Offensive Line Draft Talk Thread

[Stripes]

The 'generational talent' narrative of this draft class has been rather remarkable. I don't mean to be cheeky in saying so -- it could be valid for everyone.

Lawrence - generational QB
Chase - generational WR
Pitts - generational TE
Sewell - was once treated as a generational OT, though not at this point

Hell, even Zach Wilson is starting to get that kind of treatment from some sources.

It's very difficult to gauge how seriously it should all be taken, particularly given that it's Pro Days driving much of the dialogue. I am content to view Lawrence that way just because it's been the projection for about three years. Otherwise if the talk is even half valid, this should be one of the best set of top five-ten picks since the turn of the millennium.

[COB]

TJ’s mom is a generational talent.

[TJJackson]

1 hour ago, COB said:

TJ’s mom is a generational talent.

nah, but my dead gramma can passblock like Freddie Childress

[HoosierCat]

11 hours ago, Stripes said:

The 'generational talent' narrative of this draft class has been rather remarkable. I don't mean to be cheeky in saying so -- it could be valid for everyone.

Lawrence - generational QB
Chase - generational WR
Pitts - generational TE
Sewell - was once treated as a generational OT, though not at this point

Hell, even Zach Wilson is starting to get that kind of treatment from some sources.

It's very difficult to gauge how seriously it should all be taken, particularly given that it's Pro Days driving much of the dialogue. I am content to view Lawrence that way just because it's been the projection for about three years. Otherwise if the talk is even half valid, this should be one of the best set of top five-ten picks since the turn of the millennium.

My advice is just to log off for the next three weeks. The film has all been watched, the breakdowns have all been done, the numbers have been crunched, the days have all been pro’d, etc., and all the conversations are now fully circular. Everything you hear now is just filler because the NFL thought it was a good idea to make everyone wait an extra month for the draft.

[AMPHAR]

12 hours ago, Stripes said:

The 'generational talent' narrative of this draft class has been rather remarkable. I don't mean to be cheeky in saying so -- it could be valid for everyone.

Lawrence - generational QB
Chase - generational WR
Pitts - generational TE
Sewell - was once treated as a generational OT, though not at this point

Hell, even Zach Wilson is starting to get that kind of treatment from some sources.

It's very difficult to gauge how seriously it should all be taken, particularly given that it's Pro Days driving much of the dialogue. I am content to view Lawrence that way just because it's been the projection for about three years. Otherwise if the talk is even half valid, this should be one of the best set of top five-ten picks since the turn of the millennium.

You are right it is very difficult to gauge how seriously to take the "generational" term.   It seems like the squawking heads have fallen in love with that term.

However,  there are times in which a draft class is loaded vs. other years.   Considering the Bengals have good picks in this one.   I hope it's true in which you can find high level starters til the 4th round.

In particular the year they grabbed AJ Green that top 10 was loaded going from memory.   I think the year they got Chad was also a loaded year. 

[membengal]

I will say this - John Sheerhan has a view and take on this that mirrors my own, and he is articulating it clearer. Co-sign, all of this:

Quote

john sheeran
@John__Sheeran
·
15m
now because i feel like i have to say it, all this doesn't mean sewell wouldn't be a great pick. it just means unless they *really* hit on a non-first round receiver or higgins develops into something amazing, it's still gonna be hard for the offense to be competitive in 2021.

 

[membengal]

 

[membengal]

 

[COB]

Ok, John Sheeran has convinced me.  I don’t know who he is, but he has absolutely convinced me.  Chase in the first, non-generational tackle in the second.  

