Bratkowski's playcalling... Get the ball moving!!

[agreen_112]

Watching the Bengals offense is almost to a point where I can predict 95% of the time when they will run! Brat's playcalling was an absolute mess yesterday.

We need to get the ball moving and we HAVE to get it into T.O.'s hands!! All you have to do is toss it up to Owens and he'll come down with it. The pitch to him in the back left corner of the end zone was beautiful, too bad he was slightly interfered. Palmer really needs to get his timing and accuracy back on point. He could've threw 3-4 TD's yesterday.

[redsbengalsbucks]

Watching the Bengals offense is almost to a point where I can predict 95% of the time when they will run! Brat's playcalling was an absolute mess yesterday.

We need to get the ball moving and we HAVE to get it into T.O.'s hands!! All you have to do is toss it up to Owens and he'll come down with it. The pitch to him in the back left corner of the end zone was beautiful, too bad he was slightly interfered. Palmer really needs to get his timing and accuracy back on point. He could've threw 3-4 TD's yesterday.

I saw at least 2 runs where the defenders looked like they knew the run play, not just that it was going to be a run. They meet the RB behind the LOS and never looked anywhere else. Time to change your plays Brat!!

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

I saw at least 2 runs where the defenders looked like they knew the run play, not just that it was going to be a run. They meet the RB behind the LOS and never looked anywhere else. Time to change your plays Brat!!

Beyond the predictability of the schemes themselves, what do we think of the possibility that a player or players might be tipping the plays? Could be as simple as an O-lineman leaning one way or placement of his feet, whatever.

[bwillycuse]

I saw at least 2 runs where the defenders looked like they knew the run play, not just that it was going to be a run. They meet the RB behind the LOS and never looked anywhere else. Time to change your plays Brat!!

Beyond the predictability of the schemes themselves, what do we think of the possibility that a player or players might be tipping the plays? Could be as simple as an O-lineman leaning one way or placement of his feet, whatever.

My brother thought he could see Chad tipping that it was a run play.

I couldn't confirm though. I could imagine a wr not seem as 'into' the set up if he knows its not coming his way.

But- I do know that when Palmer audibles - it seems to be an audible into a run that doesn't work.

[ArmyBengal]

It seemed like almost every d*mn time you saw a WR go in motion and stop at the end of the line, it was a running play.

I know there are others like that, but anyway around, it's predictable.

[whizzo]

i'm not happy with Brat in every way. IMO, we could easily use Benson and Scott to set up a running game, and then attack downfield with TO and Ocho. Brat seems content with horizontal passes and dink-and-dunk stuff.

[ArmyBengal]

I think they miss a bunch of the dumpoff passes trying to make something happen downfield.

At least it seemed that way yesterday. There seemed like plenty of times Benson was sitting open on the side, but they went elsewhere.

[Trevor]

Who passes on 2nd ans 5 or less?!!!!??? KEEP RUNNING BRAT DANG!!!

[kingwilly]

Who passes on 2nd ans 5 or less?!!!!??? KEEP RUNNING BRAT DANG!!!

Exactly.

Here is what they did on second down:

1st Q

2-6-CIN 24 (14:36) 9-C.Palmer pass incomplete short middle to 84-J.Gresham.

2-5-CIN 17 (9:35) 9-C.Palmer pass short middle to 84-J.Gresham to CIN 23 for 6 yards (53-J.McClain).

2-1-CIN 32 (8:02) 9-C.Palmer pass incomplete short left to 81-T.Owens./then B. Scott stuffed on 3rd and 1, punt.

2-10-CIN 28 (6:01) 9-C.Palmer pass short middle to 85-C.Ochocinco to CIN 37 for 9 yards (31-F.Washington).

2-4-CIN 48 (3:54) 32-C.Benson right end to BLT 42 for 10 yards (25-C.Carr).

2-14-BAL 35 (1:42) (Shotgun) 9-C.Palmer pass short right to 11-J.Shipley to BLT 28 for 7 yards (43-H.Nakamura).

2-10-BAL 18 (:23) 32-C.Benson left end to BLT 18 for no gain (95-J.Johnson; 91-B.McKinney).

2nd Q

2-13-BAL 38 (12:21) (Shotgun) 9-C.Palmer pass short middle to 81-T.Owens to BLT 16 for 22 yards (92-H.Ngata).

2-5-BAL 11 (10:57) 28-B.Scott left guard to BLT 7 for 4 yards (53-J.McClain; 93-C.Redding).

2-10-CIN 9 (6:28) 32-C.Benson left guard to CIN 12 for 3 yards (55-T.Suggs; 92-H.Ngata)

2-8-CIN 14 (2:47) 32-C.Benson right tackle to CIN 14 for no gain (52-R.Lewis).

2-7-CIN 29 (:31) (Shotgun) 9-C.Palmer pass incomplete short middle to 84-J.Gresham.

3rd Q

2-6-CIN 34 (10:25) 32-C.Benson right end to CIN 36 for 2 yards (55-T.Suggs; 52-R.Lewis).

