Week 14: Bengals @ Bills

[ArmyBengal]

I have long been a Joe Brady fan back from his days coaching at LSU with Burrow and Chase.
Some Bills fans don't care for him and say he stifles Josh Allen, but I think that's what Burrow may need.
It's also a name I would think Burrow could get behind given their previous connections.
Not saying it absolutely has to be Joe Brady, but he's at least a name I can think of when asked....

Who are they going to get? 

[HoosierCat]

47 minutes ago, ArmyBengal said:

Who are they going to get? 

Likely no one. Amphar is right. Absent some kind of total collapse in the last four games, they will just point to Burrow's injury as the excuse and keep pushing the oxcart along the ditch. Maybe a couple assistants move on, but that will be about it.

[COB]

2 hours ago, volcom69 said:

The Zac Taylor era can be summed up as just not good enough. 

Agreed.  He’s just not a complete head coach.  Came up as a prodigy QB whisperer or whatever the Brown family thought he was, and he has stayed in that role.  Seems completely immersed in the offense, a resource rich offense at that, but seems incapable of building a defense.  Correction, seems incapable of rebuilding a defense after we let the heart of our Super Bowl D, Bates and Reader, get away in FA.

I like Zac, seems like a really good guy.  But when I see him perusing that Denny’s menu looking for a play, I always kind of think, “How’d that junior high substitute PE teacher end up on our sideline?”

[COB]

25 minutes ago, HoosierCat said:

Likely no one. Amphar is right. Absent some kind of total collapse in the last four games, they will just point to Burrow's injury as the excuse and keep pushing the oxcart along the ditch. Maybe a couple assistants move on, but that will be about it.

Agreed but with one caveat: if they miss the playoffs next year, they’ll move on somehow.  4 years of not making the playoffs while having Burrow, Chase, and Tee in their primes?  Even Mike can’t look past that.

[ArmyBengal]

Oh don't get me wrong, I (we) can talk about new coaches, players or whatever we want.
However, I do not expect much change heading into 2026.

I just hope they keep the winning to a minimum at this point and stay within the top 10.
I'm not asking for top 5, just keep it reasonable where someone might fall I wasn't expecting.

I was willing to concede that with a win yesterday, but there's no reason to keep rooting for wins now.

[AMPHAR]

Firing Zac would be easier if he was a complete Buffoon.   Every AFC team that's paid a franchise QB save KC has a message board fan base that wants a GM, HC, or OC change.   Everyone.

Not to say those demands are not somewhat justified, just saying none of those guys are buffoons and its harder reality to improve upon on it.   Message board fans take the path of least resistance to fix an under performing team so they work up in their minds the current leadership is just lucky and there's vast untapped coaching pool that automatically can do better. 

See it all the time in Bengal land.   Everyone here assumes Joe Burrow is Joe Burrow with any other coach in America.  Probably, maybe, not 100%. 

Zac Taylor should be fired because somehow Jake Browning had a free pass to 2nd QB snaps and he's also had enough time to get it done and hasn't.   However, there's a ton of Josh McDaniels in the world that can go down in flames just as easy. 

 

 

[HoosierCat]

In a league where you want you head coach to be a pittie or a rottweiler or doberman or German shepherd, we have a big goofy golden retriever. 

[Stripes]

I think Zac would be fine if they’d pair him with a top flight DC, as in, a former defensive head coach who you have to pay.

But they won’t do that. So fire him.

[ArmyBengal]

Yes, I assume Burrow is going to be Burrow regardless.
Even yesterday while watching the game, I felt like, "We can win this".
Maybe that's in part to Zac the "QB whisperer" as someone called him, but is he really?
Or is it Burrow is that good?  What happened to Browning?  Did he not hear the whispering?

My guess is Zac is more lucky than good.
Having generational talent at QB and WR never hurts.

I also think it's easy to suggest this is Burrow's ceiling.
Maybe pairing him with a better offensive mind would see him improve.
I think that's less likely, but not improbable.

[HoosierCat]

The thing I keep coming back to with Taylor is, what unique strength(s) does he bring to the table?

Is he a particularly savvy game-planner? I wouldn't say so, though I wouldn't say he's horrible either.

Is he a particularly good in-game coach? Same answer.

Is he a particularly good play caller? Well, he appears to have outsourced a lot of that to Burrow so it's tough to say. (Not that I blame him here. If I were in his shoes I would have taken one look at Joe and hooked my wagon to his star, too.)

Does he have a particularly good eye for talent? Again hard to say because we don't really know what goes on in the Bengals' draft room, but if so the organization isn't taking advantage of it.

Is he particularly good at developing players? I'm not sure any coach on this team can say that.

The players seem to like him, and he's clearly got a feel for navigating the FO and the "Bengals' way" of doing business, so those are good things And that latter skill, operating under the constraints imposed by the Bengals' mom & pop business model, shouldn't be underestimated. But Marvin could do that too, and the players liked him, too -- and he couldn't get over the hump on the field.

Zac at least got them to the dance once. Almost twice. That's also worth consideration. But how much of that was Taylor and how much of that was Burrow?

