Smith, was he worth signing?

[volcom69]

I knew it! That guy wearing Smith's number had to an imposter. But he can't fool me I found the real Moobs:

/>https://mobile.twitter.com/JuMosq/status/361942354556497921/photo/1

Yea really what happened to Eddie Lacy? I wonder why not much had been said about his weight?

[TJJackson]

People just can't let go of that shirtless 40.

I honestly don't care about the shirtless 40

I care about dedication to the craft, and the absence from OTAs and mandatorys is just more of the same pattern I have come to expect from him

Fines dont make up for absence. They just don't.

Be a professional, and be there

He's saying the right things. This for example from Joe Reedy's camp recap piece for 7/29 (http://cincinnati.com/blogs/bengals/2013/07/29/729-the-day-at-camp-2/)

I can’t worry about what people think about me. Just know what I want to do as a professional and go out and compete every day,” Smith said.

“I want to be a well rounded offensive lineman and be great in everything as far as run blocking, double teaming, 1 on 1 pass rush and double teaming with the tight end. I just want to be a dominant player.

But how did marvin put it once? I see better than I hear. Its fine to talk that talk, but let's see you walk the walk

A professional makes it to OTAs, and a professional makes it to mandatorys. No excuses. Period.

All that said.......I hope he becomes exactly what he says he wants to become.

[ArmyBengal]

Don't get me wrong, I have never once said I liked him missing the time, because I don't.

However, I won't go making up stories about why he's missing that time like saying he's overweight, lazy, or anything else.

By all accounts, he was fairly close to being what he said he wants to be, last year.

I understand it though, when a fan gets in his/her head that they simply dislike a player, it's a hard thing to change.

[TJJackson]

*shrug*

I just don't think it is hating or overreacting to expect a VERY highly compensated professional to act in a professional manner

[HoosierCat]

I can understand the frustration. Used to be the same way about Houshmandzadeh. I think it's fair to wonder just how committed Smith is. That said, at this point he's here, he's practicing and he's saying all the right things, so I'll let him be.

[kingwilly]

Millions = fat

period

Further, its not an overreaction to expect a football player to.........play football (which absolutely includes practices)

TJ, I get it.

Through most of the 90's I raced bicycles (road and mtn) professionally. I also ran my own teams, got my own corporate sponsors, etc.

I fired my share of un-professional riders. Guys who had talent but did not approach the job professionally. I get it. I had no tolerance for it. I didn't have to tolerate it.

The issue that seems to be undercurrent is not the money making them entitled or lazy, it is their attitude and environment, and the people in their life. A professional athlete organizes their life to be built around doing their job at maximum. Workouts, nutrition, recovery, team activities all have to take priority. It can be hard on athletes who have immense talent and have skated on that. When they confront the fact that they can no longer get by on that, and their life is not organized to make their job a priority, this is when we see regression behaviors like unpreparedness such as being out of shape, missing team training programs, getting little injuries then result.

I think this can be found in Smith. How he spent the off-season, what kind of program he was on, both fitness/strength and nutrition, as well as the fact he missed the team activities immediately after signing his extension, spells out for me he is not approaching this as a professional. Sure, they are adults, need time off, can't tell them what to do, etc. But if I'm the Bengals, I'd have levels of management that provide a functional view of the work they are doing, how they are upholding their end of the professional bargain. I'd engage with the player and his trainer to give them advanced tools, like workout tracking (HR telemetry, kilo joule output, etc.) as well as more highly incentivize their adherence to such a program.

Some of this might conflict or be against CBA language but there certainly are tools the Bengals could use to more closely manage and raise the level of professionalism of players who fall under the "Smith" category.

Just my $.02.

[HoosierCat]

That's worth more than $0.02, willy. Great insight:

It can be hard on athletes who have immense talent and have skated on that. When they confront the fact that they can no longer get by on that, and their life is not organized to make their job a priority, this is when we see regression behaviors like unpreparedness such as being out of shape, missing team training programs, getting little injuries then result.

So much this. It's the tl;dr version of why the Bengals spent the better part of two decades as the Bungles. Talented knuckleheads are, by definition, exactly those guys. It's hard enough to get one of them onto the right track (see: Smith, Andre). When you bring them in by the bushel, it's impossible.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

You have to admit he looks better physically than he has since he's been here, I was quite surprised at that after all of the conjecture about him missing OTA's because of his weight.

[COB]

Marvin spun it as though Smith didn't just choose to work out elsewhere. He made statements about Smith having something he had to take care of that kept him away. Even if true, if gets back to Willie's whole theory of building your life around being a pro athlete. It's pretty clear Andre hasn't done that. Pretty good player, though.

[ArmyBengal]

Again, all signs to the contrary.

Smith was said to be lifting weight during his absence and even was reported to be "tearing it up".

Then he reports to camp, even with missing OTA's and minicamp, at 7 pounds over his playing weight from the end of last season.

So even though in the past, I would certainly have labeled him as more lazy than anything, I don't think anyone can say that in this regard.

I will state again, that I haven't liked his work ethic to this point and don't like that he missed the time that he did.

