Defense sucks again!

[Stripes]

Perhaps lack of continuity explains the reason they can't seem to cover a TE.

Seriously, does anyone yet have a reason as to why they can't ever seem to cover a TE? Why are TEs running routes so ***damn confusing to them? Why?

Ohalete was the obvious reason TEs killed the Bengals in 2005. In '06, I don't think the problem was quite as pronounced. It was there, no doubt, and I'd attribute that to Dexter Jackson's age. If White or Duke Nukem ends up starting over an injured DJ, we can probably expect plenty of HEEAAAAPPPPs and HEEEEEAAAAATTTTTHHHHHs during divisional telecasts.

[Kazkal]

Do people forget that 4 game stretch last year when the defense played lights out, I prefer to think that they will step it up once the season starts.

Look people, it's a glorified practice not the real thing so let's not get too bent out of shape about this. Until we get beat in an actual game in which the defense plays bad then I think everything else is premature. Yes there are some distrubing warning signs but there are also some good things to be encouraged about as well.

Sir it was vs The Raiders,the Browns,Ravens and forgot 4th defense,We could own crappy offenses.

[Kazkal]

I do not blame the scheme, I blame the personnel.

Yes because chuck is so known for great defenses after getting a top 10 D in oakland he was still let go.

Even Frazier did a ok job and he had alot less talent that we had know,We've had talent it just can't stay on the field.

[Stripes]

I do not blame the scheme, I blame the personnel.

Yes because chuck is so known for great defenses after getting a top 10 D in oakland he was still let go.

I don't give a crap what Chuck is or isn't known for. Marvin has yet to fire him, and that's all that matters. I call them as I see them, and the scheme I see is similar in style to Chicago and Indianapolis -- the last two Superbowl participants. No, it isn't identical, but it's certainly similar.

We've had talent it just can't stay on the field.

Precisely. How can we blame the coaching when the players can't stay healthy?

Seriously, shouldn't we all wait until the Bengals play a REAL game before we start passing judgement?

[HairOnFire]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the defense lacks the talent to improve. They're young though, and there has been close to zero continuity.

Let me remind everyone how staggering the complete and total loss of the Joker role has been to this defense. This team not only lost David Pollack, a 1st round pick who was expected to provide much of the now missing pass rush heat, but also lost his inexpensive replacement, Hype Henderson.

Frankly, the cupboard is almost bare at a position that is critical to the scheme.

[TJJackson]

Hype Henderson.

Sweetie, have I mentioned that it makes me smile every time you call Mr Henderson that? It's almost like you do it just for my benefit :-)

[HairOnFire]

Hype Henderson.

Sweetie, have I mentioned that it makes me smile every time you call Mr Henderson that? It's almost like you do it just for my benefit :-)

I've only done two things just for your benefit. First, I often reach down into my lap and stroke your hair when you're servicing me. Hopefully it can be mistaken as a sign that I think you're pretty. Last, I stopped resting my beer on your head after you complained about it might be a sign that I don't respect you.

[BENGALTHEM]

Look.................are defense sucks. The reason why it sucks is because of the scheme. So you have to blame Chucky. I understand the Bengals have had a lot of injuries and suspensions on D. But who doesn't?

Despite the injuries and suspensions, I still like the personal on Defense. Smitth, Geathers, Peko, Thorton, Brooks, Hartwell, Jeanty, Johnson, Oneal, Joseph, Hall, Williams, Jackson.....that ain't bad. That kind of personal should get you a top 20 defense. But I fear we will be some where between 30 and 25 again.

When I watch the Bengals Defense. Nothing has changed. It's the same vanilla defense. Guys running around wide open. Sometimes it looks like were playing 11 versus 10. I don't understand it. How come are blitzes can't be as affective as the squeelers? Got to blame it on Chucky and Marvin. I just wish our D was more affectively aggressive. When I watch the Bengals play the Colts or the Pats, they get carved up because they play that prevent, keep everything in front of us, try and hold them to a fg, defense, instead of attacking and dictating on defense.

[BengalChamps]

Without chang-up speed at RB and without Cheech in the first 8 games, this O will be hard pressed to keep up with the other team's O. And this OLine is the worst in 4+ years.

Now addressing how BAD our D is:

I believe that talent is more important than coaching/scheme. Thats why NFL coaches put in such long hours. They are looking for any small thing they can find to give their team an edge. Its hard to find that edge when there are great athletes on the field.

The Bengals D needs Pro-Bowl talent and there is NONE. NONE! The ONLY pre-season Pro-Bowl candidate on D is Justin. He played like a man possessed again. The LBing corp is seriously overated. No one close to a Ray Lewis or Urlacher. Ahmed Brooks has the body but not the brain. Landon and Caleb have the brains but not the body of a Pro-Bowler. Other LB's are good retreads from other teams. Our DB's are good but NOT elite ProBowl candidates. You have to have elite players to have an elite D.

