Draft Conversation

[Kazkal]

I actually think Dez Bryant could fall...he got suspended all year. Players slipped for less, but I'm with you I don't think he'll be there. I've just seen a couple mocks that think he will and think Arrelious Benn will be the first receiver taken. It's a small chance but I can dream, can't I?

I don't See his Stock Falling because he talked to Deion Sanders,Percy Harvy still went top 20 even though he was a Known pot head.

[SupaBran]

I actually think Dez Bryant could fall...he got suspended all year. Players slipped for less, but I'm with you I don't think he'll be there. I've just seen a couple mocks that think he will and think Arrelious Benn will be the first receiver taken. It's a small chance but I can dream, can't I?

I don't See his Stock Falling because he talked to Deion Sanders,Percy Harvy still went top 20 even though he was a Known pot head.

Very true...I just like Dez b/c I would watch him play and he would show up! I can't stand when a receiver gets all this attention and then when I actually watch him play he gets shut out or something...plus I didn't know much about Damian Williams, and with me living in FL, I don't get to watch USC too much.

[SupaBran]

Players certainly have fallen for less, so yep, you never know. Benn should have come out last season before deciding to go back and drop more passes than make me comfortable taking him in the first. Dream away dude, because something tells me this is going to be another draft where someone falls to us we never thought would be there.

Williams ?? 6'1, 195lbs. with 4.45 speed. He can still add to his frame and has GREAT hands. He does very well with YAC, has great body control, and is one of those guys that makes nice leaps to get the ball at it's highest point. He does great with getting separation and has made it a point to make it a habit to get two feet down in bounds to prepare for the NFL. There are 3 things about him that I absolutely LOVE hearing.

GREAT CHARACTER

GREAT WORK ETHIC

ELITE ROUTE RUNNER

He isn't recognized as the best blocker by any stretch and might not time that fast, but he's also another weapon in punt returns. While I understand the apprehension with USC WR's in the past, I don't have those concerns with Williams. He just seems like a very solid player who doesn't appear to carry the diva label and will continue to work hard.

Yeah, I like the kid in the first...

You know what? You have officially converted me to Camp Williams! I did some "research" after I asked who he was and I saw a lot of the same stuff you just said above. I can't wait to see him at the combine and watch some of his highlights.

He sounds like the Reggie Wayne's, the Andre Johnson's of the world! He is not a diva at a position where it seems like 90% of them are.

I read a mock where the guy thinks of him as the top receiver in the draft and thinks he fits our system with his elite route running.

I agree completely that we will end up with someone other that we didn't think would slip that far.

[SupaBran]

As of now Army, I completely agree with you about your top 3 players...except for the rankings of them.

I would go with Williams first and Mays ahead of Iupati if he's there, but a lot can change obviously from now until the draft ie. needs and players value.

[ArmyBengal]

As of now Army, I completely agree with you about your top 3 players...except for the rankings of them.

I would go with Williams first and Mays ahead of Iupati if he's there, but a lot can change obviously from now until the draft ie. needs and players value.

I'm not really ranking them in any particular order and think ANY of the three of them in the first would make me happy. ANY OF THEM.

Mays is obviously a freak of nature and if the knock is he's like Roy Williams, then I say go ahead and draft him and we can look forward to the hopeful 5 pro-bowls he will bring us. Iupati would give us the replacement for the o-line we all know we need, but I understand that Guard isn't the "sexy" pick in the first round. Williams just seems electric and for the non-diva attitude, work ethic, and his versitility, it's hard not to like what you see in him. You want playmaker ?? His name is Williams.

My buddy here is a huge USC fan and we got together many weekends to watch games. Williams is the real deal and you just don't see route running and an attention to detail like his that often. Like I said though, any of those guys would make me happy and their selection wouldn't surprise me inthe least.

[redsbengalsbucks]

Players certainly have fallen for less, so yep, you never know. Benn should have come out last season before deciding to go back and drop more passes than make me comfortable taking him in the first. Dream away dude, because something tells me this is going to be another draft where someone falls to us we never thought would be there.

