Look who changed his mind

[kingwilly]

Don't get me started on this again. Why did Chad melt down? Chad loves Carson, you can't deny that. He had just lost his QB and freaked. Wouldn't you?

Would I start freaking out, go apes**t, start screaming at people, and turn halftime into a total disaster that took them out of the game that they were still leading? Hell no I wouldn't. Tough times are what separate the men from the boys. I'd act like a team leader, *calm people down*, realize we can still win it, man up, and go play.

Like any professional should do. At least the ones that aren't chokers.

Two words: JOHN KITNA. Another two words: BALL GAME.

you really just don't get it....I think I am done with you for a while. You are a waste of time/discussion.

[Ickey44]

Don't get me started on this again. Why did Chad melt down? Chad loves Carson, you can't deny that. He had just lost his QB and freaked. Wouldn't you?

Would I start freaking out, go apes**t, start screaming at people, and turn halftime into a total disaster that took them out of the game that they were still leading? Hell no I wouldn't. Tough times are what separate the men from the boys. I'd act like a team leader, *calm people down*, realize we can still win it, man up, and go play.

Like any professional should do. At least the ones that aren't chokers.

Two words: JOHN KITNA. Another two words: BALL GAME.

I think you forget that JOHN KITNA had them winning until 85 did his two-year-old tantrum routine at half-time. Then EVERYONE lost their "mojo". Let's be clear on one thing agreen, NO ONE who cares about winning as much as 85 says he does goes into halftime bitching about not getting the ball when they're winning, NO ONE. Whether or not he threw a punch at Marvin is still debatable, but it's been confirmed by at least two people in that locker room that day that he had to be restrained by multiple people. Does this sound like someone you want on your team?

[agreen_112]

Don't get me started on this again. Why did Chad melt down? Chad loves Carson, you can't deny that. He had just lost his QB and freaked. Wouldn't you?

Would I start freaking out, go apes**t, start screaming at people, and turn halftime into a total disaster that took them out of the game that they were still leading? Hell no I wouldn't. Tough times are what separate the men from the boys. I'd act like a team leader, *calm people down*, realize we can still win it, man up, and go play.

Like any professional should do. At least the ones that aren't chokers.

Two words: JOHN KITNA. Another two words: BALL GAME.

I think you forget that JOHN KITNA had them winning until 85 did his two-year-old tantrum routine at half-time. Then EVERYONE lost their "mojo". Let's be clear on one thing agreen, NO ONE who cares about winning as much as 85 says he does goes into halftime bitching about not getting the ball when they're winning, NO ONE. Whether or not he threw a punch at Marvin is still debatable, but it's been confirmed by at least two people in that locker room that day that he had to be restrained by multiple people. Does this sound like someone you want on your team?

No way in HELL John Kitna would've won that game.

[TJJackson]

No way in HELL John Kitna would've won that game.

Here's another game that John Kitna could not possibly have won.

Be sure to check the opponent's record prior to this game, OK?

http://www.jt-sw.com/football/boxes/index..../2003-11-kc-cin

Oh, and your buddy Chad has a footnote in this game, earned via words rather than catches

[agreen_112]

No way in HELL John Kitna would've won that game.

Here's another game that John Kitna could not possibly have won.

Be sure to check the opponent's record prior to this game, OK?

http://www.jt-sw.com/football/boxes/index..../2003-11-kc-cin

Oh, and your buddy Chad has a footnote in this game, earned via words rather than catches

I can't beleive the amount of knowledge and brain power one can have but at the same time lack every bit of common sense. Its amazing that you actually think JOHN KITNA had a chance at winning that game and possibly going on to win a SB. Its f**king JOHN KITNA!!!

Chad is not, and had nothing to do with, the reason why we lost that '05 playoff game. The fate of that game was exclusively the result of us losing Palmer. If the injury had not happened, we would've easily beaten the Steelers or at least it would've been a close game for the Steelers but they would NOT have won and then ulitimately won the SB... With a healthy Palmer, that trophy was ours for the taking and no one can argue that.

[TJJackson]

Nice how you ignored everything I wrote....and no, there are hundreds of thousands of folks who would argue the point with you, until they figure out that you're not listening

[Ickey44]

No way in HELL John Kitna would've won that game.