Compare our D to Atlanta's. Atlanta has elite players on D. Deangelo Hall. Keith Brookings. And the rookie DE(whats his name?) that abused our OLINE is a future elite player. There is 3 guys who could start for us RIGHT NOW. The Bengal D does not have 3 guys who are far and away better and capable of starting on Atlanta's D right now. AND ATLANTA IS NOT EVEN ONE OF THE BEST DEFENSES IN THE LEAGUE.

The draft is the source of elite players and we have not had good decisions or luck lately.

The loss of Cheech, Chris Perry, and Irons hurt bad because this D needs all the help it can get from the O.

8-8 or worse is a very real possibility.

WHO DEY anyway!

[Spor_tees]

Note to all Chicken Little's:

The sky is not falling, last night was a PRE-SEASON game which means that the defense was vanilla, starters who would play didn't(Geathers & Jackson). Also we had a 7th round pick in at SS, he was exposed for what he was a late 7th round pick who routinely gets lost in coverage. Maybe Hobson will wait until next years 7th round pick actually makes the team before he annoints him the next __________.

On the bright side I thought Ahmed Brooks played well, he didn't over run many plays and showed his athletic ability a few times, he's going to be special once the light bulb turns on.

I hope after last nights performance White or Busing gets more opportunities to show what they can do at backup SS cause Ndukwe isn't ready and should be used as a ST player at this point in his career, he truly was lost in coverage and was picked apart by journeyman qb's, he can't be TRUSTED to make plays, imo.

The d-line looked solid, Myers, Thornton, Smith, and Allen all made some plays. Peko has to focus on tackling, but besides that they looked pretty good.

Leon Hall has made 0 plays, I hope he's saving it for the regular season.

Did Keiwan get beat for a first down by a Japanese guy, they should have left his ass in Atl after that one.

If I hear the "It's Preseason" excuse anymore, I am going to just put that person on ignore. Preseason is a time to get BETTER, especially when you have a group of UNPROVEN players that need to LEARN the schemes and assignments. So if they are doing nothing other than playing a "vanilla" defense every preseason game and don't care how they look, how the hell are these guys going to get any better? The third preseason game is the "dress rehearsal game" where all the teams play all their starters for the longest time to iron out any wrinkles they might have. Well I didn't see any ironing out wrinkles unless the Bengals were practicing their hail mary dime pass protection defense. There are no excuses...Marvin has had plenty of time to get this team better. He knew all offseason Pollack would more than likely be gone. Marvin said all offseason that he was preparing the team without Odell. The Bengals had all the opportunities in the world to sign players to "fix" this defense. If anyone should be whining it is Brat, with the loss of Irons and not having Chrissy Perry, yet the Offense is still light years ahead of the defense. The defense is made up of a total 3 First Rounders, 3 Second rounders, 3 Third rounders (including Brooks who was seen as a first rounder really), and only 2 guys that were drafted 4th round or later (Peko and Jeanty). You meant to tell me those guys should be getting chewed up like they are? I mean that doesn't even include Leon Hall as a first round pick playing nickel. If you think every team is full of first round picks on defense, think again. This is coaching...coaching...coaching. Oh sorry I mean lack thereof.

On the flip side, the Bears defense, who many consider the best in the league, is made up of, 3 First rounders, 2 second rounders, 2 third rounders, and 4 players drafted in the fourth round or later. Do I need to go through more defenses to prove a point? I mean this is the Best defense in the league...with the same amount of first rounders starting as the Bengals.

[Spor_tees]

Just another...Patriots defense consist of 3 First rounders, 1 Second rounder, 3 Third rounders, and 4 players drafted Fourth round or later. All first rounders on the Patriots defense are the starting defensive line, Seymour, Wilfork, and Ty Warren. 6 of the guys on the defense were free agents brought in to make the defense fit Belichick's defensive scheme.

[Kazkal]

Without chang-up speed at RB and without Cheech in the first 8 games, this O will be hard pressed to keep up with the other team's O. And this OLine is the worst in 4+ years.

WHO DEY anyway!

Um ya speedy RB and cheech would be nice...but most other teams in NFL would kill to have Carson,Rudi,TJ & chad,If we get levi or willie not even both back I think our offensive play will be just fine.

If I hear the "It's Preseason" excuse anymore, I am going to just put that person on ignore. Preseason is a time to get BETTER,

Dude it's time for 2nd and 3rd stringers to get better,Teams are playing so vanilla a starter really isn't gonna be tested besides mybe the 3rd preseason game where wow our starters played a whole 2 qrters.