Williams ?? 6'1, 195lbs. with 4.45 speed. He can still add to his frame and has GREAT hands. He does very well with YAC, has great body control, and is one of those guys that makes nice leaps to get the ball at it's highest point](Well we all know he will be needing this as a Bengal). He does great with getting separation and has made it a point to make it a habit to get two feet down in bounds to prepare for the NFL. There are 3 things about him that I absolutely LOVE hearing.

GREAT CHARACTER

GREAT WORK ETHIC

ELITE ROUTE RUNNER

He isn't recognized as the best blocker by any stretch and might not time that fast, but he's also another weapon in punt returns. While I understand the apprehension with USC WR's in the past, I don't have those concerns with Williams. He just seems like a very solid player who doesn't appear to carry the diva label and will continue to work hard.

Yeah, I like the kid in the first...

[redsbengalsbucks]

I actually think Dez Bryant could fall...he got suspended all year. Players slipped for less, but I'm with you I don't think he'll be there. I've just seen a couple mocks that think he will and think Arrelious Benn will be the first receiver taken. It's a small chance but I can dream, can't I?

I don't See his Stock Falling because he talked to Deion Sanders,Percy Harvy still went top 20 even though he was a Known pot head.

Probably the reason he has been having migraines all year, he has had to give up the green and is having withdrawal pains.

[SupaBran]

As of now Army, I completely agree with you about your top 3 players...except for the rankings of them.

I would go with Williams first and Mays ahead of Iupati if he's there, but a lot can change obviously from now until the draft ie. needs and players value.

I'm not really ranking them in any particular order and think ANY of the three of them in the first would make me happy. ANY OF THEM.

Mays is obviously a freak of nature and if the knock is he's like Roy Williams, then I say go ahead and draft him and we can look forward to the hopeful 5 pro-bowls he will bring us. Iupati would give us the replacement for the o-line we all know we need, but I understand that Guard isn't the "sexy" pick in the first round. Williams just seems electric and for the non-diva attitude, work ethic, and his versitility, it's hard not to like what you see in him. You want playmaker ?? His name is Williams.

My buddy here is a huge USC fan and we got together many weekends to watch games. Williams is the real deal and you just don't see route running and an attention to detail like his that often. Like I said though, any of those guys would make me happy and their selection wouldn't surprise me inthe least.

Ok, I got you! I agree, I just wanted to add Earl Thomas, the safetly outta Texas to my list.(even tho I don't know much about him)

[Pidge]

Earl Thomas probably looks a better prospect than Mays at this point - whoulda thunk it just a few months back. Still, a good combine combined with mays size and speed and he could easily push himself back into the top 10/15.

That safety out of Vandy is still the guy I'd go with in the 2nd rnd. Try and grab Iupati in the first. Only other position (outside of a lineman of either persuasion) I'd be happy with in the first is one of the top 3 or 4 WRs. You'd get much better and faster production out of a lineman or a safety though. Hell, maybe a nice pass rusher falls there.

[ArmyBengal]

Players certainly have fallen for less, so yep, you never know. Benn should have come out last season before deciding to go back and drop more passes than make me comfortable taking him in the first. Dream away dude, because something tells me this is going to be another draft where someone falls to us we never thought would be there.

Williams ?? 6'1, 195lbs. with 4.45 speed. He can still add to his frame and has GREAT hands. He does very well with YAC, has great body control, and is one of those guys that makes nice leaps to get the ball at it's highest point](Well we all know he will be needing this as a Bengal). He does great with getting separation and has made it a point to make it a habit to get two feet down in bounds to prepare for the NFL. There are 3 things about him that I absolutely LOVE hearing.

GREAT CHARACTER

GREAT WORK ETHIC

ELITE ROUTE RUNNER

He isn't recognized as the best blocker by any stretch and might not time that fast, but he's also another weapon in punt returns. While I understand the apprehension with USC WR's in the past, I don't have those concerns with Williams. He just seems like a very solid player who doesn't appear to carry the diva label and will continue to work hard.

Yeah, I like the kid in the first...

