you guys call it

[Bengals29]

is this a Touchdown or not

here us a close up of his feet

to this day I say he was in

[AMC]

In the past...

We'll get a TD later that wasn't supposed to be...Maybe in PITT to win the game...

The universe has a funny way of evening things out

[Jet23]

As he was overruling the td, the ref said Chad didn't get both feet down. I sure don't see conclusive evidence of that. It was a beautiful play, let is stand jackball!

[Kirkendall]

Sorry for not being a homer, but I thought he was out. His left hand hit the out of bounds marker before his elbow hit. And his right foot never touched the ground.

Great catch, great throw, but I do think he was out.

[Jonboat]

Looks like his feet was crossed up & the left foot didn't touch the ground before the hand came down OB. so I hate to say it but I think it was a good call.

The thing I was getting pissed about was the TV announcer kept saying the ball was moving on his chest ! All the replays they showed was of Chads back, not one replay we seen did you even see the ball after he brought it in !

Chris Henry should've caught his pass & this play would've been forgotten. I think that drive with the call , dropped ball, missed FG really set the tone & gave the Pitt. D a boost.

[bengalboomer7]

I think we are missing the point. The point of replay is to judge "indisputably" whether a call is right or not. I think taht it took too long and they were gonna find anything to overturn it. here's a little blip from profootballtalk.com that explains it. Even cites this play

1. Replay Needs A Review.

The NFL replay system is broken. The thing either needs to be fixed, or it needs to be scrapped.

The biggest problem is that the guys in the white hats continue to use the black box as a tool to re-do the decision that already was made on the field by one of their colleagues. But the rules plainly state that a call will be overturned only if the visual evidence is indisputable.

Several weeks back, the Lions got jobbed out of a win over the Bucs when referee Gerry Austin decided to cross-reference two separate angles in order to essentially make the call from scratch. On Sunday, ref Tony Corrente similarly failed to apply the letter and spirit of the replay rule in overturning a "did-he-or-didn't-he?" touchdown reception by Bengals wideout Chad "Cha Cha" Johnson.

Sorry, but with Johnson's black shoes on black FieldTurf and no way of seeing whether his second toe did or didn't drag (kicking up black rubber pellets), we can't say that it's indisputable that Johnson's second foot wasn't in before his hand hit the white line.

Here's a tip, refs. It after watching the best angle more than twice you feel the need to watch the thing again before making a decision, the evidence isn't indisputable and the call (whatever it is) should stand.

We've also noticed that the manner in which the refs explain the decision routinely omits the key words "indisputable visual evidence." Instead, they explain their conclusion as if they re-made the call based on what they saw, not whether they decided that there was sufficient proof to overturn the call that already was made.

The other problem, in our view, is the notion that, for 56 minutes of the game, the question of whether questionable calls are reviewed entails a multi-faceted exercise in strategy. However, the mere fact that the NFL automatically permits replay to be initiated from the booth within the last two minutes (or, as the Saints learned on Sunday, after the two-minute warning) of the second quarter and fourth quarter represents an implicit admission that the league recognizes there are circumstances in which it's important to get calls right.

But what's so damned magical about the last two minutes of the half or the game? Most pro football contests turn on a handful of plays peppered throughout all four quarters. For every game that hinges on a last-minute drive, there are five or more in which the turning point comes well before the last 120 ticks.

So we firmly believe that the system should revert to its original rules, under which the replay official initiated all replays.

The argument in favor of the current structure is that it limits the number of replays and thus speeds up the game. But considering that college games drag on and on for 3.5 hours or longer and given that the delays resulting from replays typically entail a little drama and intrigue, who cares if the games last a few minutes longer? To the extent the NFL fears that a few extra minutes before the final gun sounds might alienate fans, maybe the league should consider the impact on customer loyalty of a replay system with facets that seem to be arbitrary, such as the tweak in the rules that screwed the Saints on Sunday against the Rams, when an obviously incorrect call at a key juncture of the game could not be reviewed.

With that said, we realize that a system rendering replay automatic for every possible mistake could result in a flood of reviews for issues like the spot of the ball on second down and seven or whether a guy got his feet in bounds on a catch that would have been good for a two-yard gain on 3rd-and-23. So in order to avoid replays of potentially bad calls that really weren't important, we suggest limiting replay to the following range of plays and outcomes:

a. Any play resulting in a change of possession.

b. Any play resulting in a touchdown.

c. Any play in which the outcome of the review would determine whether a first down is or is not awarded.

