Sick this morning

[BengalszoneBilly]

Debate, but do it without being insulting to one another.

[HairOnFire]

Honestly, I have a hard time getting all steamed about people not going to games. They can spend their money any way they choose.

Absolutely. But remember, in the dead thread where this subject was first discussed the question was asked if the poor attendance was proof Cincinnati couldn't financially support an NFL team, and if true, no longer deserved one.

I used to have season tickets, now I have a kid. I'll end up going to 2-3 games a year.

See above. The fact remains that whatever might be true of an individual due to personal circumstances is a very poor excuse for collective behavior. And there's the rub because you can point to your kid as a reason for why you no longer attend games, but TJ and ZooBoy point directly to their hatred for Mike Brown. In fact, TJ just bragged about how every single fan pointed to Mike Brown when answering the question of why fans weren't going to games on the CincyJungle website. Apparently, nobody used kids, the zoo, the weather, or the economy as an excuse.

And that's what makes us special, right? Because where else in the NFL landscape do fans make their choice about attending games based upon a person who doesn't play and is rarely seen? In other cities fans go to see football games and watch players play because they're actually ....(wait for it)....football fans. Here, people go to the zoo instead because of their hatred for an old fat man who sits in his corner office ignoring hate mail.

You can go to the games too. Do you go to the games? What does that make you if you don't go?

The last time I came back to the hinterland when the Bengals were playing I ditched family obligations for the day, rounded up a few old friends, and dropped $530 bucks on Bengal tickets and food. Plus, I spend more than that every year for NFL Sunday Ticket just so I can watch the Bengals play every week. And no, when I'm making those choices I don't give one minute of thought to the fat man in the corner office. And why should I? As a football fan I actually WANT to watch football games.

[HairOnFire]

So it's a good match. The worst fans in so many measurable ways paired up with the worst owner in the NFL in so many measurable ways.

As long as we're willing to accept who we are as a fanbase, and most of you have been very reluctant to do so, that's actually a point that's hard to argue.

It's sorta funny how loudly some of you protest when faced with attendance figures that rank dead last in the NFL. For example, if the Bengals running game were ranked dead last you'd all admit the problem and demand change. Or if the Bengals starting QB were ranked dead last you'd all loudly call for that player to be replaced with someone better. But when the dead last ranking is a reflection on us as fans most of you quickly begin bleating about how smart and passionate all of you are. In reality, what most of you are is summed up rather neatly by empty seats and empty excuses.

[cincyhokie]

I just want to throw it out there that we have an awesome zoo here in Cincinnati. There's nothing wrong with going. Even in the winter, it's awesome. Festival of lights.

[HairOnFire]

This team has been supported by the fans in the past to a level that it rarely deserved.

And there's your problem. Because you don't deserve anything when you do nothing. In fact, you're not entitled to a football team at all, and if you deliberately refuse to support it due to your sense of entitlement you deserve to lose it. But sadly, you won't....because there's 20 years remaining on a lease your leaders keep trying to get out of due to that same misguided sense of entitlement.

[skyline]

This team has been supported by the fans in the past to a level that it rarely deserved.

And there's your problem. Because you don't deserve anything when you do nothing.

His point is that those fans DID do something and that they will again. And, I'm guessing that next season's attendance numbers will prove him right. Guess we'll have to wait and see on that one.

As I said in my earlier post, this isn't a problem unique to Cincinnati. Nashville is going through exactly the same problem. It isn't showing up in ticket sales, because we have a lot of large companies that eat up tons of season tickets and distribute them to employees. Regardless of the fact that the tickets have been sold, people aren't actually showing up in the seats. Even regular consumers that purchased season tickets aren't showing up. It's been a pretty big point of discussion here this season. The Titans/city are planning a lot of facility upgrades that they think will help, but it won't. Reading their message boards right now is a pretty good source of entertainment.

Football fans are football fans, regardless of the city or the team. Bengals fans might be a little quicker to reach levels of despair, but that habit has been taught to them time and time again over the past x number of years.

[derekshank]

Here, people go to the zoo instead because of their hatred for an old fat man who sits in his corner office ignoring hate mail.

Is that what people in Cincy are doing instead of going to the games? Damn... the Cincinnati Zoo must be packed on Sundays. It's really small.

Hey Bengal fans... you should come up to Columbus. The zoo here is roughly 8 times the size of your s**tty Cincinnati Zoo, and is currently ranked #1 in the country.

