It Looks Like Pats Cheated in Super Bowls

[COB]

Here's the link, and the pertinant information. The slick talking Greg Aiello, NFL spokesman, couldn't talk his way past this guy's questions. Positively Clintonian phrasing by Aiello. Also, the fact that the Pats took 72 hours to turn everything over tells me they just copied it all to keep on cheating. The Patriots don't deserve all the adulation and respect they get. They are cheaters.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story...mp;lid=tab1pos1

Pats' tapes are gone, but questions remain

By Gregg Easterbrook

Special to Page 2

Updated: September 25, 2007, 5:42 PM ET

Reader Abhijit Kumbare of San Jose, Calif., writes, "It is very fishy that the NFL immediately destroyed all the evidence submitted by the Patriots." Steve Libenson of New York writes, "Consider what the press reaction would have been if David Stern had collected all the evidence about the ref altering games, then immediately destroyed that evidence without saying what it showed, and did so four days after going on national television and promising to get to the bottom of things."

Fishy, indeed. On Sunday, Sept. 16, NFL commissioner Roger Goodell went on national TV and promised he would get to the bottom of the Patriots' sign-stealing. Four days later, the NFL announced all videotapes and other spying materials compiled by the Patriots had been obtained by the league and destroyed. Goodell, who until then had been very upfront in addressing the Beli-Cheat scandal, didn't go back on television to say what the tapes contained; the commissioner has been in radio silence about the Patriots since the files arrived at the NFL's Park Avenue headquarters. The league acted in a hurry to dispose of damning documents, but has not revealed what was in the tapes and notes, nor said why there was a rush to get rid of them.

The lack of answers leaves several questions hanging out there. Chief among them: Is it possible the Patriots' tapes showed some evidence of New England cheating in a Super Bowl?

This weekend, in an e-mail exchange with NFL spokesman Greg Aiello, I asked twice whether the Patriots' documents contained evidence of cheating in the Super Bowl, and Aiello twice declined to either confirm or deny the existence of such evidence. The first time, he changed the subject with a detailed response about the original penalty; and the second time, after I protested he hadn't answered my questions, he replied, "I did answer your questions to the extent I'm going to answer them."

As a matter of logic, refusing to deny something is not the same as admitting it. But if the Patriots' tapes and documents contained no indication of cheating in the Super Bowl, it would be strongly in the NFL's interest to publicize this. Instead, the New England documents were shredded within roughly 48 hours of the NFL receiving them -- see timeline below. The rapid shredding occurred although Goodell said nothing about plans to destroy the materials when he was on national TV vowing his purpose was "maintaining the integrity of the NFL."

After Aiello twice declined to say what the Patriots' materials showed, I heard from him a third time Sunday. He wrote in an e-mail that my assumption the tapes contained indications of Super Bowl cheating is "wrong," then wrote, "There is no such evidence regarding the Patriots' Super Bowl victories." So, is this the denial that I've been seeking? But wait: Three days earlier, the NFL destroyed the evidence. I asked Aiello whether he meant there is no evidence now of New England cheating in a Super Bowl -- that is, after the destruction of the files -- or whether examination of the materials positively affirmed no cheating. He did not reply.

Aiello's "There is no such evidence" phrasing calls to mind what Richard Nixon's attorney general John Mitchell dubbed the "non-denial denial," an assertion that seems to say something but doesn't. On Sunday, I asked Aiello whether the league would make a simple, declarative statement that the spying files proved the Patriots did not cheat in a Super Bowl -- and have not heard back from him. I assume this is not because he has forgotten: I've heard from Park Avenue sources that the fact I am asking these questions is very much on the NFL's radar. I have known Aiello professionally for years and, like others who deal with him, have always found him skilled, knowledgeable and forthright. It's very odd to be getting a "non-denial denial" from him now.

I further asked Aiello who had examined the New England materials before they were destroyed, and he would answer only "senior members of the league office staff." I asked when the materials actually arrived at league headquarters -- How long were they there before being destroyed? -- and he would not answer. I asked whether the materials had been inspected by anyone conversant with the game plans and signals the Rams, Panthers and Eagles used against Bill Belichick's Patriots in the Super Bowl; football signs and terminology are cryptic, so it would help to have a skilled eye. Aiello wouldn't answer that. I asked who had ordered the tapes and notes destroyed, and he wouldn't answer that, either.

