I've had enough Bengal bashing

[walzav29]

ENOUGH!Fine Palmer wants to retire, and the T.O. experiment went horribly wrong. But this team is 1 season removed from winning the division. The defense is young and will be a top 10 unit this season. Smith has lost alot of weight and could step up. They have quietly been getting alot of talent on offense. They had a great draft last year, and a well graded draft this year. It's not like they've went 0-16 or never made a Super Bowl. Every team has a shot, and this team has a ton of young talent. When this CBA get's done and the Red Dragon gets some reps they are going to make the playoffs. That's right. WITH a rookie QB.

[ArmyBengal]

Hope springs eternal...

I'm usually VERY optimistic when it comes to the Bengals, but this season presents many challenges that temper my expectations.

Possibly (probably) a rookie QB starting from the get go. Which i'm actually hopeful for and would be exciting to watch.

A new OC in Gruden and everything that goes along with major changes and young players.

Free agents like JJoe and Benson possibly not returning. Yes, they both concern me with little to gain on the market should they leave.

There is more that has already been discussed greatly here, but I will admit that the very things i'm hopeful for may result in worse results.

Meaning, I hope Dalton is the starter. I hope Chad is gone and Green is given all chances to be the #1 WR. I hope the offense changes philosophy to a great degree. I hope there are moves on defense like getting Rey in the middle. So on and so on.

If Carson is gone and all the changes happen, I will be really excited to watch the 2011 Bengals and I will hope for the best.

However, I simply don't think we are going to see a 10 win season out of these guys, which will be the minimum needed to see the playoffs.

WHODEY !?!?

[HoosierCat]

I don't know if this qualifies as "bashing," but I don't think my expectations for a season have ever been lower, for many of the reasons Army already cited. I just see too many question marks across the board -- offense, defense and special teams -- to think they'll win very many games. Right now, I put the O/U at 6.

[walzav29]

I think they will follow the good old AFC North recipe of great defense and a running game to go 9-7 or 10-6. I think Rey will make a huge difference in the middle.

[TJJackson]

ENOUGH!

If you have had enough, vote with your feet.

No one is stopping you.

This team is due for a great deal more bashing in the months (and years) to come

[ArmyBengal]

People like to look at our schedule and say that it's easy and we might be able to get more wins than what most are calling for.

Here's the problem with that line of thought in regards to our division:

The Bengals are tied for the 27th easiest schedule in the NFL for the coming season.

Want to guess who else is tied for the 27th spot ?? The Steelers.

Want to take another guess at whose schedule is even easier ?? The Ravens.

So even if we were to come up with 9 or even 10 wins, I don't see it being enough to get a playoff spot. As much as it pains me to say it, the Steelers and Ravens look to be the teams banging it out for the AFCN title. They have easy schedules and don't have anything close to the issues facing the Bengals as an entire organization. While anything could happen, there just appears to be to much going against them this season to compete for a playoff spot. I'd would rather head into the season looking for the youngsters to get their feet wet and gain the experience needed for the future.

Don't get me wrong, i'm not sitting here thinking it's going to be another 4 win season. Heck, we could win 8.

I'm just of the line of thought that it won't be enough when considering the Steelers and Ravens.

Hopefully the team can find a way to use 2010 as some motivation and we get more than we expect.

[walzav29]

ENOUGH!

If you have had enough, vote with your feet.

No one is stopping you.

This team is due for a great deal more bashing in the months (and years) to come

I don't mind you numbskulls bashing. I'm talking about the guys who really don't follow the Bengals saying they are the worst team in the NFL. I know the organization is horrible, but this team will be good this year. Pittsburgh has had letdowns after their last 2 SB appearances, and we can hang with Baltimore. It looks bad that Palmer has quit on the team, but the schedule was brutal last year. On top of everything else. People are piling on, but 45 guys showing up for those workouts was a great sign.

[ArmyBengal]

The schedule being brutal last season was everything the Bengals could have hoped for coming off the 2009 AFCN title where they swept the division.

They had the opportunity to shed the "soft" label this team seems to wear so proudly, but they didn't. They folded.

The defense went from top 5, to sh*t. Palmer couldn't throw the ball for sh*t. T.O. and Chad were a mistake. They gave up the running game.

All of that with not only the same players coming back, but additions of Gresham, Dunlap, and Shipley.

