargers a week ago

[kingwilly]

Mr. GregCook68,

I didn't say you were stupid. If that's how you took it, then perhaps you need to more slowly and precisely read what I wrote.

Failing that, simply saying since we don't have an inside line to management that nothing we write will change anything is your end all argument, and, heck there's more to life so let's all just move on. If so, you've missed why folks around here post their screeds.

People are not generally here to "aw-shucks we lost, better luck next time", at least I'm not.

Go on your way from this thread. I've certainly spent more than enough time typing these words, and from the looks of your responses I'm not sure you are getting me. And that's cool. It's not my aim to rile you up or make you feel slighted or insulted. But I'm gonna write what I like and it's up to you to fully read it, or simply ignore it, rather than come back with how stupid I said you were or how I insulted you. Sorry, didn't do that.

Back to football, seems Dalton is taking his medicine well based on his post game quotes, and the team has his back in the sense they project themselves as a unit, not one man, who lost the game. That's impressive.

King, YOU read threads better, I did not mention your name anywhere in that thread or insinuate you whatsoever. Yes, you said I had a defeatist loser attitude.

If that's the way you see it, so be it, but I would never criticize your attitude AND DISCUSSION in here on strategies and opinions on staff, team members, fans etc, are WHAT these forums are for.

I was calling out the folk here that DEMAND this and DEMAND that, and if this isn't done then by George I'm outta here etc.

I demanded that my son follow the discipline I setup for him growing up. I demanded that he followed some rules when he got his driver's license, etc. I can DEMAND those things, because I had control over not whether or not he broke them, but the consequences and decisions if they WERE broken!

I am addressing this to the ones who criticize MY attitude and DEMAND. You can't demand something you have no control over! Very simple logic here!

AGAIN, for those that are demanding, but not LEAVING the team, how do we get it done???

You replied directly to my post, quoting me. Who else would one guess you are referring to?

Ugh. Enough.

Logic circle fail.

[gregcook68]

Mr. GregCook68,

I didn't say you were stupid. If that's how you took it, then perhaps you need to more slowly and precisely read what I wrote.

Failing that, simply saying since we don't have an inside line to management that nothing we write will change anything is your end all argument, and, heck there's more to life so let's all just move on. If so, you've missed why folks around here post their screeds.

People are not generally here to "aw-shucks we lost, better luck next time", at least I'm not.

Go on your way from this thread. I've certainly spent more than enough time typing these words, and from the looks of your responses I'm not sure you are getting me. And that's cool. It's not my aim to rile you up or make you feel slighted or insulted. But I'm gonna write what I like and it's up to you to fully read it, or simply ignore it, rather than come back with how stupid I said you were or how I insulted you. Sorry, didn't do that.

Back to football, seems Dalton is taking his medicine well based on his post game quotes, and the team has his back in the sense they project themselves as a unit, not one man, who lost the game. That's impressive.

King, YOU read threads better, I did not mention your name anywhere in that thread or insinuate you whatsoever. Yes, you said I had a defeatist loser attitude.

If that's the way you see it, so be it, but I would never criticize your attitude AND DISCUSSION in here on strategies and opinions on staff, team members, fans etc, are WHAT these forums are for.

I was calling out the folk here that DEMAND this and DEMAND that, and if this isn't done then by George I'm outta here etc.

I demanded that my son follow the discipline I setup for him growing up. I demanded that he followed some rules when he got his driver's license, etc. I can DEMAND those things, because I had control over not whether or not he broke them, but the consequences and decisions if they WERE broken!

I am addressing this to the ones who criticize MY attitude and DEMAND. You can't demand something you have no control over! Very simple logic here!

AGAIN, for those that are demanding, but not LEAVING the team, how do we get it done???

You replied directly to my post, quoting me. Who else would one guess you are referring to?

Ugh. Enough.

Logic circle fail.

Continue to rant and rave and let this thing dictate your days ahead king! I'll pray for you!

[kingwilly]

Mr. GregCook68,

I didn't say you were stupid. If that's how you took it, then perhaps you need to more slowly and precisely read what I wrote.

Failing that, simply saying since we don't have an inside line to management that nothing we write will change anything is your end all argument, and, heck there's more to life so let's all just move on. If so, you've missed why folks around here post their screeds.

People are not generally here to "aw-shucks we lost, better luck next time", at least I'm not.

Go on your way from this thread. I've certainly spent more than enough time typing these words, and from the looks of your responses I'm not sure you are getting me. And that's cool. It's not my aim to rile you up or make you feel slighted or insulted. But I'm gonna write what I like and it's up to you to fully read it, or simply ignore it, rather than come back with how stupid I said you were or how I insulted you. Sorry, didn't do that.