And I asked, if there was nothing incriminating in the New England documents, why was the league in such a hurry to shred them? First, Aiello wrote, "The purpose of destroying the tapes and related documents was to eliminate any advantage they might have given the Patriots going forward and ensure a level playing field for all 32 teams." But the league announced last week that the Patriots "certified in writing" that no copies of the materials exist. If the sole copies of the sign-stealing materials had been sent to the league office, it would be impossible for these materials to give the Patriots any advantage. When I pointed that out, Aiello countered that the reason for the destruction was "so that our clubs would know they no longer exist and cannot be used by anyone." Again, if the sole copies were being held by the league, how could any club use the material?

Aiello further said Tuesday Morning Quarterback was wrong to assert, in last Tuesday's column, that Goodell issued an "emergency" order on the morning of Sunday, Sept. 16, mandating New England turn over all illegally obtained videotapes and sign-stealing materials. Aiello explained Goodell actually issued that order Thursday, Sept. 13, but that the existence of the order did not become known publicly until the morning of Sept. 16, when it was reported by Chris Mortensen on ESPN. I regret the error.

Aiello said the heavy penalties assessed the Patriots on Sept. 13 were for "the totality of the conduct" in multiple instances of sign-stealing over several years, not for "one tape seized at the end of one quarter of one game," meaning the tape taken from the Patriots in their season opener at the New York Jets.

It is unclear why, if Goodell on Sept. 13 issued an order for the surrender of all New England spying tapes and materials, the league said nothing about that directive at the time. More important, come Sunday night, Sept. 16, Goodell told Bob Costas of NBC that the Patriots had not yet complied with the order that we now know was issued Thursday and that he would "absolutely" impose additional penalties on the Patriots if they did not comply promptly. This means there were at least 72 hours in which New England was failing to abide by a high-profile direct order from the commissioner of the NFL -- and in that time was doing with its spying materials, well, lord knows what.

Here is a timeline of events so far:

Sunday, Sept. 9: During the Patriots-Jets season opener, security officers seize a video camera a team official on the New England sideline was using to film signal-calling on the New York sideline. NFL rules forbid filming the opponents' sideline or recording opponents' signal calling. Clubs had been reminded of this prohibition by a strongly worded directive sent from league headquarters in September 2006.

Thursday, Sept. 13: Commissioner Goodell declares the Patriots guilty of "a calculated and deliberate attempt to avoid long-standing rules designed to encourage fair play and promote honest competition on the playing field." He imposes on New England the strongest penalty in NFL history: loss of a first-round pick (if the Pats make the playoffs), or second- and third-round choices in the 2008 draft (if New England fails to reach the postseason); a $500,000 personal fine against Belichick; and a $250,000 club fine. Goodell orders the Patriots to turn over all videotapes and other materials obtained in violation of NFL rules, although this part of his decision is not publicly announced.

Sunday morning, Sept. 16: On ESPN, Chris Mortensen reports Goodell's directive that the Patriots surrender all videotapes and notes containing cheating materials.

Sunday evening, Sept. 16: On NBC's "Football Night in America," Goodell says New England has not yet complied with his order to surrender all illegal materials, adding the Patriots will be penalized more if the materials don't arrive soon.

Monday, Sept. 17: Asked whether he will surrender videotapes and notes to the league, Belichick answers, "Of course." Asked by The Boston Globe whether NFL headquarters has received the Patriots' materials, Aiello answers, "We don't have anything else on the matter to report right now."

Sometime between Monday night, Sept. 17, and Thursday afternoon, Sept. 20: The New England materials arrive at league headquarters.

Thursday night, Sept. 20: The NFL announces all of the Patriots' materials have been destroyed, disclosing nothing about their contents.

The history of scandals teaches us that when the point is reached that everything has come out, then the principals apologize in public and tell all. When the point has not yet been reached that everything has come out, there is usually stonewalling, denial and weird Nixonian/Clintonesque statements. The destruction of evidence and the lack of answers about what the evidence contained, leaves me wondering if there is something very important about the Patriots' spying scandal that has not yet come out.

[snerdly]

Ohhh Jezuzzz Krrrist...

So is this going to be your excuse when the Bengals get their hides skinned?

[BengalszoneBilly]

Ohhh Jezuzzz Krrrist...

So is this going to be your excuse when the Bengals get their hides skinned?

Not mine.

[James_Brooks21]

Ohhh Jezuzzz Krrrist...

So is this going to be your excuse when the Bengals get their hides skinned?