Also... Columbus is outside the blackout radius, so you don't have to try to watch the games on some internet stream. Instead, you can go to the zoo after the game. Two birds!

[skyline]

Here, people go to the zoo instead because of their hatred for an old fat man who sits in his corner office ignoring hate mail.

Hey Bengal fans... you should come up to Columbus. The zoo here is roughly 8 times the size of your s**tty Cincinnati Zoo, and is currently ranked #1 in the country.

Hey now. I have no problem admitting that Columbus has a perfectly great zoo, but let's hold off on bashing the Cincy Zoo unless you're ready for me to show up at your doorstep looking for a fight

I practically grew up at that zoo...lots of amazing childhood memories.

[HairOnFire]

His point is that those fans DID do something and that they will again. And, I'm guessing that next season's attendance numbers will prove him right. Guess we'll have to wait and see on that one.

Why wait when nobody, including me, is suggesting the numbers won't improve?

IMHO the empty seats this season are just one impossible to ignore sign of the staggering negativity that surrounds this franchise, and that's still going to be true next season even if most or all of the empty seats are filled.

We're still going to be the fanbase that boos the home team during a playoff game. We're still going to be the same fanbase that boasts of an amazing number of so-called fans who adamantly refuse to financially support the team in any way. And we're still going to be the same fanbase where half of the so-called fans on a Bengal messageboard are whining fed-ups who not only refuse to f**k off, but think it's their duty to piss in the punchbowl.

[skyline]

His point is that those fans DID do something and that they will again. And, I'm guessing that next season's attendance numbers will prove him right. Guess we'll have to wait and see on that one.

We're still going to be the fanbase that boos the home team during a playoff game. We're still going to be the same fanbase that boasts of an amazing number of so-called fans who adamantly refuse to financially support the team in any way. And we're still going to be the same fanbase where half of the so-called fans on a Bengal messageboard are whining fed-ups who not only refuse to f**k off, but think it's their duty to piss in the punchbowl.

Again, Titans fans do all of those things as well. Football fans are football fans. It's not going to change, so why spend time worrying about it?

This year, we're last in the league in ticket sales. Next year it'll probably be someone else while we see an upswing thanks to a couple of rookies and a shining ray of hope.

As for myself, I prefer to ignore all of the pseudo-fans, enjoy the team being in Cincy for as long as it's there (hopefully a very long time), and cheer on my team for as long as I'm able to do so.

[COB]

come up to Columbus. The zoo here is roughly 8 times the size of your s**tty Cincinnati Zoo, and is currently ranked #1 in the country.

The Columbus Zoo kills. I am so ready to go over to the smack section and have a flame war over who has a better zoo.

The Columbus Zoo has an underwater viewing area for it's polar bears. It is full of trout. At 4 pm the zoo workers throw a bunch of trout food in the water right in front of the underwater viewing area. The trout all swim up to it and the polar bears proceed to rip about ten trout to shreds and chow down.

Also, there is an adelescent male gorilla in Columbus' world class gorilla habitat who routinely eats his own excrement. This is more of a curiosity type thing than a "must see" attraction.

They've got a giant tank with manatees swimming around in it with chopped up tails from hillbilly bass fisherman running over them down in Florida.

They've got wolves running all over the place, they've got grizzly bears, they've got rhinos (who incidentally look bored out of their minds, note to anyone who might be reading this who works at the Columbus Zoo, those rhinos barely have a pulse), they've got giant bats hanging upside down sleeping all day, they've got a king cobra, and they've got an antique carousel that will take you back to the pre world war I era.

Cincinnati Zoo? I didn't even know there was one. The aquarium across the river is pretty awesome.

[derekshank]

come up to Columbus. The zoo here is roughly 8 times the size of your s**tty Cincinnati Zoo, and is currently ranked #1 in the country.

The Columbus Zoo kills. I am so ready to go over to the smack section and have a flame war over who has a better zoo.

The Columbus Zoo has an underwater viewing area for it's polar bears. It is full of trout. At 4 pm the zoo workers throw a bunch of trout food in the water right in front of the underwater viewing area. The trout all swim up to it and the polar bears proceed to rip about ten trout to shreds and chow down.

The Polar Bear exhibit is absolutely a must see. And soon. They are still juveniles, so they're really active.

Also, there are a bunch of Canadian Geese that don't seem to know their surroundings. Recently one landed in the tiger exhibit. The Tiger hunted it, caught it, and smeared it's bloody corpse all over the glass as if it was trying to intimidate the guests. Pretty awesome.

