Our Defense will Improve

[bengalboomer7]

There was a note on Bengals.com about this being perhaps the last game without Levi and Richie. We'll see how it goes for the short week. I also wonder the status of Simmons and Deltha, they would both be welcome additions for Thursday.

Off Topic- Did anyone else notice, even at the beginning of the game, how wuiet it was while Carson was running the No huddle. I could hear the cadence!

[derekshank]

Think about this game from the Browns perspective. They were just shut-out by the worst statistical defense in the NFL! Imagine how livid we would be if that had happened to us? I'll bet Frye is not an NFL starter next year.

[derekshank]

WOO HOO!!! Now we're ranked 31st! Eat it Tennessee!

http://nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/DEF-TOTA...ar?sort_col_1=4

[BengalszoneBilly]

WHAT DID I SAY?

Today I think we all saw Improvement.......who cares if it was Cleveland...it doesnt matter....a Shutout is a Shutout, and they dont happen very often in this league. Oh yeah, and the 203 total yards the defense game up, is 174 yards less than our average

I, the self proclaimed "King Disser of the Defense" is today giving them mad props for getting the Bengals first shutout since 1989, and on the road no less! I think Mr. BengalPimp was right...the defense is improving, and hopefully will continue to do so!

[TJJackson]

number 31! wahoo!

Number 30, here we come :-)

[BengalPimp]

WHAT DID I SAY?

Today I think we all saw Improvement.......who cares if it was Cleveland...it doesnt matter....a Shutout is a Shutout, and they dont happen very often in this league. Oh yeah, and the 203 total yards the defense game up, is 174 yards less than our average

I, the self proclaimed "King Disser of the Defense" is today giving them mad props for getting the Bengals first shutout since 1989, and on the road no less! I think Mr. BengalPimp was right...the defense is improving, and hopefully will continue to do so!

Thank you, the D was out to prove a point, which they did. Now , I just hope they continue to play with that chip on their shoulder....they have some upcoming games with teams that are not very good offensively, so that should not only allow them to move up the rankings, but give them the confidence they need so they have that "swagger" on the field.....understand that they Shut-Out the Browns yesterday, and they know that they CANT go out the next game and give up 30 points....not after a shut-out....Thursday, the defense will be defending the shut-out they had on sunday....they will have confidence, they will have attitude, they will have that "swagger" and realize that the defense is learning how to play together, after having so many different players at different positions the first half of the season....

The offense is also another BIG reason that the Defense played well. By converting 7 of 14 3rd down attempts, they were able to sustain their drives, and in the process, give their Defense some rest, by keeping them off the field. Key Stat from the game....Time of Possession: Bengals 37:50 Browns 22:10

give the D some rest, they'll be okay...when the offense couldnt convert 3rd downs the last few games and kept going 3 and out, the Defense was always on the field and tired. You gotta keep them fresh.

[walzav29]

If you want to look at the glass as half full. The Bengals have the hardset schedule in the NFL and the defense is ranked 17th in scoring which seems to be a big stat among coaches.

[BengalPimp]

If you want to look at the glass as half full. The Bengals have the hardset schedule in the NFL and the defense is ranked 17th in scoring which seems to be a big stat among coaches.

and have given up 17 points or less in 7 of the 11 games. 2TD's (14points) or less in 5 of the 11 games.

[derekshank]

Thank you, the D was out to prove a point, which they did. Now , I just hope they continue to play with that chip on their shoulder....

I'm still questioning how big of a point they made. All it proved to me was that the 31st ranked defense in the leauge wasn't quite as incompetent as the 31st ranked offense in the league (Thank you Charlie Frye).

The big problem with this defense all season is the point you just made... continuing to play well. The are the most inconsistent defense in the NFL. In fact... I'd be curious to find out if any defense in the history of the NFL has ever given up 595 yards in one game, only to come back and hold a team to 203 the following week.

It's the same problem the Bears are having right now with Grossman. He'll play lights out one week, and throw 5 INT's the next. When he's on, people love him... but he's too inconsistent to count on him to lead the team to victory on a regular basis - and it might cost them a Super Bowl opportunity. That is our defense right now.

