HoosierCat Posted October 28 Report Posted October 28 Well, once again folks it’s not quite Halloween and it’s more or less over. A Raiders win will all but seal it and right now I have zero confidence that the Bengals could beat a squad of Girl Scouts. Even if they do manage a win, their reward is a Thursday game in Baltimore and then a trip to the west coast. I’m thinking 4-7 at the bye and that’s with a win Sunday. Draft-wise they now sit just outside the top 10. Quote
COB Posted October 28 Report Posted October 28 The game and the business of the nfl has passed Mike Brown. His “family business” model, and all the small ball strategy that entails, is truly and irrefutably obsolete. An off field move that screams this to me is Mike being the lone vote against allowing private equity interests to buy into NFL teams. The other owners see a cash infusion they can use to expand and get better. Mike just sees interference in the 60s/70s business techniques he uses to run the organization. He’s not only completely blowing it when it comes to the Bengals, he’s absolutely positively making a huge error when it comes to his family fortune. It’s insane to have several billion dollars wrapped up in one business and own almost nothing else. In a very quiet and understated way, Mike is an egomaniac who listens to almost no one, and cannot accept that his own ideas and methods need changed. 1 Quote
ArmyBengal Posted October 28 Report Posted October 28 I have a large swath of grass in the middle of my horseshoe driveway. Yesterday, I decided to drive my lawnmower into the middle, engage the blades and proceeded to cut in circles from the inside out. Oh my God I cannot wait to see what really cool ideas will jump in my head this coming Sunday for grass cutting and yard maintenance !! 1 Quote
HoosierCat Posted October 28 Author Report Posted October 28 6 minutes ago, COB said: He’s not only completely blowing it when it comes to the Bengals, he’s absolutely positively making a huge error when it comes to his family fortune. It’s insane to have several billion dollars wrapped up in one business and own almost nothing else. In the long term you are probably right. The NFL won’t last forever because nothing does, so eventually the big tv dollars will dwindle. But in the meantime it’s guaranteed no-effort money for The Family. They can cover all their expenses and pay themselves handsomely out of the checks the league office sends out every year. The only way to screw it up would be to, you know, actually spend like other teams. So they don’t. I can’t say I blame ‘em. If I were in Mike’s hover round, I’d probably do the same thing. “Lol suckers, I got mine, f**k you.” Quote
volcom69 Posted October 28 Report Posted October 28 4 hours ago, HoosierCat said: Well, once again folks it’s not quite Halloween and it’s more or less over. A Raiders win will all but seal it and right now I have zero confidence that the Bengals could beat a squad of Girl Scouts. Even if they do manage a win, their reward is a Thursday game in Baltimore and then a trip to the west coast. I’m thinking 4-7 at the bye and that’s with a win Sunday. Draft-wise they now sit just outside the top 10. What a sad post this is lol. All this hope and excitement flushed down the toilet. 1 Quote
ArmyBengal Posted October 28 Report Posted October 28 Ok, ok, the Bengals. Draw your own conclusions. I'm just reporting... We are playing a last place schedule this year. Many thought it to be fairly easy sledding. We won 3 games against teams that have 5 combined wins. Through 8 games, the teams they've faced are a combined 30-31. On the offensive side of things... Burrow is #7 in total passing yards, #4 in completion percentage, #3 in passing TD's, and #1 in QBR. He's only thrown 3 INT's, but has been sacked 19 times which is the 9th highest QB in the league. Are the sacks his fault? The o-line? Good defense? I don't know, but he's still taking sacks. We don't have a RB on the roster in the top 25 total yards. Neither Brown nor Moss are averaging even 45 yards per game. Neither are in the top 30 in picking up rushing first downs. Brown has 4 TD's which is 15th in the league. Ja'Marr leads the league in yards. No other Bengal WR places in the top 50. Ja'Marr also leads the league in TD's. Higgins and Iosivas both have 3 which is tied for 18th in the league. Ja'Marr also places 4th in the league in YAC and receiving 1st downs. The offense ranks #8 in passing, #28 in rushing, and #13 in total offense. They are also the #10 scoring offense, #9 in the red zone and 3rd downs. On the defensive side of things... Wilson and Pratt are #3 and #6 respectively in total tackles. You have to go to 75 and beyond before finding another Bengal defender. CTB and Stone are the next two top tacklers, but I use the word "top" with a grain of salt. Trey comes in at #5 in the league in sacks. You have to go all the way down to #99 before finding another Bengal defender with a sack. Bell, Pratt, Hubbard, ADG, Stone, and CTB each have a single INT. Doing the advanced mathematics, that's 6 total. The defense ranks #21 against both the pass and the run and #23 in total defense. They are also #20 in scoring, #27 in red zone, and #24 in 3rd down defense. 1 Quote