[The PatternMaster]

Note to all Chicken Little's:

The sky is not falling, last night was a PRE-SEASON game which means that the defense was vanilla, starters who would play didn't(Geathers & Jackson). Also we had a 7th round pick in at SS, he was exposed for what he was a late 7th round pick who routinely gets lost in coverage. Maybe Hobson will wait until next years 7th round pick actually makes the team before he annoints him the next __________.

On the bright side I thought Ahmed Brooks played well, he didn't over run many plays and showed his athletic ability a few times, he's going to be special once the light bulb turns on.

I hope after last nights performance White or Busing gets more opportunities to show what they can do at backup SS cause Ndukwe isn't ready and should be used as a ST player at this point in his career, he truly was lost in coverage and was picked apart by journeyman qb's, he can't be TRUSTED to make plays, imo.

The d-line looked solid, Myers, Thornton, Smith, and Allen all made some plays. Peko has to focus on tackling, but besides that they looked pretty good.

Leon Hall has made 0 plays, I hope he's saving it for the regular season.

Did Keiwan get beat for a first down by a Japanese guy, they should have left his ass in Atl after that one.

If I hear the "It's Preseason" excuse anymore, I am going to just put that person on ignore. Preseason is a time to get BETTER, especially when you have a group of UNPROVEN players that need to LEARN the schemes and assignments. So if they are doing nothing other than playing a "vanilla" defense every preseason game and don't care how they look, how the hell are these guys going to get any better? The third preseason game is the "dress rehearsal game" where all the teams play all their starters for the longest time to iron out any wrinkles they might have. Well I didn't see any ironing out wrinkles unless the Bengals were practicing their hail mary dime pass protection defense. There are no excuses...Marvin has had plenty of time to get this team better. He knew all offseason Pollack would more than likely be gone. Marvin said all offseason that he was preparing the team without Odell. The Bengals had all the opportunities in the world to sign players to "fix" this defense. If anyone should be whining it is Brat, with the loss of Irons and not having Chrissy Perry, yet the Offense is still light years ahead of the defense. The defense is made up of a total 3 First Rounders, 3 Second rounders, 3 Third rounders (including Brooks who was seen as a first rounder really), and only 2 guys that were drafted 4th round or later (Peko and Jeanty). You meant to tell me those guys should be getting chewed up like they are? I mean that doesn't even include Leon Hall as a first round pick playing nickel. If you think every team is full of first round picks on defense, think again. This is coaching...coaching...coaching. Oh sorry I mean lack thereof.

On the flip side, the Bears defense, who many consider the best in the league, is made up of, 3 First rounders, 2 second rounders, 2 third rounders, and 4 players drafted in the fourth round or later. Do I need to go through more defenses to prove a point? I mean this is the Best defense in the league...with the same amount of first rounders starting as the Bengals.

I'm not arguing that we don't have the talent, all I'm saying is let's wait until, you know, an actual game as been played before we start talking about how bad the defense is going to be. Most players and coaches look at the preseason as gloriifed practice, hell last years SB champs went 0-4 in the preseason so that tells you how important the preseason is.

I think Bres's schemes are extremely flawed at times and at times I think the players don't execute the scheme well enough on many occasions, they all need to do better in order for us to win. Unlike many here I thought there were some good things that came out of the game on MNF, one being that Ahmed Brooks looked like he knew what he was doing out there.

The defense has been a question mark for awhile now, you never know what kind of performance our going to get from them, but I have belief that they can get the job done.

[HoosierCat]

I'm not arguing that we don't have the talent, all I'm saying is let's wait until, you know, an actual game as been played before we start talking about how bad the defense is going to be.

Why? Set aside the preseason. What do you still have? Well, first of all, you have the same scheme as last year, which everyone seems to agree is terrible. And second, you have pretty much the same players as last year. The only new starter is Myers. Everyone else was either a No. 1 or 2 here last season. Same scheme + same players = same crappy results. That IMHO is a reasonable assumption. And so far preseason has done little to convince me I'm wrong.

[The PatternMaster]

I'm not arguing that we don't have the talent, all I'm saying is let's wait until, you know, an actual game as been played before we start talking about how bad the defense is going to be.

Why? Set aside the preseason. What do you still have? Well, first of all, you have the same scheme as last year, which everyone seems to agree is terrible. And second, you have pretty much the same players as last year. The only new starter is Myers. Everyone else was either a No. 1 or 2 here last season. Same scheme + same players = same crappy results. That IMHO is a reasonable assumption. And so far preseason has done little to convince me I'm wrong.

Well we have no Tory James, we have young hungry players who are eager to prove to themselves and the world that they belong and they can make plays. We have players who have gotten better with time, Ahmed Brooks is one of them.

