Offensive Line Draft Talk Thread

[membengal]

Ordinarily I would not only consider it, I would be all for it, but if Sewell is what apparently might be, I don’t in this case. You don’t pass on a Munoz, or an Ogden, etc etc if they are there. No guarantees, but if that’s his potential, then...you take him. Plenty of time to sort it out.

happy thanksgiving.

[TJJackson]

I guess I am of the mind that the draft is such a crapshoot that if you gamble on getting a hit on 5 players vs getting a hit on 1 player, you are more likely to get a hit on 5

but I am glad we took Burrow rather than the 5 or so other players we could have had in his place, so............

that said, this time, because we have the franchise qb in hand, I'd prefer the basket of high-drafted  players over the one possible HOFer in order to better build a full team around said QB

[AMPHAR]

Leatherwood m (or another tackle) comes into play if they somehow win games down the stretch or trade out.

Sewell could be all that, BUT like last year they are in need of a bunch of players. 
 

 

 

 

 

[AMPHAR]

If you can get Willie Anderson AND Ray Lewis you pass on Ogden. 
 

But of course staying put and grabbing Ogden isn’t a wrong  move either

You could unite Williams and Leatherwood AND Burrow with Chase.

 

Last draft it was predictable that Herbert would be awesome.  He is and in theory could have had extra picks. 

They need a bunch of players.   



 

 

[membengal]

TJ -- you have Hobs in your corner. He wants them to trade down. Says Sewell is nice and all but we are set at T...

[Stripes]

48 minutes ago, membengal said:

TJ -- you have Hobs in your corner. He wants them to trade down. Says Sewell is nice and all but we are set at T...

When in doubt, the best strategy is always the exact opposite of whatever Hobson asks for.

[TJJackson]

5 hours ago, membengal said:

TJ -- you have Hobs in your corner. He wants them to trade down. Says Sewell is nice and all but we are set at T...

well, no, thats (in part) the opposite of what I am saying

we are MOST CERTAINLY NOT set at OT

trade down depends in large part on the value to be gained, but I think 5 additional day 2 picks and the number 2 OT would (for me) work

[cincyhokie]

Hobson is full of shit. Set at OT? 

[AMPHAR]

They will have 4 young tackles under contract at the end of this season. 
 

Drafting a tackle means cutting somebody,  so....... this is concerning because in their mind they are set at tackle. 
 

 

[cincyhokie]

Yeah, well they've also got their franchise QB out with a shredded knee. 

[cincyhokie]

13 hours ago, TJJackson said:

well, no, thats (in part) the opposite of what I am saying

we are MOST CERTAINLY NOT set at OT

trade down depends in large part on the value to be gained, but I think 5 additional day 2 picks and the number 2 OT would (for me) work

I'm completely ok with trading down and they should be able to do so with only going down a few draft spots. Draft the top OT with that top pick, gather more picks.

[AMPHAR]

IF that’s true.... then it doesn’t matter what coach you bring in here. 
 

It’s completely rational to think you’ll make playoffs with an offense needing to deliver the ball in 2.5 seconds or less.  
 

What a joke. 

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Not sure how you pass on Sewell if he pans out pre-draft.  There really isn't a position on that line that should be "set."  Even Jonah at LT.   If a Chase Young, Watt or Bosa type were there, then ok, but not seeing it yet.

[COB]

Set at tackle?  What’s Hobson been watching?  Because it’s not the same thing I’ve been watching.  We put our youngster back there and he basically got the crap kicked out of him for 10 games or whatever, sacked a shitload of times until he got wrecked.  Set at tackle?  Fucking insulting as hell.  
 

This lazy front office has the attitude that once they’ve secured a position player and signed him, they’re not doing all that work again.  That’s how we end up with Girlchrck and Bodine starting for the length of their deals when they were bottom 5 in the league at their position.  It’s like “we did our part, now you coach him up.”  
 

