Peter Kings Palmer take

[walzav29]

6. I think I'm starting to think Carson Palmer belongs in Jay Cutlerville. He hasn't been a commanding presence on the field for some time, I'd say going back to mid-2006, and I'm hard-pressed to think of him in the same league with the top five or six quarterbacks. I did put him there in my top 50 in the SI NFL Preview issue, but after watching him Sunday, I almost wish I could have that one back.

They have to give him protection, but things are looking bad.

[Ickey44]

Well, I, for one, would like to see Carson step up and be more vocal. Marvin obviously isn't going to do it. Somebody needs to light some fire under their asses. May as well be Palmer.

[gregstephens]

Well, I, for one, would like to see Carson step up and be more vocal. Marvin obviously isn't going to do it. Somebody needs to light some fire under their asses. May as well be Palmer.

I agree on these points, but the on-field play is definitely different. I understand this line is bad, but a lot of teams have 'bad' o-lines and don't have a game like Palmer's yesterday. And I'm talking about quarterbacks that are clearly not in Palmer's caliber. He doesn't have the same presence and/or confidence since the playoff game injury. Getting his nose broken a few weeks ago didn't help.

Remember what set Palmer apart in 2005. He looked like Peyton Manning. Confident, poised, barking out orders and audibles at the LOS. He had the confidence to take control. That's gone. If he doesn't find it quick, somehow, he'll never be what he can.

[Ickey44]

Someone said it in another thread, but I agree with it. Right now, until Palmer and/or the line gets it's act together, Fitzpatrick may be a better option for us right now. He can run, elude the rush, and improvise. All things Palmer can't do. Until the line starts pass blocking again, I would fully support the Bengals should the choose to do this.

[Wraith]

"Someone said it in another thread, but I agree with it. Right now, until Palmer and/or the line gets it's act together, Fitzpatrick may be a better option for us right now. He can run, elude the rush, and improvise. All things Palmer can't do. Until the line starts pass blocking again, I would fully support the Bengals should the choose to do this."

Your nuts!

[Ickey44]

"Someone said it in another thread, but I agree with it. Right now, until Palmer and/or the line gets it's act together, Fitzpatrick may be a better option for us right now. He can run, elude the rush, and improvise. All things Palmer can't do. Until the line starts pass blocking again, I would fully support the Bengals should the choose to do this."

Your nuts!

So you would rather watch Palmer get drilled week in and week out? Did you see Fitzpatrick play in the preseason? His rating was over 100. And he played with the first team offense most of the time he was in. When Palmer played in the preseason, he looked just like he did yesterday.

They way things are going right now, we may see Fitz in there whether we want to or not. Palmer's gonna get hurt back there unless the line/backs/TE's start blocking and picking up blitzes.

I didn't suggest this as a permanent solution either. Just until the line finally plays like an NFL caliber line and can pass protect so Carson's not playing scared all day.

[walzav29]

Are we losing our minds? Bench Palmer for Ryan Fitzpatrick? The Offensive Line and the Receivers have to do a better job. That's it. Simple.

[gregstephens]

"Someone said it in another thread, but I agree with it. Right now, until Palmer and/or the line gets it's act together, Fitzpatrick may be a better option for us right now. He can run, elude the rush, and improvise. All things Palmer can't do. Until the line starts pass blocking again, I would fully support the Bengals should the choose to do this."

Your nuts!

So you would rather watch Palmer get drilled week in and week out? Did you see Fitzpatrick play in the preseason? His rating was over 100. And he played with the first team offense most of the time he was in. When Palmer played in the preseason, he looked just like he did yesterday.

They way things are going right now, we may see Fitz in there whether we want to or not. Palmer's gonna get hurt back there unless the line/backs/TE's start blocking and picking up blitzes.

I didn't suggest this as a permanent solution either. Just until the line finally plays like an NFL caliber line and can pass protect so Carson's not playing scared all day.

Yeah, but even with a temporary intent, that move would have permanent implications. Palmer would never get his confidence back and it would further shake a team that may or may not be disgruntled over the RJ/Willie purge. I see your point on paper, but I think that is the final nail in the Bengals' coffin, Palmer's coffin, TJ and Fredo's coffins. That's extreme, especially after only week one.

[walzav29]

Looking back. Losing Steinbech was huuuuuuuuuge.

[membengal]

My last memory of Steinbach was him getting Carson's knee caved in. Just sayin'.

[gregstephens]

Looking back. Losing Steinbech was huuuuuuuuuge.

Most significant offensive personnel move of the 2000's. Also not replacing Braham adequately.

[gregstephens]

My last memory of Steinbach was him getting Carson's knee caved in. Just sayin'.

Brady got his knee caved in yesterday, too. Not a bad o-line in New England. Not one person's fault. Sacks happen to any team to every o-lineman. The angle of the hit can't be stopped. I don't blame Steinbach for that hit.

[vettespd20]

"Someone said it in another thread, but I agree with it. Right now, until Palmer and/or the line gets it's act together, Fitzpatrick may be a better option for us right now. He can run, elude the rush, and improvise. All things Palmer can't do. Until the line starts pass blocking again, I would fully support the Bengals should the choose to do this."