My wife works at the zoo, and until recently, she would from time to time bring all varieties of baby animals home with her for late night feedings. I found out that I am allergic to kangaroos. Do any of you know if you are allergic to kangaroos or not? Didn't think so.

[skyline]

come up to Columbus. The zoo here is roughly 8 times the size of your s**tty Cincinnati Zoo, and is currently ranked #1 in the country.

The Columbus Zoo kills. I am so ready to go over to the smack section and have a flame war over who has a better zoo.

The Columbus Zoo has an underwater viewing area for it's polar bears. It is full of trout. At 4 pm the zoo workers throw a bunch of trout food in the water right in front of the underwater viewing area. The trout all swim up to it and the polar bears proceed to rip about ten trout to shreds and chow down.

Also, there is an adelescent male gorilla in Columbus' world class gorilla habitat who routinely eats his own excrement. This is more of a curiosity type thing than a "must see" attraction.

They've got a giant tank with manatees swimming around in it with chopped up tails from hillbilly bass fisherman running over them down in Florida.

They've got wolves running all over the place, they've got grizzly bears, they've got rhinos (who incidentally look bored out of their minds, note to anyone who might be reading this who works at the Columbus Zoo, those rhinos barely have a pulse), they've got giant bats hanging upside down sleeping all day, they've got a king cobra, and they've got an antique carousel that will take you back to the pre world war I era.

Cincinnati Zoo? I didn't even know there was one. The aquarium across the river is pretty awesome.

Underwater viewing for poloar bears @ Cincinnati? Check.

Fun, excrement eating gorillas @ Cincinnati? Check.

Manatee exhibit @ Cincinnati? Check.

Rhinos, giant bats, and cobars @ Cincinnati? Check.

No grizzlies or wolves, though, so that's pretty cool. Why can't we all enjoy our respective zoos without all the hate?

If you guys want a crappy zoo, then head on down to Nashville. Fun place for the kids, but a complete embarassment when compared to the ones we're discussing.

[COB]

The solution grows closer daily, and is inevitable - he won't live forever.....

Bad news. From the Enquirer website:

Zombie Mike Brown Will Run Bengals From The Grave

Cincinnati Enquirer - AP - Bengals fans hoping for a change of management after the passing of controversial owner Mike Brown might be in for a surprise.

After Mike Brown's death, the Bengals will be run by a computer powered by the energy produced by Brown's decomposing corpse.

The Bengals have developed the computer, programmed with a combination of every decision Mike Brown made running the Bengals, biographies of his father, Paul Brown, and several books on management and law that Mike Brown holds dear.

After Mike Brown's death, the energy produced by saprobic bacteria in Brown's body, the bacteria that breaks down human tissue during the decomposition process, will be harnessed and will power the Mike Brown Zombie Computer that will be the team's new GM. The excess energy will be used to power the vending machines in Paul Brown Stadium.

Team officials have already tested the computer and are confident it will work. Troy Blackburn, team Director of Personnel, said, "We already tested this thing out with a dead hobo from Over The Rhine. We did a simulation, and the computer sued Hamilton County, hired Bob Bratkowski's 19 year-old nephew as our new defensive coordinator, and for a first round draft pick selected Atari Jones, a 6' 7" basketball player from San Jose State who's never played football but has amazing athleticism. We're pretty sure it's Mike in there, inside that computer."

The computer also produces quotes for the media. Blackburn isn't happy with look of the computer, though. "It looks like something out of 'Lost In Space'. Danger, Danger, Danger. Ha ha. We're exploring holography. Hopefully we'll hear 'Dad' talking and running the Bengals for decades after his death."

During the simulation, the Mike Brown Zombie Computer said, "Atari Jones is a diamond in the rough. Athletes like that don't come along every day. We're confident we can cure his meth addiction, and he'll become an all-pro for us. It's a 7 year plan."

Katie Blackburn, Brown's daughter, said, "We want Dad to keep running the Bengals. He's almost got the oxcart out of the ditch, and plus he knows how hard it is to run an NFL franchise. Why make a change?"

The computer was developed without Brown's knowledge. He is known to be distrustful of computers, and on several occasions he has referred to them as, "a lot of hokum". It is common knowledge within the league that the Bengals don't use computers, relying instead on trustworthy technology from the 1950s, like 3 ring binders and handwritten notes. When told about the computer that will run the Bengals after his death, Brown said, "Harumph".

