Offensive Line Draft Talk Thread

[ShulaSteakhouse]

17 hours ago, TJJackson said:

Hmm so he DOES wanna play in 2021 after all

we need to get him in for a visit as well asap.

career ORG

I don't know what cap space they have left, but they don't seem too active, those top FA G's left are mighty expensive I'm guessing.   I can't remember the last OG they signed as a FA that was one of the best available.  MB has been almost completely reliant on the draft for the o-line, to a fault.  

They will need to have some luck if that interior line is going to be any good, i.e. Price and/or Carman or one of the other G's stepping-up.  Slim pickins talent-wise.

[TJJackson]

2 hours ago, ShulaSteakhouse said:

I don't know what cap space they have left, but they don't seem too active, those top FA G's left are mighty expensive I'm guessing.   I can't remember the last OG they signed as a FA that was one of the best available.  MB has been almost completely reliant on the draft for the o-line, to a fault.  

They will need to have some luck if that interior line is going to be any good, i.e. Price and/or Carman or one of the other G's stepping-up.  Slim pickins talent-wise.

last I heard, remaining cap space was on the order of 18 million

cant know the players ability or price if you dont at least bring them in for a talk and a look-see.  If he doesnt have anything left in the tank, fine, let him walk.......but I am frustrated when they dont even bother to take a look at a guy who could help, especially when it is at a key weak spot like ORG is for us.  Pay for plane fare and a couple meals, have the medical team and Pollack check him out, I think thats simple due diligence

 

 

 

[TJJackson]

hey mem

so there is allegedly a statement on the Athletic that Spain is beating XSF for the OLG spot

location: https://theathletic.com/2665884/2021/06/22/most-important-takeaways-of-the-bengals-offseason-program-offense/ https://pic.twitter.com/VQs63Y0qxP

can you post just the part(s) about XSF, Spain, and the battle at OLG

well ok, if there is something on Carman, Ossai, D Smith, or Cam Sample.....I'd like to see that too, if you're feeling generous-ish

[membengal]

Quote

 

Even before the Bengals began their offseason workouts, there was a lot of optimism, whether it was coming from inside the walls of Paul Brown Stadium or the outside, about how good their offense can be in 2021.

One month later, with 10 practices during OTAs and minicamp in the books and the bulk of quarterback Joe Burrow’s rehab behind him, the confidence continues to swell.

With insight from head coach Zac Taylor and offensive coordinator Brian Callahan, here is a look at the most important takeaways on the offensive side of the ball over the last several weeks:

Burrow looks like Burrow
The most important development of the offseason has been the progress Burrow has shown not only in rebuilding the strength in his knee but in his game overall.

Burrow’s every move this offseason was tracked and dissected, and raging optimism has followed, with every coach and teammate raving about the increased velocity Burrow has on his passes.

Everyone saw how quickly Burrow adapted to the NFL last year with no offseason or preseason. He’s unlikely to have much, if any, preseason action this year, but being able to be on the field and do as much as he did has everyone buzzing about the offense’s potential with the addition of first-round pick Ja’Marr Chase and the healthy returns of running back Joe Mixon and tight end C.J. Uzomah.

It’s to the point where anything other than one of the best Year 2 bumps in recent history would be considered a disappointment.

“As you guys heard me on the first day here, certainly very guarded in our approach there. I think he’s done a great job,” Taylor said. “He looks good. Certainly not all the way there yet, so there’s still a process we have to follow leading into training camp, but you guys have been out there. I think everybody’s optimistic. I think he really enjoyed getting out there. It was probably good for him to get the jersey on, put the helmet back on and get in the huddle and call plays, just to be able to throw the ball and see coverages in 7-on-7, so I would say obviously I didn’t want to make any predictions before the offseason program, but he’s in a really good spot.”

Which means the entire offense is as well.

Seeing Burrow back on the field slinging the ball so hard his receivers had to retrieve their gloves just built on the already positive vibes surrounding the team and its 100 percent participation in voluntary workouts.

Everything the franchise is trying to accomplish revolves around Burrow. Even with some slight limitations on what the coaches and trainers were willing to let him do this spring, Burrow showed impressive levels of growth, which erased whatever doubt there may have been.