Your nuts!

So you would rather watch Palmer get drilled week in and week out? Did you see Fitzpatrick play in the preseason? His rating was over 100. And he played with the first team offense most of the time he was in. When Palmer played in the preseason, he looked just like he did yesterday.

They way things are going right now, we may see Fitz in there whether we want to or not. Palmer's gonna get hurt back there unless the line/backs/TE's start blocking and picking up blitzes.

I didn't suggest this as a permanent solution either. Just until the line finally plays like an NFL caliber line and can pass protect so Carson's not playing scared all day.

Ok did you forget that fitz was playing against back ups and against players that didnt even make some teams!!! This could be the stupidest thing i have heard on here in a very long time!!

[membengal]

My last memory of Steinbach was him getting Carson's knee caved in. Just sayin'.

Brady got his knee caved in yesterday, too. Not a bad o-line in New England. Not one person's fault. Sacks happen to any team to every o-lineman. The angle of the hit can't be stopped. I don't blame Steinbach for that hit.

I do. He ole'd Kimo through to Palmer. Not the first time it had happened, either.

It was fundamentally different from what happened to Brady yesterday, where the guy was already on the ground, and lunged up at Brady.

Look, I am down with the bad-mouthing of the team. They have earned it. But let's not turn Steinbach into something he wasn't. He was often over-powered at the point of attack. He was best when pulling. But his lack of size and strength was at times an issue.

[redsbengalsbucks]

My last memory of Steinbach was him getting Carson's knee caved in. Just sayin'.

Brady got his knee caved in yesterday, too. Not a bad o-line in New England. Not one person's fault. Sacks happen to any team to every o-lineman. The angle of the hit can't be stopped. I don't blame Steinbach for that hit.

I do. He ole'd Kimo through to Palmer. Not the first time it had happened, either.

It was fundamentally different from what happened to Brady yesterday, where the guy was already on the ground, and lunged up at Brady.

Look, I am down with the bad-mouthing of the team. They have earned it. But let's not turn Steinbach into something he wasn't. He was often over-powered at the point of attack. He was best when pulling. But his lack of size and strength was at times an issue.

From what I saw of the Browns game he did not look to impressive yesterday.

[COB]

I despise Peter King, but his claim that Palmer looks like s**t is undeniable. Everyone screams it's the line, and it's true Palmer would look good if he got good blocking. But so what? They all look good with plenty of time. A rookie starting in his first NFL game looked good against us yesterday because he had time. Defenses are so fast and sophisiticated now that in this day and age the good quarterbacks are the ones who can move. Tony Romo comes to mind. Big Ben can move, and when he doesn't he's so damn big guys can barely get him on the ground. And that rookie against us yesterday? Seems like he made a hell of a run against us. Carson couldn't make that play.

[gregstephens]

My last memory of Steinbach was him getting Carson's knee caved in. Just sayin'.

Brady got his knee caved in yesterday, too. Not a bad o-line in New England. Not one person's fault. Sacks happen to any team to every o-lineman. The angle of the hit can't be stopped. I don't blame Steinbach for that hit.

I do. He ole'd Kimo through to Palmer. Not the first time it had happened, either.

It was fundamentally different from what happened to Brady yesterday, where the guy was already on the ground, and lunged up at Brady.

Look, I am down with the bad-mouthing of the team. They have earned it. But let's not turn Steinbach into something he wasn't. He was often over-powered at the point of attack. He was best when pulling. But his lack of size and strength was at times an issue.

I haven't anointed Steinbach the next Munoz (and I know they played different positions, you know what I mean as an o-lineman), but you can't seriously contend this o-line would still be this bad if we had kept Steinbach.

[membengal]

I dunno. Maybe. Hard to say. All I know is Steinbach was responsible for the play that single-handedly changed this franchise's fortunes at the end of 2005. And wasn't it him that got overwhelmed when Palmer's knee got hurt to end Palmer's 2004 season in New England?

Steinbach is a quality lineman, but he was far from perfect, and I thought the decision to let him walk for the kind of money he ended up getting was more than defensible.

The bigger issue for me is the retirement of Braham and the inability to replace him. That's on the coaches, Ghuicac, and the drafters/scout/Mikey B/ etc. I think much of the problems this line has had has been with that, as opposed to losing Steinbach.

Fix the C, and a lot of this falls into place. But they are simply not picking up blitzes like they used to, and they are not playing as cohesively or as smart up front as they used to. They miss Richie more than any of can properly understand, I suspect.

[gregstephens]

I dunno. Maybe. Hard to say. All I know is Steinbach was responsible for the play that single-handedly changed this franchise's fortunes at the end of 2005. And wasn't it him that got overwhelmed when Palmer's knee got hurt to end Palmer's 2004 season in New England?

Steinbach is a quality lineman, but he was far from perfect, and I thought the decision to let him walk for the kind of money he ended up getting was more than defensible.