However, no one knows for sure why he was absent. Falling back on the old "he's lazy", "he's a fatass", or whatever is baseless.

Injuries happen, just ask Dunlap.

[combatbengal]

Did I miss something. I thought he missed all that time because of personal issues, not weight issues. Bottom line, in the Army when I showed up for the semi annual fitness test, I was prepared to pass it; max it, and pass weight and or tape test. If you paid me a million $$ to play football, you bet my you know what, I would show up on time, fit and prepared to do my job! However, that's old news, now he's here, let's see how he does!

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Again, all signs to the contrary.

Smith was said to be lifting weight during his absence and even was reported to be "tearing it up".

Then he reports to camp, even with missing OTA's and minicamp, at 7 pounds over his playing weight from the end of last season.

So even though in the past, I would certainly have labeled him as more lazy than anything, I don't think anyone can say that in this regard.

I will state again, that I haven't liked his work ethic to this point and don't like that he missed the time that he did.

However, no one knows for sure why he was absent. Falling back on the old "he's lazy", "he's a fatass", or whatever is baseless.

Injuries happen, just ask Dunlap.

I'm shocked the two guys known to have work ethic/character issues and "skinny legs" or "weight problems" would be constantly injured or absent.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Did I miss something. I thought he missed all that time because of personal issues, not weight issues. Bottom line, in the Army when I showed up for the semi annual fitness test, I was prepared to pass it; max it, and pass weight and or tape test. If you paid me a million $$ to play football, you bet my you know what, I would show up on time, fit and prepared to do my job! However, that's old news, now he's here, let's see how he does!

He had an injured foot, who knows why he never physically showed up to OTA's, and media speculation assumed he would lose his bonus and be held out of camp because of his weight, so he simply didn't show up as a result.

An injured foot = no exercise and extra weight you would think...but the shape he's in right now contradicts all of that, so who knows...

[HoosierCat]

I thought of Gilligan just now when I saw that the Saints cut Jason Smith. Y'know, Andre may not have had the smoothest start to his career, and that's putting it mildly, but compared to most of the rest of the top picks in 2009 he's a frikkin' gold-plated success.

1. Matt Stafford - good QB, crappy team, sounds familiar somehow...

2. Jason Smith - megabust

3. Tyson Jackson - 5 sacks in 5 years. We took MJ in what round again?

4. Aaron Curry - now on his third team (NYG)

5. Mark Sanchez - butt fumble

6. Andre Smith - gold-plated success story

Oh, and we just cut the 11th pick that year, Maybin. Yuck.

[ArmyBengal]

Stop it Hoosier.

Don't you remember when he ran that shirtless 40 ??

I mean holy hell does he suck...

[skyline]

Sure, it's a fluff piece, but it's good to read all the same:

http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Smith-offering-a-clinic/11e3e8b9-b043-4bc6-a9df-e75b8b7b4625

[HoosierCat]

If Sir Winston Churchill once said of Russia it "is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma," you wonder what he would he would say about Bengals right tackle Andre Smith.

If he saw Smith play so powerfully and well in the first two preseason games he would probably say, "This is his finest hour," because that's what people whom have watched every snap of Smith's five NFL seasons are saying.

That may be the most pretentious lead ever written on bengals.com. Will someone please go slap Hobs?

[skyline]

If Sir Winston Churchill once said of Russia it "is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma," you wonder what he would he would say about Bengals right tackle Andre Smith.

If he saw Smith play so powerfully and well in the first two preseason games he would probably say, "This is his finest hour," because that's what people whom have watched every snap of Smith's five NFL seasons are saying.

That may be the most pretentious lead ever written on bengals.com. Will someone please go slap Hobs?

It's just asking for me to photoshop a picture of Gilligan and Churchhill standing side-by-side with arms clasped around each other.

[princeton]

there are some plays in which that right side just wipes out everyone

but there are too many plays in which one of them completely whiffs, which wipes out our ballcarrier or QB.

left side is more consistent, but it's consistently mediocre.

[ArmyBengal]

Correct me if i'm wrong but wasn't the right side the only side they could consistently run behind all of last season ??

I thought I remember seeing those stats, but don't have the time to go find that out.

[skyline]

Correct me if i'm wrong but wasn't the right side the only side they could consistently run behind all of last season ??

I thought I remember seeing those stats, but don't have the time to go find that out.

Would make sense. Smith has always been an excellent run blocker.

[HoosierCat]

Yes, they were much better running to the right last year than to the left. But they were most successful slamming it up the gut.

/>http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol2012

[princeton]

Yes, they were much better running to the right last year than to the left. But they were most successful slamming it up the gut.

/>http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol2012

good up the middle and lousy on the flanks, which helps to explain why we were nearly last in second line yardage. There's a lot of second line defenders up the middle.

enter Gio...

[ArmyBengal]

No not lousy on the flanks. Lousy to the left. Best up the middle (which surprises me) and almost top third to the right.

Again, Smith is not the issue. People just hate him. I get that because there are players I dislike as well.

Granted none that are considered one of the top at their position in the league, but still.

[HoosierCat]

I think you also have to take into account that BJGE was the "bell cow" last year and he isn't much of a threat to take it outside.