That's it. It's all they need. Get rid of the red flag. Get rid of the two-minute rule. Get rid of the ref conducting the video review, since he's subject to the influences of loud-mouthed coaches and drunk-ass fans. Keep it all in the replay booth, and make the replay official completely independent of the officiating crew.

And please -- please -- get rid of the stupid down-by-contact thing that prevents a non-call on a fumble from being reviewed.

2. "Ned Flanders is Hepped Up On Goofballs."

We still like Jim Mora, Jr., but we'll admit that we're feeling a tad bit confused by his apparent affinity for sniffing ammonia capsules -- and for sticking them under the noses of his players.

It's not illegal and by all appearances not dangerous. Power lifters routinely use ammonia capsules to get "psyched up" for a heavy rep.

But it's bizarre, to say the least, to see a head coach of a pro football team messing with the capsules like a kid who found a box of them in a drawer in the basement. Though ammonia isn't a threshold drug, the act of inhaling anything for fun is a threshold behavior that can lead to more dangerous and addictive sniffing activities.

Kids, after all, aren't in a position to understand the things that will hurt them and the things that won't. Ammonia capsules, from what yours truly recalls as Florio Jr. was making his now-I-know-why-I-didn't-got-to-medical-school entrance into the world, surely smell like they can cause harm -- and kids who think it's okay to stick them under their noses because Coach Mora did it could then decide to sample the bouquet of other substances, once they get bored with the aroma of ammonia.

So knock off the ammonia sniffing, Jim. You really need to think about the impact it can have on the youngsters who see you doing it.

[Kirkendall]

Sounds like Profootball just wants to bitch about the system and will pull anything to do so.

His hand is out of bounds BEFORE his second foot touches (which makes that foot irrelevent).

Anyway, it's over. No point in bitching about something 3 days after the fact. If someone should complain about being jobbed, it's any team that plays the Chicago White Sox!!!

[walzav29]

He was out. That damn Henry should have caught the ball. Whatever. It's over. The Pack will get a beating and everyone can say how much the Bengals suck when they are 7-2 going into the bye week. Pitt will get theirs Dec. 4th.

By the way. The Bengals were 7-2 during their Super Bowl season after 9 games. 1 game at a time. Pack, then Ravens.

[Jet23]

The replay was designed to overturn blatantly bad calls. Now, coaches are throwing red flags hoping the refs will catch something on slow motion that they missed. It is slowing down the game. It used to be that the replay official did not want to show up the ref by overturning the call. Now it seems as if they want to overturn every call. Get rid of it. It kills the flow of the game.

By the way, I do not think that call had any bearing on the outcome.

[bengalboomer7]

I can't change the call, that's not the point. The point is that the "spirit" or the intentions of the rule are not being properly implemented. It's causing refs to stop blowing whistles, and hesitate to make calls. They use the replay as a tool to bail themselves out

[alleycat]

I thought the biggest impact of the replay was not that it overturned the call, but that the ref took about five minutes to look at the damn thing and that blew our rythm to hell. In a brilliant coaching move, Cowher then called a time-out to even further keep of us balance. We were a humming maching up till that point, and then we couldn't keep in sync.

[redsbengalsbucks]

TD

but Perry fumbled and it was missed also

[HoosierCat]

His hand is out of bounds BEFORE his second foot touches (which makes that foot irrelevent).

So if he hadn't put his hand out and just smashed face-first into the turf so his whole body would have been in, it would have been a catch?

Sorry, I gotta agree, a bogus call. Evidence is not indisputable.

[Stripes]

I don't see how there's any question. He was out. Before his left foot touched the ground, his hand was out of bounds, and he even bobbled the ball sightly when his lower body fully hit the ground. I think there was enough evidence to overturn the call correctly.

[bengalboomer7]

I'm not disputing the call, I'm disputing the process. By the rules of replay, that particular play was handled incorrectly in my opinion

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Looks like his feet was crossed up & the left foot didn't touch the ground before the hand came down OB. so I hate to say it but I think it was a good call.

The thing I was getting pissed about was the TV announcer kept saying the ball was moving on his chest ! All the replays they showed was of Chads back, not one replay we seen did you even see the ball after he brought it in !

Chris Henry should've caught his pass & this play would've been forgotten. I think that drive with the call , dropped ball, missed FG really set the tone & gave the Pitt. D a boost.

