Tab Perry to Saftey?

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

Noone is saying he is definitively the answer to our injury prone safeties. However, this is the second season in a row where we have lost more than one of our starting safeties for the entire season. Don't you think having someone other than Kevin Kaesviharn ready to step in as a backup if necessary is a good idea? Don't you think it's a pretty damned good idea to take a guy who has played the position and has shown he has a lot of athleticism and a willingness to do more than just return kicks and work him out somewhere else? I suppose you are one of those guys who thinks Billy B out in New England was a fool for thinking a wideout could be a cornerback and *gasp* play at the position in the Super Bowl of all things! Marvin apparently is actually looking at Tab Perry and saying hey, I'm not going to wait until we are totally screwed again at the position. I'm going to get someone who expressed interest a chance to see if he can do it.

If that's all it is, fine. Emergency backups are always fine to have, and February is probably a good month for that. And Tab's an ideal candidate since he's taking up a roster spot solely to play special teams. But the fact that he played S in high school doesn't mean much to me, at least half the league probably went both ways in HS. I'm sure some people on this board played S in high school.

The question is, does this change the fact that we need a S in the first two rounds of the draft? I don't really think so.

He didn't just play safety in high school. He played it in college as well in his first couple of years.

[membengal]

Joisey, please stop ignoring what was ahead of TJ on the depth chart as a rookie versus what was ahead of Perry. Of couse Perry had less opportunities this year. We all knew that going in. He was drafted to return kicks and provide an updgrade there, he did that. He was drafted to develop someday as a receiver. He may yet do that. Moving him to safety in any manner f**ks with that curve in my opinion. You don't share that. No biggie. But that's where it's at.

221 yards from TJ in 2001 is not all that impressive, given how wide open the receiving opporturnities were ahead of him. And he has turned out just fine. I guess I am a little stunned at how dismissive you are of Perry as a receiver given how limited his run was necessarily going to be. I would submit we don't know what he can be yet, and won't for a year or two more.

And...so what if he is on a three year contract? Why does that bother you? All guys that sign down there in the draft are on such contracts. In that time, he will either get more opportunities as a receiver and step up to them, or he won't. If he does, he will make more on his next contract. If he doesn't, he won't.

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

Stop ignoring what was ahead of TJ on the depth chart? Wait a second, wasn't that Pdud and Ron Dugans (you know, the supersuck?) Sure, we had Chad Johnson, but he was a rookie too, and frankly, in 2001, TJ was as good as Chad Johnson. Gee, guess what, the more they play together, the better they both are. Oh wait, I almost forgot, the incredible edible egg, Danny Farmer was on the squad too.

Truth be told, TJ SHOULD have had more opportunities in his first year, but he didn't because our QB wasn't Carson "The Franchise" Palmer.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Perry could get the nod to "compete" for a spot at SS, at some point, but I'd rather see them draft or sign someone and get rid of the uselessness that is Mitchell, or even KK.

I don't think they are going to pass up a SS in the draft or FA because of him though - if that isn't obvious.

I think Tab should be worried about competing for Walter's spot on the roster at WR - he could potentially be a better all-around player - more speed, slightly more size - and more valuabe on special teams.

CJ, TJ, Henry, Perry, Walter - 4 solid WR's to have - two of which can contribute in multiple ways.

People act as if Tab didn't see the light of day WR last year - hell they designed plays for him as the season went along.

I think people are under-estimating the impact he'll have at the WR position in the next year or two - be patient folks - he's only a 2nd year player drafted in the 7th round! I would like to see how he does in preseason action at WR now that he knows the offense.

[HoosierCat]

Joisey, please stop ignoring what was ahead of TJ on the depth chart as a rookie versus what was ahead of Perry.

I didn't make the comparision, you did. If you feel (now) that their first season performance isn't comparable, why did you bring it up in the first place?

And...so what if he is on a three year contract? Why does that bother you? All guys that sign down there in the draft are on such contracts. In that time, he will either get more opportunities as a receiver and step up to them, or he won't.

Exactly how is he going to get more opportunities? Even you admit the players ahead of him are hugely talented. That's the whole point of this conversation: it's simply not possible for Tab to get much action at WR.

