The draft is blowing up right now.

[ArmyBengal]

Good, that means our chances to trade down are increasing every day !!!

[Whur CHad At?]

I don't think so buddy. Last time we traded down in the 1st it seemed to have backfired....BIG TIME.

[ArmyBengal]

I don't think so buddy. Last time we traded down in the 1st it seemed to have backfired....BIG TIME.

Good line of thought. So lets not do it ever again, because it didn't work last time. And you're going on about the team not doing things to improve. For a team that wants to build through the draft, it's exactly what they need to be considering to fill all the needs they have as early as possible.

[sacosud]

I don't think so buddy. Last time we traded down in the 1st it seemed to have backfired....BIG TIME.

Good line of thought. So lets not do it ever again, because it didn't work last time. And you're going on about the team not doing things to improve. For a team that wants to build through the draft, it's exactly what they need to be considering to fill all the needs they have as early as possible.

I agree, it's time to call it, what it is.

A serious rebuild and you do that with picks. I think using Crabtree would fit a lot of needs for teams wanting to move up and you can always count on Jerry Jones, if the need becomes desperate. I can see it now Crabtree and TO or is it To and Crabtree...whew...fireworks in BIG D. I know that's not best for the Bengals right now.

I'm just making a point. Crabtree is looked upon as maybe the best skill player ava. and we should take advantage of that. We of course need him to be ava. at #6.

[Clackwoods]

Well, with TJ going to the Seahawks, I don't see them going after Crabtree in the first. Either an OT or a defensive pick. I could see them hoping Heyward-Bey lasts until the 2nd for them...

Yeah, T.J. and Crabtree are too similar, so he definitely isn't the pick at #4. I could see them hoping Harvin slips, as they still need a speed receiver. They still need OT's in the worst way but I bet they're hoping that Curry is there, as many teams are. They just lost Rocky Bernard, so they could be looking at Raji, too.

Jim Mora loves D-lineman, as a former defensive coordinator.

Crabtree may not be proven yet, but in a couple years I am sure you are going to look back on that comparison and smack yourself!

[Clackwoods]

I don't think so buddy. Last time we traded down in the 1st it seemed to have backfired....BIG TIME.

Good line of thought. So lets not do it ever again, because it didn't work last time. And you're going on about the team not doing things to improve. For a team that wants to build through the draft, it's exactly what they need to be considering to fill all the needs they have as early as possible.

I agree, it's time to call it, what it is.

A serious rebuild and you do that with picks. I think using Crabtree would fit a lot of needs for teams wanting to move up and you can always count on Jerry Jones, if the need becomes desperate. I can see it now Crabtree and TO or is it To and Crabtree...whew...fireworks in BIG D. I know that's not best for the Bengals right now.

I'm just making a point. Crabtree is looked upon as maybe the best skill player ava. and we should take advantage of that. We of course need him to be ava. at #6.

I would love Crabtree at six, but if we do that we need to trade Chad for a first, possibly 13 and pick up a defensive player (Maybe Rey Rey).

I don't agree however, that we are in a serious rebuilding mode. Yes, we do have holes, but so do most teams in the NFL. We will fill them in the draft and be in the playoffs next year on the back of our weak schedule. I think something we should do that would be very smart is sign Ray Lewis.

Yes he would cost a lot and he is in decline, but he would elevate our defense and he would rip the heart out of the Ravens defense. Losing Scott, Lewis, McCallister, and their safety in one offseason would hurt badly.

[jditty47]

i would LOVE ray ray on the bengals...but no chance it happens.

[Kazkal]

I don't think so buddy. Last time we traded down in the 1st it seemed to have backfired....BIG TIME.

Hey Buddy the last time we had a good offer on the table and didn't take it led to Akili Smith so your reasoning works both ways....The problem in 2004 was we traded down with a team that took the best RB in the draft and then we took a RB ourselves...

[HairOnFire]

I don't think so buddy. Last time we traded down in the 1st it seemed to have backfired....BIG TIME.

Good line of thought. So lets not do it ever again, because it didn't work last time.

They haven't managed the trick of late, but after nearly every draft they talk about failed attempts to do so....including last year. And that was after squashing all talk about moving up to get Ellis. So unless they're lying about things the idea of trading down is a popular one in the Cincy warroom. Where things break down relates to finding a trade partner, closing the deal.....and then selecting the right player.