I get your point there, but this is something that you will find is lacking in many college WR's. They don't put a lot of thought into the smaller things like that and getting two feet down in bounds. Williams does. Are there other WR's out there that would be great to have ?? Yes. Are there other players that would be better than the ones i've listed ?? Yes, but I'm only thinking of the ones I think have a realistic chance of falling to #21. Honestly, whatever is being said about Mays now will probably disappear quickly after the combine and make our nice talk about him now, unrealistic. Here's to hoping not though...

[SupaBran]

Earl Thomas probably looks a better prospect than Mays at this point - whoulda thunk it just a few months back. Still, a good combine combined with mays size and speed and he could easily push himself back into the top 10/15.

That safety out of Vandy is still the guy I'd go with in the 2nd rnd. Try and grab Iupati in the first. Only other position (outside of a lineman of either persuasion) I'd be happy with in the first is one of the top 3 or 4 WRs. You'd get much better and faster production out of a lineman or a safety though. Hell, maybe a nice pass rusher falls there.

Like Carlos Dunlap?

[HAPPYJAQ]

I think the Bengals might be keying on Bay Bay Thomas out of GT, as a WR prospect in round 2 or 3. No inside information, just guessing here, but he's a large WR at 6'3'', 230 and a proven deep threat. I believe he averaged 25 yards per catch this season as a 3rd team All-American.

I'd be OK with Benn and would love to see Bryant fall to us. Benn would be a perfect understudy to Chad, and he's by far the most explosive player in this draft. I believe the drops are more of a concentration/focus thing, as he will also make some incredibly acrobatic catches.

It kills me to type this, but I think the Bengals will go with a pash-rusher in the 1st round, after reportedly almost pulling the trigger on Orakpo last draft. I remember that they also coveted Derrick Harvey and Manny Lawson in recent drafts and Zim has been negative about the lack of a pash-rush for two seasons now. Brandon and Jeanty are also UFAs and at least one of them will leave, and possibly both. I think they go some combination of WR, S and TE in the following rounds. Gilyard would be perfect in Round 2 and this is maybe the deepest draft ever for Safties. I don't believe you'll see a TE drafted ahead of where they picked Coffman last year, as it would essentially be calling Chase a bust. Kelly could be back and I think they like what they have in Foschi. A veteran TE is more likely (if Kelly isn't re-signed), while they further evaluate Coffman.

Anybody think that the Bengals would talk to Jerry again about Martellus Bennett? Watching this guy, I'd be OK with us trading a 1st. He's an absolute monster, and more of a sure thing than Gresham, especially as a blocker. Besides, it's not like the first is a Top-10 pick. It kinda goes back to the Coffman thing, but I see Bennett as a future Pro Bowl type TE, who would help open up the offense.

[SupaBran]

I think the Bengals might be keying on Bay Bay Thomas out of GT, as a WR prospect in round 2 or 3. No inside information, just guessing here, but he's a large WR at 6'3'', 230 and a proven deep threat. I believe he averaged 25 yards per catch this season as a 3rd team All-American.

I'd be OK with Benn and would love to see Bryant fall to us. Benn would be a perfect understudy to Chad, and he's by far the most explosive player in this draft. I believe the drops are more of a concentration/focus thing, as he will also make some incredibly acrobatic catches.

It kills me to type this, but I think the Bengals will go with a pash-rusher in the 1st round, after reportedly almost pulling the trigger on Orakpo last draft. I remember that they also coveted Derrick Harvey and Manny Lawson in recent drafts and Zim has been negative about the lack of a pash-rush for two seasons now. Brandon and Jeanty are also UFAs and at least one of them will leave, and possibly both. I think they go some combination of WR, S and TE in the following rounds. Gilyard would be perfect in Round 2 and this is maybe the deepest draft ever for Safties. I don't believe you'll see a TE drafted ahead of where they picked Coffman last year, as it would essentially be calling Chase a bust. Kelly could be back and I think they like what they have in Foschi. A veteran TE is more likely (if Kelly isn't re-signed), while they further evaluate Coffman.

Anybody think that the Bengals would talk to Jerry again about Martellus Bennett? Watching this guy, I'd be OK with us trading a 1st. He's an absolute monster, and more of a sure thing than Gresham, especially as a blocker. Besides, it's not like the first is a Top-10 pick. It kinda goes back to the Coffman thing, but I see Bennett as a future Pro Bowl type TE, who would help open up the offense.