My thoughts exactly. His left foot was the key, his elbow/arm should've had nothing to do with it since the ball was against his chest and his foot was already down before his arm was (unfortunately the other foot never actually touched the ground and got caught on his heel). In college that's a TD I guess.

Kind of a "throw it up for grabs" pass too - something Palmer does too much in the red zone, how CJ caught that in the 1st place is pretty amazing, with a guy blanketing him.

[derekshank]

I think he was out... but the evidence doesn't look indisputable to me. I think the play should have stood as called on the field, either way... Regardless, we should have scored anyway, and gone up 14-0. We can't blame the refs for that.

[rizzy]

Sounds like Profootball just wants to bitch about the system and will pull anything to do so.

His hand is out of bounds BEFORE his second foot touches (which makes that foot irrelevent).

Anyway, it's over. No point in bitching about something 3 days after the fact. If someone should complain about being jobbed, it's any team that plays the Chicago White Sox!!!

Yeah it is over and we have green bay now, but I want to know what you saw to say, "His hand is out of bounds BEFORE his second foot touches (which makes that foot irrelevent)." If you had another camera angle or picture that showed his feet without an obstructing view I would like to see it.

[kingwilly]

It was called in (TD) and there was nothing "indisputible" about any of the angles or images I saw. He may not have gotten his other foot down at all but it was called a TD on the field. Either way it was a hell of a throw and catch.

Had he been called OOB or incomplete, and we'd thrown the flag, there was still nothing indisputable to reverse to a TD.

LET THE PLAY STAND!!!! oh well....

They did miss the Perry fumble. It was clearly a fumble, so they gave us one back right there.

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

It was pretty clear to me as well, it wasn't a TD.

[buck3y3d]

It was pretty clear to me as well, it wasn't a TD.

Agreed. He never touches with his second leg after he gains possesion of the ball. Like the ref said, the elbow would have been the second leg, but his hand hit out.

It should of been a TD on the next play though, come on Henry.

[rizzy]

Stop saying it was clear that it was not a touchdown, that his foot did not touch the ground etc etc.. Please show me where it is seen from any of the camera angles that shows 100% that his foot did not touch the ground.

[Jet23]

It was pretty clear to me as well, it wasn't a TD.

Agreed. He never touches with his second leg after he gains possesion of the ball. Like the ref said, the elbow would have been the second leg, but his hand hit out.

It should of been a TD on the next play though, come on Henry.

Boomer doesn't agree:

http://nfl.com/news/story/9003209

And Boomer (Esiason, not that putz from ESPN) doesn't lie...

[thefrazz]

Unfortunatly he was out of bounds.

While he was coming down his left foot hit the back of his right ankle and never touched the ground untill his right hand hit out of bounds. His elbow hit shortly after.

It was close....REAL close. However, I think Cohwer would have taken the call either way. He did the right thing buy challenging the call to slow momentum. When it showed that CJ was out of bounds...he not only slowed our momentum...he switched it all together to the Steelers. You could even point to this play as the turning point/game making play of the game. We make that TD (points at Henry) we go up 7-0 instead of 0-0. Next drive we get 3...or 7 with the momentum, then you see less of the 'Bengal killing bus'.

I hope our guys have learned their lesson, and will not repeat the mistakes! When they mature a little more, they will not let these things hold them back.

WHO-DEY

[rizzy]

Unfortunatly he was out of bounds.

While he was coming down his left foot hit the back of his right ankle and never touched the ground untill his right hand hit out of bounds. His elbow hit shortly after.

It was close....REAL close. However, I think Cohwer would have taken the call either way. He did the right thing buy challenging the call to slow momentum. When it showed that CJ was out of bounds...he not only slowed our momentum...he switched it all together to the Steelers. You could even point to this play as the turning point/game making play of the game. We make that TD (points at Henry) we go up 7-0 instead of 0-0. Next drive we get 3...or 7 with the momentum, then you see less of the 'Bengal killing bus'.

I hope our guys have learned their lesson, and will not repeat the mistakes! When they mature a little more, they will not let these things hold them back.

WHO-DEY

Once again someone has said "Unfortunatly he was out of bounds.

While he was coming down his left foot hit the back of his right ankle and never touched the ground untill his right hand hit out of bounds. His elbow hit shortly after."

WHERE DID YOU SEE THIS AT? I would love to see where it shows his hand out of bounds before his foot hits. Again someone says it but has no evidence showing it.