Carson Palmer will be able to overcome their ineptitude a lot of times... but other times (such as the San Diego game) they will just be too piss poor to give us a chance. The problem is, you don't know what you're going to get. Is the defense that led the league in INT's last year going to show up... or is the one that had a 4 week drought without a turnover and allowed 455 yards/game coming?

That's the problem I have with this defense... and a shut-out against Charlie Frye isn't enough to squelch my concern.

If you want to look at the glass as half full. The Bengals have the hardset schedule in the NFL and the defense is ranked 17th in scoring which seems to be a big stat among coaches.

and have given up 17 points or less in 7 of the 11 games. 2TD's (14points) or less in 5 of the 11 games.

This is the only stat that really holds water with me (although it's only 6 games, not 7). The problem is the fact that we allow big points when we don't hold a team to 20 or less. Vick put 29 on us. The Pats rolled up 38, and the Chargers nailed us for 49. When we allow that kind of scoring, especially against teams that primarily run the ball (keeping Palmer is sitting on the sideline), it doesn't give us a good chance to win.

We're going to have to fix it if we want to win a playoff game. The problem is that I don't think the unit is consistent enough, or has enough of a personality to sustain that kind of effort 4 straight weeks against playoff caliber teams.

[BengalPimp]

Thank you, the D was out to prove a point, which they did. Now , I just hope they continue to play with that chip on their shoulder....

I'm still questioning how big of a point they made. All it proved to me was that the 31st ranked defense in the leauge wasn't quite as incompetent as the 31st ranked offense in the league (Thank you Charlie Frye).

The big problem with this defense all season is the point you just made... continuing to play well. The are the most inconsistent defense in the NFL. In fact... I'd be curious to find out if any defense in the history of the NFL has ever given up 595 yards in one game, only to come back and hold a team to 203 the following week.

It's the same problem the Bears are having right now with Grossman. He'll play lights out one week, and throw 5 INT's the next. When he's on, people love him... but he's too inconsistent to count on him to lead the team to victory on a regular basis - and it might cost them a Super Bowl opportunity. That is our defense right now.

Carson Palmer will be able to overcome their ineptitude a lot of times... but other times (such as the San Diego game) they will just be too piss poor to give us a chance.

? Do you not realize that in games like the SD game, when a team is down by that many points, they have no choice but to play lights outs and take risks, throw more, go deep more often than they normally would, because they are already down, and have nothing to lose. The Meltdown in the 2nd half of the Chargers game wasnt just the Defense's fault....The Offense was going 3 and out and punting the ball, giving it to the Chargers at Mid-Field. YOU CANT PUT YOUR DEFENSE IN THAT POSITION. SD was working with a short-field the entire 2nd half and the times the Bengals did score in the 2nd half, they were all quick scores..YOU HAVE TO EAT UP THE CLOCK WHEN YOU ARE AHEAD>>>>Blame the defense if you like, but ask Pittsburg, ask Baltimore, ask Jacksonville, what they do when they have a lead...THEY RUN THE DAMN BALL TO USE UP THE CLOCK, GIVING THE OPPONENT LESS CHANCES TO SCORE, AND KEEPING THEIR DEFENSE FRESH. THE BENGALS DIDNT/COULDNT RUN THE FRIGGIN BALL IN THE 2ND HALF AGAINST SAN DIEGO......GET IT?

[derekshank]

? Do you not realize that in games like the SD game, when a team is down by that many points, they have no choice but to play lights outs and take risks, throw more, go deep more often than they normally would, because they are already down, and have nothing to lose. The Meltdown in the 2nd half of the Chargers game wasnt just the Defense's fault....The Offense was going 3 and out and punting the ball, giving it to the Chargers at Mid-Field. YOU CANT PUT YOUR DEFENSE IN THAT POSITION. SD was working with a short-field the entire 2nd half and the times the Bengals did score in the 2nd half, they were all quick scores..YOU HAVE TO EAT UP THE CLOCK WHEN YOU ARE AHEAD>>>>Blame the defense if you like, but ask Pittsburg, ask Baltimore, ask Jacksonville, what they do when they have a lead...THEY RUN THE DAMN BALL TO USE UP THE CLOCK, GIVING THE OPPONENT LESS CHANCES TO SCORE, AND KEEPING THEIR DEFENSE FRESH. THE BENGALS DIDNT/COULDNT RUN THE FRIGGIN BALL IN THE 2ND HALF AGAINST SAN DIEGO......GET IT?