Good stuff...you beat me to the punch but I was coming on here to say to all those who said we would absolutely not draft Gresham at #21...y not? We tried to trade our 1st or 2nd round pick for Martellus Bennett and I absolutely don't think Bennett is better than Jermaine Gresham...at least pre injury!

[Pidge]

Earl Thomas probably looks a better prospect than Mays at this point - whoulda thunk it just a few months back. Still, a good combine combined with mays size and speed and he could easily push himself back into the top 10/15.

That safety out of Vandy is still the guy I'd go with in the 2nd rnd. Try and grab Iupati in the first. Only other position (outside of a lineman of either persuasion) I'd be happy with in the first is one of the top 3 or 4 WRs. You'd get much better and faster production out of a lineman or a safety though. Hell, maybe a nice pass rusher falls there.

Like Carlos Dunlap?

As long as he isn't pulled over with a DUI on the way to rookie camp. But yeah, if his "character problems", as they will be lazily described, cause him to fall (and he gets rids of that pudding basin haircut) then grab him without thinking. Call me a pessimist but I'm not sure how Odom will be next yr. The Achilles tendon is a pretty important thing for a 280 lb guy who needs to push off 50 or so times a game.

[ArmyBengal]

I was coming on here to say to all those who said we would absolutely not draft Gresham at #21...y not?

Why not ??

Because safety, guard, wide receiver, defensive end, and maybe even defensive tackle are bigger needs.

Gresham is coming off an injury.

There are other TE's that could help in free agency.

There are other TE's that could be had later in the draft and make a pretty good impact.

We still don't know what the Bengals are going to do with Kelly.

Ignoring all of that, we should absolutely draft Gresham in the first....

[goaueagles]

the first round pick can't be a WR unless they are drafting for 2012. They just don't have a place to play a new high round pick. Ocho is already blocking Simpson from playing, and I don't see them paying a top pick to return punts with Cosby doing that for the cheap. #2 is firmly in the hands of Caldwell. Cosby seemed to come on late with some chemestry with Carson and looks to be the small, fast catching option that Chris Perry was suppose to be, pre injuries. Only open spot for a top pick would be Cole's spot, (Henry's spot will be a late round wr pick) but I don't see them getting rid of the locker room presence since Kelly won't be back. The passing game needs some serious help, but with the above WR's the only spot for catching some of Carson's spirals is the TE position which would open up the middle. With the Bengals love of off balanced lines, they need the complete TE that they have wanted since Lewis got here. They have the Blocking TE in Right Tackle Roland (that allows them to double up on an active game day roster spot)and they have the a pass catching TE in push up loving Chase. Now they need someone that can do both but without tipping Run or Pass to the defense. The Bengals must decide if they can get that TE in the 3rd round or hope that Chase can block. Round 2 has always been the best player that falls (good drafting). Round 1 will go to the D, which is still a few players away from having the depth needed to allow it to play a 16 game schedule injuries and all.

[Kazkal]

How do we not have a spot on our Roster for a Wide Receiver when we wearn't getting Production out of our Current ones?

Why Draft a Pass Catching Tight who suffered a Injury this year(like Coffman last) When we can instead for a reasonable price go sign a Proven Tight End in Free Agency? On top of having Coffman & Foschi still on the roster.

5 WR Gameday 6 on Team Total

Chad Ochocinco-Teams 1# and more likely remain so

L.Coles-I doubt the Bengals cut him but I think he has a better year having another year in the system and a offseason working with Carson

Caldwell-Runs hot and Cold looks like a playmaker at times other he just disappears...But Even when he's making plays was against teams 3rd & 4th top DB...

Quan Cosby-Hopefully they Exspand his role the guy is a Smart Player.

Rookie Here-He'll be able get activated on the game day Roster and get plenty balls unless someone on roster already steps up

Jerome Simpson-He has had 3 Years to get it he hasn't so our Draft Day should consider he's cut THOUGH if he finally does get it before cut date it's not a problem because it makes the Aged WR's more expandable

If Jerome Doesn't show enough that he can make a game day roster then I look for him to get cut and replaced either by Purify or a later drafted WR.