I may not like the bashing the team takes as a fan, but I also won't act like it's not deserved.

I'm all for rooting the team on this coming season and think a Dalton led team will be fun to watch though.

[volcom69]

Yea i think this year im not going to get very excited about the wins and losses, because im not expecting much. However im excited to see these young second year players, and the new rookies playing. Watching this team grow,hopefully without Carson and Chad, and then i will be hopeful for the next season.

[membengal]

6 wins Hoosier? That would be swell.

I don't care if they win 2, as long as they spend the season breaking in Dalton and seeing what they have with him. Oh, and no Chad Johnson. Because I want to see this team work toward the future. So, no Palmer, no Johnson, and I am good with the pains.

Anything beats last year and that kind of losing with a**h***s at quarterback, wide receiver, and a whole bunch of other places.

[ArmyBengal]

Yep, give me the youngsters and whatever happens with wins and losses as long as we are moving forward for the future of the team and taking out the trash.

[bwillycuse]

I'm with the group that is excited to see the up and comers prove their worth. And also looking forward to seeing the dead weight out the door.

New start - Palmer and Chad and Brat and Lewis had their shot - oh Lewis is still here? 3 out of 4 ain't bad.

Edit - Oh and how does the Steelers and Ravens have an easier schedule than us? That doesn't seem right. Oh wait - Yeah they play us and the Browns twice - We play them twice. Got it.

[damiancasey]

"1 season removed from winning the division"????

Been saying that every year for 20 years...it's a tradition!

[Stripes]

"1 season removed from winning the division"????

Been saying that every year for 20 years...it's a tradition!

If your meaning was the same as walzav's, the Bengals would have won the division 10 times during that span.

[HoosierCat]

Apropos of nothing...

/>http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Don-t-sue-Mark-Cuban-right-before-the-Mavs-win-a?urn=nba-wp5375

[damiancasey]

"1 season removed from winning the division"????

Been saying that every year for 20 years...it's a tradition!

If your meaning was the same as walzav's, the Bengals would have won the division 10 times during that span.

Ha! Nope - I meant we suckers have very short memories and we're unreasonably hopeful and naive! Who dey!

[Kazkal]

New start - Palmer and Chad and Brat and Lewis had their shot - oh Lewis is still here? 3 out of 4 ain't bad.

3 out of 5 I stick by paul alexander being terrible

[cincy9275]

New start - Palmer and Chad and Brat and Lewis had their shot - oh Lewis is still here? 3 out of 4 ain't bad.

3 out of 5 I stick by paul alexander being terrible

yes paul mr 1 pro bowl player! how in the hell can you coach a position on 1 team for 17 seasons and have only 1 guy make the pro bowl? unf**king real!

[Mobster]

New start - Palmer and Chad and Brat and Lewis had their shot - oh Lewis is still here? 3 out of 4 ain't bad.

3 out of 5 I stick by paul alexander being terrible

yes paul mr 1 pro bowl player! how in the hell can you coach a position on 1 team for 17 seasons and have only 1 guy make the pro bowl? unf**king real!

I don't know.

How can you have one of the top 4 defenses in the entire NFL and not have a single player make the Pro Bowl?

How can you have both CBs tie for second in the entire NFL in interceptions, be recognized as being as good as any tandem in the league that year, and neither one makes the Pro Bowl.

How can you win your division, go undefeated in your division, and have not a single player make the Pro Bowl while every other team in the division that you swept has multiple players selected.

Why was Takeo Spike never selected for the Pro Bowl while in Cincinnati, then immediately goes to Buffalo and is selected his first year.

Why did Justin Smith never make the Pro Bowl as a Bengal, then immediately gets selected his first year in San Fran?

Why did Eric Steinbach get no recognition while with the Bengals, then as soon as he leaves, he is recognized as a Pro Bowler?

Why was Willie Anderson the most dominant RT in the NFL for years, but never selected to the Pro Bowl until finally near the end of his career?

Why do guys like Kenny Anderson, Isaac Curtis, and Ken Riley get no consideration for the Hall of Fame?

Why did some RB in New England beat out Ickey Woods for AFC Offensive Rookie of the Year after Ickey rushed for over 1,000 yards, led the NFL in TD runs, averaged 5.3 yards per carry, and carried his team to the Superbowl?