HoosierCat Posted October 28 Author Report Posted October 28 Since we are 8 games in and could be looking at offseason talk starting a few months early, it's worth a glance at how offseason 2024 has been working out. Way to early to judge the draft but the most important pick, Mims, appears to be working out very well. All seems like a keeper and potential star. Everyone else...ehh, reply hazy, ask again later. How about tagging Tee? I can't argue with that call, I would have done it too, so ultimately I am in no position to complain about it. And Tee has been a force when on the field. As just one example he has more first down conversions than anyone but Ja'Marr despite having missed three games. But...he has missed those three games and at the moment we don't know if he will miss more with the new injury. Strictly from an ROI perspective that $21.8 million is looking like a shaky investment. Then there's FA. Moss: meh. After Sunday he has fallen behind Chase Brown in attempts (74 to 78) Chase also has 100+ more yards, 2 more TDs, is averaging 1.3 yards per carry more, etc. I realize he was supposed to be part of a 1-2 punch versus the Mixon bell cow approach, but I was under the impression he was supposed to be the 1. This year Moss has pocketed $4.5 million in return for 429 combined yards and 3 combined TDs. He is a good blocker and outlet receiver, so there's that at least. Like I said, meh. Trent Brown: exactly what we feared. Again I would still have signed him but yeah, might as well have flushed $4.75 million down the toilet. Gesicki: I'd say he's been fine. Mostly serving as a Boyd replacement. 25 catches and 253 yards so far. But he's only signed for 1 year, $3 million and with a 3-5 record you have to think about getting Burton and McLachlan some snaps. They (may) have a future here, Mike doesn't. Stone: Well, shit. Another entry for the "shoulda kept Bates" file. I dunno, maybe there's some hope there, we'll see if/when he gets back. But 2 years, $15 million is feeling pretty rich right now. Rankins: 5 games, 15 tackles, 1 sack. Just for the record he is pocketing $14 million this year (4th-largest cash outlay on the roster this year) and a $12 million cap hit (5th on the rosters). I know, I know, stats don't tell the whole story on the dline but still, this is easily looking like the worst signing on the offseason. Quote
HoosierCat Posted October 28 Author Report Posted October 28 8 minutes ago, ArmyBengal said: Ok, ok, the Bengals. Draw your own conclusion. I'm just reporting... We are playing a last place schedule this year. Many thought it to be fairly easy sledding. We won 3 games against teams that have 5 combined wins. Through 8 games, the teams they've faced are a combined 30-31. On the offensive side of things... Burrow is #7 in total passing yards, #4 in completion percentage, #3 in passing TD's, and #1 in QBR. He's only thrown 3 INT's, but has been sacked 19 times which is the 9th highest QB in the league. Are the sacks his fault? The o-line? Good defense? I don't know, but he's still taking sacks. We don't have a RB on the roster in the top 25 total yards. Neither Brown nor Moss are averaging even 45 yards per game. Neither are in the top 30 in picking up rushing first downs. Brown has 4 TD's which is 15th in the league. Ja'Marr leads the league in yards. No other Bengal WR places in the top 50. Ja'Marr also leads the league in TD's. Higgins and Iosivas both have 3 which is tied for 18th in the league. Ja'Marr also places 4th in the league in YAC and receiving 1st downs. Burrow and Ja'Marr are the whole offense. And both of them appear to be getting aggravated by that. Burrow in particular does not sound happy about the state of the run game. I know everyone and their mother screams whenever they "take the ball out of their best player's hands" but he can't do it alone. Want to cut down those sacks, having a run game