Week 2: Jaguars @ Bengals

[HoosierCat]

Yup, just get it (surgery) over with and start the road back.

So, ride or die with Jake Browning, or go get someone else (Ryan Tannehill? Make Tom Grossi's day and trade for Kirk Cousins?)?

I'm betting they stick with Browning but they're going to have to bring in another QB.

ETA note from Schefty:

Quote

Cincinnati did not have another quarterback on its active roster as of Monday morning. Brett Rypien is on the Bengals practice squad, and sources told Schefter that Cincinnati has been contacting other free-agent quarterbacks in the wake of Burrow's injury.

 

[QuintynB]

Jow burrow out for 3 month thats so shity

[ArmyBengal]

I think I'm just still in shock, because I don't really know what to think.

The o-line was bad for Burrow again.  Is that on them?  On Burrow and his style?  The coach?  The scheme? 
Burrow looked hesitant again and much like he did week 1, so playing in the preseason wasn't the solution.
The play calling was poor.  Is that Burrow at the line or Zac?  Whomever it was, they sucked at it.

It's been a few seasons but I recall vividly Burrow talking about how he loves being able to send everyone on routes and leaving the 5 O-linemen to block.  I commented about that happening during the game and that shit needs to stop.  This isn't college where you see stacked o-lines capable of holding off the defense the way Burrow had it at LSU.  NFL defenses are simply too good, strong, fast, etc. to think you are going to pull that off more often than not.

I suppose Jake can go out there and win more games than he loses, but I don't expect much as the season progresses.  I expect Burrow to be out for the season, as "at least" three months from today is week 15.  Even if they are still in the race at that point, would you switch back to Burrow knowing they got that far with Jake?  I think if the team is still in it, it would be predicated on how the team changed with the loss of Burrow.  The last thing I would want is to see him back against the Ravens with the season on the line, taking his first snaps since yesterday.  That team won't be the one from week 2 and I don't trust the coaches to not flip the whole damn thing around because Burrow was back.

The sky isn't falling, it has fallen.  The season, while not over, is.  They won't be competing for the Super Bowl and won't make the playoffs.  I expect a lot more losses and a top 10 pick in the 2026 draft.  That might actually be the best thing would could hope for at this point, so something tells me they will manage to fuck that up too.

Just bummed out today.

[HoosierCat]

PFF oline grades:

OBj 85.9 pass / 53.2 run / 72.5 overall

Fairchild 84.9 / 53.9 / 66.5

Karras 66.0 / 54.3 / 58.8

Mims 61.3 / 41.8 / 53.6

Risner 45.3 / 57.4 / 48.1

Ford 0.0 / 59.5 / 45.6

 

[volcom69]

Every year it’s the same thing we come in here and bitch about the same things, the o-line sucks, where the hell is the running game.  I agree that I have no idea who is to blame o-line, Burrow, Zac, probably all 3 if I had to choose. At the end of the day though Zac is the head coach, and you think after how many years, he would finally say this is not working. I get Burrow likes what he likes, and while for the most part it works, it puts a lot of pressure on the o-line to hold up, and it does not work. I’ll be interested to see how the offense changes now and see if the o-line gets better. 

[HoosierCat]

32 minutes ago, ArmyBengal said:

It's been a few seasons but I recall vividly Burrow talking about how he loves being able to send everyone on routes and leaving the 5 O-linemen to block.  I commented about that happening during the game and that shit needs to stop.  This isn't college where you see stacked o-lines capable of holding off the defense the way Burrow had it at LSU.  NFL defenses are simply too good, strong, fast, etc. to think you are going to pull that off more often than not.

And that's pretty much the Bengals' dilemma in a nutshell. If you let Joe cook, then Joe will eventually get cooked, because even the best oline (which ours isn't, to be clear) is going to struggle to pull this style of offense off consistently. But if you change the scheme, you take away what makes Burrow so special. The Bengals have never been able to find a happy medium.

[ArmyBengal]

Ok so allow me to say what immediately jumped in my head when I read your comment Hoosier...

Maybe Burrow isn't special.  There I said it.

Don't get me wrong, I don't really think that's the case, but maybe what he needs isn't a coach, staff, whatever who just thinks  "Let him cook", which is a saying that I think is really stupid, but rather a coach that KNOWS you don't just let that shit happen.  Maybe a coach that won't simply indulge because that's what the player wants.  You know, coach them that doing that shit in the pros might get your ass killed.