Dirk Bonecutter, a Bengals fan wearing his team gear for an outing to the Cincinnati Zoo, was a little skeptical, "A computer? Running off a dead body? Screw that. A Commodore 64 with a pong game as it's only software could run the Bengals better than Mike Brown has. I'll withhold all financial support on general principle just like I have for the last ten years."

Enquirer columnist Paul Daugherty jumped off the John A. Roebling Suspension Bridge when told of the Mike Brown Zombie Computer. An upside down calculator being pounded upon by a rhesus monkey will continue to write his columns.

[HairOnFire]

Football fans are football fans. It's not going to change, so why spend time worrying about it?

Worry about it or simply venting?

This thread started with fan after fan writing about what he was most sick about after the loss to the Texans. Some said they were done with the head coach. Some said they were done with the defensive coordinator. Some said the were sick of the conservative playcalling. I said I'm sick of us, and I gave my reasons why, thereby prompting the same familiar voices to pop off about why their involvement with this team is strictly limited to stuff they can do for free and why this team is best supported by row after row of empty seats.

I listen to it all and wonder why any Bengal player would risk his health playing for a bunch of miserable fans like us. Worse, I start to realize why so many of them feel compelled to punch the clock and feel perfectly satisfied with mediocrity. Mediocrity is exactly what this teams fanbase deserves.

As for myself, I prefer to ignore all of the pseudo-fans, enjoy the team being in Cincy for as long as it's there (hopefully a very long time), and cheer on my team for as long as I'm able to do so.

Well how do you do that? Seriously, I'm asking. And the reason I'm asking is because my past is littered with scraps and fights with every pseudo-fan who calls this place home and it seems to me there are far more of them than the type of normal fan you see rooting for any team you care to name.

Frankly, we can all pretend we're not the worst fans in the NFL but I doubt any of us can pretend we're normal. And like the thread title says, I'm f**king sick of it.

[HoosierCat]

The solution grows closer daily, and is inevitable - he won't live forever.....

Bad news. From the Enquirer website:

Zombie Mike Brown Will Run Bengals From The Grave

Cincinnati Enquirer - AP - Bengals fans hoping for a change of management after the passing of controversial owner Mike Brown might be in for a surprise.

After Mike Brown's death, the Bengals will be run by a computer powered by the energy produced by Brown's decomposing corpse.

The Bengals have developed the computer, programmed with a combination of every decision Mike Brown made running the Bengals, biographies of his father, Paul Brown, and several books on management and law that Mike Brown holds dear.

After Mike Brown's death, the energy produced by saprobic bacteria in Brown's body, the bacteria that breaks down human tissue during the decomposition process, will be harnessed and will power the Mike Brown Zombie Computer that will be the team's new GM. The excess energy will be used to power the vending machines in Paul Brown Stadium.

Team officials have already tested the computer and are confident it will work. Troy Blackburn, team Director of Personnel, said, "We already tested this thing out with a dead hobo from Over The Rhine. We did a simulation, and the computer sued Hamilton County, hired Bob Bratkowski's 19 year-old nephew as our new defensive coordinator, and for a first round draft pick selected Atari Jones, a 6' 7" basketball player from San Jose State who's never played football but has amazing athleticism. We're pretty sure it's Mike in there, inside that computer."

The computer also produces quotes for the media. Blackburn isn't happy with look of the computer, though. "It looks like something out of 'Lost In Space'. Danger, Danger, Danger. Ha ha. We're exploring holography. Hopefully we'll hear 'Dad' talking and running the Bengals for decades after his death."

During the simulation, the Mike Brown Zombie Computer said, "Atari Jones is a diamond in the rough. Athletes like that don't come along every day. We're confident we can cure his meth addiction, and he'll become an all-pro for us. It's a 7 year plan."

Katie Blackburn, Brown's daughter, said, "We want Dad to keep running the Bengals. He's almost got the oxcart out of the ditch, and plus he knows how hard it is to run an NFL franchise. Why make a change?"

The computer was developed without Brown's knowledge. He is known to be distrustful of computers, and on several occasions he has referred to them as, "a lot of hokum". It is common knowledge within the league that the Bengals don't use computers, relying instead on trustworthy technology from the 1950s, like 3 ring binders and handwritten notes. When told about the computer that will run the Bengals after his death, Brown said, "Harumph".

Dirk Bonecutter, a Bengals fan wearing his team gear for an outing to the Cincinnati Zoo, was a little skeptical, "A computer? Running off a dead body? Screw that. A Commodore 64 with a pong game as it's only software could run the Bengals better than Mike Brown has. I'll withhold all financial support on general principle just like I have for the last ten years."