2-9-BAL 42 (7:04) 9-C.Palmer pass incomplete short middle to 85-C.Ochocinco (31-F.Washington).

2-10-CIN 38 (5:17) 9-C.Palmer scrambles right tackle to CIN 39 for 1 yard (55-T.Suggs).

2-6-BAL 43 (3:22) 32-C.Benson left end to BLT 32 for 11 yards (26-D.Landry).

2-10-BAL 32 (2:50) 32-C.Benson left guard to BLT 34 for -2 yards (92-H.Ngata).

2-10-BAL 21 (1:07) 32-C.Benson left tackle to BLT 17 for 4 yards (97-K.Gregg).

4th Q

2-15-CIN 42 (11:04) (Shotgun) 9-C.Palmer pass short middle to 11-J.Shipley to CIN 49 for 7 yards (52-R.Lewis).

2-4-BAL 20 (4:52) 9-C.Palmer pass incomplete short right to 81-T.Owens (25-C.Carr) [55-T.Suggs].

2-6-BAL 7 (3:34) 32-C.Benson right guard to BLT 7 for no gain (92-H.Ngata).

So, of the 5 plays that were 2nd and 5 or less (bold), they threw 3 times, and converted on 1, and ran twice and converted on 1.

Kind of scary are the number of 2nd downs of 10 or more yards (italicized): 9 out of 21, and only converted on 1 of them.

75 yards on 2nd down, avg 3.5 yards per.

I think what I take away from this is that they have some bread and butter plays that good defenses can easily sniff out, like the Benson over guard run, and rarely convert on them. They seem to attempt a balance on run/pass, and only convert two second downs with running plays overall.

[TJJackson]

All you have to do is toss it up to Owens and he'll come down with it

Please explain again how you can say this of a receiver well known for his high percentage of drops.

Oh yeah, thats right, the whole 'facts and reason be damned' approach you've built your reputation on.

Sorry, carry on.

[volcom69]

That was pathetic playcalling yesterday. They have a chance to put the game away at the end with the B Johnson interception, and they dont even attempt to throw in the endzone?

What happend to Shipley and Gresham, dont stop feeding the ball to the guys who are open, and what the defense is giving you. Where was Gresham going up the seam i didnt even see it. On Balitmores all out blitzes they should have had Palmer take a one step drop and pass it to Gresham going up the middle. I dont think brat knows how to use the TE!!!!!

Stop forcing the ball to TO and Chad, if they are not open check the ball down, dont forget about Shipley and Gresham, and the RB. How about Brat learns how to run the screen pass, the screen pass looks pathetic!!!

[kingwilly]

That was pathetic playcalling yesterday. They have a chance to put the game away at the end with the B Johnson interception, and they dont even attempt to throw in the endzone?

What happend to Shipley and Gresham, dont stop feeding the ball to the guys who are open, and what the defense is giving you. Where was Gresham going up the seam i didnt even see it. On Balitmores all out blitzes they should have had Palmer take a one step drop and pass it to Gresham going up the middle. I dont think brat knows how to use the TE!!!!!

Stop forcing the ball to TO and Chad, if they are not open check the ball down, dont forget about Shipley and Gresham, and the RB. How about Brat learns how to run the screen pass, the screen pass looks pathetic!!!

I saw Ocho open quite a bit.

What I think was the problem was quite a bit of hesitancy from Palmer. He was simply too indecisive.

Gresham hitting the seam would have given them fits. After Palmer's pick six, I think he might be a bit gun-shy about the quick hit to Gresham. Who knows...

Giving Palmer his selection of new, shiny weapons has been done. Brat is still calling some bone-dumb plays, so who knows where the true problem is. Winning ugly is fine, except that when your franchise QB is winking and blinking like he has forgotten to play the game and is trying to think his way to a win. Don't think, just play.

[HairOnFire]

1st Q

2-1-CIN 32 (8:02) 9-C.Palmer pass incomplete short left to 81-T.Owens./then B. Scott stuffed on 3rd and 1, punt.

Times like these are sometimes called teachable moments.

[HairOnFire]

Gresham hitting the seam would have given them fits. After Palmer's pick six, I think he might be a bit gun-shy about the quick hit to Gresham. Who knows...

+1

[HairOnFire]

Hobnobbing.....

More themes: The Bengals' continuing battle with pre-snap penalties. As he came off the field Wednesday, offensive coordinator Bob Bratkowski said he's looking to change the way things are called in an effort to cut down on the flags. And he said he liked the way they worked at those issues after he told them on Monday that it's OK to be frustrated but don't take it to the practice field.

Yet some of them are just going to be growing pains. The 12 men-on-the-field penalty on third down that blew up last Sunday's first drive happened because rookie tight end Jermaine Gresham was out there in a package in which he didn't belong.