Man stop posting this garbage about the Pats cheating, football fans could care less maybe the Bengals need some pointers on how to. You sound like the little league coaches when I went to the peewee game this week and 10 year olds were playing after the other team started getting beat down they started saying " I know they got 11 year olds on their team" I just shook my head everyone is looking for an excuse rather then admit the team is better then yours.

[agreen_112]

Beside the Pats being a great team, One thing is for sure; The coaches and franchise players are very, very SMART. I see no foul here and no stripping them of their SB rings, even if these tactics were used. It was smart.

[COB]

Ohhh Jezuzzz Krrrist...

So is this going to be your excuse when the Bengals get their hides skinned?

There is currently no evidence to indicate that this is going to be my excuse. Brooks, there is a huge difference. Your little league parents were making unfounded accusations. The league did an investigation, found the evidence, convicted and punished the Pats. In one case, no basis or evidence. In the other, a mountain of evidence. You are absolutely right about one thing: football fans couldn't care less. I am mystified as to why something that so seriously affects the competitive balance and threatens the integrity of the game isn't of more interest to folks.

[membengal]

The fact that the Patriots are dirty cheaters will always be relevant, no matter how whiny their fans get about it.

The fact that the commish apparently covered up the dirty cheating will also always be relevant.

So, Pats fans, I give you this:

*

*

*

That's what goes by each of your Super Bowl wins in my mind. Deal with it.

[Bengals1]

I've always had a soft spot in my heart for the Patriots. When you're a Bengal fan and you’re used to your team being mathematically eliminated by Halloween most years you quickly learn to find a second team to root for just to keep the season interesting if you know what I mean.

That team for me was always the Pats. I liked them all the way back to the Daryl Stingley and Steve Grogan days. The days of their red jerseys and the little guy on the side of the helmet hiking the football. I even rooted for them when they got clobbered by the Bears in their first Super bowl way back when.

I have no idea if they cheated in any of their recent Super bowl games or not but after this scandal I certainly wouldn’t say it’s impossible. However, what really galls me about this latest NFL scandal is how many Steeler fans I know who are loving it! They act as if this is some sort of vindication for all the times the Pats beat them to get to those Super bowls.

Of course, these same Steeler fans don’t want to hear about the more than questionable officiating that “gave” them their last Super bowl title. Oh no, to them that was all just a tempest in a teapot, “Nope, nothing to look at here, just move along folks….”

Puh-leeze!

I still refer to the Steelers as the “Millie Vanillies” ‘cause they didn’t earn what they won either.

[PatsAddict]

Sadly Easterbrook has absolutely lost his mind over this matter. I don't think he really understands why the Pats were videotaping the opposition's defensive signals and he's not alone. It's been stated numerous times that the videotaping was not for any in-game advantage as that would be impossible for a number of reasons - time being the largest. And while there have been numerous theories as to why Belichick did what he did, the two that make the most sense are that a) you can save in preperation time over the course of the week by using the videotape instead of the tried-and-true binocular and note-pad style of sign-stealing which goes on every week in the NFL and you can gauge as to how long it takes for certain D coordinators to call in their defensive signals and if you find some who are slower than others in certain situations you can use that to your advantage with the speed in which you call your offensive plays.

In the end you'll find the majority of Pats fans believe the team got what they deserved by brazenly thumbing their nose at the commish's memo. At the same time, we are happy that it's given the players a chance to rally around something. It was the coaching staff that applied the videotaping practice but the players have been dragged through the mud as well and they haven't been too happy about it. I wouldn't want to be the Eagles or the Steelers later on this year as those two teams have been the most vocal about SpyGate. I'm sure the Bengals players will be asked about it this week and if lewis is smart he'll advise his players to take the high road. I'm not sure he wants any bulletin board material for the Pats.

In the end it should be a high scoring game Monday night. This is the toughest offense the Pats have played all year (nice job San Diego trading Marty for Norv) and I know how loud the stadium will be for a Monday night game.

[sonsofkraftybob]

Ohhh Jezuzzz Krrrist...

So is this going to be your excuse when the Bengals get their hides skinned?

There is currently no evidence to indicate that this is going to be my excuse. Brooks, there is a huge difference. Your little league parents were making unfounded accusations. The league did an investigation, found the evidence, convicted and punished the Pats. In one case, no basis or evidence. In the other, a mountain of evidence. You are absolutely right about one thing: football fans couldn't care less. I am mystified as to why something that so seriously affects the competitive balance and threatens the integrity of the game isn't of more interest to folks.

The cameraman was 10 feet forward from where he was supposed to be.