“I’ve noticed quite a bit of improvement across the board, not just velocity,” Callahan said. “He spent a lot of time looking at the things he wanted to get better at from the season, both mentally and physically. And I think he’s done that over the course of the offseason program. He’s had a goal in mind of how he wanted to change his throwing motion and his mechanics — I shouldn’t say motion. But some of his footwork and stance and how he was going to (get) some more velocity on the ball and all those things. And I think he’s done that. I have noticed it. He’s throwing the ball with a little more velocity. It’s allowing him to maybe hang onto the ball an extra split second and be able to fit into a window a little bit later than he did a year ago. I think all those things are a positive.”

Nothing that happened this spring was more important than No. 9 looking like No. 9.

The line and the lineup

Taylor and Callahan entered May with a good idea of what the depth chart will look like on Sept. 12 when the Bengals open against the Vikings, and aside from the season-ending pectoral injury to backup offensive lineman Hakeem Adeniji, nothing that happened during OTAs and minicamp practices forced them to upset their vision of who the starters will be.

“Outside of the interior offensive line stuff, we know what we’ve got, which is kind of fun,” Callahan said. “You’re not waiting on training camp battles to figure it out. We’ve got some depth battles, which is important, but it’s kind of nice going into training camp knowing you’ve got a bunch of guys who can play.

“I feel like we’re deeper this year,” Callahan continued. “Even on the offensive line. I think we’re better, but I also think we’re deeper. It’s not like you’re scared if somebody were to get hurt. We’ve got guys who can step in and play.”

It’s been clear that the right guard job is rookie second-round pick Jackson Carman’s to lose, while left guard belongs to Quinton Spain.

There has been a lot of talk about the young players on offense making a big jump this season, but Callahan sees Spain, a six-year veteran who didn’t join the Bengals until midseason after being waived by the Bills and found himself starting less than 72 hours after arriving, as a lock to make a leap.

“The guy I feel the most comfortable with right now that he’s going to be even better than he was the year before is Quinton Spain,” he said. “Now he’s got a chance to learn the system from Day 1. And he’s made of the right stuff. He played every spot on the line last year it felt like. So to get him settled in with techniques and verbiage and all that, I think that’s going to help him. If he can return to how he played at Tennessee, that would be great for us.”

The nature of OTAs negates the ability to glean much from offensive line play. There’s only so much those guys can show in jerseys and shorts. And even when the team ran a handful of 11-on-11 plays, it was not nearly at full speed.

But that hasn’t stopped Callahan from spending some of his practice time watching the offensive line’s position drills.

“I love watching (offensive line coach Frank Pollack) do his individual stuff,” he said. “I think he’s a great technician and a great teacher. To be able to watch him and hear him, he’s demanding. There is a standard that needs to be met. The way that he interacts with the players, the players love playing for him. I think they have been excited about it.

“It’s not an easy task going to practice with Frank every day,” Callahan continued. “It isn’t easy for those guys. He works them hard. It’s not necessarily always fun, but they respond well to it. His detail is outstanding, and he’s got great energy. But the biggest thing is that he has great expectations for where he wants this unit to be come September.”

Receiver depth
Burrow isn’t the only player the Bengals are counting on to make a big leap in Year 2 after a promising rookie season, nor was he the only one this spring showing great promise that he’ll be able to do just that.

Wide receiver Tee Higgins was commanding attention before he even stepped on the field to start catching passes.

“He came back strong. He looks great physically,” Callahan said. “He put a lot of work in the offseason between the time we ended the season to the time we came back to change his body. He’s more explosive.

“Tee’s gonna play a huge role,” Callahan added. “He’s got every trait to be a top-level receiver in this league.”

Burrow noticed the difference immediately.

“He looks like a different guy out there,” Burrow said. “We were throwing the deep balls and the first couple I underthrew him a little bit and I was like, ‘Gee, Tee, where did that come from?’ I didn’t really expect that from him. He’s getting out of there this year. We have some horses on offense that I’m really excited about. Tee’s going to have a big year.”

