1st Round #2: Kevin Zeitler

[redsbengalsbucks]

Put me in the group that thinks they did this the exact right way. FA vet, backups cheaply and draft for the future.

The futures so bright I gotta wear shades!

[ArmyBengal]

The futures so bright I gotta wear shades!

-10

[kingwilly]

A full example of what an NFL scouting report looks like...and its on Zeitler. And he comes off like a mauling beast:

/>http://gnb.scout.com/2/1175432.html

Here's a taste of the MUCH longer piece. Seriously, read it in its entirety. In any event, this bit is from the "Competitiveness" section where he graded a perfect 8.0:

2010: Zeitler is a player that loves to mix it up in the trenches. He relies a lot on technique and while he can be an effective mauler, he is not the type that gets rattled under pressure or one that will get overaggressive. The thing you see on every play is that he will not quit until the whistle. He uses his strength well to simply drive defenders off the ball. He is the type that is always looking for defenders to hit. He plays with enthusiasm and knows how to keep his temper in check (only one penalty in two-plus years as a starter), but will not hesitate to throw down and mix it up in the trenches. He works to finish blocks and covers defenders up with his consistency at the X’s. The thing you see on film is that he is not wild and mistake-prone like the popular John Moffitt, rather taking that businessmen’s approach, but don’t be fooled, he wants to win every battle in the trenches…

2011 Update-There is a reason that Zeitler was called “The Terminator” by teammates in the past – he plays with a very aggressive nature. Still, he showed remarkable field savvy, cutting down on costly mistakes, and even when he missed an assignment, he quickly blocked it out and got on to the next play. He battled through ankle woes early in the season, but still played with great physicality and aggression. He consistently finished blocks and one look at his blocking performance totals (97% grade, 142 knockdowns, 33 TD-resulting blocks), he has laid claim to the title of being the best offensive guard in the collegiate game.

Works for me...

Could be a big change in the attitude and performance of the core of the o-line this year. Protecting Dalton and opening holes for the rb committee, kick ass!

[membengal]

From Peter King:

I think the team that was plumb out of luck in round one was Baltimore. The Ravens, picking 29th, loved Alabama linebacker Dont'a Hightower, but the Patriots jumped them and chose Hightower 25th. One of their fallback players was guard Zeitler, who got picked 27th ... and what made that hurt even more is that Zeitler was drafted by division rival Cincinnati.

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/04/27/2012.nfl.draft.first.round/index.html#ixzz1tFwrDxQF

[BengalszoneBilly]

From Peter King:

I think the team that was plumb out of luck in round one was Baltimore. The Ravens, picking 29th, loved Alabama linebacker Dont'a Hightower, but the Patriots jumped them and chose Hightower 25th. One of their fallback players was guard Zeitler, who got picked 27th ... and what made that hurt even more is that Zeitler was drafted by division rival Cincinnati.

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/04/27/2012.nfl.draft.first.round/index.html#ixzz1tFwrDxQF

Ha! Breaks my heart.

[ArmyBengal]

Nice to be on the other side on getting the best of another team that wanted a particular player !!!

[HoosierCat]

I disagree.

After all of the free agent work they did, I feel, made two of our weak areas passable. After drafting these two players, I hope that our two weak spots have now turned into strengths.

Well, in that case, free agency was pretty much a waste, right? Instead of actually addressing a need by getting a starting-caliber player (for example, Nicks or Grubbs) they frittered money away on bargain guys -- and then spent two first round picks on exactly the two spots in which they spent the most in FA, the o-line and the defensive backfield.

The Bengals needed two starting OG spots. They brought in Wharton who will be a big upgrade over Livings, and now Zeitler who will be an upgrade over Bobbie. They addressed the biggest weakness on this team in both FA and the draft.

Not sure how that's deflating. But to each his own.

Well, let's put back in the next sentence of my post and see if that helps, shall we?

The focus on fixing those areas is understandable, but they've spent a huge amount of resources on them and I can't help but think of what that has potentially cost them elsewhere.

Step back and look at what the Bengals have done at OL and DB over the last 12 or so months. In 2011, they spent a 4th on Clint Boling, traded away a 2012 7th for Taylor Mays, and gave Kyle Cook and Leon Hall new deals worth a combined $58 million. In 2012 they signed Wharton, Bell, Collins, Roland, Newman, Allen, Nelson and Jones to $42 million worth of deals. And yesterday they used two 1sts on a corner and a guard.

14 players, $100 million worth of deals (and more to come when Zeitler and Kirkpatrick are signed) and four picks including two firsts. That is a metric sh*t ton of resources spent on those two units. And I'm not disputing the need for all that attention. Heck, I supported most of the big signings like Nelson and Cook. But there's no doubt they've cut deeply into the team's ability to address other areas of need.

[skyline]

I disagree.