PS,Bengals more likely would have Resigned Chris we have to replace his production that were going to be missing on top of still upgrading the lack of it we had.

[ArmyBengal]

Chad is keeping Simpson from being active ??

Whew, and here I thought it was because he can't digest the playbook and learn plays. I mean it would be a real bitch to have two or three other players that were drafted AFTER him to get playing time while he doesn't. Maybe if one of the WR's gets hurt he might get his shot then.

Wait a minute... You mean Caldwell, Cosby, AND Purify have had playing time ?? And Simpson didn't make plays when Henry went down ??

Oh yeah, Simpson has SUCKED BALLS to this point !!! Would it be nice if this was "his year" and he makes the impact we all hoped for ?? Sure.

Until then Simpson = wasted pick...

[SupaBran]

I was coming on here to say to all those who said we would absolutely not draft Gresham at #21...y not?

Why not ??

Because safety, guard, wide receiver, defensive end, and maybe even defensive tackle are bigger needs.

Gresham is coming off an injury.

There are other TE's that could help in free agency.

There are other TE's that could be had later in the draft and make a pretty good impact.

We still don't know what the Bengals are going to do with Kelly.

Ignoring all of that, we should absolutely draft Gresham in the first....

Ur missing my point Army...I'm not saying Gresham is my first choice, or 5th for that matter! I'm saying the team could do it with them trying to trade a 1st(or a 2nd, I don't remember which) for Martellus Bennett. Obviously the team thought that a tight end would make us better...even with Chase already on the roster and enough to think it was worth that high of a pick. I don't agree with it, I would rather have all those positions you named above except maybe def. end, simply b/c we are already paying buttloads to Odom and Geathers(even tho only one of them is earning it!).

I will say that if all those other positions are gone...I would take Gresham in a heartbeat. The only thing that scares me is he is coming off an injury. But, he had the whole college season to get healthy and rehab and is prob. back to full health if not close. They say Gresham is a wide receiver in a tight end's body and prob. has the best hands in the draft including WRs.

And don't try to sell me that he's not a good blocker b/c I don't care about that to the point where that's all I worry about. Its important, don't get me wrong...I just think this staff has put to much emphasis on a tight ends blocking to the point where all they line up out there are smaller OLineman like Reggie Kelly and Coats and no playmakers. I think Carson would love a receiving tight end in the middle of the field, like a bigger TJ! Especially in this type of offense!

But if Chase can do that and has developed after a year of riding the pine and we don't have to use another high draft pick on a tight end, then count me in but I just don't want Coffman turning into the tight end version of Jerome Simpson, with 3 years gone by and were all wondering why Chase can't get any playing time.

[SupaBran]

Earl Thomas probably looks a better prospect than Mays at this point - whoulda thunk it just a few months back. Still, a good combine combined with mays size and speed and he could easily push himself back into the top 10/15.

That safety out of Vandy is still the guy I'd go with in the 2nd rnd. Try and grab Iupati in the first. Only other position (outside of a lineman of either persuasion) I'd be happy with in the first is one of the top 3 or 4 WRs. You'd get much better and faster production out of a lineman or a safety though. Hell, maybe a nice pass rusher falls there.

Like Carlos Dunlap?

As long as he isn't pulled over with a DUI on the way to rookie camp. But yeah, if his "character problems", as they will be lazily described, cause him to fall (and he gets rids of that pudding basin haircut) then grab him without thinking. Call me a pessimist but I'm not sure how Odom will be next yr. The Achilles tendon is a pretty important thing for a 280 lb guy who needs to push off 50 or so times a game.

LMFAO! Puddin' basin haircut...that's frickin hilarious! He hasn't had that since his soph. season, he has a normal fade haircut but that gameday pic is atrocious.

[Kazkal]

Ur missing my point Army...I'm not saying Gresham is my first choice, or 5th for that matter! I'm saying the team could do it with them trying to trade a 1st(or a 2nd, I don't remember which) for Martellus Bennett.