Yeah, I hate Zac.  After this debacle, I will no longer be supporting him.

[gregcook69]

42 minutes ago, ArmyBengal said:

Ok so allow me to say what immediately jumped in my head when I read your comment Hoosier...

Maybe Burrow isn't special.  There I said it.

Don't get me wrong, I don't really think that's the case, but maybe what he needs isn't a coach, staff, whatever who just thinks  "Let him cook", which is a saying that I think is really stupid, but rather a coach that KNOWS you don't just let that shit happen.  Maybe a coach that won't simply indulge because that's what the player wants.  You know, coach them that doing that shit in the pros might get your ass killed.

Yeah, I hate Zac.  After this debacle, I will no longer be supporting him.

I saw a comment in SB Nation that was interesting that no one else dare say.  The guy was saying how he couldn’t understand how the backup QB comes in with the same OL and doesn’t get sacked, finds open receivers that Burrow somehow could not find in 2 games?!?

I’m putting this here for others to weigh in on.  Is the guy who made this comment ‘out of touch’, or does he have a valid point?  

Also, Army, I know you’re close in age to being able to remember this, but I am thinking that Burrow is the Don Gullet of the Bengals!

Dominant player but ALWAYS dealing with injuries which, like Gullet, inhibits his ability to put up the numbers he’s capable of.

I also believe another issue for the front office is they have the smallest scouting program in the NFL!

Think about this.  With that small of a program are they able to scout in the other College divisions like Paul Brown did?

Paul Brown found Kenny Anderson at Augustana College in Rock Island, Ill a Division III college!!!

[HoosierCat]

I think Joe is special, but every QB has limitations in their game and no one, not Joe, not the coaches, seems particularly interested in addressing his.

But more to the point, this year in about 5.5 quarters Burrow had 189 yards and 2 TDs. That's after having a completely healthy offseason, full camp with all his weapons signed, happy and healthy, and a couple quarters' worth of preseason time with the starters to knock off the rust.

Meanwhile, Browning has been dicking around with the 2's and 3's and scrubs, playing sloppy mopup presason ball, comes in cold, and puts up 249 yards, throws two TDs and rushes for a third, game-winning score, in 2.5 quarters. Yes, he also threw 3 picks, but the point is that he's playing with the exact same players on offense. Same oline, same receivers, same backs, same TEs.

That's not what you would expect from the hype around Joe.

[AMPHAR]

The biggest question for me about the game at the time Joe went out was more about the Defense.  Could they rally to get enough stops to win?   I never really doubted the offenses ability vs. Jags to put up yards/points under Joe.

The biggest question is why there was such a dramatic change in pass pro results because on the surface a back up QB trailing in the game should have gotten way more pressure and the Jags gave several looks and brought the house a couple times. 

I actually thought Zac out coached whoever was calling Jags D 2nd half.    There's no doubt in my mind Joe puts up equal or better production vs. Jags yesterday.  

[HoosierCat]

I haven't had a chance to watch more than the highlights, but from what Joe & Jake were saying on the postgame show, the Jags's D was really focused on Burrow while he was in. After he got hurt, they went to a more conventional defense, probably because they now considered it an actual possibility that the Bengals might, y'know, run the ball or throw passes that weren't back-shoulder bombs to Chase. They both thought that if the Jags had stuck with what they were doing with Joe, Browning would have been toast.

[ArmyBengal]

Again, I believe Burrow is an exceptionally talented QB and glad he is ours, but you sure as hell have to be asking these questions.  Questions about him, the players, and the coaches.  Some more appropriate and feasible than others, but still.  The answer to the problems cannot simply be, "Well because"...

[AMPHAR]

5 hours ago, HoosierCat said:

Yup, just get it (surgery) over with and start the road back.

So, ride or die with Jake Browning, or go get someone else (Ryan Tannehill? Make Tom Grossi's day and trade for Kirk Cousins?)?

I'm betting they stick with Browning but they're going to have to bring in another QB.

ETA note from Schefty:

 

If they are going FAs then its ride or die with Browning.   

[gregcook69]

 Not saying he ISN’T the best.  Now I know Dalton is not even in the same league with Burrow, but if memory serves he was only hurt the one time with the thumb.