the opposing D was forced to respect would help, too. 13 minutes ago, ArmyBengal said: On the defensive side of things... Wilson and Pratt are #3 and #6 respectively in total tackles. You have to go to 75 and beyond before finding another Bengal defender. CTB and Stone are the next two top tacklers, but I use the word "top" with a grain of salt. Trey comes in at #5 in the league in sacks. You have to go all the way down to #99 before finding another Bengal defender with a sack. Bell, Pratt, Hubbard, ADG, Stone, and CTB each have a single INT. Doing the advanced mathematics, that's 6 total. The defense ranks #21 against both the pass and the run and #23 in total defense. Trey's a stud but this D is the textbook example of the old saying about how it's hard to soar with the eagles when you're surrounded by turkeys. Quote
ArmyBengal Posted October 28 Report Posted October 28 I also took a look at the draft, since they claim to build the team through that process. Coach Zac took over in 2019 and has made 51 total picks. The # of picks per round are as follows: 1st- 6 2nd- 6 3rd- 7 4th- 10 5th- 5 6th- 10 7th- 7 Of those 51 picks, 30 are still with the team and 10 of those represent starters at their position. I'm not sure what that looks like for all teams claiming to hold a philosophy of "building through the draft" but that's less than 50% of the starters coming from the draft during Zac's tenure as head coach. The Myles Murphy and Dax Hill picks have really hurt this team, especially when considering the defensive woes. The team needs those two to perform at the talent level suggested by their draft ranking and them not doing that contributes greatly to the problems. Is it the players? The scouts? The coaches and schemes? Maybe a combination, but those hurt. My take away when considering all those numbers is that this team should be taking more chances to move up in the draft, taking a shot at better quality players. I get you need to round out rosters, but it's hard to build a quality roster when nearly 63% of your draft picks come from the 4th round or later. That number is staggering to me. EDIT: The Bengals have gotten 2 pro bowl players out of those picks. 1 Quote
volcom69 Posted October 28 Report Posted October 28 Burrow having one of his best years, if not the best year statistically, and yet they still suck. Who ever said this team would win no matter what because they have Joe Burrow was full of shit! They still have no true 3rd receiver, Yoshi who we were hopeful for has now just disappeared, and really has not been great. Burton hardly sees the field, they don’t even try Charlie Jones. They need to find that other guy, or use the TE more. The defense well I don’t know I kind of just gave up on them, don’t see things getting any better. Quote
HoosierCat Posted October 28 Author Report Posted October 28 What they need is a run game. Right now they are 29th in rushing attempts, 28th in yards and 24th in yards per attempt. And this is against defenses keying on stopping the pass! They have talent at RB and if they don’t love the line’s blocking you have All to play hybrid TE/FB. Between him, Chase B and Moss they ought to be able to run the damn ball. Quote
ArmyBengal Posted October 29 Report Posted October 29 Couldn’t agree more. The lack of a running attack is problematic. I don’t usually say this but a dynamic running back should be considered early in the 2025 draft. While coaches aren’t on the field making plays, Anarumo is failing. Mightily. While not having elite talent at all three levels, he has enough that the defense should be good enough to produce a win when the offense puts up 25+ points. 1 Quote
HoosierCat Posted October 29 Author Report Posted October 29 The d is a rebuild candidate, including DC. Can’t get pressure, can’t cover, can’t scheme their way out of it. Again getting to the point where we need more Murphy, Jackson, Anderson, Anthony just to figure out if there’s anything there. We know Bell, Ossai, Hubbard etc aren’t the answer. Quote
volcom69 Posted October 29 Report Posted October 29 4 hours ago, HoosierCat said: What they need is a run game. Right now they are 29th in rushing attempts, 28th in yards and 24th in yards per attempt. And this is against defenses keying on stopping the pass! They have talent at RB and if they don’t love the line’s blocking you have All to play hybrid TE/FB. Between him, Chase B and Moss they ought to be able to run the damn ball. We have been saying this now for how long, every freaking year. They had Mixon and hardly ran, now he is running like a pro bowler. It’s sickening seeing this year after year, and how much better this offense could be if they could just run the ball. It would help keep the defense on the bench, and hopefully win the time of possession. Unfortunately Zac calls plays and never runs, or gives up way to easy on it. Most of our posts in the game threads are about running the ball, but you know that since your there, just sucks they don’t 1 Quote
