Offensive Line Draft Talk Thread

[ArmyBengal]

The fact that Hart remains their most viable option is beyond pathetic.
His lack of ability, coupled with his two cent head are a recipe for Burrow to get blown up.

[TJJackson]

from my point of view, if its a remotely close competition, they just HAVE to go with the younger guy, so he can continue to improve

with Hart, you know what that lump of crap is already both on the field and off

[HoosierCat]

4 minutes ago, TJJackson said:

from my point of view, if its a remotely close competition, they just HAVE to go with the younger guy, so he can continue to improve

with Hart, you know what that lump of crap is already both on the field and off

I think it’s a mistake to describe Hart as a lump of crap. A lump of crap might actually be effective in thwarting a rusher, if only because they’d be inclined to take a couple extra seconds to not step in it. He’s more of a lump of Jell-o, something you wouldn’t think twice about crashing through and which might actually be fun.

[AMPHAR]

With Burrow taking his first NFL snaps being "close" to Bobby Hart isn't exactly a great reason to start Fred. 

I think you probably will have to platoon if it's close playing the guy that has the best match up or most effective.

Not the best situation but the hand it's that's been dealt.

 

[AMPHAR]

Hobson declares MJ the most improved player in camp. 
 

Great news! 

[AMPHAR]

Yeah they sucked game 1.   Hopefully not going to continue. 
 

 

[HoosierCat]

Yes, I know: dead horse comma beating a. But what scares me about this is that this is how Cincy QBs get Bengalized. We’ve seen it with Klingler, with Palmer, with Dalton. Put them behind a terrible line and watch them get battered until they start looking like a deer in the headlights, hearing footsteps and running from ghosts. I know there’s no easy fix right now but Hart cant be allowed to keep playing if this is what awaits.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

It's getting REALLY old watching this every single year.  Where was Jordan yesterday? Hurt? Maybe I just didn't see him out there. I can't remember what it's like to have a good o-line here at this point, that isn't breaking-down constantly and can at least give a QB and RB time/room, they lose so many games due to just this issue alone.  The entire first half yesterday was comically bad from that group - so bad it looked amateurish.  I expected some break downs, but not every single play for an entire half and most of a game.   

Their whole organizational approach to the o-line needs to change, spend some $$ on it, put some real attention into it and get a new position coach if needed etc.., but most of all invest some real talent on the interior and stop skimping on Guards, find someone who can develop guys, enough already, just tired of this stupid nonsense every single season.

 

[membengal]

Jordan was in all game. He was good.

 

hart is still a disaster. I assumed that Johnson would have been given a chance to win the job. He never was. This is on Turner. 

[Stripes]

Williams, Jordan, and Hopkins all did a good job as far as I saw. The unit should be better than last year even with the shitty first half. The right side is exactly what we expected it to be. If Johnson wasn't good enough in camp to supplant Hart, maybe try Adeniji. It doesn't really get worse.

[AMPHAR]

Palmer and Dalton have NO "bengalized" excuse.   Their lack of post season success falls on bad luck with injury and their own poor play.

As far as who was good or bad individually,  I'll wait for the PFF grades.   I would be shocked if anyone individual graded out as a solid starter from this game.    Hart got whipped for sure.   I think Hopkins struggled, didn't look very athletic. 

Of course this was expected as the Chargers have an elite d-line. 

The passing pocket from all angles didn't last long at all.   The pocket integrity got blown up so fast that the QB had no choice to move to spots that linemen had no idea where he was which destroys leverage of everyone.   Hard to say anyone played "good" or "solid" because Burrow (excellent job) had to move all over the place the whole game.   It's not like he was constantly sliding left behind Jonah Williams.   It just wasn't good at all.

Burrow's misses down the field, IMO, were because of this because he was sped up. 

 

 

[AMPHAR]

1 hour ago, ShulaSteakhouse said:

It's getting REALLY old watching this every single year.  Where was Jordan yesterday? Hurt? Maybe I just didn't see him out there. I can't remember what it's like to have a good o-line here at this point, that isn't breaking-down constantly and can at least give a QB and RB time/room, they lose so many games due to just this issue alone.  The entire first half yesterday was comically bad from that group - so bad it looked amateurish.  I expected some break downs, but not every single play for an entire half and most of a game.   

Their whole organizational approach to the o-line needs to change, spend some $$ on it, put some real attention into it and get a new position coach if needed etc.., but most of all invest some real talent on the interior and stop skimping on Guards, find someone who can develop guys, enough already, just tired of this stupid nonsense every single season.

 

I feel you.   IF it doesn't turn around.  Tobin's job has to be on the line IF this franchise truly wants to win.   Followed by Zach.

Gone are the days that Alexander is a hold over.    We've gone through 3 line coaches and a slew of draft picks/FA signings.   Mike Brown isn't involved anymore at that level. 