First of all... what's with the yelling? Is it for emphasis? If so... most people don't respond to it well. Treating people like they are stupid is not a good tactic. In fact... it's usually the first sign you look for when someone is losing an argument. I think it is clear who has the better argument here. You are defending the 31st ranked defense in the NFL. My argument is simply easier to defend... since it always easier to defend the correct position.

Now... you're argument is that the Bengals giving up 6 TD's in 7 possessions was the offense's and ST's fault. Lets take a look at the facts:

SD's scoring drives in the 2nd half

6 plays for 69 yards in 2:28.

1 play for 46 yards in 0:07.

9 plays for 80 yards in 3:19.

7 plays for 40 yards in 2:55.

1 play for 9 yards in 0:06.

12 plays for 72 yards in 5:19.

I'll admit the Palmer fumble hurt them late in the game... but they had already scored 4 straight TD's at that point, averaging more than 10 yards/play. That is no one's fault but the defense.

Our offense won the Time of Possession stat, rushing the ball 28 times for 128 yards, gained 545 total yards, scored 41 points, had only 1 turnover. Explain to me again how the loss is the offense's fault? We couldn't get a single stop from our defense until we were losing the game. Even if the offense had played like crap, you should be able to expect 1 stop, rather than allowing 5 TD's in 5 possessions.

[derekshank]

Also, your point that SD had no choice but to take risks and throw the ball deep is an argument in my favor. They were forced to become a one dimensional team. We knew they had to throw the ball and score quickly... and we let them. That is pathetic.

The defense doesn't always play that poorly... but that's my point. You can't count on them to show up the way they did against Cleveland, because at any given moment... they might allow a good offense to score at will.

[johnson85]

I just watched the press conference video on bengals.com, did i hear marvin right that he was calling the defensive plays? If so I doubt Bres will be here next season.

[Stripes]

The defense made me proud, but it was the Browns. Grain of salt and all that. I agree with Derek.

The defense isn't as bad as they were in the second half against the Chargers, but nor are they as good as they were against Cleveland.

Unfortunately, I think they're closer to the first extreme than the latter.

[HoosierCat]

The defense made me proud, but it was the Browns. Grain of salt and all that. I agree with Derek.

The defense isn't as bad as they were in the second half against the Chargers, but nor are they as good as they were against Cleveland.

Unfortunately, I think they're closer to the first extreme than the latter.

Yup.

[BengalPimp]

Again......WHAT DID I SAY?

[derekshank]

We've had two incredibly great games in a row. I will say that first of all... a streak of 2 in a row against offenses ranked 31 and 25 isn't enough to get the sour taste out of my mouth from the previous 2 weeks of giving up 1000 yards. (By the way... we're more likely to play offenses ranked in the top ten than in the bottom 10 in the playoffs).

I'll give them their due... because they've played complete games 2 weeks in a row. There's no reason to deny it, but I'll continue to go back to my argument that they are inconsistent until they play like this several weeks in a row (and I don't expect them to play like this against Indy).

And just to give you an idea of how inconsistent they are... they've played 2 incredible games in a row giving up only 259 yards/game (which would be ranked #1 in the league if we did that all season), and yet they are still ranked 31st. That is the definition of inconsistent.

Like I said in another thread, if they hold Indy under 350 yards and 28 points... then I'll be ready to admit the defense is ready for a playoff run. But... you can't help but be a little impressed from their effort the last two weeks.

[Tasher]

Raiders, Colts, Broncos, Steelers loom...

Like Marvin said in the lockerroom afterward, this win means nothing if we don't handle business week to week.

I want to see this defensive intensity and RESULTS EVERY minute of EVERY GAME.

Just like Sam said, you cannot play football for 59 minutes!

But this is definitely better than what we saw in the San Diego fiasco.

[derekshank]

I think what I've ben the most impressed with has been the D-Line. I know some of you aren't happy with our pass-rush... but our DT's were outstanding yesterday. Sam Adams is finally playing the way we paid him to. Peko is continually improving... and i was really impressed with how S. Smith showed up with the opportunity given to him by Thornton's injury.