As for the three year deal, if you -- who claim Tab is one a "one to three year apprenticeship" -- can't see the relevance, there isn't much I can do.

[Tasher]

Something else to remember about Tab is that he came out of UCLA, which is a Quarters school, as opposed to semesters. He missed all the minicamps of the spring and summer due to still being in school and prohibited from participating by NFL rules. (UCLA gets out in late June) So everyone else had a head start with the offense. I think that that gap will have been closed by this time and you will see a very different Tab in offseason camps.

But, alas, probably not at Safety!

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

Perry could get the nod to "compete" for a spot at SS, at some point, but I'd rather see them draft or sign someone and get rid of the uselessness that is Mitchell, or even KK.

I don't think they are going to pass up a SS in the draft or FA because of him though - if that isn't obvious.

I think Tab should be worried about competing for Walter's spot on the roster at WR - he could potentially be a better all-around player - more speed, slightly more size - and more valuabe on special teams.

People act as if Tab didn't see the light of day WR last year - hell they designed plays for him as the season went along.

1. KK isn't useless. The dude started all season for the pay of a backup because of injuries, and while he wasn't the greatest free safety in the world, he certainly wasn't the worst either. NOT EVERYONE ON YOUR ROSTER IS A STARTER. KK does his job, and he does it well.

2. I don't think they plan to use Tab as the answer to our safety problem. The fact is, this is our second season where we lost most of our depth at safety to injury. Herring may be the next coming of the Norse Gods at strong safety, but you know what, if he's also the next coming of Ki-Jana Carter in the whirlpool/trainers room, he isn't the answer. We don't need A SINGLE SAFETY in the offseason. We need two more. One who can start, and another backup.

3. Yes, they did indeed design plays for Tab, but open your eyes, they were plays where he was inserted at running back and took a shovel pass, not plays where he was a wide receiver. They are just trying to get the ball into his hands and see what he can do. Go figure, they want to see what he can do at safety too.

[membengal]

Joisey, please stop ignoring what was ahead of TJ on the depth chart as a rookie versus what was ahead of Perry.

I didn't make the comparision, you did. If you feel (now) that their first season performance isn't comparable, why did you bring it up in the first place?

And...so what if he is on a three year contract? Why does that bother you? All guys that sign down there in the draft are on such contracts. In that time, he will either get more opportunities as a receiver and step up to them, or he won't.

Exactly how is he going to get more opportunities? Even you admit the players ahead of him are hugely talented. That's the whole point of this conversation: it's simply not possible for Tab to get much action at WR.

As for the three year deal, if you -- who claim Tab is one a "one to three year apprenticeship" -- can't see the relevance, there isn't much I can do.

He will get run in practice, like all grinders at receiver get. His obvious value at returning kicks protects him plenty as he gets that run. Not every receiver blows it out the door from the start. They tend to all go through an appreticeship at that position. Yes, for one to three years.

Next, you make my point. TJ should have done more than he did. His 221 yards is roughly the equivalent of Perry's 21, given the difference in who they were sitting behind.

I simply don't understand the infatuation with moving Perry to address the gaping hole at S. Makes no sense. I guess, armageddon scenario, he has to play, getting snaps makes sense, but there is no way in hell he is any kind of fix for that position. That fix is in the draft.

Sure, I could be wrong about that, but I don't think so. If Perry ends up taking snaps at safety next year, I will dredge this thread back up and note my wrongness.

Perry could get the nod to "compete" for a spot at SS, at some point, but I'd rather see them draft or sign someone and get rid of the uselessness that is Mitchell, or even KK.

I don't think they are going to pass up a SS in the draft or FA because of him though - if that isn't obvious.

I think Tab should be worried about competing for Walter's spot on the roster at WR - he could potentially be a better all-around player - more speed, slightly more size - and more valuabe on special teams.

CJ, TJ, Henry, Perry, Walter - 4 solid WR's to have - two of which can contribute in multiple ways.

People act as if Tab didn't see the light of day WR last year - hell they designed plays for him as the season went along.

I think people are under-estimating the impact he'll have at the WR position in the next year or two - be patient folks - he's only a 2nd year player drafted in the 7th round! I would like to see how he does in preseason action at WR now that he knows the offense.