After all of the free agent work they did, I feel, made two of our weak areas passable. After drafting these two players, I hope that our two weak spots have now turned into strengths.

Well, in that case, free agency was pretty much a waste, right? Instead of actually addressing a need by getting a starting-caliber player (for example, Nicks or Grubbs) they frittered money away on bargain guys -- and then spent two first round picks on exactly the two spots in which they spent the most in FA, the o-line and the defensive backfield.

The Bengals needed two starting OG spots. They brought in Wharton who will be a big upgrade over Livings, and now Zeitler who will be an upgrade over Bobbie. They addressed the biggest weakness on this team in both FA and the draft.

Not sure how that's deflating. But to each his own.

Well, let's put back in the next sentence of my post and see if that helps, shall we?

The focus on fixing those areas is understandable, but they've spent a huge amount of resources on them and I can't help but think of what that has potentially cost them elsewhere.

Step back and look at what the Bengals have done at OL and DB over the last 12 or so months. In 2011, they spent a 4th on Clint Boling, traded away a 2012 7th for Taylor Mays, and gave Kyle Cook and Leon Hall new deals worth a combined $58 million. In 2012 they signed Wharton, Bell, Collins, Roland, Newman, Allen, Nelson and Jones to $42 million worth of deals. And yesterday they used two 1sts on a corner and a guard.

14 players, $100 million worth of deals (and more to come when Zeitler and Kirkpatrick are signed) and four picks including two firsts. That is a metric sh*t ton of resources spent on those two units. And I'm not disputing the need for all that attention. Heck, I supported most of the big signings like Nelson and Cook. But there's no doubt they've cut deeply into the team's ability to address other areas of need.

Which is fine as long as the other areas don't need as much attention, which I don't believe that they do. WR needs 1 more guy, and hopefully that will be addressed tonight. RB would be good, but certainly not necessary. An improved o-line alone should lead to an improved run game. D-line is our strongest area. Any addition there is just icing on the cake.

An upgrade at LB would be nice, but we'll be okay waiting til next year, I believe.

Not to mention the fact that we STILL have a ton of cap space available. The money had to be spent somewhere, and these were the two largest areas of need. These moves have all made the Bengals a better team without handicapping themselves for the future.

[derekshank]

14 players, $100 million worth of deals (and more to come when Zeitler and Kirkpatrick are signed) and four picks including two firsts. That is a metric sh*t ton of resources spent on those two units. And I'm not disputing the need for all that attention. Heck, I supported most of the big signings like Nelson and Cook. But there's no doubt they've cut deeply into the team's ability to address other areas of need.

You're not deflated that they have spent a lot of resources on the O-Line. You're deflated because they chose to use the draft instead of spending those resources on Nicks or Grubbs.

And to that I say, fine. Be deflated. But when Mike Brown signs the current young core of comically underpaid players to long term contracts, I hope you reinflate.

[HoosierCat]

You're not deflated that they have spent a lot of resources on the O-Line. You're deflated because they chose to use the draft instead of spending those resources on Nicks or Grubbs.

Well, there's the rub, right? They have spent a lot of resources, and didn't spend them on top-tier FAs, so they also had to use multiple picks. It's the football equivalent of spending a bunch of money to get your old junker running -- and then going out next week and buying a new car, too. And to pivot off of skyline:

Which is fine as long as the other areas don't need as much attention, which I don't believe that they do.

Suffice it to say I'm less optimistic. We shall see.

[Kazkal]

And to that I say, fine. Be deflated. But when Mike Brown signs the current young core of comically underpaid players to long term contracts, I hope you reinflate.

True that and I hope we get some contracts done early to hopefully save some money,Like Geno needs be locked up asap because if he gets close to Free Agency he'll get top 5 money.

[skyline]

You're not deflated that they have spent a lot of resources on the O-Line. You're deflated because they chose to use the draft instead of spending those resources on Nicks or Grubbs.

Well, there's the rub, right? They have spent a lot of resources, and didn't spend them on top-tier FAs, so they also had to use multiple picks. It's the football equivalent of spending a bunch of money to get your old junker running -- and then going out next week and buying a new car, too.

No...it's more like replacing the engine on a car we already had. It's not as redundant as you make it out to be. The Bengals had a car that needed a lot of work. Mission accomplished.

Plus, let's say we go out and sign Grubbs like you suggest, and then focus on other areas in the draft. Where does that put us if Grubbs gets hurt? Where we were last year? Worse? Of course, you can make this argument for any position, but the coaches apparently felt that the o-line needed the work more than other areas. I agree with them. I long to see the run game return, and I think this will do the trick nicely.

[HoosierCat]

Plus, let's say we go out and sign Grubbs like you suggest, and then focus on other areas in the draft. Where does that put us if Grubbs gets hurt?

Same place we'll be if Zeitler gets hurt: counting on Boling or Hudson to step up. (Or calling Bobbie.)