Dude, Pro Bowl selections are a joke. Basing your opinion of a bengal coach on how many players have been selected to the Pro Bowl is idiotic and ignorant.

[bwillycuse]

New start - Palmer and Chad and Brat and Lewis had their shot - oh Lewis is still here? 3 out of 4 ain't bad.

3 out of 5 I stick by paul alexander being terrible

yes paul mr 1 pro bowl player! how in the hell can you coach a position on 1 team for 17 seasons and have only 1 guy make the pro bowl? unf**king real!

I don't know.

How can you have one of the top 4 defenses in the entire NFL and not have a single player make the Pro Bowl?

How can you have both CBs tie for second in the entire NFL in interceptions, be recognized as being as good as any tandem in the league that year, and neither one makes the Pro Bowl.

How can you win your division, go undefeated in your division, and have not a single player make the Pro Bowl while every other team in the division that you swept has multiple players selected.

Why was Takeo Spike never selected for the Pro Bowl while in Cincinnati, then immediately goes to Buffalo and is selected his first year.

Why did Justin Smith never make the Pro Bowl as a Bengal, then immediately gets selected his first year in San Fran?

Why did Eric Steinbach get no recognition while with the Bengals, then as soon as he leaves, he is recognized as a Pro Bowler?

Why was Willie Anderson the most dominant RT in the NFL for years, but never selected to the Pro Bowl until finally near the end of his career?

Why do guys like Kenny Anderson, Isaac Curtis, and Ken Riley get no consideration for the Hall of Fame?

Why did some RB in New England beat out Ickey Woods for AFC Offensive Rookie of the Year after Ickey rushed for over 1,000 yards, led the NFL in TD runs, averaged 5.3 yards per carry, and carried his team to the Superbowl?

Dude, Pro Bowl selections are a joke. Basing your opinion of a bengal coach on how many players have been selected to the Pro Bowl is idiotic and ignorant.

Though you have good points there describing Bengal bias, calling Kaz's comments idiotic is a bit out of line.

So you are saying Paul Alexander is a good o-line coach and shouldn't be included in the list?

You can argue that the Browns got more out of Steinbach than we did?

So I take it - for you - Pro Bowl and Hall Of Fame aren't good gauges of a players yearly or career success.

[redsbengalsbucks]

New start - Palmer and Chad and Brat and Lewis had their shot - oh Lewis is still here? 3 out of 4 ain't bad.

3 out of 5 I stick by paul alexander being terrible

yes paul mr 1 pro bowl player! how in the hell can you coach a position on 1 team for 17 seasons and have only 1 guy make the pro bowl? unf**king real!

I don't know.

How can you have one of the top 4 defenses in the entire NFL and not have a single player make the Pro Bowl?

How can you have both CBs tie for second in the entire NFL in interceptions, be recognized as being as good as any tandem in the league that year, and neither one makes the Pro Bowl.

How can you win your division, go undefeated in your division, and have not a single player make the Pro Bowl while every other team in the division that you swept has multiple players selected.

Why was Takeo Spike never selected for the Pro Bowl while in Cincinnati, then immediately goes to Buffalo and is selected his first year.

Why did Justin Smith never make the Pro Bowl as a Bengal, then immediately gets selected his first year in San Fran?

Why did Eric Steinbach get no recognition while with the Bengals, then as soon as he leaves, he is recognized as a Pro Bowler?

Why was Willie Anderson the most dominant RT in the NFL for years, but never selected to the Pro Bowl until finally near the end of his career?

Why do guys like Kenny Anderson, Isaac Curtis, and Ken Riley get no consideration for the Hall of Fame?

Why did some RB in New England beat out Ickey Woods for AFC Offensive Rookie of the Year after Ickey rushed for over 1,000 yards, led the NFL in TD runs, averaged 5.3 yards per carry, and carried his team to the Superbowl?

Dude, Pro Bowl selections are a joke. Basing your opinion of a bengal coach on how many players have been selected to the Pro Bowl is idiotic and ignorant.

Though you have good points there describing Bengal bias, calling Kaz's comments idiotic is a bit out of line.

So you are saying Paul Alexander is a good o-line coach and shouldn't be included in the list?

You can argue that the Browns got more out of Steinbach than we did?

So I take it - for you - Pro Bowl and Hall Of Fame aren't good gauges of a players yearly or career success.