Here's another game that John Kitna could not possibly have won.

Be sure to check the opponent's record prior to this game, OK?

http://www.jt-sw.com/football/boxes/index..../2003-11-kc-cin

Oh, and your buddy Chad has a footnote in this game, earned via words rather than catches

I can't beleive the amount of knowledge and brain power one can have but at the same time lack every bit of common sense. Its amazing that you actually think JOHN KITNA had a chance at winning that game and possibly going on to win a SB. Its f**king JOHN KITNA!!!

Chad is not, and had nothing to do with, the reason why we lost that '05 playoff game. The fate of that game was exclusively the result of us losing Palmer. If the injury had not happened, we would've easily beaten the Steelers or at least it would've been a close game for the Steelers but they would NOT have won and then ulitimately won the SB... With a healthy Palmer, that trophy was ours for the taking and no one can argue that.

Have you ever noticed how much in the minority your opinions always are? Let's recall what happened in that playoff game. Palmer goes out in the very FIRST play, meaning that Jon Kitna led them to their halftime lead. Chad blows up at halftime and neither side of the ball played with very much fire after that. You can't tell me the team that came out and played the second half was the same team that came out in the first.

Also, my friend, you have no room to accuse others of having no common sense. You know, people who live in glass houses and such.....

[gregstephens]

No way in HELL John Kitna would've won that game.

Here's another game that John Kitna could not possibly have won.

Be sure to check the opponent's record prior to this game, OK?

http://www.jt-sw.com/football/boxes/index..../2003-11-kc-cin

Oh, and your buddy Chad has a footnote in this game, earned via words rather than catches

I can't beleive the amount of knowledge and brain power one can have but at the same time lack every bit of common sense. Its amazing that you actually think JOHN KITNA had a chance at winning that game and possibly going on to win a SB. Its f**king JOHN KITNA!!!

Chad is not, and had nothing to do with, the reason why we lost that '05 playoff game. The fate of that game was exclusively the result of us losing Palmer. If the injury had not happened, we would've easily beaten the Steelers or at least it would've been a close game for the Steelers but they would NOT have won and then ulitimately won the SB... With a healthy Palmer, that trophy was ours for the taking and no one can argue that.

Have you ever noticed how much in the minority your opinions always are? Let's recall what happened in that playoff game. Palmer goes out in the very FIRST play, meaning that Jon Kitna led them to their halftime lead. Chad blows up at halftime and neither side of the ball played with very much fire after that. You can't tell me the team that came out and played the second half was the same team that came out in the first.

Also, my friend, you have no room to accuse others of having no common sense. You know, people who live in glass houses and such.....

One quick correction...it was the second play. I remember that because not only was I one of the 65,000 that simultaneously said, "Oh sh&%" in PBS that night, but also because I temporarily trademarked the phrase, "The Second Play...We Will Never Forget". I was going to have that put on t-shirts and sell them when the Steelers came to PBS in 2006, but I couldn't dig up the funds. I woulda made a killing.

[agreen_112]

Nice how you ignored everything I wrote....and no, there are hundreds of thousands of folks who would argue the point with you, until they figure out that you're not listening

That KC game is irrelevant. It was regular season and the Chiefs were out of gas. Not a huge feat if you ask me. Anyways, that was several years ago when Kitna was a little above average. In '05... Washed up. Kitna was a great mentor for Palmer, that's it. The only feat in Kitna's whole career is that he was a great mentor to Carson Palmer. Period.

[agreen_112]

No way in HELL John Kitna would've won that game.

Here's another game that John Kitna could not possibly have won.

Be sure to check the opponent's record prior to this game, OK?

http://www.jt-sw.com/football/boxes/index..../2003-11-kc-cin

Oh, and your buddy Chad has a footnote in this game, earned via words rather than catches

I can't beleive the amount of knowledge and brain power one can have but at the same time lack every bit of common sense. Its amazing that you actually think JOHN KITNA had a chance at winning that game and possibly going on to win a SB. Its f**king JOHN KITNA!!!

Chad is not, and had nothing to do with, the reason why we lost that '05 playoff game. The fate of that game was exclusively the result of us losing Palmer. If the injury had not happened, we would've easily beaten the Steelers or at least it would've been a close game for the Steelers but they would NOT have won and then ulitimately won the SB... With a healthy Palmer, that trophy was ours for the taking and no one can argue that.