Thank you Shula. My point, made rather succinctly.

I don't understand the eagerness to f**k with Perry at wide receiver. I see a big strong and fast player well worth giving time to develop behind what we have now. And, a player who brings plenty to the table while doing so. I don't read his year last year as a disappointment in any measure in terms of receiving, as he got only the limited opportunties we would have expected him to get.

And, no, joisey, there will not necessarily be more opportunities in the next few years, but what are you advocating? Replacing him as sixth WR? Why? What has he done to cause that to be anyone's position?

[HoosierCat]

And, no, joisey, there will not necessarily be more opportunities in the next few years,

At last, the light dawns...

but what are you advocating?

What's the title of this thread again?

Replacing him as sixth WR? Why? What has he done to cause that to be anyone's position?

It's not an issue of "cause," it's simply what happpens when you're the 6th WR. If at the end of his alleged three-year apprenticeship he's still just a return and ST guy he will have difficulty sticking. That just isn't enough to justify a roster spot; there are any number of low-round draft picks who can return kicks and make ST tackles. At most, they tender him for one more year of return duty and then away he goes. Not gonna pony up bucks for a No. 6 receiver.

As you yourself have come to acknowledge, his chances at WR are slight to nonexistent given the talent ahead of him. Therefore, if he wants to stick long-term, finding something else to occupy his time is the only alternative.

[membengal]

That is NOT what I am acknowledging at all. You are putting words there that are not there.

You and I view the 5th and 6th receivers roles on this team very differently. I think my views are closer to ML's than yours are.

If you are going to stick, initially, as a 5th or 6th, you better bust ass at special teams. He does that. That gives him time to work his way up at receiver. Which he may yet do. I don't see the window on that as closed. In fact, I see it is as a progression. Much like with Kevin Walter, who is adding receiver responsiblity and looks as the years pass, after having stuck for his special teams prowess. Shockingly, he didn't have to go learn safety to get that chance. For some reason you think Perry has to learn an almost compltely new position on the other side of the ball to stick aruond. I think you are completely off base in that, you don't.

I think moving him to safety is rock stupid, you don't.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

As you yourself have come to acknowledge, his chances at WR are slight to nonexistent given the talent ahead of him. Therefore, if he wants to stick long-term, finding something else to occupy his time is the only alternative.

Ya gotta remember, this is the NFL and turnover is fast. You can't say for sure who we'll have in a couple of years. The chances of keeping your top 3 at any position together over that span is low. Today we learned why that is - somebody gets hurt, leaves for more money, or gets thrown in jail. If you're on the roster, you'll get a shot.

I guarantee he'll get a chance to move up the depth chart in coming years, if not next year. Squirrel is probably gone, and Henry is going to be somebody's girlfriend in the pen (the way he looks, they'll have a dress on him in 20 minutes). He WILL get a real look at WR this year.

Also remember WRs generally take a couple of years. As good a KR as he is, they'd be retarded not to give him a shot to contribute on offense. Will he get a shot at S? Sure, could happen. That's the kind of crazy stuff that coaches tend to think about this time of year assuming they're not in the SB.

But to me, the greater point to consider is that this is NOT any kind of fix outside of the worst-case scenario we had this year. We need real depth at S. I know Marvin does the whole "best player available" thing, but at some point, you have to fix the gaping holes in your team. I could honestly see drafting 2 safeties, that's how bad it is. They better not be expecting a 2nd-year WR to fix their problems.

Additionally, if your logic holds, teams would be switching up all kinds of guys if they're close to being that proverbial 53rd man, to see if they can get them on the field. It doesn't generally work, because there's a reason they play the position they do. Namely, because they're better at that than the other positions. I just can't really imagine Tab being that great a safety.

[HoosierCat]

I guarantee he'll get a chance to move up the depth chart in coming years, if not next year. Squirrel is probably gone, and Henry is going to be somebody's girlfriend in the pen (the way he looks, they'll have a dress on him in 20 minutes). He WILL get a real look at WR this year.

We'll see. He couldn't even get the call over Walter in the Pitt game. Henry's stupidity has just given him a boost but I think Kwash just got locked into stripes.