What if he can’t be coached up?  You have to move on from guys sometimes and upgrade.  You have to put in the work to get creative with contracts and cap management.  Not down at the old Brown Family Ace Hardware Store!  We still count out exactly how many wood screws you want and hand them to you in a tiny paper bag.  What?  There’s a giant Lowe’s moving in two blocks down?  Well, we still do things our way.  This works just fine.  Why, we’ve got all our grandkids stopping in after school to sweep up!  Can’t do that at Lowe’s.  
 

Fuck this family of Dartmouth fuckheads.  

[AMPHAR]

Way too early to get worked up about what Hobson says.  He's got 3 month of draft talk staring him in the face.     He was saying "trade down" last year and entertaining Dalton return as starter.   Year before he was entertaining DTs and LBs and the name Jonah Williams was absent from his early "Hobson Choice" whenever he talked about OTs.  Pimping Jawann Taylor.

In both those cases after the draft it was clear Burrow and Williams were the top targets and it was determined early in the process.   In the case of Williams they pimped LB so hard that most people still think and the Steelers clearly thought they had to trade up to steal Bush from us. 

Hobson isn't giving you anything accurate, he's got to do something to entertain draft talk for 3 months.

Lap is the only guy that shown accuracy in projecting the first round pick and that usually comes a week or two before.    Although last year it was a bad kept secret the Taylor loved Burrow and that was leaked via the Nebraska ties between the two families.

 

 

[AMPHAR]

on the 0-line.   It's basically Jonah Williams and a bunch of late round drafted or UDFAs.   The exception being Jordan.

When All-Pro and Pro Bowl teams are awarded no one will be claiming any of our O-line has been robbed.  

With the exception of Williams there is a good chance multiple draft OL prospects from this class will grade out better than what they have entering the draft.   

The worry part is if you read prior Bengals.com reports they have stood by this same group that hasn't delivered.   Spain removing Jordan (vs. Giants) is very worrisome.   So do they have an accurate read on these guys or not? Probably not.  Are they going to go against their initial scouting thoughts?    The talk of Spain is also worrisome because he's clearly an upgrade but still closer to a journeyman vs. All-Pro.

They need at least one more guy and probably two along with Williams that people can legitimately argue can be future All-Pros.   It's possible to find these guys later in the draft but it's unlikely.   It's becoming harder to find those guys in the first round.

So if Sewell has the grade that matches his hype, it's hard to pass up, IMO.   However,  it's a deep class and they need everywhere. 

[TJJackson]

I just read a Sewell-related comment I kinda liked from a fellow named WhoDey2019 on the Cincyjungle.com site

The suggestion made was addressing the problem of bringing in Sewell, a OLT, into a line where arguably the best player is Williams, who is also a OLT

Basically, it went like this:  this fellow believes Williams would be better suited as a OG than OT, so he moves Williams to OLG (which removes Jordan, who has been a big part of the problem imo) and installs Sewell at OLT.  This possibly makes the left side - the blind side - of the offensive line very strong

This would then leave us with the Hart problem at ORT.  The suggestion made here is that Spain should be installed as the ORG and Adeniji should be given every chance to take the ORT spot.  I'd argue that the Big Johnson (sometimes know as Fred) should also get a shot at this spot.  The loser between these two would be the backup/swing tackle

I kinda like this if (and only if) we take Sewell and ergo choose not to trade down for a much needed basket of day 2 picks this year and/or next

that said, I am on team [Trade Down] for the moment, and I want an ORT with the first pick we get back in the trade (likely still in the top 10) and an OG in the 2nd or early 3rd round

At Center.....Hopkins is signed through 2022 and we have two backups: Price and Finney.  I dont have much confidence in either, and I think it's probably time to seek an OC to groom as Hopkins eventual replacement.  I think a 5th round pick would suffice - emphasis on physical abilities/measurements, intelligence, and character over experience here, the rest can be coached as he rides the bench in 2021 and 2022.  On veteran rest days for Hopkins, he will take the reps with the first team

and of course with all this, you need a new offensive line coach.  I volunteer to drive Turner to the airport myself and watch him board his plane to ensure he is gone

 

[AMPHAR]

Everyone pays attention to QB scouting more.    In 2019 Zac showed up to Oklahoma pro day and everyone thought "Kyler Murray",  later that draft it was rumored the Bengals were trying to trade up to select Cody Ford.