Back to football, seems Dalton is taking his medicine well based on his post game quotes, and the team has his back in the sense they project themselves as a unit, not one man, who lost the game. That's impressive.

King, YOU read threads better, I did not mention your name anywhere in that thread or insinuate you whatsoever. Yes, you said I had a defeatist loser attitude.

If that's the way you see it, so be it, but I would never criticize your attitude AND DISCUSSION in here on strategies and opinions on staff, team members, fans etc, are WHAT these forums are for.

I was calling out the folk here that DEMAND this and DEMAND that, and if this isn't done then by George I'm outta here etc.

I demanded that my son follow the discipline I setup for him growing up. I demanded that he followed some rules when he got his driver's license, etc. I can DEMAND those things, because I had control over not whether or not he broke them, but the consequences and decisions if they WERE broken!

I am addressing this to the ones who criticize MY attitude and DEMAND. You can't demand something you have no control over! Very simple logic here!

AGAIN, for those that are demanding, but not LEAVING the team, how do we get it done???

You replied directly to my post, quoting me. Who else would one guess you are referring to?

Ugh. Enough.

Logic circle fail.

Continue to rant and rave and let this thing dictate your days ahead king! I'll pray for you!

Greg, I don't rant or rave. I also don't need prayers but thanks for the thought. I realize I cannot expect you see my light, as you have your own, and that's cool. Or, as is popular, we will have to agree to disagree.

[gregcook68]

Mr. GregCook68,

I didn't say you were stupid. If that's how you took it, then perhaps you need to more slowly and precisely read what I wrote.

Failing that, simply saying since we don't have an inside line to management that nothing we write will change anything is your end all argument, and, heck there's more to life so let's all just move on. If so, you've missed why folks around here post their screeds.

People are not generally here to "aw-shucks we lost, better luck next time", at least I'm not.

Go on your way from this thread. I've certainly spent more than enough time typing these words, and from the looks of your responses I'm not sure you are getting me. And that's cool. It's not my aim to rile you up or make you feel slighted or insulted. But I'm gonna write what I like and it's up to you to fully read it, or simply ignore it, rather than come back with how stupid I said you were or how I insulted you. Sorry, didn't do that.

Back to football, seems Dalton is taking his medicine well based on his post game quotes, and the team has his back in the sense they project themselves as a unit, not one man, who lost the game. That's impressive.

King, YOU read threads better, I did not mention your name anywhere in that thread or insinuate you whatsoever. Yes, you said I had a defeatist loser attitude.

If that's the way you see it, so be it, but I would never criticize your attitude AND DISCUSSION in here on strategies and opinions on staff, team members, fans etc, are WHAT these forums are for.

I was calling out the folk here that DEMAND this and DEMAND that, and if this isn't done then by George I'm outta here etc.

I demanded that my son follow the discipline I setup for him growing up. I demanded that he followed some rules when he got his driver's license, etc. I can DEMAND those things, because I had control over not whether or not he broke them, but the consequences and decisions if they WERE broken!

I am addressing this to the ones who criticize MY attitude and DEMAND. You can't demand something you have no control over! Very simple logic here!

AGAIN, for those that are demanding, but not LEAVING the team, how do we get it done???

You replied directly to my post, quoting me. Who else would one guess you are referring to?

Ugh. Enough.

Logic circle fail.

Continue to rant and rave and let this thing dictate your days ahead king! I'll pray for you!

Greg, I don't rant or rave. I also don't need prayers but thanks for the thought. I realize I cannot expect you see my light, as you have your own, and that's cool. Or, as is popular, we will have to agree to disagree.

Agree to disagree in love!! One of the many million great things about being a Christian, is that people can't stop me from praying for them!!

[ArmyBengal]

Dalton is going to need the thickness of armadillo skin if he is going to keep the amount of heat he's going to get from getting to him.

I'm rooting for him. I really am, but i'm not as optimistic moving forward.

There's only so much Dalton can do with what God's given him. He doesn't have a strong arm, a tall body or quick feet. On top of all that, I don't think he's as accurate as was his billing coming out of college? Do any of you see that differently?

Nope and why I mentioned i'm not as optimistic moving forward.

I think Dalton has some really good things going for him and some bad things that he needs to improve.

I don't think that's really changed for me from earlier in the season.

The thing is, does he make those improvements ??

Again, i'm rooting for him. Why ?? What else are we to do ??

They aren't drafting a QB early. ARE. NOT.

[kingwilly]

Dalton is going to need the thickness of armadillo skin if he is going to keep the amount of heat he's going to get from getting to him.

I'm rooting for him. I really am, but i'm not as optimistic moving forward.