My own $0.02: As an NFL coach, I think Taylor is below average, but not by a lot. On a scale of 1 to 5 he's around a 2.8. Theoretically, they could do much better. Practically -- meaning taking into consideration the constraints of the organization and its well-documented frugality -- guys like Taylor and Lewis (and for that matter, LeBeau and Coslet) are about the best we can expect. 

[volcom69]

2 hours ago, Stripes said:

I think Zac would be fine if they’d pair him with a top flight DC, as in, a former defensive head coach who you have to pay.

But they won’t do that. So fire him.

The problem is he had years to do this. When he first took over I always felt he needed a veteran presence with him because he was so young and raw and never a head coach. However he went the complete opposite and took his guys who non of them really had head coaching, or anybody really had great experience for that matter. 
 

After they fired Lou there was a chance to go get one of those DC that were head coaches or had huge success in this league, but instead went for his friend. Huge mistake if you ask me huge mistake. 

[gregcook69]

6 hours ago, volcom69 said:

The problem is he had years to do this. When he first took over I always felt he needed a veteran presence with him because he was so young and raw and never a head coach. However he went the complete opposite and took his guys who non of them really had head coaching, or anybody really had great experience for that matter. 
 

After they fired Lou there was a chance to go get one of those DC that were head coaches or had huge success in this league, but instead went for his friend. Huge mistake if you ask me huge mistake. 

Not really sure why Zimmer was never considered, but that’s just it.

i know it’s the forums and it’s the place to come to speculate and couch coach, and I GET that, but if we are looking forward, for me, I try to look at what I think management will do, not what I think SHOULD be done, which, with management, it normally isn’t positive, BUT . . . all we can do is work with the hand we’re dealt and hope . . . one day, they get it right?!?

[AMPHAR]

Zac Taylor is way above average coach.    To suggest otherwise is emotion talking not reality of the NFL.     Zac Taylor is nearing the top 100 all time wins in the NFL.   Top 50 playoff wins.  1 of 60 coaches to win a Conference Championship.

Would anyone be in favor of enshrining Forrest Gregg, Sam Wyche or Marvin Lewis in the ROH?   ZT if given the same number of games would eclipse Wyche, maybe Gregg, and fall short of Lewis in total wins but has already beaten them all in playoff wins. 

So when a head coach nears the top 100 in wins.  The names clearly are not impressive until you realize how much turnover and how many guys actually get hired/fired as NFL head coaches.

You see a lot of fans wanting to get rid of Tomlin, Harbaugh, McDermott.   That's fine.  Expectations are bitch for sure. The boredom of fans with a certain level of success breeds frustration.   Doesn't breed quality opinion.  

Just from a numbers stand point alone it is very hard to find that elite HC.   The fact the Bengals fired or moved on from a top 30 win coach, and top 50 playoff season Head Coach and elevated the franchise with the very next hire is quality.

The reality is that is hard to do.  

[AMPHAR]

That said.  Given the NFL Head Coaching math of success.   IF the Bengals would have a job opening this year or next they would have several quality applicants.  WHY?   Every coach from pee wee to the pros knows the pains of the job.

1. Its rare to even get the opportunity at all.  

2. The chances of success are slim no matter how good a coach you think you are.

3. Any new HC will have Burrow, Chase, and Higgins and a manageable cap. 

4. Patient Ownership.  So yes, you are likely to get 4 seasons.  Which would beat the average life span of a head coach in the NFL. 

Fans across the league (not Chiefs fans) forget the struggle finding another elite coach once they fired Marty.   Browns have never found one since firing Marty.   Broncos same shit. 

Teams have wondered in the wilderness for multiple seasons looking for HCs.   I think that probably goes hand in hand in finding a QB.   That's why its ridiculous to try to separate Zac success from Burrow.   Most successful winning head coaches had HOF QBs.   

 

[gregcook68]

1 hour ago, AMPHAR said:

That said.  Given the NFL Head Coaching math of success.   IF the Bengals would have a job opening this year or next they would have several quality applicants.  WHY?   Every coach from pee wee to the pros knows the pains of the job.

1. Its rare to even get the opportunity at all.  

2. The chances of success are slim no matter how good a coach you think you are.

3. Any new HC will have Burrow, Chase, and Higgins and a manageable cap. 

4. Patient Ownership.  So yes, you are likely to get 4 seasons.  Which would beat the average life span of a head coach in the NFL. 

Fans across the league (not Chiefs fans) forget the struggle finding another elite coach once they fired Marty.   Browns have never found one since firing Marty.   Broncos same shit. 

Teams have wondered in the wilderness for multiple seasons looking for HCs.   I think that probably goes hand in hand in finding a QB.   That's why its ridiculous to try to separate Zac success from Burrow.   Most successful winning head coaches had HOF QBs.   

 

Not disagreeing with any of it A, but like I said in an earlier post, we can vent and yes emotions do run wild here, but, it IS the forums, and that's part of the reason WHY they exist!

The first dropped pass, fumble, or missed tackle it's FIRE EVERYONE!

What do we think the decisions and moves that MANAGEMENT will make because, when all the smoke clears from emotions, THAT'S the hand we are dealt and have to play!