The DE's seemed like they were intentionally bull-rushing the entire game, rather than trying to just beat their blockers. Maybe this was the same strategy they used with Vick because they didn't want McNair to beat them with his legs, but there were several times I felt like the pass-rush was a scheme to keep McNair in the pocket, and give the illusion of pressure.

Regardless... the D-Line was the main reason we won this game. They had no running game because the D-Line played so well (and the LB's maintained their gaps), and the Ravens WR's are not good enough to beat our secondary.

[HairOnFire]

But this is definitely better than what we saw in the San Diego fiasco.

If the Bengals miss the playoffs the San Diego meltdown will likely be seen as the defining moment of the season for most Bengal fans, and rightly so. That said, we may be sitting here several years from now discussing whether that game was the turning point that resulted in a far more focused and disciplined defense.

I'm not kidding.

[derekshank]

But this is definitely better than what we saw in the San Diego fiasco.

If the Bengals miss the playoffs the San Diego meltdown will likely be seen as the defining moment of the season for most Bengal fans, and rightly so. That said, we may be sitting here several years from now discussing whether that game was the turning point that resulted in a far more focused and disciplined defense.

I'm not kidding.

It's possible. Who knows. Maybe if we managed to win that game, the defense wouldn't have learned its lesson about needing to step up. On the other hand... we still gave up almost 600 yards the next week to N.O. So I'm thinking the turning point for them might have been seeing their names dead last in defense ranking.

[HairOnFire]

It's possible. Who knows. Maybe if we managed to win that game, the defense wouldn't have learned its lesson about needing to step up. On the other hand... we still gave up almost 600 yards the next week to N.O. So I'm thinking the turning point for them might have been seeing their names dead last in defense ranking.

I just watched the New Orleans game and I've got to tell you that the staggering amount of passing yardage the Bengals gave up didn't concern me too much. Perhaps that's due entirely to the fact that I already knew the outcome of the game I was watching, but I thought the Bengals defense did a pretty great job of keeping the Saints out of the endzone all game long. In fact, the only play that resulted in me screaming at my television was the 70 yard pitch and catch to Joe Horn.

[Tasher]

I was a wreck during the Saints game.

Physically sick to the point that I was almost hunched over the commode. And no it was not alcohol related.

That is how I remember the Saints game. Until Kilmer intercepted the pick 6 I was not comfortable.

I liked the effort and results of last night far better. I could sit and enjoy the game, not fearful that we were going to blow up, although I was still a little nervous.

Note to Marvin, run the ball late, kick those two FGs and get a bigger lead than 14 points, thankyouverymuch.

[Bengalhead]

I think what I've ben the most impressed with has been the D-Line. I know some of you aren't happy with our pass-rush... but our DT's were outstanding yesterday. Sam Adams is finally playing the way we paid him to. Peko is continually improving... and i was really impressed with how S. Smith showed up with the opportunity given to him by Thornton's injury.

The DE's seemed like they were intentionally bull-rushing the entire game, rather than trying to just beat their blockers. Maybe this was the same strategy they used with Vick because they didn't want McNair to beat them with his legs, but there were several times I felt like the pass-rush was a scheme to keep McNair in the pocket, and give the illusion of pressure.

Regardless... the D-Line was the main reason we won this game. They had no running game because the D-Line played so well (and the LB's maintained their gaps), and the Ravens WR's are not good enough to beat our secondary.

That's a great point. I didn't really pick up on that until you mentioned it. I think that's a smart gameplan for mobile QBs. It obviously worked last night!

[Jonboat]

I think it goes to show you it's not about the DC it's about execution ( tackling/doYOUR job) & we can see what this D is capable of doing hopefully they start to really buy into it. You have to be able to trust the guy next to you to be where he's supposed to be which is difficult when you don't have the same players on the field week to week due to injuries. I think if we can stay healthy from here on out we'll see more consistency from the D.

I've really been impressed w/ Caleb, I was a bit worried about his size @ MLB but he seems to be very disciplined & always seems to be around the ball. I also like how they're using LJ & bringing him on more blitzes.

I agree Derek, the Dline has really been getting after em. Big Sam keeps saying his knee is feeling better each week & it has shown the last couple weeks. I like Smith too he seems to get more push than Thornton. Personally, I've never been a big fan of JT's, while I think he's played OK this year , to me he seems to get pushed around too much but what the hell do I know the coaches seem to like him !