Enquirer columnist Paul Daugherty jumped off the John A. Roebling Suspension Bridge when told of the Mike Brown Zombie Computer. An upside down calculator being pounded upon by a rhesus monkey will continue to write his columns.

That was f**king hilarous. Not to mention dead on. I am in awe.

[glasgowbengal]

This debate seems to have descended into a personal point scoring exercise, with a decent bit of trolling, to boot.

Living in Scotland, i'm pretty unaware of the local fanbase dynamic in Cinci. What i do know is that i shell out thousands, every season, to get over for at least one home game.

It's a punch in the guts to look forward to something for so long and then find yourself in a half empty stadium. I'm seriously considering a road game, next year, instead.

My local professional 'soccer' team, Celtic, is going through a similar thing at the moment. The 60,000 stadium is generally 65% full for games and there are two, main, partisan camps involved:

1. those who stay away, as a protest at the ownership. They see those who continue to shell out for season tickets as part of the problem. They also refuse to buy merchandise.

2. the 'faithful through and through' brigade, who view either personal or organised boycotts as anathema. they view supporting the team as a duty, whether that means financially propping up the owners or not. "hate the board, support the team"

So, it's not a situation unique to the Bengals and it is certainly not a black and white issue. All we can say, with certainty, is that people are staying away - no doubt for a plethora of reasons - whether they be economic, personal principal or general apathy.

The ownership must be embarrassed at the empty stands, but will they care until it hurts them financially? The psuedo-socialism of the NFL ensures that the financial bullet is never going to be too hard to bite.

I suppose it all boils down to whether MB loves the game or loves the financial gain that accompanies it. We can all speculate on his position, but that's as much as we can do until he does something decisive, such as: consulting fan focus groups, trying to relocate or shuffling off this mortal coil.

[skyline]

Football fans are football fans. It's not going to change, so why spend time worrying about it?

Worry about it or simply venting?

This thread started with fan after fan writing about what he was most sick about after the loss to the Texans. Some said they were done with the head coach. Some said they were done with the defensive coordinator. Some said the were sick of the conservative playcalling. I said I'm sick of us, and I gave my reasons why, thereby prompting the same familiar voices to pop off about why their involvement with this team is strictly limited to stuff they can do for free and why this team is best supported by row after row of empty seats.

I listen to it all and wonder why any Bengal player would risk his health playing for a bunch of miserable fans like us. Worse, I start to realize why so many of them feel compelled to punch the clock and feel perfectly satisfied with mediocrity. Mediocrity is exactly what this teams fanbase deserves.

As for myself, I prefer to ignore all of the pseudo-fans, enjoy the team being in Cincy for as long as it's there (hopefully a very long time), and cheer on my team for as long as I'm able to do so.

Well how do you do that? Seriously, I'm asking. And the reason I'm asking is because my past is littered with scraps and fights with every pseudo-fan who calls this place home and it seems to me there are far more of them than the type of normal fan you see rooting for any team you care to name.

Frankly, we can all pretend we're not the worst fans in the NFL but I doubt any of us can pretend we're normal. And like the thread title says, I'm f**king sick of it.

How do I do that? I realize that there are better uses of my time. Getting in a scrap with angry fans is only going to get me dirty, too. After we lose, I typically take a small break from this place.

You know, spend time with my wife and kid for a change Play my guitar. Play some chess. Read a book. Go for a run. Do normal, well-adjusted things.

[skyline]

This debate seems to have descended into a personal point scoring exercise, with a decent bit of trolling, to boot.

Living in Scotland, i'm pretty unaware of the local fanbase dynamic in Cinci. What i do know is that i shell out thousands, every season, to get over for at least one home game.

It's a punch in the guts to look forward to something for so long and then find yourself in a half empty stadium. I'm seriously considering a road game, next year, instead.

My local professional 'soccer' team, Celtic, is going through a similar thing at the moment. The 60,000 stadium is generally 65% full for games and there are two, main, partisan camps involved:

1. those who stay away, as a protest at the ownership. They see those who continue to shell out for season tickets as part of the problem. They also refuse to buy merchandise.

2. the 'faithful through and through' brigade, who view either personal or organised boycotts as anathema. they view supporting the team as a duty, whether that means financially propping up the owners or not. "hate the board, support the team"

So, it's not a situation unique to the Bengals and it is certainly not a black and white issue. All we can say, with certainty, is that people are staying away - no doubt for a plethora of reasons - whether they be economic, personal principal or general apathy.