That said,  the shock of them getting whipped up front the first game shouldn't be a shock.  Chargers are supposed to be and looked the part of an Elite front. 

Williams and Jordan; fans have every right to expect improvement as snaps pile up.   Hart sucks and it's not going to change.   Hopkins, IMO, is blue collar player at best. 

I just don't know.   Have to watch it unfold.  Williams and Jordan have to lead the way. 

[AMPHAR]

3 hours ago, HoosierCat said:

Yes, I know: dead horse comma beating a. But what scares me about this is that this is how Cincy QBs get Bengalized. We’ve seen it with Klingler, with Palmer, with Dalton. Put them behind a terrible line and watch them get battered until they start looking like a deer in the headlights, hearing footsteps and running from ghosts. I know there’s no easy fix right now but Hart cant be allowed to keep playing if this is what awaits.

I'm not trying to stick up for Hart.    But I love the twitter knee jerk screen shots or TV videos.

 

[membengal]

FWIW:

 

[membengal]

 

[kingwilly]

2 hours ago, AMPHAR said:

I'm not trying to stick up for Hart.    But I love the twitter knee jerk screen shots or TV videos.

 

Citing video evidence is powerful, especially in sports. Mine own eyes and all. 
 

don’t tell me how we don’t know the play, block scheme, assignments etc. 

[Stripes]

Remarkable that one guy really did account for such a huge chunk of the trash.

And it's the exact guy everyone expected.

[AMPHAR]

Who gave up the rest of the sacks? 

 

[HoosierCat]

Burrow was blamed for one, don’t know about the third.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

3 hours ago, membengal said:

 

 

Pretty terrible all-around, even against an elite pass-rushing defense with elite CB's.  I dunno, expected it really, but at some point you just want to see improvement from the veteran guys, but it's clear they're over-matched against top DL's.  You will not win playoff games with this o-line, period, end of story.  

[HoosierCat]

 

[AMPHAR]

12 hours ago, ShulaSteakhouse said:

 

Pretty terrible all-around, even against an elite pass-rushing defense with elite CB's.  I dunno, expected it really, but at some point you just want to see improvement from the veteran guys, but it's clear they're over-matched against top DL's.  You will not win playoff games with this o-line, period, end of story.  

So that's 17 hurries and 3 sacks?    I think they ran 68 plays.     I remember a graphic thrown up for plays negative and at 1 point it was 6 for the bengals.

These are horrific numbers something that falls through the cracks of just base line PFF grades.

Last year people were conned into believing the line improved based on PFF numbers.  It didn't (pass pro).   They play calling changed to protect Finley.   The rushing game improved tremendously.     Dalton returned and vs the Dolphins (one of the worse pass rush teams)  The line got run over.   

Might want to change offensive to protect this line similar to Finley.   It was foolish to line up empty against this Chargers defense given this line and also to pass so much in the first half.  Not real impressed with ZT on this.

 

[HoosierCat]

Many years back, during the Dark Times, I remember an early preseason game. I think it was against Chicago. The Bears just owned the Bengals oline, destroyed it utterly. Postgame, Big Willy cried that the Bears were doing things like stunting and blitzing — how dare they! In preseason no less! — and that the line looked so bad because they hadn’t installed their protection packages yet. Everything would be fine, he assured fans. (Spoiler: it wasn’t.)

So yesterday I read that the line’s struggles are being blamed on communications issues that happened because — again, how dare they! — the Chargers D came out in a different formation than the Bengals expected. Zounds! Those cads! How dare they not do what we expect them to do!

And OK I get it. We’ve got a couple new players, a whole line that hasn’t played together, no preseason, first game blah blah blah. But yeah, it doesn’t exactly give me a huge confidence boost re Taylor & Co.

[COB]

Bobby Hart is being treated like Ghuicheck and Bodine.  Just having starts handed to him as he proves himself incompetent over and over.  Once they finally move on from him, he probably won’t even get minutes ever again, even if he inexplicably lands on a roster for another season.

[HoosierCat]

58 minutes ago, COB said:

Bobby Hart is being treated like Ghuicheck and Bodine.  Just having starts handed to him as he proves himself incompetent over and over.  Once they finally move on from him, he probably won’t even get minutes ever again, even if he inexplicably lands on a roster for another season.

Yeah, I hadn’t really thought about it, but it is kind of unique to this franchise. I mean, over the years as I’ve moved around I’ve casually followed the Jets, Giants and Bears just because they’re what the local news covers. And I can’t recall situations outside of QB (in that case usually a high draft pick) when there is a multi-year starter who is clearly a liability, but doesn’t get replaced, sometimes gets rewarded with more money, and is defended to the proverbial death by coaches. And then when he finally leaves, is basically never heard of again despite having dozens of starts under his belt.