Have you ever noticed how much in the minority your opinions always are? Let's recall what happened in that playoff game. Palmer goes out in the very FIRST play, meaning that Jon Kitna led them to their halftime lead. Chad blows up at halftime and neither side of the ball played with very much fire after that. You can't tell me the team that came out and played the second half was the same team that came out in the first.

Also, my friend, you have no room to accuse others of having no common sense. You know, people who live in glass houses and such.....

The minority? I disagree. Hundreds of people read but never post so you don't know that... First throw, SECOND play... The team was playing on adrenaline, including Kitna, for the first half after losing our QB1. When they came out for the second half, with a lead of only 3, they were all out of life (must've had something to do with the word the Palmer wouldn't return). They didn't score one more point and Kitna threw terrible pass after terrible pass and interception after interception.. KITNA'S garbage, He can't lead a team, never will, which is why we dumped his ass within the next few months.

[TJJackson]

That KC game is irrelevant.

Not a huge feat if you ask me.

ROTFL!

[agreen_112]

That KC game is irrelevant.

Not a huge feat if you ask me.

ROTFL!

What's a bigger accomplishment; Winning a playoff game or beating an undefeated team in the regular season that really means nothing?

[Bobcat Bengal]

Palmer has come through plenty in the clutch.......when he throws it to TJ. You can't always come through in the clutch when Chad is dropping every other pass.

Yeah, don't get me wrong, Palmer has made some huge plays. You can call them clutch if you like, but I'm talking about the game winning drives, when it really matters. We've yet to see Palmer give us a Brett Favre or Tom Brady or Peyton Manning - like drive to win the game.

All I'm saying is that it's not one mans fault for the Bengals choking since 2005. I'm not trying to knock Palmer or any other Bengal.

He did it in Denver....threw that bomb to Henry.....anyone ELSE remember that?

Then it got called back cuz Chad was offsides or something.....

[TJJackson]

That KC game is irrelevant.

Not a huge feat if you ask me.

ROTFL!

What's a bigger accomplishment; Winning a playoff game or beating an undefeated team in the regular season that really means nothing?

You are completely missing the point, as usual, and there is no point trying to educate you

[gregstephens]

That KC game is irrelevant.

Not a huge feat if you ask me.

ROTFL!

What's a bigger accomplishment; Winning a playoff game or beating an undefeated team in the regular season that really means nothing?

You are completely missing the point, as usual, and there is no point trying to educate you

Felix and Oscar are back together. You two don't realize you complete each other, like Tom Cruise and Renee Zellwiger.

[agreen_112]

I'm missing your point because its irrelevent to the fact of the matter that John Kitna would not have won that game. Originally the blame was placed on Chad for a lot of things including the '05 playoff loss. That's completely untrue and unfair to say. We lost that game because we lost Carson Palmer; nothing more, nothing less.

To compare John Kitna's win against a lame Kansas City (who didn't win the championship that year) to the '05 playoff game is the worst point I've seen from you.

Agreen, out.

[BengalByTheBay]

Felix and Oscar are back together. You two don't realize you complete each other, like Tom Cruise and Renee Zellwiger.

I think they had each other at "you're a jackass."

[gregstephens]

Felix and Oscar are back together. You two don't realize you complete each other, like Tom Cruise and Renee Zellwiger.

I think they had each other at "you're a jackass."

I believe that is when I heard the harps and the doves.

[ArmyBengal]

I can't believe this is really still an argument for anyone to tell you the truth, but I'll play...

Chad = Douchebag (Although he didn't cost us that playoff game)

Kitna = Garbage (Although he didn't cost us that playoff game)

Want a place to point the finger in that loss ?? I point to the defense and call it good...

WHODEY !!!

[Ickey44]

No way in HELL John Kitna would've won that game.

Here's another game that John Kitna could not possibly have won.

Be sure to check the opponent's record prior to this game, OK?

http://www.jt-sw.com/football/boxes/index..../2003-11-kc-cin

Oh, and your buddy Chad has a footnote in this game, earned via words rather than catches

I can't beleive the amount of knowledge and brain power one can have but at the same time lack every bit of common sense. Its amazing that you actually think JOHN KITNA had a chance at winning that game and possibly going on to win a SB. Its f**king JOHN KITNA!!!