Better OL?  More durable even though way less talented?

We cannot put the appendicitis and the wrist injury on the OL.

[gregcook69]

How much is scouting connected to their inability to put together the OL with a higher rating.

Is it possible that he is just injury prone?
 

From Google:

• a wrist fracture in 2017 at Ohio State, a knee injury in 2020 during his NFL rookie season, a dislocated finger in 2021, an MCL sprain in the 2022 Super Bowl, a calf strain in 2023 training camp, a season-ending wrist ligament tear in late 2023, and a recent turf toe injury in Week 2 of the 2025 season requiring surgery. 

[AMPHAR]

Dalton's OL crushes anything Burrow has had.   Whit, Boling, Bodine, Z, and Big tits.   Hands down a top 10 unit if not top 5.    Fans didn't like the OL coach because they thought he was a Mike Brown hold over the same with Brat.   Idiot thinking.

A lot of Bengals wanted to live a bad OL life, bad back then.   Unfortunately we get to live a bad OL life now.     

There was a season Alexander's line gave up 17 sacks in a SEASON.   Recent Bengals give that up first 4 games and probably more. 

 

 

 

[HoosierCat]

Yeah, that was 2005 IIRC. Great line.

But to greg's point, yeah it could just be that Joe is snakebit. It's not like he was taking some historic pounding. He was sacked 5 times against Cleveland and Jax. Other QBs with 5 sacks on the year are Lamar and  Russell Wilson. Eight QBs have been dropped 6+ times, including Rodgers. Poor Cam Ward has been sacked 11 times, so he might be dead by week 17. Another 8 QBs have 4 sacks, including Mahomes, Stafford and Flacco.

Bottom line, 19/32 QBs have 4+ sacks, including Burrow with 5. He was not getting especially beat up.

[volcom69]

18 minutes ago, AMPHAR said:

Dalton's OL crushes anything Burrow has had.   Whit, Boling, Bodine, Z, and Big tits.   Hands down a top 10 unit if not top 5.    Fans didn't like the OL coach because they thought he was a Mike Brown hold over the same with Brat.   Idiot thinking.

A lot of Bengals wanted to live a bad OL life, bad back then.   Unfortunately we get to live a bad OL life now.     

There was a season Alexander's line gave up 17 sacks in a SEASON.   Recent Bengals give that up first 4 games and probably more. 

 

 

 

I will always go down saying Alexander was a great OL coach and was upset when they got rid of him. He goes on Sirius XM radio every now and then and I’ll listen to him

[volcom69]

Zac saying today at his presser about this team is not built to run it 40 times, who hell is asking for 40 runs, how about 20-25. 

Like I said it will be interesting to see how Zac schemes things this week, and to be honest I think he will scheme Jake, better than he did Joe. Guess will see how things pan out after next week though.

The defense needs to step up in a huge way and keep the score lower, but not sure how much they are up for that. They really need more pass rushing guys they really do. Maybe even a bit of secondary help also. 

[HoosierCat]

Text of a tweet from PFF's Timo Riske:

Bengals OL combined pass blocking grade yesterday

w/ Joe Burrow in the field yesterday: 49.9

w/ Jake Browning on the field: 73.1

In 2023 in was 67.2 with Browning and 54.6 with Burrow

It's a weird paradox that Burrow is much better, but his play comes with diminished returns, because the Bengals OL just can't deal with his offense.

Will be interesting to see how Zac Taylor can adjust this time over a long time of 3 months.

[TJJackson]

The bad news keeps piling up

MOO MAH is gone

[gregcook69]

“Joe Burrow suffered two major injuries in his college career: a broken bone in his throwing hand in 2017 as a sophomore at Ohio State, and a torn rib cartilage in his left side during the 2019 National Championship Game as a redshirt senior at LSU. He recovered quickly from the hand injury to become a backup for the Buckeyes, and he played through the rib injury during the championship game, according to Yahoo Sports.

It seems to me he is injury prone.

Let’s see what happens with Browning with the same OL.  After all he’s going to be the QB going forward this year!

I hope I’m wrong and time will tell.

As far as picks go, let’s not forget Burrow threw 4 against the Steelers on September 11, 2022.

Like yesterday, Burrow tied the game at 20 all, and the Bengals had a chance to win, but their 29-yard field goal attempt by Evan McPherson was missed.