I'll start with this, I think the Browns have gotten less from Steiny than the Bengals did, yet he is consider a pro-bowl caliber player for them.

Some teams are favored by the pro-bowl and HOF while others are snubbed, so in some cases it isnt a good measure of head to head player comparisons.

[cincy9275]

New start - Palmer and Chad and Brat and Lewis had their shot - oh Lewis is still here? 3 out of 4 ain't bad.

3 out of 5 I stick by paul alexander being terrible

yes paul mr 1 pro bowl player! how in the hell can you coach a position on 1 team for 17 seasons and have only 1 guy make the pro bowl? unf**king real!

I don't know.

How can you have one of the top 4 defenses in the entire NFL and not have a single player make the Pro Bowl?

How can you have both CBs tie for second in the entire NFL in interceptions, be recognized as being as good as any tandem in the league that year, and neither one makes the Pro Bowl.

How can you win your division, go undefeated in your division, and have not a single player make the Pro Bowl while every other team in the division that you swept has multiple players selected.

Why was Takeo Spike never selected for the Pro Bowl while in Cincinnati, then immediately goes to Buffalo and is selected his first year.

Why did Justin Smith never make the Pro Bowl as a Bengal, then immediately gets selected his first year in San Fran?

Why did Eric Steinbach get no recognition while with the Bengals, then as soon as he leaves, he is recognized as a Pro Bowler?

Why was Willie Anderson the most dominant RT in the NFL for years, but never selected to the Pro Bowl until finally near the end of his career?

Why do guys like Kenny Anderson, Isaac Curtis, and Ken Riley get no consideration for the Hall of Fame?

Why did some RB in New England beat out Ickey Woods for AFC Offensive Rookie of the Year after Ickey rushed for over 1,000 yards, led the NFL in TD runs, averaged 5.3 yards per carry, and carried his team to the Superbowl?

Dude, Pro Bowl selections are a joke. Basing your opinion of a bengal coach on how many players have been selected to the Pro Bowl is idiotic and ignorant.

first resorting to name calling is ignorant. second how many games have you watched? because our o-line have been a complete joke for years. how many times have you ever watch our line play and said man they are well coached? the fact is you have not. the man has had 2 decent o-lines and 1 damn good player in 18 years. if you coached over 100 players and only 1 gets recognized for being a good player. you suck as a coach. he is a complete fail period! our o-line year after year looks like a bunch of holding, false starting, unprepared players and that is a fact!

[derekshank]

the man has had 2 decent o-lines and 1 damn good player in 18 years. if you coached over 100 players and only 1 gets recognized for being a good player. you suck as a coach. he is a complete fail period! our o-line year after year looks like a bunch of holding, false starting, unprepared players and that is a fact!

I'm not in love with Alexander by any stretch... but you are really overstating your case.

For instance... Rich Braham couldn't make the team in Arizona. He became one of the best Centers in the NFL under Alexander's coaching.

In '05, Cincy had one of the best O-Lines in the NFL, ranked 2nd in the NFL in sacks allowed, and 11th in the NFL in rushing.

Once Steiny left, his play dropped off considerably in Cleveland (coincidence?). Levi and Willie broke down, Andrews wasn't worth the money, and Ghiaciuc wasn't an NFL caliber player (not just in Cincy... but everywhere).

So, they started over. In '09 the O-Line had almost no experience. Whitworth hadn't started at LT since college, and with the exception of an aging Bobby Williams, the rest of the group were undrafted free agents. That group was in the top 10 in sacks allowed and top 10 in rushing yards. In fact, I remember Alexander getting national praise on the NFL network for what he was able to accomplish with that group.

So, you don't think he's a good coach? Fine. You are entitled to your opinion... but don't act like it is an indisputable fact. It isn't. And you have to ignore a lot of success to reach the conclusions you have.

[redsbengalsbucks]

first resorting to name calling is ignorant.

I couldnt agree more, with this statement.

[derekshank]

first resorting to name calling is ignorant.

I couldnt agree more, with this statement.

I'm not sure I want to get too involved here... but he didn't call anyone any name.

He said that judging a coach by the number of pro bowlers he has produced is ignorant. The exact same thing that was done when the above "resorting to name calling is ignorant" was typed. It's the activity that is ignorant... not the person doing the activity.

Of course, the two are not mutually exclusive.