[HoosierCat]

From Breer at si today:

Quote

Eyes are on Atlanta and Detroit now. The first three picks are spoken for. And that leaves the Falcons as a team to watch—one that’s going to have to make a decision on its pick with some complicated finances at quarterback (due to all Matt Ryan’s restructures), and a team in need of cheaper young talent with which to surround its core. My guess has been that the Falcons will stick at No. 4 and take a quarterback, because I don’t think they want to count on picking that high again and this happens to be a really strong year at the position. But I do know they’re open to the idea of trading the pick and have had exploratory talks with other teams on a deal that would have someone else moving up to No. 4. And Detroit’s another team I’ve been told to keep an eye on—since they can give other teams an opportunity to jump Carolina and Denver in the quarterback line (though that’d more likely be a draft-day deal, since you can’t totally be sure who’ll be there at No. 7 right now). I’m told they’ve got a cluster of players ID’d they’d be good with at seven, but are open to doing a deal to move down as well. What about Cincinnati and Miami? The former’s been conservative in moving first-rounders over the last 25 years, and will likely have its pick of a top target (Kyle Pitts/Ja’Marr Chase) or a bodyguard for Joe Burrow at No. 5; and the latter went through a lot to stay in the top six within the context of its trade with San Francisco (though it’s hard to rule moves out with Chris Grier pulling the trigger for the Dolphins).

 

[AMPHAR]

Eh,  IF the Bengals just hit on the top 5 pick in this draft.   They won't maximize Burrow.  This has always been the case.

Tackle vs. WR?    I say WR or Pitts because it appears those guys have less ????.   I also believe the WR will get plucked faster and won't be there when 38 comes around.

Pitts is still my top choice.    He's the biggest mismatch for a defense.   Also, I think he has the bigger impact in helping protection via coming open quickly.    LBs and Safeties will not be free to make havoc for the blocking schemes.   If your a half step too late it's a field changing play with Pitts. 

Think back post Burrow injury and all the confusion on the line when LBs were stuffed up at the line,  Hart/Spain looking like clowns as the free runner tees off on Allen.   A defense will be playing with fire trying that stuff IF they have Pitts.

It's a two yard pass with a huge catch radius and 40 yard play with a broken tackle.

[Wraith]

4 minutes ago, AMPHAR said:

Eh,  IF the Bengals just hit on the top 5 pick in this draft.   They won't maximize Burrow.  This has always been the case.

Tackle vs. WR?    I say WR or Pitts because it appears those guys have less ????.   I also believe the WR will get plucked faster and won't be there when 38 comes around.

Pitts is still my top choice.    He's the biggest mismatch for a defense.   Also, I think he has the bigger impact in helping protection via coming open quickly.    LBs and Safeties will not be free to make havoc for the blocking schemes.   If your a half step too late it's a field changing play with Pitts. 

Think back post Burrow injury and all the confusion on the line when LBs were stuffed up at the line,  Hart/Spain looking like clowns as the free runner tees off on Allen.   A defense will be playing with fire trying that stuff IF they have Pitts.

It's a two yard pass with a huge catch radius and 40 yard play with a broken tackle.

I agree, Pitts will have the biggest impact of any player in this draft, that said conventional wisdom has #1 WR as more valuable based on WAR  than any position other than QB and Edge.

[TJJackson]

this is incorrect

quite simply, the quarterback doesnt make throws from his back or  hospital bed

one can indeed experience emotion (anger, sadness, shock) on watching a knee becoming The Knee. 

But the fact of the matter, all emotions put aside, is that these sort of hits need to not happen (or happen far far far less frequently) in order for this team to be successful

so no, John, got to disagree with you here

[membengal]

Did you read the rest of the thread, or no?

[TJJackson]

yep.

i like john, but "fueled with emotion" is simply wrong

[Stripes]

Lost in the ~protect Burrow~ rhetoric is that the running game sucked last year, and an offensive lineman figures to help with that problem more than a receiver would. Both would have some tangible impact. Anyway, if those positions are the first two picks, I no longer give a damn what order they come in.

[HoosierCat]

 

[GapControl]

On 4/4/2021 at 12:20 PM, Wraith said:

Chad Johnson was under 6' 2" and ran a 4.5 /40

Devote Adams (Chase's most common pro comp) is under 6' 2" and also ran a 4.5 /40

Ja'Marr Chase is a much better athlete than either.  I can guarantee you that Chad Johnson never had a 41" vertical....for that matter neither did AJ.