Pairing Higgins with Chase and one of the top slot receivers in the league in Tyler Boyd is on par with Burrow’s return when citing reasons for optimism this year.

But the options run deeper than that. One of the players Callahan said he’s been most impressed with this spring is Auden Tate.

“He sometimes gets forgotten, but he has a really unique skill set that makes him one of the best out there in terms of contested catches,” Callahan said. “And he’s huge. As a fourth receiver, he’s been good this spring.”

It’s also a contract year for Tate, which is something that tends to light an additional fire under a player. But Callahan said he doesn’t think that will be the case with Tate.

“He’s always had a fire under him,” he said. “I just think that he does a lot of good things and I’m looking forward to seeing all of them this year.”

A late-round gem in the making
One of the biggest takeaways of the preseason from a not-so-big name was the performance of rookie sixth-round running back Chris Evans.

The sure hands and smooth route running that led the Bengals to draft him were on instant display at rookie camp and continued through OTAs and the one-day minicamp.

Asking Giovani Bernard to take a pay cut and then releasing him when he refused had a chance to be the offseason move with the biggest negative impact. But if Evans can slide into that role and become another weapon for Burrow, it adds another dimension to the offense.

“I’m really going to be curious to see how Chris Evans responds in training camp,” Callahan said. “He’s got the most natural hands for a running back that I’ve ever been around. And not to say that’s the end-all, be-all, but he’s so natural at catching the ball and he can track the ball down the field. A lot of times, running backs struggle down the field. He doesn’t. So he could be a unique piece for us.

“And he can carry the ball, too. He’s a big kid. I’m really eager to watch him when it comes time to play because when you put pads on and play a game, it all changes. Will he rise up or will he shrink? I’m counting on him to rise, and that will be fun for us to have that type of player to complement Joe (Mixon) and Samaje (Perine).”

 

 

[membengal]

That's the whole piece - it is offensive focused. They did a defensive one prior to this. Did I post that one in the other thread?

[TJJackson]

unsure

[TJJackson]

forgot to thank you.....thanks as always, greatly appreciated.

I honestly had not seen any other source claiming Spain was in the lead to take the OLG spot over XSF, and honestly as well see this as a bit of an upset/surprise

either way - depth is a gooooooooooooooood thing to have

I do hope that thy have a date on their calendar marked for a decision on is Carman is the man at ORG.  I want him to be, but there is wanting, there is hoping, and then there is "this isnt working, lets try something else"   So little has been written about Carman thus that I have no idea if he is working out as the ORG starter, or even progressing towards that point on schedule

I also want to see more on Ossai, Cam Sample, and DAnte Smith. 

what the hell, ok, Shelvin too

GIMME SOME LINEMEN NEWS :-)

[TJJackson]

so in linemen news :

David DeCastro got cut, and Trai Turner signed, by the Steelers

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/steelers-sign-former-pro-bowl-guard-trai-turner-after-cutting-david-decastro-per-report/

DeCastro is hurt, like as in out the entire 2021 season hurt. 

However, the Bengals could easily afford to sign him to a contract that takes it as a given that he will sit out and rehab all of 2021.  There'd be a big roster bonus just before the 2022 draft, and if he's good to go the bonus is paid (gamble was successful), otherwise he's released  (gamble failed).  The timing is perfect as he'd be coming on as the new ORG right as either Carman or DSmith would become the starter at ORT, with Reiff leaving

Does he want to rehab and play?  thats really the only question here as far as I am concerned

TALK TO THE MAN NOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ShulaSteakhouse]

 

 

29 minutes ago, TJJackson said:

so in linemen news :

David DeCastro got cut, and Trai Turner signed, by the Steelers

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/steelers-sign-former-pro-bowl-guard-trai-turner-after-cutting-david-decastro-per-report/

DeCastro is hurt, like as in out the entire 2021 season hurt. 