Last year there was late speculation that Herbert was in play for the Bengals.   They were confirmed at the Oregon vs. Arizona game. I can't find anything saying they were at the Rose Bowl last year.  Oregon was one of the few schools to hold a pro day and the Bengals were there.    Oregon has a bunch of OL working out that day (not sure if Sewell did).    However it's easy to talk to position coaches etc.

I'm sure they already got a decent report on Sewell already.    I would say the same for Leatherwood considering they spent a lot of time scouting Williams.

 

[AMPHAR]

Cincy Jungle notes Fred being a healthy scratch 2 weeks in a row indicates Adeniji had won the “swing” tackle spot. 

[TJJackson]

So there's a Sewell article on Cincyjungle today

https://www.cincyjungle.com/2020/12/2/21755176/bengals-penei-sewell-highlights-oregon-ducks-football-nfl-draft

This writer is in favor of leaving Williams on the left and plugging Sewell in on the right

[Wraith]

Take the sure thing, draft Sewell.

In the top of the second you look at who has dropped.  Trey Smith or Wyatt Davis might still be there but the guy I want if he drops is Pat Freiermuth the TE from Penn State

[TJJackson]

have we had much luck drafting Penn State players?

for me, it is more of a sure thing to get one great player out of 5 or so selections than one......especially if the first pick of said lot is still in the top 10

[AMPHAR]

Right? Left?   I wonder how much this matters anymore?   It was always the best speed rusher was rushing against Left because most QBs are right handed and that's their blind side.   Then the heavier DE on the right thus making the RT the road grader run blocking TE.

Now a days teams have both run/pass called on a high percentage of snaps.  Defenses a lot of time have speed rushers on the field from both sides.   A lot of times tackles are run blocking out of two point stance.   Qb could be reading something post snap that turns a run into a pass and vice versa.

Williams to guard has merit because most snaps are out of shotgun with no drop so quick interior pressure can force the QB to move.   So the value of pass pro guard has risen.

 

 

 

 

[Wraith]

On 12/7/2020 at 9:37 AM, AMPHAR said:

"Right? Left?   I wonder how much this matters anymore?   It was always the best speed rusher was rushing against Left because most QBs are right handed and that's their blind side.   Then the heavier DE on the right thus making the RT the road grader run blocking TE.

Now a days teams have both run/pass called on a high percentage of snaps.  Defenses a lot of time have speed rushers on the field from both sides.   A lot of times tackles are run blocking out of two point stance.   Qb could be reading something post snap that turns a run into a pass and vice versa.

Williams to guard has merit because most snaps are out of shotgun with no drop so quick interior pressure can force the QB to move.   So the value of pass pro guard has risen."

Leave Williams at the Tackle position but maybe move him to RT, but to your other point.....TJ Watt rushes most often from the right side and I don't think any will argue that he is the division's most effective pass rusher.  Right or Left makes no matter anymore.  I also completely agree that Guard is WAAAAY undervalued in today's NFL.  IMHO Trey Smith from Tennessee is the best guard available if his health checks out, I have not been impressed with Wyatt Davis from the 4 OSU games I have seen, he was a liability against far inferior talent vs. Indiana....got abused on several snaps.

Also, for some reason NFL Teams still seem to be devaluing TE.  Take a look at the last 5 Super Bowls, and then compare the All-Pro roster at TE it is illuminating.

 

 

 

 

[AMPHAR]

I’m not sold on Spain but I just can’t see them entering TC with Jordan and Redmond.    Spain and Xavier?  That’s not too exciting. 
 

There are two top guard FAs but those will carry a high price that exceeds what they’ve historically balked at.   Brandon Schreff would be nice.

Trey Smith would be excellent but that would probably require a trade down.