COB Posted October 29 Report Posted October 29 On 10/28/2024 at 10:59 AM, HoosierCat said: Just read that the Ravens are getting Diontae Johnson from Carolina. There really is quite a contrast between the way the Bengals conduct business and the way the ravens, Steelers, Chiefs, etc, conduct business. 1 Quote
ArmyBengal Posted October 29 Report Posted October 29 The Bengals utilize two main business philosophies from my perspective. The "Wait and See" and the "Hope and Pray". Wait for the offseason to hit and they have to figure out all the free agents they are getting ready to have to make a decision on. There are 6 starters getting ready to be UFA's. That doesn't include dealing with Ja'Marr's contract. Quote
HoosierCat Posted October 29 Author Report Posted October 29 "Some day, we'll get the right collection of players, and then we'll win." That, or very nearly that, was Mike's answer to Paul Daugherty's question about the team's strategy for building a winner in an interview a long time ago. To what extent the next generation (Katie, etc.) share this philosophy I don't know, but Mike clearly believed that success in the NFL was essentially random. You hit on a draft or two, get an easy schedule, don't lose key guys to injuries, fumbles bounce your way, weather is cooperative, etc, etc., and voila! Championship. If not, well, there's always next year. And of course there is truth to that. But as the old saying goes, the Lord helps those who help themselves. Good teams do things, like invest in scouting to make drafting less of a crapshoot, to nudge the odds in their favor. They use all the financial tools available to keep good players that they draft and develop. They attack areas of weakness in free agency. And on and on, all stuff we have talked about ad infinitum. But for The Family, it's, welp, we didn't get lucky this year. Maybe we'll get lucky next year. That's it. That's the strategy. Quote
volcom69 Posted October 29 Report Posted October 29 So I saw a topic about was Marvin Lewis a better coach then Zac Taylor. Now I’m not sure he was a better coach, however the assistant coaches through the years here were freaking awesome!! If Zac had these assistant coaches that Marvin had, I really think this team would be so much better. I really believe coaching is the biggest problem on this team, with better coaching they would be a better team. That said with a better front office they would know how to handle business and not let there key players walk away, or tease players into contracts only not to pay them. So who knows it’s all a shit show. There best chance to win the super bowl has now come and gone and we again sit here pissed off because another talented bengals team sucks!! Quote
HoosierCat Posted October 29 Author Report Posted October 29 Every HC has their strengths and weaknesses. The one thing I will say re Zac v Marvin is that I never thought the job was too big for Lewis. Zac, by contrast, often strikes me as out of his depth. Quote
volcom69 Posted October 29 Report Posted October 29 Yea I agree with that Hoosier sometimes it does feel like it’s to much for him Quote
HoosierCat Posted October 29 Author Report Posted October 29 Burton film breakdown. Need him out there more. Quote
Stripes Posted October 30 Report Posted October 30 I think Taylor builds a strong culture, he's a solid free agency recruiter, and he has great respect for tradition. I don't think he does much well on Sundays though. He isn't a great playcaller, he's an even worse game planner (especially early in seasons), he makes bad decisions with respect to risk/reward, and he doesn't seem to have a coherent philosophy. Every week I get the feeling he is winging it. 1 2 Quote
ArmyBengal Posted October 30 Report Posted October 30 Agree wholeheartedly with the "Winging It" aspect. When things don't go right, he always gets that stupid, "That didn't work?" look on his face. Also agree with his skill in culture building. Quote
HoosierCat Posted October 30 Author Report Posted October 30 Higgins, OBj DNP today. Burrow declares game a must-win. Quote
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