However, the Bengals could easily afford to sign him to a contract that takes it as a given that he will sit out and rehab all of 2021.  There'd be a big roster bonus just before the 2022 draft, and if he's good to go the bonus is paid (gamble was successful), otherwise he's released  (gamble failed).  The timing is perfect as he'd be coming on as the new ORG right as either Carman or DSmith would become the starter at ORT, with Reiff leaving

Does he want to rehab and play?  thats really the only question here as far as I am concerned

TALK TO THE MAN NOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well you're in fantasy land son.  But I think he's considering retirement also, from what it sounded like.   MB ain't paying any one to not play for a year.  You know that.

[TJJackson]

its not fantasy land. 

this happens all over the league

SoaG needs to put down his latest copy of Reader's Digest and talk to the man

[COB]

The Steelers know he’s probably near the end.  Lot of wear and tear on that dude.  I’m not a fan of bringing former Steelers in here so they can big shot everyone who’s here trying to build something.  Fuck DeCastro.  

[TJJackson]

so we lose out on Morgan Moses and Trai Turner - the latter for a mere 3 million, and apparently the Steelers docs pronounced him to be good to go - in a span of just 3 days

I am so freakin pissed

we didnt even T R Y

dammit, why do we not even T R Y to improve?

[COB]

11 hours ago, TJJackson said:

so we lose out on Morgan Moses and Trai Turner - the latter for a mere 3 million, and apparently the Steelers docs pronounced him to be good to go - in a span of just 3 days

I am so freakin pissed

we didnt even T R Y

dammit, why do we not even T R Y to improve?

Dude they’re trying.  We can’t just sign every lineman that comes on the market, nor do we need to.  
 

I’m not claiming our line is stacked with all-pro guys, but we’re not completely desperate any more either.  Kind of feels like the Steelers are though.  
 

If Turner’s profile doesn’t fit, I’m fine with passing on him.  
 

PS - there is a good chance we kick the Steelers in the teeth twice this year.  Trai Turner can’t save them.  Their whole organization is getting sucked into the vortex of Ben’s career death-spiral.  He doesn’t give a fuck because he’s a selfish pig.  

[ShulaSteakhouse]

On 6/24/2021 at 10:31 PM, TJJackson said:

its not fantasy land. 

this happens all over the league

SoaG needs to put down his latest copy of Reader's Digest and talk to the man

It is, because it's the Bengals.   I think the lack of attention paid to the interior o-line will come back to haunt them again this year possibly, unless Carman works out and guys stay healthy, then it's reasonable to think they could at least be improved.  But when Spain is your best/most reliable guy,  I'd say there's a talent issue there.

[TJJackson]

COB, what I want to see is the effort to bring them in for a looksee

that costs almost N O T H I N G

we're not even getting that minimal effort with these guys who could help

I get it that you dont sign a guy who is out of range on cost or is hurt or really doesnt want to play. 

But you bring them in to look at and talk to them......thats basic bare minimum due diligence

I am seeing Z E R O due diligence from this team, as always

[Stripes]

They've blown the doors off of free agency two straight offseasons.

[membengal]

I can’t even, TJ. Is your default setting always “everything is awful”?

[HoosierCat]

2 hours ago, membengal said:

I can’t even, TJ. Is your default setting always “everything is awful”?

 

[TJJackson]

Mem: dehner says he has a q&a piece up, with one of the questions being on line depth.

can you post just that part here?

[membengal]

“Now, finally, on to the actual question Jim asked: Line depth.

No secret the team needs probably one more addition at both the offensive and defensive line to feel secure. With the injury to Hakeem Adeniji, a veteran swing tackle should be on the table. They should also be kicking the tires on a backup to Larry Ogunjobi, a situation I detailed a few times, but notably in the offseason defensive takeaways story this week.

I wouldn’t worry too much about the fact nobody signed yet. These things have a tendency to pop off just before camp starts. That’s when a number of the remaining free agents will make their final move. Remember, the Bengals added Mike Daniels on Aug. 11 last year. Exercise patience on that one.”

[COB]

20 hours ago, HoosierCat said:

 

/Mike watches the computers above go kablooey/

“Ha, I’ve never seen a Franklin Planner blow up.  Got a shelf full of Franklin Planners!”

[HoosierCat]

Numbers to make Mike’s butthole pucker.