If this makes you sleep easier at night or distracts you from your own teams current problems...have a blast.

The bottom line is that the cameraman was 10 feet closer than he should have been. For that we got fined $750,000.00 and lost our #1 pick in the draft.

Why is it that only sucky teams fans latch onto this cheating crap?

You should be talking about why your defense sucks, why Herm isn't getting the job done, what photoshop tools BlackJesus uses. relevant things like that.

You are just distracting yourself so you don't have to face your own teams collapse by trying to nitpick the best run, most successful and winningest organization this century.

Look in the mirror bro and clean your own house first

[sonsofkraftybob]

The fact that the Patriots are dirty cheaters will always be relevant, no matter how whiny their fans get about it.

The fact that the commish apparently covered up the dirty cheating will also always be relevant.

So, Pats fans, I give you this:

*

*

*

That's what goes by each of your Super Bowl wins in my mind. Deal with it.

Yeah, I stopped by the trophy case last Sunday. They were all still there...no *'s to be found. They looked nice and shiney without a spot of tarnish, when I went into the stadium all the banners were still up. I said, "wait a minute...all the jealous fans of inferior teams told me there were *'s everywhere and that our Lombardi's had tarnish all over them"

I guess I'll stop believing everything I read on the internet

[Bobcat Bengal]

Ohhh Jezuzzz Krrrist...

So is this going to be your excuse when the Bengals get their hides skinned?

There is currently no evidence to indicate that this is going to be my excuse. Brooks, there is a huge difference. Your little league parents were making unfounded accusations. The league did an investigation, found the evidence, convicted and punished the Pats. In one case, no basis or evidence. In the other, a mountain of evidence. You are absolutely right about one thing: football fans couldn't care less. I am mystified as to why something that so seriously affects the competitive balance and threatens the integrity of the game isn't of more interest to folks.

The cameraman was 10 feet forward from where he was supposed to be.

If this makes you sleep easier at night or distracts you from your own teams current problems...have a blast.

The bottom line is that the cameraman was 10 feet closer than he should have been. For that we got fined $750,000.00 and lost our #1 pick in the draft.

Why is it that only sucky teams fans latch onto this cheating crap?

You should be talking about why your defense sucks, why Herm isn't getting the job done, what photoshop tools BlackJesus uses. relevant things like that.

You are just distracting yourself so you don't have to face your own teams collapse by trying to nitpick the best run, most successful and winningest organization this century.

Look in the mirror bro and clean your own house first

Herm?

I thought this was a Bengals forum, not Chiefs Training Camp.

Herm may not be getting the job done in KC, but he sure does know how to run a fashion show.

[MinnyBengal]

Ohhh Jezuzzz Krrrist...

So is this going to be your excuse when the Bengals get their hides skinned?

There is currently no evidence to indicate that this is going to be my excuse. Brooks, there is a huge difference. Your little league parents were making unfounded accusations. The league did an investigation, found the evidence, convicted and punished the Pats. In one case, no basis or evidence. In the other, a mountain of evidence. You are absolutely right about one thing: football fans couldn't care less. I am mystified as to why something that so seriously affects the competitive balance and threatens the integrity of the game isn't of more interest to folks.

The cameraman was 10 feet forward from where he was supposed to be.

If this makes you sleep easier at night or distracts you from your own teams current problems...have a blast.

The bottom line is that the cameraman was 10 feet closer than he should have been. For that we got fined $750,000.00 and lost our #1 pick in the draft.

Why is it that only sucky teams fans latch onto this cheating crap?

You should be talking about why your defense sucks, why Herm isn't getting the job done, what photoshop tools BlackJesus uses. relevant things like that.

You are just distracting yourself so you don't have to face your own teams collapse by trying to nitpick the best run, most successful and winningest organization this century.

Look in the mirror bro and clean your own house first

You sir are a chaunce... Does it make you feel better to go on other team's website and justify your "cheating crap."

Truth is our squad has its fair share of problems, that doesnt mean talking about you guys cheating means its our excuse if we lose to you. Were not gonna lose to you either.

Saying youre the winningest organization in the century isnt really saying much either. Go back to your own boards instead of getting all bent out of shape about us talking about a significant topic in the sports world.

And please explain who this "Herm" is...

Before you go and bash us, you should know who our coach is chief. Just because marvin is black doesnt make him herm edwards.

[sonsofkraftybob]

Ohhh Jezuzzz Krrrist...

So is this going to be your excuse when the Bengals get their hides skinned?