The ownership must be embarrassed at the empty stands, but will they care until it hurts them financially? The psuedo-socialism of the NFL ensures that the financial bullet is never going to be too hard to bite.

I suppose it all boils down to whether MB loves the game or loves the financial gain that accompanies it. We can all speculate on his position, but that's as much as we can do until he does something decisive, such as: consulting fan focus groups, trying to relocate or shuffling off this mortal coil.

Nice post! Make more of them, please

[cincyhokie]

come up to Columbus. The zoo here is roughly 8 times the size of your s**tty Cincinnati Zoo, and is currently ranked #1 in the country.

The Columbus Zoo kills. I am so ready to go over to the smack section and have a flame war over who has a better zoo.

The Columbus Zoo has an underwater viewing area for it's polar bears. It is full of trout. At 4 pm the zoo workers throw a bunch of trout food in the water right in front of the underwater viewing area. The trout all swim up to it and the polar bears proceed to rip about ten trout to shreds and chow down.

The Polar Bear exhibit is absolutely a must see. And soon. They are still juveniles, so they're really active.

Also, there are a bunch of Canadian Geese that don't seem to know their surroundings. Recently one landed in the tiger exhibit. The Tiger hunted it, caught it, and smeared it's bloody corpse all over the glass as if it was trying to intimidate the guests. Pretty awesome.

My wife works at the zoo, and until recently, she would from time to time bring all varieties of baby animals home with her for late night feedings. I found out that I am allergic to kangaroos. Do any of you know if you are allergic to kangaroos or not? Didn't think so.

Dude, the Cincinnati Zoo took a s**t awhile ago and gave birth to the Columbus Zoo and that pansy ass Jack Hanna. Please. The original self excrement eating gansta apes are in Cincy.

Edit: I do think that you being allergic to kangaroos, is well, awesome. Props to the misses working there too. I work across the street from the Cincinnati Zoo so that counts for something.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Why wait when nobody, including me, is suggesting the numbers won't improve?

Because I'd assumed there was some consistency of thought rattling around under that flaming hair of yours. If you concede that attendance tracks performance, minus a year, then your pages of rants linking attendance to some misguided protest on the part of the town doesn't make sense.

The only ones using their lack of butt in seat as a silent protest against Mike Brown are the 1% of the fans who really get into off-the-field issues, which is probably an extreme minority who are overly represented on message boards.

[walzav29]

What the hell are you guys talking about? Are you really debating a zoo? Man. You guys have lost it. Can we focus on the Rams? Is Dunlap playing? Snap out of it!

(On a side note. In Michigan we have the Detroit zoo. People routinely drive to the Toledo zoo. That's what I hear is the best one)

[TJJackson]

TJ just bragged about how every single fan pointed to Mike Brown when answering the question of why fans weren't going to games on the CincyJungle website. Apparently, nobody used kids, the zoo, the weather, or the economy as an excuse.

Speaking of blatant lies inaccuracies - thats not what I said, nor did I "brag" about it. The truth - most of the respondents named ownership as the reason they do not attend Bengals games. Most, not all. Some did indeed have other reasons, including but not limited to the economy, their kids, and so forth. Oh, and it wasn't on CincyJungle, it was a Joe Reedy "20 questions" blog post.

As a football fan I actually WANT to watch football games.

Now there's a better definition of what it means to be a fan than the one you were pushing earlier.......

[Sea Ray]

Frankly, we can all pretend we're not the worst fans in the NFL but I doubt any of us can pretend we're normal. And like the thread title says, I'm f**king sick of it.

Yeah and your entire rant is based upon attendance (and ridicule of the local zoo) which has only very recently fallen off. All other signs of fan support remain yet you conveniently talk more about the zoo than you do TV ratings. And you wonder why some of us tune you out as the outlier on this subject?

[derekshank]

In Michigan we have the Detroit zoo. People routinely drive to the Toledo zoo. That's what I hear is the best one

USA Travel Guide's most recent Power Rankings have the Columbus Zoo ranked #1, Cincinnati Zoo #7... and the Toledo Zoo doesn't make the list.

If the Columbus zoo were a football team, they'd be the Packers... the Cincinnati zoo would be the 49ers, and the Toledo Zoo would be the Little Sisters of the Poor.

That's right people! We're having a zoo flame war!