There's only so much Dalton can do with what God's given him. He doesn't have a strong arm, a tall body or quick feet. On top of all that, I don't think he's as accurate as was his billing coming out of college? Do any of you see that differently?

I don't need Aaron Rodgers back there but if we just got a QB who's 6'5" with a stronger arm, at the very least we'll see fewer batted down passes and fewer underthrown AJ Green TD passes.

I don't know if this will ever be proven true but IMO if we did stick a QB with those attributes in there, we'd soon see that this offense is so talented that any avg QB could put up the results that Dalton did if given the reps and off season coaching. Maybe I'm being unfair to him but I think most NFL QBs could have taken this talented team to 11-5 this year. A 2nd string guy nearly beat the Chargers a week ago

I think the things that he is supposed to lean on, lots of weapons, offense that fits his skillset, and high football IQ are maybe not as strong as once thought. Or, at least not strong enough when the pressure dials up and the lights get that much brighter. His decision making, the thing he had shown so well at TCU with only a handful of INTs, did not transfer to the NFL. I think that is safe to concede.

I've said it many times now. Dalton is Kitna 2.0, down to the T. Even the God stuff aligns. Kitna had the hats, Dalton cites chapter and verse on Tweets.

Recall how much Kitna helped ground this team? Brought a competitiveness and no-quit style? Dalton does that. Heck down to playing ability and limitations, they might as well be cousins.

Had Dalton picked up this team from the mat after Carson quit? Yep. Has he injected energy and a winning vibe, never getting flustered or down? Sure. But is it enough, is he enough. Not so far.

So, can he get there. As smartly compared, he's the ten foot ladder. Can he grow another rung or two? Not at this point. Will the wall lower itself? I doubt it.

We need a new ladder.

[cincyhokie]

Dalton is going to need the thickness of armadillo skin if he is going to keep the amount of heat he's going to get from getting to him.

I'm rooting for him. I really am, but i'm not as optimistic moving forward.

There's only so much Dalton can do with what God's given him. He doesn't have a strong arm, a tall body or quick feet. On top of all that, I don't think he's as accurate as was his billing coming out of college? Do any of you see that differently?

Nope and why I mentioned i'm not as optimistic moving forward.

I think Dalton has some really good things going for him and some bad things that he needs to improve.

I don't think that's really changed for me from earlier in the season.

The thing is, does he make those improvements ??

Again, i'm rooting for him. Why ?? What else are we to do ??

They aren't drafting a QB early. ARE. NOT.

Call me crazy, but I wouldn't be suprised at all if they drafted a QB in rounds 3-4. In fact, I think they have to do something at least in terms of adding a more credible back-up option.

Dalton is like Kitna. I like the guy, he shows flashes, he's a good student of the game. However, when it comes down to it, he's not the guy to get you over the top.

[ArmyBengal]

I'd actually be very surprised if they drafted a QB before the 5th.

If Gruden doesn't leave, I bet they don't draft one at all.

If Dalton fails again next season and they don't extend him, they will look for a QB early in 2015.

Then again, I could be wrong and Dalton could shock the world in winning the Super Bowl next year.

There's always next year, right ??

[COB]

Just heard on ESPN radio, 4 of the teams looking for head coaches want to interview Gruden. He's sort of the flavor of the month, and losing when we did helps him in that it opens up his candidacy earlier than expected. Also, Andy failing could help him, i.e., "look how limited this kid is, and Jay had him setting records and getting AFC player of the month awards."

I suspect Gruden is gone. And I think he might make a better head coach than OC. His OC slant is way too arena football flavored. If he gets an OC who's called plays in this league, I think Jay's input into play design could be a huge help with an experienced OC, and Jay has run football teams as HC before.

[kingwilly]

Just heard on ESPN radio, 4 of the teams looking for head coaches want to interview Gruden. He's sort of the flavor of the month, and losing when we did helps him in that it opens up his candidacy earlier than expected. Also, Andy failing could help him, i.e., "look how limited this kid is, and Jay had him setting records and getting AFC player of the month awards."

I suspect Gruden is gone. And I think he might make a better head coach than OC. His OC slant is way too arena football flavored. If he gets an OC who's called plays in this league, I think Jay's input into play design could be a huge help with an experienced OC, and Jay has run football teams as HC before.

I think if I was Gruden, I'd absolutely be playing up what was accomplished with Dalton.

My selling point to the Skins would be, just give me a chance and see what I can do with a guy like RG3. And he might be right.

[ArmyBengal]

He could play that up all he likes, but the other side of that coin will be considered as well.

What could Dalton have accomplished without some of the sh*tty playcalling ??

Don't get me wrong, Gruden might make a better HC, but I want no part of him continuing here.