There is currently no evidence to indicate that this is going to be my excuse. Brooks, there is a huge difference. Your little league parents were making unfounded accusations. The league did an investigation, found the evidence, convicted and punished the Pats. In one case, no basis or evidence. In the other, a mountain of evidence. You are absolutely right about one thing: football fans couldn't care less. I am mystified as to why something that so seriously affects the competitive balance and threatens the integrity of the game isn't of more interest to folks.

The cameraman was 10 feet forward from where he was supposed to be.

If this makes you sleep easier at night or distracts you from your own teams current problems...have a blast.

The bottom line is that the cameraman was 10 feet closer than he should have been. For that we got fined $750,000.00 and lost our #1 pick in the draft.

Why is it that only sucky teams fans latch onto this cheating crap?

You should be talking about why your defense sucks, why Herm isn't getting the job done, what photoshop tools BlackJesus uses. relevant things like that.

You are just distracting yourself so you don't have to face your own teams collapse by trying to nitpick the best run, most successful and winningest organization this century.

Look in the mirror bro and clean your own house first

You sir are a chaunce... Does it make you feel better to go on other team's website and justify your "cheating crap."

Truth is our squad has its fair share of problems, that doesnt mean talking about you guys cheating means its our excuse if we lose to you. Were not gonna lose to you either.

Saying youre the winningest organization in the century isnt really saying much either. Go back to your own boards instead of getting all bent out of shape about us talking about a significant topic in the sports world.

And please explain who this "Herm" is...

Before you go and bash us, you should know who our coach is chief. Just because marvin is black doesnt make him herm edwards.

At least i didn't call him Lovie.

And I wasn't "bashing" your organization.

i was questioning your fanbase's obsession with some cameramna being 10 feet forward from where he was supposed to be instead of questioning, well, everything about your own team.

So do you think that subconciously makes me a racist? Hmmmm, I must be. How could I ever confuse the great marvin lewis with the terrible herm edwards.

[The PatternMaster]

Ohhh Jezuzzz Krrrist...

So is this going to be your excuse when the Bengals get their hides skinned?

There is currently no evidence to indicate that this is going to be my excuse. Brooks, there is a huge difference. Your little league parents were making unfounded accusations. The league did an investigation, found the evidence, convicted and punished the Pats. In one case, no basis or evidence. In the other, a mountain of evidence. You are absolutely right about one thing: football fans couldn't care less. I am mystified as to why something that so seriously affects the competitive balance and threatens the integrity of the game isn't of more interest to folks.

The cameraman was 10 feet forward from where he was supposed to be.

If this makes you sleep easier at night or distracts you from your own teams current problems...have a blast.

The bottom line is that the cameraman was 10 feet closer than he should have been. For that we got fined $750,000.00 and lost our #1 pick in the draft.

Why is it that only sucky teams fans latch onto this cheating crap?

You should be talking about why your defense sucks, why Herm isn't getting the job done, what photoshop tools BlackJesus uses. relevant things like that.

You are just distracting yourself so you don't have to face your own teams collapse by trying to nitpick the best run, most successful and winningest organization this century.

Look in the mirror bro and clean your own house first

You sir are a chaunce... Does it make you feel better to go on other team's website and justify your "cheating crap."

Truth is our squad has its fair share of problems, that doesnt mean talking about you guys cheating means its our excuse if we lose to you. Were not gonna lose to you either.

Saying youre the winningest organization in the century isnt really saying much either. Go back to your own boards instead of getting all bent out of shape about us talking about a significant topic in the sports world.

And please explain who this "Herm" is...

Before you go and bash us, you should know who our coach is chief. Just because marvin is black doesnt make him herm edwards.

At least i didn't call him Lovie.

And I wasn't "bashing" your organization.

i was questioning your fanbase's obsession with some cameramna being 10 feet forward from where he was supposed to be instead of questioning, well, everything about your own team.

So do you think that subconciously makes me a racist? Hmmmm, I must be. How could I ever confuse the great marvin lewis with the terrible herm edwards.

Your coach knowingly broke the rules to gain a competitive advantage..i.e..he cheated. Deal with it, he cheated on his wife and he cheated on his job, he's a cheater and you're a douche.

If you team is so great why must the coaches cheat? I admit that they have a tremendously talented group of players on offense and defense, but you trying to defend the coaches cheating is just pathetic. Did they need to cheat to win, probably not, but nobody knows. What you do know is that they did caught cheating, which would make them cheaters.