The bigger issue for me is the retirement of Braham and the inability to replace him. That's on the coaches, Ghuicac, and the drafters/scout/Mikey B/ etc. I think much of the problems this line has had has been with that, as opposed to losing Steinbach.

Fix the C, and a lot of this falls into place. But they are simply not picking up blitzes like they used to, and they are not playing as cohesively or as smart up front as they used to. They miss Richie more than any of can properly understand, I suspect.

Oh I never said Steinbach was perfect. I don't think he ole'd Kimo on that play, either, but he did block Kimo into Palmer. Letting him walk for the money he wanted was defensible at the time because we (the team, the fans, whoever) assumed Levi would stay healthy and tough and that Willie would be around forever. The Steinbach issue is, to a large degree, a hindsight one. Had we known then what we know now, the money would have been justified.

You are totally correct on the center issue. It boggles me that this team has not made some major effort to replace Braham through the draft and/or free agency. Picking up Santucci and counting on Ghiachick doesn't count for me.

[BengalByTheBay]

Peter King remains a douchebag and it's hardly surprising that he'd take the opportunity to pile on -- he's never failed to do so in the past. I'm not saying we are good, just that I don't give two craps what Peter King thinks about it. He doesn't have any particular insight into the team any more. It doesn't take a paycheck as a sports writer to see that nobody on this team is performing well and Palmer doesn't get a free pass either. To my eye, this team simply wasn't ready for the speed of the rats defense and Palmer had his share of blame for that as well. Against a lesser defense, we'll look okay, but we're all looking for some semblence of confidence and it's just not there.

[membengal]

That's 100% true.

King is definitely a douchebag.

[Ickey44]

"Someone said it in another thread, but I agree with it. Right now, until Palmer and/or the line gets it's act together, Fitzpatrick may be a better option for us right now. He can run, elude the rush, and improvise. All things Palmer can't do. Until the line starts pass blocking again, I would fully support the Bengals should the choose to do this."

Your nuts!

So you would rather watch Palmer get drilled week in and week out? Did you see Fitzpatrick play in the preseason? His rating was over 100. And he played with the first team offense most of the time he was in. When Palmer played in the preseason, he looked just like he did yesterday.

They way things are going right now, we may see Fitz in there whether we want to or not. Palmer's gonna get hurt back there unless the line/backs/TE's start blocking and picking up blitzes.

I didn't suggest this as a permanent solution either. Just until the line finally plays like an NFL caliber line and can pass protect so Carson's not playing scared all day.

Ok did you forget that fitz was playing against back ups and against players that didnt even make some teams!!! This could be the stupidest thing i have heard on here in a very long time!!

Not all the time. The stupidest (if that's even a word) thing to do now is to let Palmer get rocked every Sunday. If the offensive line continues to blow, then you have to put Fitzy in. The last thing we need is a $100 million QB sitting on IR.

[vettespd20]

"Someone said it in another thread, but I agree with it. Right now, until Palmer and/or the line gets it's act together, Fitzpatrick may be a better option for us right now. He can run, elude the rush, and improvise. All things Palmer can't do. Until the line starts pass blocking again, I would fully support the Bengals should the choose to do this."

Your nuts!

So you would rather watch Palmer get drilled week in and week out? Did you see Fitzpatrick play in the preseason? His rating was over 100. And he played with the first team offense most of the time he was in. When Palmer played in the preseason, he looked just like he did yesterday.

They way things are going right now, we may see Fitz in there whether we want to or not. Palmer's gonna get hurt back there unless the line/backs/TE's start blocking and picking up blitzes.

I didn't suggest this as a permanent solution either. Just until the line finally plays like an NFL caliber line and can pass protect so Carson's not playing scared all day.

Ok did you forget that fitz was playing against back ups and against players that didnt even make some teams!!! This could be the stupidest thing i have heard on here in a very long time!!

Not all the time. The stupidest (if that's even a word) thing to do now is to let Palmer get rocked every Sunday. If the offensive line continues to blow, then you have to put Fitzy in. The last thing we need is a $100 million QB sitting on IR.

so next week if carson passes for 300 yards and if they win the game are you going to still be talking about benching carson?? I swear some people amaze the hell out of me. So quick to turn there back on some one. It was week one, the offense has been beat up and have not played together. I AM NOT SAYING I am happy with the way things looked but god lets take a breath here and calm down

[BengalByTheBay]

I AM NOT SAYING I am happy with the way things looked but god lets take a breath here and calm down

Serenity now.........insanity later.

[COB]

I AM NOT SAYING I am happy with the way things looked but god lets take a breath here and calm down

I'm calm. And I'm all for letting Fitzpatrick run around out there for a while.

Where's the harm in letting the Harvard guy give it a go? It's not like he's going to derail our Super Bowl run. Or damage our march to a division championship. Or screw up our wild card bid. Or spoil our chance at a winning record.

Or we could just leave the statue in there and wait for the offensive line to gel a little bit. Which they will likely do, around game 5. Then they will play at a near average level.

Based on what I saw in preseason, Fitzpatrick gives this team a better chance to win.