Also remember WRs generally take a couple of years. As good a KR as he is, they'd be retarded not to give him a shot to contribute on offense. Will he get a shot at S? Sure, could happen. That's the kind of crazy stuff that coaches tend to think about this time of year assuming they're not in the SB.

Actually, I have been assured in this thread that it is a "rock stupid" idea. So welcome to the rock stupid club. You, me, Marvin, Hue...decent company, I suppose.

[Bengalbob]

Sorry to bump a thread full of heated disagreement, but I was wondering if the drafting of zero safeties and three WRs on a team that has safety depth needs and nine plus three (by my count) WRs on the roster means that Marvin will reconsider this? My memory is that after some consideration Marvin came back and said that they had scrapped the idea of moving Tab to safety. Do you think this gets revisited this spring? I'm with Joisey (if he still has this opinion): it'll be more and more difficult to get Tab on the field (especially now with a potential "slash" on the roster). Maybe a switch now gets Tab in as a starter at safety in 2007 or 8?

[Stripes]

I doubt this "possibility" comes into serious conversation ever again, honestly. If the Bengals need another safety at any point in the season because of injury, then they'll go to Indiana Jones or Tony Bua (unless they put Ratliff there again).

[HoosierCat]

Sorry to bump a thread full of heated disagreement, but I was wondering if the drafting of zero safeties and three WRs on a team that has safety depth needs and nine plus three (by my count) WRs on the roster means that Marvin will reconsider this? My memory is that after some consideration Marvin came back and said that they had scrapped the idea of moving Tab to safety. Do you think this gets revisited this spring? I'm with Joisey (if he still has this opinion): it'll be more and more difficult to get Tab on the field (especially now with a potential "slash" on the roster). Maybe a switch now gets Tab in as a starter at safety in 2007 or 8?

Well, Marvin said a few weeks back that while Tab had played some DB in practice, they weren't planning to move him to the defensive side of the ball. Of course, that was before they didn't get a safety in the draft, and it's been rightly pointed out that our options beyond Madieu and Jackson are either young untested guys (Bua, Jones) or aging vets of average talent (Mitchell, K2). So I dunno. I'm not expecting them to revist the possibility, but it wouldn't surprise me if they did.

[TJJackson]

Body played safety in college and has speed, is probably a better option than Tab in an emergency

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

Body played safety in college and has speed, is probably a better option than Tab in an emergency

In an EMERGENCY, Tab is actually activated and can play. Body, on the other hand, is inactive or on the practice squad, or cut for that matter.

[Stripes]

I thought Body played well in what limited action he saw, at least on special teams. He is a defender by experience, and think he'd offer a much better option at safety than Tab in an emergency situation, as I see it.

It's sad how we're preconditioned to think about this problem in the first place. Ohalete is no more.

*edit: I misread ya TNBT. Indeed, being inactive is a bit of an obstacle.

[TJJackson]

Well, yeah, there is that :-)

I was thinking that the week after all our active safeties get hit by a runaway mutated mammoth (sci fi channel movie last week, what the heck) Body could play safety

[Whur CHad At?]

Body played safety in college and has speed, is probably a better option than Tab in an emergency

What was his 40 time TJ?

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Well, yeah, there is that :-)

I was thinking that the week after all our active safeties get hit by a runaway mutated mammoth (sci fi channel movie last week, what the heck) Body could play safety

If that happens, I'm sure OhellImtoast will be available.

[cincinnatikid85]

im new to on here to. dont think they should move tab to safety. Switch joseph and m.williams around now that will work.

[derekshank]

Tab is going to be the 4th receiver after we trade/release KW. There is no moving him to Safety.

[JPW]

Body played safety in college and has speed, is probably a better option than Tab in an emergency

What was his 40 time TJ?

It was reported that he ran a 4.25 while in college.

Most draft sites had him at like 6'2", 195 with a 4.31 40 time.

From day one the Bengals liked him at CB and it appears that they still do.

From Bengals.com (4/17/06) ....

The club remains high on the Toledo product.

Making the switch from college safety, Body showed steady improvement after a dreadful rookie minicamp and he just keeps getting better and better on the corner.

He opened eyes with some real competitive practice play against the team's elite receivers.

[Tasher]

who the <explitive deleted> dredged this up?