[Baraka]

I don't think so buddy. Last time we traded down in the 1st it seemed to have backfired....BIG TIME.

Good line of thought. So lets not do it ever again, because it didn't work last time.

They haven't managed the trick of late, but after nearly every draft they talk about failed attempts to do so....including last year. And that was after squashing all talk about moving up to get Ellis. So unless they're lying about things the idea of trading down is a popular one in the Cincy warroom. Where things break down relates to finding a trade partner, closing the deal.....and then selecting the right player.

depending on how other teams value sanchez or crabtree this could be a prime year to move down

[HAPPYJAQ]

I don't think so buddy. Last time we traded down in the 1st it seemed to have backfired....BIG TIME.

Good line of thought. So lets not do it ever again, because it didn't work last time.

They haven't managed the trick of late, but after nearly every draft they talk about failed attempts to do so....including last year. And that was after squashing all talk about moving up to get Ellis. So unless they're lying about things the idea of trading down is a popular one in the Cincy warroom. Where things break down relates to finding a trade partner, closing the deal.....and then selecting the right player.

depending on how other teams value sanchez or crabtree this could be a prime year to move down

I agree with this point. I think Sanchez missed his opportunity at the Combine, though. There has been some recent talk about the Lions either taking Curry 1st, which would mean that either Crabtree or Stafford could be there at #6.

[Baraka]

i was thinking about it last night it'll probably go stafford, j. smith, a. curry, e.monroe, then? the browns want curry but he won't be there and jenkins combine wasn't that great, so who knows which way they go. point being i don't see where either sanchez or crabtree go before we pick.

[Kazkal]

Look forward to the draft really could see the top 5 going quite a few different ways... vs last year couple years it was pretty much known who was going where...

[ArmyBengal]

The thing is having a team within a handful of picks below us NEEDING a player that not only falls to us, but the team think that player will be picked BEFORE they get the chance to pick. This is why I think Crabtree is the player that meets all the criteria. He's one of the best players in the draft, we don't have an overwhelming need for WR, the team immediately following us (Raiders) will pick Crabtree in a heartbeat, and three teams within 5 picks of us would kill for Crabtree.

I see it as all the planets aligning in order for us to be able to address many needs with at least 5 picks in the first 3 rounds.

[Baraka]

The thing is having a team within a handful of picks below us NEEDING a player that not only falls to us, but the team think that player will be picked BEFORE they get the chance to pick. This is why I think Crabtree is the player that meets all the criteria. He's one of the best players in the draft, we don't have an overwhelming need for WR, the team immediately following us (Raiders) will pick Crabtree in a heartbeat, and three teams within 5 picks of us would kill for Crabtree.

I see it as all the planets aligning in order for us to be able to address many needs with at least 5 picks in the first 3 rounds.

that would certainly be ideal.

another possibility could be the niners moving ahead of jacksonville in order to pick sanchez, though that scenario is more of a long shot

[rwalling]

What if we took Crabtree and traded Ocho for another second rounder (read center)? Crabtree and Coles would look nice at wideout.

[Kazkal]

What if we took Crabtree and traded Ocho for another second rounder (read center)? Crabtree and Coles would look nice at wideout.

Or how about we trade Ocho and not draft Crabtree but instead giving the 3 WR's we drafted last year a chance.

[Clackwoods]

What if we took Crabtree and traded Ocho for another second rounder (read center)? Crabtree and Coles would look nice at wideout.

I don't understand why everyone doesn't think we can get a first rounder for Chad Johnson. The guy played with a bum of a QB last year. Did anyone else notice that TJ's numbers dropped monumentally last season from 07 and his value didn't take much of a hit. Chad was hurt and he wasn't around for the offseason which is why he played like crap last year. I am sure that we can still get a first for him and now that we have Coles, I think we will get one!

[HAPPYJAQ]

What if we took Crabtree and traded Ocho for another second rounder (read center)? Crabtree and Coles would look nice at wideout.

I don't understand why everyone doesn't think we can get a first rounder for Chad Johnson. The guy played with a bum of a QB last year. Did anyone else notice that TJ's numbers dropped monumentally last season from 07 and his value didn't take much of a hit. Chad was hurt and he wasn't around for the offseason which is why he played like crap last year. I am sure that we can still get a first for him and now that we have Coles, I think we will get one!