[derekshank]

You're not deflated that they have spent a lot of resources on the O-Line. You're deflated because they chose to use the draft instead of spending those resources on Nicks or Grubbs.

Well, there's the rub, right? They have spent a lot of resources, and didn't spend them on top-tier FAs, so they also had to use multiple picks. It's the football equivalent of spending a bunch of money to get your old junker running -- and then going out next week and buying a new car, too. And to pivot off of skyline:

Well at LG they didn't spend a bunch of money to get an old junker running. They got rid of the old junker, and bought a dependable and economic Honda Civic.

At RG, they traded in a 12 year old truck. It was dependable and did the job as long as it was asked to... but it was time to trade it in for a 2013 model.

Your complaint seems to be that they didn't spring for the Porsche... but the Bengals are leasing a lot of vehicles that are about to expire.

[cHaD711Johnson]

Car analogies have me

[Wraith]

Love it Love it LOVE IT!

Zeitler is the second best pure guard in this draft and as was said before Zeitler + extra 3rd Rder > DeCastro.

Sucked to see DeCastro go to the Steelers though they got a heck of a Guard (Faneca replacement)

[skyline]

Plus, let's say we go out and sign Grubbs like you suggest, and then focus on other areas in the draft. Where does that put us if Grubbs gets hurt?

Same place we'll be if Zeitler gets hurt: counting on Boling or Hudson to step up. (Or calling Bobbie.)

Ummmmm, no? We're left with Wharton (upgrade) and Bell (the jury's still out). THEN, we have Boling and Hudson and possibly Williams.

Still better off than last season...

[HoosierCat]

Your complaint seems to be that they didn't spring for the Porsche.

Oh, they sprang for the Porche all right. They picked it up at 27 last night -- and at what's certain to be a bargain price. It will look nice next to the used sports cars they got in free agency. The trouble is they also need a new truck, a new tractor and a new motorcycle. And that riding mower is looking kinda iffy. Now they have to hope they can squeeze another year out of all of them.

[HoosierCat]

Plus, let's say we go out and sign Grubbs like you suggest, and then focus on other areas in the draft. Where does that put us if Grubbs gets hurt?

Same place we'll be if Zeitler gets hurt: counting on Boling or Hudson to step up. (Or calling Bobbie.)

Ummmmm, no? We're left with Wharton (upgrade) and Bell (the jury's still out).

Ummmm, Wharton is going to be kind of busy starting at LG, isn't he? Bell (LG) will be backing him up, assuming he sticks at all. The backups at RG are the same they've been all along, Boling and Hudson.

[TJJackson]

All this car talk and no mention of the Lumina yet?

Thats just not right

[skyline]

Plus, let's say we go out and sign Grubbs like you suggest, and then focus on other areas in the draft. Where does that put us if Grubbs gets hurt?

Same place we'll be if Zeitler gets hurt: counting on Boling or Hudson to step up. (Or calling Bobbie.)

Ummmmm, no? We're left with Wharton (upgrade) and Bell (the jury's still out).

Ummmm, Wharton is going to be kind of busy starting at LG, isn't he? Bell (LG) will be backing him up, assuming he sticks at all. The backups at RG are the same they've been all along, Boling and Hudson.

Oh, are we assuming that LGs can't be backups at the RG position? Even though Wharton played RG in college and Bell has done both in his career? Alright, then if we're going on the assumption that NFL guards can't ever do both, then we have to consider that Grubbs is a LG as well.

[HoosierCat]

Oh, are we assuming that LGs can't be backups at the RG position?

No, we're just assuming that Wharton is busy being the starting LG. If Zeitler is hurt, I very much doubt the Bengals would want to create even more disruption on the line by changing personnel at two spots.

[skyline]

Oh, are we assuming that LGs can't be backups at the RG position?

No, we're just assuming that Wharton is busy being the starting LG. If Zeitler is hurt, I very much doubt the Bengals would want to create even more disruption on the line by changing personnel at two spots.

No, but there's still Bell.

The point is that Wharton+Bell+Zeitler gives us more flexibility than Grubbs or Nicks alone.

[BengalPimp]

All this car talk and no mention of the Lumina yet?

Thats just not right

Too easy.....Too obvious

[HoosierCat]

Oh, are we assuming that LGs can't be backups at the RG position?

No, we're just assuming that Wharton is busy being the starting LG. If Zeitler is hurt, I very much doubt the Bengals would want to create even more disruption on the line by changing personnel at two spots.

No, but there's still Bell.

The point is that Wharton+Bell+Zeitler gives us more flexibility than Grubbs or Nicks alone.

Yes, but on the other hand, Grubbs/Nicks isn't alone. It's Grubbs+Hill or Nicks+Chandler or whatever combination you prefer. That's the resource trade-off. Again, I'm not saying the Bengals did anything wrong, they just made a different choice than I would have.