Oops I gave Chad an extra inch he never needed.

what’s up with Chase’s catch radius?  Does he have really long arms ?

 

[COB]

1 hour ago, HoosierCat said:

 

Tobin telegraphing our pick, what a doofus.

[membengal]

Not sure it matters, COB. It's Chase or Sewell. At lease one will be there. No one is expending precious draft capital to move up that part of the first round ahead of us for a non-QB. 

[Wraith]

10 hours ago, GapControl said:

Oops I gave Chad an extra inch he never needed.

what’s up with Chase’s catch radius?  Does he have really long arms ?

 

Nope neither short nor long arms.  He measured in at 30.25" with 9.625" hands.  He isn't a catch radius monster, if you want that you should hope they get Pitts who at almost 6' 6" has an 83" wingspan and did not drop a single pass last year.

Instead Chase has incredible burst (41" very 11' broad jump), deep speed (4.38/40), is a route technician who has a warrior mentality (will fight for every contested ball).  Chase is very strong as evidenced by 23 reps at 225 and uses that strength both in keeping defenders away from the ball and breaking tackles.  The timing also is important here, Burrow knows Chase, knows what routes he likes and how he runs those routes, it should be easy to get these guys in synch again.  Chase is a home run hitter who can also hit for average.  He can take the top off the defense because teams will have to respect him vertically but he is sharp in his cuts and is very effective short and intermediate.  The combo of Higgins, Boyd, and Chase fit very nicely together and teams are going to have a hard time dealing with them. More importantly, because teams are going to have to defend all quadrants of the field they cannot stack the box, that should make the run game and the oline better, you blitz Burrow with this trio of weapons you are going to be in trouble you put 8 in the box to stop the run and you have three 1,000 yard receivers in man coverage.  

Last year AJ Green was thrown 101 passes and he caught only 47.  Increase your effiency there and defenders are going to be facing a nightmare.  In 2019 Chase caught 84 out if 105 targets from Burrow for 20 TDs....and he was only 19 years old.

 

[AMPHAR]

12 hours ago, GapControl said:

Oops I gave Chad an extra inch he never needed.

what’s up with Chase’s catch radius?  Does he have really long arms ?

 

Chase's catch radius is significant based on his vertical.      I'm not sure how it compares just based on height and length.

He'll be a significant target down the field for sure.  

[AMPHAR]

10 hours ago, COB said:

Tobin telegraphing our pick, what a doofus.

Not really.   Picks 1-3 are telegraphed.    4th is still some question.   No one is trading above 5 to grab a non QB.

They'll have their pick of multiple players fans have targeted.   Its just a matter of any trade downs or which player they end up taking

 

[COB]

If we let everyone know we want Chase, Atlanta can feint that direction and force a swap with attendant compensation.  That’s why these teams all play it close to the vest.  
 

But if Atlanta feints towards Chase, do we even care?  Tobin acts like he doesn’t want to take a tackle because so many starting tackles are available in later rounds.  (Alert - Duke Tobin considered Bobby Hart a starting tackle).  But is that what he really thinks?  

[AMPHAR]

53 minutes ago, COB said:

If we let everyone know we want Chase, Atlanta can feint that direction and force a swap with attendant compensation.  That’s why these teams all play it close to the vest.  
 

But if Atlanta feints towards Chase, do we even care?  Tobin acts like he doesn’t want to take a tackle because so many starting tackles are available in later rounds.  (Alert - Duke Tobin considered Bobby Hart a starting tackle).  But is that what he really thinks?  

Have to remember there was strong suggestion the Miami Dolphins would take Herbert at this point last year.   So anything being said can be some percentage of BS.

IMO,  I don't even care IF Chase and Pitts fly off the board before 5. (Would be slightly disappointed)   Because they are worse case looking at Sewell or my personal pick Slater.    But also in this scenario there's a QB at 5 that you take a trade for.