I don't think you can accurately judge how a team will perform in the regular season based on what they did in the preseason for a few reasons: 1.) Most coaches don't call their best plays because they want to save them for the regular season, 2.) Alot of players sit these games out and don't play due to minor injuries that they would normally play through if it were the regular season, 3.) Many of the players who get alot of playing time in the preseason games won't play in the regular season or might not even make the team.

I could go on, but I think you get my point. As fans of the team I think we should wait until proves that they can't do something in a game that actually means something before we start saying they suck and can't do this and that.

[BengalszoneBilly]

I could go on, but I think you get my point. As fans of the team I think we should wait until proves that they can't do something in a game that actually means something before we start saying they suck and can't do this and that.

So you don't see any kind of train wreck ahead. No potential for it at all. Even from the glum comments made after games by the coaching staff. Nothing?

Is your real name Ronnie Milsap, or Stevie Wonder?

[HoosierCat]

We have players who have gotten better with time, Ahmed Brooks is one of them.

While we do have players who have gotten better with time (Geathers comes to mind) IMHO Brooks is not one of them. If possible he looks even more lost at MLB than in his brief appearances last season. I think he's about thisclose to losing his MLB job, as evidenced by their moving Hartwell from backup WLB to backup MLB, and then employing Brooks as a down lineman in the Atlanta game.

[The PatternMaster]

I could go on, but I think you get my point. As fans of the team I think we should wait until proves that they can't do something in a game that actually means something before we start saying they suck and can't do this and that.

So you don't see any kind of train wreck ahead. No potential for it at all. Even from the glum comments made after games by the coaching staff. Nothing?

Is your real name Ronnie Milsap, or Stevie Wonder?

Well my first name is Steve and when I was lil kid I answered to Stevie, but sadly, no I am neither of the men you referenced.

I too am concerned but not overly worried because I have yet to see what the 2007 defense can do once the bullets start flying FOR REAL.

Can we just wait until Tuesday 9/11/07 before we say ___________ sucks?

[BengalszoneBilly]

[Can we just wait until Tuesday 9/11/07 before he we say ___________ sucks?

Sounds good. I'll just copy it to my computer clipboard now for easy reference later.

[bengalsfansince68]

So you don't see any kind of train wreck ahead. No potential for it at all.

I acknowledge the potential for a train wreck.

Somebody acknowledge the potential for it to get better, too.

Crissakes, ya'll are killing me!

[BengalszoneBilly]

Somebody acknowledge the potential for it to get better, too.

Sure, that potential does exist. It's just smaller.

[GapControl]

CONSIDERABLY smaller..... lol

[agreen_112]

Well if Tory James plays good this year and Artrell Hawkins plays good again this season, then we know why our D is so horrible. It's gotta be the scheme.

[chrishcovga]

WE ALL KNOW THE PROBLEMS WITH THE DEFENSE !!

1. Chuck Bresnahans' wimpy scheme.

2. Age and lack of athleticism at Defensive Tackle ( except Peko )

3. No O'Dell, NO Pollack ( Should've been playing DE anyways - or we should have made the move to the 3-4

4. Chuck Bresnahans' wimpy scheme. ( The Eagle cover 3 only works on Madden CHUCK )

I'm not concerned about the Defense surprisingly. I actually think the " D " will be better this year.

- I'm Concerned about the OFFENSE

1. Offensive line's health. - this unit is a far cry from the unit that was so dominant in '05.

2. No Chris Henry - Tab is so average compared to Henry's elite type of skill. The others are just roster spots.- Hopefully, Skyler Green can give the offense short fields to work with on a regular basis.

3. No One to take 100 or more carries behind Rudi. Maybe Chris Perry comes back, Maybe he doesn't. Is it just me, Or does no one on this coaching staff have any faith in Kenny Watson !!

[The PatternMaster]

WE ALL KNOW THE PROBLEMS WITH THE DEFENSE !!

1. Chuck Bresnahans' wimpy scheme.

2. Age and lack of athleticism at Defensive Tackle ( except Peko )

3. No O'Dell, NO Pollack ( Should've been playing DE anyways - or we should have made the move to the 3-4

4. Chuck Bresnahans' wimpy scheme. ( The Eagle cover 3 only works on Madden CHUCK )

I'm not concerned about the Defense surprisingly. I actually think the " D " will be better this year.

- I'm Concerned about the OFFENSE

1. Offensive line's health. - this unit is a far cry from the unit that was so dominant in '05.

2. No Chris Henry - Tab is so average compared to Henry's elite type of skill. The others are just roster spots.- Hopefully, Skyler Green can give the offense short fields to work with on a regular basis.

3. No One to take 100 or more carries behind Rudi. Maybe Chris Perry comes back, Maybe he doesn't. Is it just me, Or does no one on this coaching staff have any faith in Kenny Watson !!

He called Bres's scheme "wimpy". lol!