T.J. still finished with over 90 catches and over 900 yards, which is relatively close to his average over the last 4 seasons or so. Chad finished with about 50 catches for around 500 yards last season. As a recent trade barometer, the Patriots only had to give up a 4th rounder to acquire Randy, who was almost 2 years younger when he was traded to New England than Chad is now and without any history of notable injuries. Randy had 42 catches for 553 yards and 3 TD's his final season in Oakland, which are very close to the numbers that Chad had this year.

There are a million reasons why a team won't trade a 1st for Chad. The most obvious is that he is a potential malcontent and distraction for any team that acquires him. After watching the whole T.O. saga/soap opera in Dallas and what Chad did last offseason, you have to believe that teams will be leary of adding players like Chad to their team. Add in a first round price tag to a 30+ receiver who not only is coming off a career year statistically, but a season in which he was injured and it doesn't make sense to trade a 1st rounder for him.

Chad's trade value was it's highest last year and the only team that offered a 1st for him out of the other 31 teams was the Washington Redskins, who run their organization like they're playing Madden. Another huge factor is that acquiring Chad would also mean that you have to offer him a new contract, so not only are you giving up a 1st, you also have to commit at least 8-10 million per season for a WR who is on the backside of his career.

[Whur CHad At?]

Some team would be dumb enough to give us a second. Owners prefer second round picks.

[Thurmanation]

Some team would be dumb enough to give us a second. Owners prefer second round picks.

If/When we trade Chad i can almost be certain we'll be getting atleast one first rounder for him. Mike Brown will lock Chad in a basement at PBS before he lets him go for anything less.

[Wraith]

Guessing the top 5 now to be.

1: Stafford

2: Jason Smith

3: Curry

4: Monroe

5: Orakpo

6: Maualuga or Raji.

[ArmyBengal]

I don't want to take a WR in the first and to tell you the truth if they did, I would prefer Maclin. His return capabilities make him more valuable to the Bengals.

In regards to Chad, I'm left to wonder if people realize that TJ and Chad were two different types of WR's ?? What is so hard to understand that they do different things on the field and while a change in QB's might not affect one, it may the other ?? Chad took a huge hit in having Fitz throwing the ball most of the season. TJ thrived with the type of QB Fitz is. Chad is still Chad and TJ still benefitted having him on the field.

I'm still not anywhere near Chad's biggest fan, but the talent is still there, regardless...

[Baraka]

I don't want to take a WR in the first and to tell you the truth if they did, I would prefer Maclin. His return capabilities make him more valuable to the Bengals.

In regards to Chad, I'm left to wonder if people realize that TJ and Chad were two different types of WR's ?? What is so hard to understand that they do different things on the field and while a change in QB's might not affect one, it may the other ?? Chad took a huge hit in having Fitz throwing the ball most of the season. TJ thrived with the type of QB Fitz is. Chad is still Chad and TJ still benefitted having him on the field.

I'm still not anywhere near Chad's biggest fan, but the talent is still there, regardless...

yeah there are a lot of people throwing the towel in on chad, especially with coles here now. but like you said different responsibilities i think they (ocho and coles) make a great tandem with coles willingness to go over the middle. unlike tj though, if they start cheating up on him he can run past them with his speed. i'm pretty jazzed to be honest.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

T.J. still finished with over 90 catches and over 900 yards, which is relatively close to his average over the last 4 seasons or so. Chad finished with about 50 catches for around 500 yards last season. As a recent trade barometer, the Patriots only had to give up a 4th rounder to acquire Randy, who was almost 2 years younger when he was traded to New England than Chad is now and without any history of notable injuries. Randy had 42 catches for 553 yards and 3 TD's his final season in Oakland, which are very close to the numbers that Chad had this year.

I will say, the fact that the Moss trade is known to be one of the biggest lopsided trades in recent NFL history actually raises Chad's stock. To me, that trade doesn't cap the value - it reminds people that diva WRs tend to give up on crappy QBs.

To be sure, his value was a lot higher a year ago, and I'm pretty sure we could have gotten a 2008 1st and possibly as much as another 2009 first. Now, I'd say a 2nd is the minimum.