They love the way Gresham keeps improving, but he's having his moments. One happened Sunday when he whiffed blocking Ravens outside linebacker Jarret Johnson so badly that he yelled to quarterback Carson Palmer, "Look out, look out." Since all Gresham was doing was yelling, Palmer made an unbelievable spin move while shoveling the ball to him for a short completion.

[COB]

One happened Sunday when he whiffed blocking Ravens outside linebacker Jarret Johnson so badly that he yelled to quarterback Carson Palmer, "Look out, look out."

Pretty awesome stuff right there.

[ArmyBengal]

Maybe they should start employing simple voice commands like that to simplify things across the board.

Like when Nugent is lined up for a FG, someone can yell, "KICK THAT SH*T HARD" !!!

It's all about simplifying things...

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Maybe they should start employing simple voice commands like that to simplify things across the board.

Like when Nugent is lined up for a FG, someone can yell, "KICK THAT SH*T HARD" !!!

It's all about simplifying things...

Nice, that's hilarious. And sadly, potentially useful.

Is there a way to tell Kyle Cook to learn to count?

[Stripes]

More relevant to the first post than any other in the thread:

Anyone who claims to predict a noteworthy majority of the Bengals offensive plays before they're executed is full of s**t. It's not that the Bengals are significantly unpredictable as compared to any other team, it's that no football team at any level is quite that simple (except a peewee team that only runs the ball).

[HairOnFire]

I was watching Playbook last week and they were discussing why the 49'ers offense was being flagged so often for delay of game penalties. Long story short, their coordinator admitted that the names of plays and the terminology associated with protection packages, checkdowns, and audibles were simply too long and too complicated to be relayed quickly enough from the booth, to the QB, then yet again to the players in the huddle, and then called out yet again at the line of scrimmage.

The solution? Shorten the names of plays. Reduce the verbiage. Simplify.

Go figure.

[combatbengal]

I agree with the play calling issue but another issue is clock management and a sense of urgency. In the first game we were down by more than 20 points with 3 minutes remaining in the first half. The offense would run a play then you see all the vets walking to the huddle and then walking to the line of scrimmage. Now, Shipley on the other hand was jogging the entire time. That’s because he was coached right in college and still has that desire to win. It was like they had given up and didn’t seem like they wanted to score before half ended. That right there is a lack of discipline! In last year’s playoff game, the defense was on the field when a quarter ended. Peko immediately ran to the other side of the field and was ready to start the new quarter with no break, no water, no time out, etc. He came to play and he came to win. That was all heart and discipline. We need to get that back with every player on the team.

So work on play calling, time management, discipline, and come up with a sense of urgency.

This is totally ridicules that we have all these weapons on offense and can’t score one touchdown. There isn’t any defense out there that can guard Chad, TO, Shipley, Gresham, and Benson at the same time. One of those men is going to be open for something.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

...their coordinator admitted that the names of plays and the terminology associated with protection packages, checkdowns, and audibles were simply too long and too complicated to be relayed quickly enough from the booth, to the QB, then yet again to the players in the huddle, and then called out yet again at the line of scrimmage.

The solution? Shorten the names of plays. Reduce the verbiage. Simplify.

Go figure.

If I recall, the Niners even added the extra step of relaying the plays from the OC to the QB coach and then into the QB.

You're right, as complicated as some of the verbiage is, it ends up just being a lot of words. Now that you mention it, it makes me wonder how you ever have a play that gets executed correctly.

[agreen_112]

More relevant to the first post than any other in the thread:

Anyone who claims to predict a noteworthy majority of the Bengals offensive plays before they're executed is full of s**t. It's not that the Bengals are significantly unpredictable as compared to any other team, it's that no football team at any level is quite that simple (except a peewee team that only runs the ball).

Bulls**t dude... your wrong.

[agreen_112]

I agree with the play calling issue but another issue is clock management and a sense of urgency. In the first game we were down by more than 20 points with 3 minutes remaining in the first half. The offense would run a play then you see all the vets walking to the huddle and then walking to the line of scrimmage. Now, Shipley on the other hand was jogging the entire time. That’s because he was coached right in college and still has that desire to win. It was like they had given up and didn’t seem like they wanted to score before half ended. That right there is a lack of discipline! In last year’s playoff game, the defense was on the field when a quarter ended. Peko immediately ran to the other side of the field and was ready to start the new quarter with no break, no water, no time out, etc. He came to play and he came to win. That was all heart and discipline. We need to get that back with every player on the team.

So work on play calling, time management, discipline, and come up with a sense of urgency.

This is totally ridicules that we have all these weapons on offense and can’t score one touchdown. There isn’t any defense out there that can guard Chad, TO, Shipley, Gresham, and Benson at the same time. One of those men is going to be open for something.

Good call! May I add one thing - Better protection for Palmer.

[COB]

Maybe they should start employing simple voice commands like that to simplify things across the board.

Like when Nugent is lined up for a FG, someone can yell, "KICK THAT SH*T HARD" !!!

It's all about simplifying things...

Perfect. Right before the ball is snapped, Carson can just yell, "Push Guy Away" at the linemen.