Like it or not, the Pats will go down as cheaters because of Belicheck's actions, blame him not other fans who rightfully question the integrity of the victories due to the FACT that Beilcheck and Pats are CHEATERS!!!

[BengalByTheBay]

At least i didn't call him Lovie.

And I wasn't "bashing" your organization.

i was questioning your fanbase's obsession with some cameramna being 10 feet forward from where he was supposed to be instead of questioning, well, everything about your own team.

So do you think that subconciously makes me a racist? Hmmmm, I must be. How could I ever confuse the great marvin lewis with the terrible herm edwards.

Having reviewed your increasingly-defensive posts, I have to agree -- you're a douche. News flash, it's not a Bengals fan jihad against the Patriots -- your team admitted to cheating. It's reasonable and predictable that fans of every other team are going to question exactly how big an advantage you obtained -- not whether there was an advantage. There was. It may have been very close to zero in which case, your organization is arrogant and stupid to run the risk of being caught. If it was something more than zero, your organization is smarter and more of a cheat. But it's a little too late to argue that you didn't do it.

The passive-aggressive tactic of saying that "only fans of sucky teams" care about the cheating ignores the fact that articles are being written by people who -- and I'm just guessing here -- are not Bengal fans.

[SteelerFan87]

I love Bengals vs Pats week.

[Undertaker #59]

I love Bengals vs Pats week.

Is this the one week you are a Patriots fan?

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Maybe you whiny little Patsie fans can have a group bitch session with the SF Giants fans about cheering for cheaters. Your team cheated, they got caught, they were punished. Deal with it.

Methinks you guys are a little sensitive that maybe your Unabomber-lookalike for a coach had a little help being a so-called 'genius'. And if he's half the genius some people think he is, there isn't a doubt in my mind that his staff could get the defensive calls figured out midway in the 2nd quarter with time enough to put together a halftime briefing.

[Undertaker #59]

Maybe you whiny little Patsie fans can have a group bitch session with the SF Giants fans about cheering for cheaters. Your team cheated, they got caught, they were punished. Deal with it.

Methinks you guys are a little sensitive that maybe your Unabomber-lookalike for a coach had a little help being a so-called 'genius'. And if he's half the genius some people think he is, there isn't a doubt in my mind that his staff could get the defensive calls figured out midway in the 2nd quarter with time enough to put together a halftime briefing.

We have been dealing with it. I don't make any excuses. They broke a rule, they got caught, they got punished.

How much those tapes actually helped Belichick, we will probably never know. Oh well.

I was hoping to come here and see more about the upcoming game, to tell you the truth.

[Ras-al-Ghul]

[NYBengalfan]

OK OK we've got criminals and the Pats are being accused of cheating. So what bottom line is I dont know if they cheated or not! There's not enough evidence to make that assumption. So we have had a few guys arrested, everyone makes mistakes...... some more than others. We've got a tough game this week against a very good team.

Im not saying we dont have a chance, but we will have to play well to win this one.

This thread is going along the line of smack talk.

Personally I dont care if they cheated or not.

[jjakq27]

If it's no big deal then why do the Pats fans seem so touchy?

[HoosierCat]

I'm down with the Mike Brown wanted poster!

[jjakq27]

We killed this one to death a couple of weeks ago but I can't let it go. Whether they used this stuff at the time it was recorded or the next time, it had to give them some type of advantage or they wouldn't have done it.

As far as them using this stuff in the Super Bowls and winning because of it, I am not really sure. Considering that they won all three title by three points probably means that it didn't give them a great advantage if they were doing it back then but it couldn't have hurt. It's not like they blew anyone out in any of those Super Bowls but it makes me wonder a little bit.

But I do have some serious suspicions about some of the games against the Colts in the playoffs. Manning looked absolutely dreadful at times and now it makes me wonder. It reminds me of a similar comment out of the Raiders after they lost to Jon Gruden and TB in the Super Bowl. "It was as if they were in our huddle and they knew the play that was coming." They must have because Gruden was their coach prior to that season. And if the Pats had been studying Manning and the Colts then I am sure it helped the second time around in those games.

And I really don't care one way or the other about Mangini but blaming him as some have done is just stupid. If my head coach knew about it but didn't do anything about it would have pissed me off. I give him credit for doing what he did for his team and in the long run, the league.

The Pats do deserve all the credit this year and for what they have accomplished this decade. They will probably have their way with the Bengals this week but I just hope we takes notes on how a good team gets it done as long as they don't complain to the league.