It was a 2nd I think and it was a Mid Season despration & last day before trade deadline because we were despite for a Tight End...But Now during the Offseason they can find one in FA If not at some point in the draft....I would put money Marvin in Anthony Fasano aslong as he doesn't have 2nd round tender then I could still see him coming in since they were expected to draft him before the cowboys snatched him right be for us.

[Wraith]

I for one would love Gilyard or Gresham in the first but would also be very comfortable with Brandon Spikes, Rolondo McClain (I know I am dreaming but Linebackers have been dropping lately), Terrance Cody, or Taylor Mays (depending on Player Personel Evaluations, not convinced that he is dedicated enough to the game to truly succeed in the NFL).

Gilyard will likely be gone by the time we pick in the second round, (he is in the 20-40 range in most draft evaluations now). He is a dedicated young man and is an outspoken leader, his football skills are beyond reproach and I feel he could have a massive impact from his rookie year forward. Nevermind his connections back to Cincinnati, he is just the kind of WR that we need, tall enough and fast enough to draw a double team but dedicated enough to be a reliable pass catcher.

Gresham is a top ten talent that will drop because of injury concerns, fast, tall, good blocker, great hands, runs near perfect routes....losing Gresham was the single worst blow Oklahoma had this season (more than losing Bradford) and anytime you can grab a talent like his at a need position, you do it. The Bengals need to have a threat in middle of the field to loosen coverage on our WRs, someone who is faster than the LBers to draw off a Safety. The fact that we didn't have that person this year was a major blow to the offense.

My wish list would be:

1) McClain (not that he will be there)

2) Gresham

3) Spikes (I have been dreaming of a Rivers, Spikes, Maualuga LBers corp for two years now)

4) Gilyard

5) Cody (Cody, Sims, Peko, Tank Johnson is one heck of a DT rotation)

6) Mays (Berry will be gone)

[SupaBran]

Ur missing my point Army...I'm not saying Gresham is my first choice, or 5th for that matter! I'm saying the team could do it with them trying to trade a 1st(or a 2nd, I don't remember which) for Martellus Bennett.

It was a 2nd I think and it was a Mid Season despration & last day before trade deadline because we were despite for a Tight End...But Now during the Offseason they can find one in FA If not at some point in the draft....I would put money Marvin in Anthony Fasano aslong as he doesn't have 2nd round tender then I could still see him coming in since they were expected to draft him before the cowboys snatched him right be for us.

That's very realistic. It is easily in my Bengal expectations ballpark. Grabbing Gresham or signing Brandon Marshall...ah..not so much.

[Kazkal]

Like if we selected Greshem I wouldn't complain myself There are other players I would much rather have hopefully if they took greshem they were all off the board...But it would atleast give me hope that they have plans to utilize the TIght End Position in 2010...Like I mentioned on another thread 10 out of 12 Playoff teams had a play maker at Tight End I just hope we address somewhere that isn't the first round..Hell it may be Signing Daniels,Scheffler,Scaife,Watson,Fasano or even snatching Matt Spaeth...Now that I think of it I think it's a very real possibility that we end up Signing a Free Agent Tight end because one it's a position where top players doesn't cost you a whole lot of money ,Two They Tryed trading for the Dallas cat and Ejected Utecht Mid season rather then giving him one more chance...(Which would make since if they plan on making a move in the following Free agenecy that has alot of good TIght Ends becoming available.)

PS,<3 for Wraith but just say no to 1st round Linebackers! We spent enough 1st day picks at the position...Time to give a Position we normally don't draft high a chance.

[SupaBran]

I agree w/ Kazkal, I wouldn't say we're set at LB but unless he's clearly the BPA (like Spikes in the 2nd round) I say pass and keep Dhani in the middle to play out his contract and then put Rey back to the middle in 2 years. Then we can draft an OLB early to pair with Rivers and Rey.

I don't get y ppl want Cody either. He is clearly a 3-4 nose tackle...and not even a good one at that. I'm not saying this b/c I'm a Gator fan and I have a hatred for the Crimson Tide but we've played him the past 2 years and he has been invisible for over 90% of the time.

My wish list:

1. Any WR in one of the first 2 rounds(obviously not a Jerome Simpson type)

2. Taylor Mays

3. Mike Iupati

4. Jermaine Gresham

5. Carlos Dunlap