Chad is not, and had nothing to do with, the reason why we lost that '05 playoff game. The fate of that game was exclusively the result of us losing Palmer. If the injury had not happened, we would've easily beaten the Steelers or at least it would've been a close game for the Steelers but they would NOT have won and then ulitimately won the SB... With a healthy Palmer, that trophy was ours for the taking and no one can argue that.

Have you ever noticed how much in the minority your opinions always are? Let's recall what happened in that playoff game. Palmer goes out in the very FIRST play, meaning that Jon Kitna led them to their halftime lead. Chad blows up at halftime and neither side of the ball played with very much fire after that. You can't tell me the team that came out and played the second half was the same team that came out in the first.

Also, my friend, you have no room to accuse others of having no common sense. You know, people who live in glass houses and such.....

The minority? I disagree. Hundreds of people read but never post so you don't know that... First throw, SECOND play... The team was playing on adrenaline, including Kitna, for the first half after losing our QB1. When they came out for the second half, with a lead of only 3, they were all out of life (must've had something to do with the word the Palmer wouldn't return). They didn't score one more point and Kitna threw terrible pass after terrible pass and interception after interception.. KITNA'S garbage, He can't lead a team, never will, which is why we dumped his ass within the next few months.

We "dumped" him? He choose not to resign with us cause he wanted to be a starter. We wanted to keep him. And Chad was part of the team in 05 so he does have something to do with why we lost. And if you're so naive that you believe that this team is nothing without Palmer, then we have nothing more to discuss.

So you believe that we only got the halftime lead from the adrenaline of losing Palmer and then, what, totally forgot about Palmer in the second half? Could that possibly be because the whole team just saw a grown man acting like a three year old? That you're defending?

You clearly don't have the mental capacity to comprehend what myself and many other people are telling you. And, yes, I do know you're opinion is in the minority most of the time because no one EVER backs you up on any of your views.

[agreen_112]

No way in HELL John Kitna would've won that game.

Here's another game that John Kitna could not possibly have won.

Be sure to check the opponent's record prior to this game, OK?

http://www.jt-sw.com/football/boxes/index..../2003-11-kc-cin

Oh, and your buddy Chad has a footnote in this game, earned via words rather than catches

I can't beleive the amount of knowledge and brain power one can have but at the same time lack every bit of common sense. Its amazing that you actually think JOHN KITNA had a chance at winning that game and possibly going on to win a SB. Its f**king JOHN KITNA!!!

Chad is not, and had nothing to do with, the reason why we lost that '05 playoff game. The fate of that game was exclusively the result of us losing Palmer. If the injury had not happened, we would've easily beaten the Steelers or at least it would've been a close game for the Steelers but they would NOT have won and then ulitimately won the SB... With a healthy Palmer, that trophy was ours for the taking and no one can argue that.

Have you ever noticed how much in the minority your opinions always are? Let's recall what happened in that playoff game. Palmer goes out in the very FIRST play, meaning that Jon Kitna led them to their halftime lead. Chad blows up at halftime and neither side of the ball played with very much fire after that. You can't tell me the team that came out and played the second half was the same team that came out in the first.

Also, my friend, you have no room to accuse others of having no common sense. You know, people who live in glass houses and such.....

The minority? I disagree. Hundreds of people read but never post so you don't know that... First throw, SECOND play... The team was playing on adrenaline, including Kitna, for the first half after losing our QB1. When they came out for the second half, with a lead of only 3, they were all out of life (must've had something to do with the word the Palmer wouldn't return). They didn't score one more point and Kitna threw terrible pass after terrible pass and interception after interception.. KITNA'S garbage, He can't lead a team, never will, which is why we dumped his ass within the next few months.

We "dumped" him? He choose not to resign with us cause he wanted to be a starter. We wanted to keep him. And Chad was part of the team in 05 so he does have something to do with why we lost. And if you're so naive that you believe that this team is nothing without Palmer, then we have nothing more to discuss.

So you believe that we only got the halftime lead from the adrenaline of losing Palmer and then, what, totally forgot about Palmer in the second half? Could that possibly be because the whole team just saw a grown man acting like a three year old? That you're defending?

You clearly don't have the mental capacity to comprehend what myself and many other people are telling you. And, yes, I do know you're opinion is in the minority most of the time because no one EVER backs you up on any of your views.

WITHOUT PALMER, Yes, wheter we're talking about '05 or this season, THIS TEAM IS NOTHING. Palmer is this teams only hope with a decent defense. NO CHANCE IN COLD HELL KITNA WOULD'VE WON THAT GAME.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

WITHOUT PALMER, Yes, wheter we're talking about '05 or this season, THIS TEAM IS NOTHING. Palmer is this teams only hope with a decent defense. NO CHANCE IN COLD HELL KITNA WOULD'VE WON THAT GAME.

Spot Kitna a halftime lead against a wildcard team at home, and he can't pull one out? Sure he could.

Kitna wasn't fantastic, and his tendency to do fantastically retarded things at times boggled the mind, but he wasn't terrible. That is, if Kitna and the coaches had an appropriate environment to prepare at halftime as opposed to dealing with an emotional WR who - depending on your source - was screaming at or punching coaches.

You've apparently never had to deal with pressure as a professional, but let me tell you, that's not how you do it.

[duus]

WITHOUT PALMER, Yes, wheter we're talking about '05 or this season, THIS TEAM IS NOTHING. Palmer is this teams only hope with a decent defense. NO CHANCE IN COLD HELL KITNA WOULD'VE WON THAT GAME.

Spot Kitna a halftime lead against a wildcard team at home, and he can't pull one out? Sure he could.

Kitna wasn't fantastic, and his tendency to do fantastically retarded things at times boggled the mind, but he wasn't terrible. That is, if Kitna and the coaches had an appropriate environment to prepare at halftime as opposed to dealing with an emotional WR who - depending on your source - was screaming at or punching coaches.

You've apparently never had to deal with pressure as a professional, but let me tell you, that's not how you do it.

I have to agree. I am surely not a Kitna fan by any stretch, but I do believe had the team had more maturity (individually as well as as a unit), he could surely have led them to victory. But we all know that was not the case ... and it does start with the leaders of the team not named Palmer (who of course was injured). You know, I continue to think about this halftime garbage. Although we may never know exactly what happened, but IF he took a swing at his coach ... that should have been it. No discussion. I simply cannot imagine anyone taking a swing at their coach or boss. If I ever did that there is no way I would be employed the next day. You've used the word 'professional'. That is key. Problems happen. Frustrations occur. Heck, you may ever honestly HATE your coworker or boss. But you never ... NEVER ... take a swing at them. (at least not in a workplace setting )

[agreen_112]

WITHOUT PALMER, Yes, wheter we're talking about '05 or this season, THIS TEAM IS NOTHING. Palmer is this teams only hope with a decent defense. NO CHANCE IN COLD HELL KITNA WOULD'VE WON THAT GAME.

Spot Kitna a halftime lead against a wildcard team at home, and he can't pull one out? Sure he could.

Kitna wasn't fantastic, and his tendency to do fantastically retarded things at times boggled the mind, but he wasn't terrible. That is, if Kitna and the coaches had an appropriate environment to prepare at halftime as opposed to dealing with an emotional WR who - depending on your source - was screaming at or punching coaches.

You've apparently never had to deal with pressure as a professional, but let me tell you, that's not how you do it.

Dude, DC, quit playing yourself. Kitna was OWNED by the Steelers throughout his Bengal's career... I can't believe you guys actually think Chad was the fault behind us losing that '05 playoff game. Rediculous.

[duus]

Dude, DC, quit playing yourself. Kitna was OWNED by the Steelers throughout his Bengal's career... I can't believe you guys actually think Chad was the fault behind us losing that '05 playoff game. Rediculous.

I'm not sure folks have said that it was his fault and his fault alone. The point is more that he surely did not help things. In fact, he may have been the trigger that started the downward spiral during halftime and into the second half. The bottom line is that he did something no true professional athlete or professional in general should do. My hope is that he regrets that as the worst mistake of his career. It would go so far in my view if he would come out and admit how completely wrong that was and dedicate his remaining years as a Bengal to correct that mistake. That would be professional. That would be mature. That would be so not-Chad.