Bengals Cap Shape For 06 Among League's Best

[HoosierCat]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/4966370

see last paragraph...so, after we win the Super Bowl and FAs flock to our door who do we sign?

[Stripes]

Absolutely nobody.

[BengalByTheBay]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/4966370

see last paragraph...so, after we win the Super Bowl and FAs flock to our door who do we sign?

Corey Dillon

[Ox]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/4966370

see last paragraph...so, after we win the Super Bowl and FAs flock to our door who do we sign?

Corey Dillon

Now that would be a sight to see...

Leon slinking back up to Marvin, trying to be buddy buddy, acting as if he DIDN'T chuck his gear into the stands. I would love it.

[USMC203]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/4966370

see last paragraph...so, after we win the Super Bowl and FAs flock to our door who do we sign?

Corey Dillon

Now that would be a sight to see...

Leon slinking back up to Marvin, trying to be buddy buddy, acting as if he DIDN'T chuck his gear into the stands. I would love it.

They need to use some of that to sign Big Willy, Jones, "G/C" STINNNNNIE !!!!!!!! and get Chad a new contract .

[HairOnFire]

Sheesh, they list the Bengals as being in the 5th best cap shape and then immediately implore Mike Brown to adopt the spending strategy of the teams they just slagged for being in the worst shape.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Sheesh, they list the Bengals as being in the 5th best cap shape and then immediately implore Mike Brown to adopt the spending strategy of the teams they just slagged for being in the worst shape.

I have no problem with the Bengals having cap problems for a couple of years if it makes a difference.

Obviously they have a lot of high priced players to consider resigning, or in some cases, hopefully not if they can somehow replace them...Levi comes to mind (he will be pricey).

The Bengals' are one of the most profitable franchises in all of pro sports - they have no excuse for remaining that high in cap room considering their history at this point IMO. They owe us and the city more than that...as well as the players and coaches.

[alleycat]

Yes, I know it's early, but as I am a fan of watching college ball - especially with an eye on players for the NFL draft - how does our current team, the upcoming free agents, and the cap situation play out, ideally? What I'm really wondering is who do we get rid of (cutting the fat), where do we put on veteran FA's, and where do we look to the draft (my biggest question I s'pose). The goal is Super Bowl next year, but with an eye on the Dynasty that Marvin is on his way to creating.

I wonder about players like Tory James and Brian Simmons and if they are just too old and slow for our future. Sure starting to look that way.

We probably don't have the money to keep Levi, Steiny, Willie, and Justin, so given their performance and potential, who stays and who goes? I would have said a couple of weeks ago to keep Anderson at all costs because of what he means to the team (and because Levi's penalties and getting beaten on the edge are tiring me out), but his body doesn't seem to be cooperating. Is Justin worth keeping or do we say it's about time we go for a premier DE (FA or draft)?

And then there are the players who are just plain average, like KK (I had nightmares of him getting blocked out of contain on the perimeter against Jax).

Again, early, but I know some of you guys follow this stuff closely and I would appreciate some thoughts to guide my draft explorations/daydreams.

[HairOnFire]

Sheesh, they list the Bengals as being in the 5th best cap shape and then immediately implore Mike Brown to adopt the spending strategy of the teams they just slagged for being in the worst shape.

I have no problem with the Bengals having cap problems for a couple of years if it makes a difference.

Obviously they have a lot of high priced players to consider resigning, or in some cases, hopefully not if they can somehow replace them...Levi comes to mind (he will be pricey).

The Bengals' are one of the most profitable franchises in all of pro sports - they have no excuse for remaining that high in cap room considering their history at this point IMO. They owe us and the city more than that...as well as the players and coaches.

I don't think there's any chance they'll look to retain most of that cap room. The real question is if what seems to be a sizable amount of coin is actually enough to retain all of the free agents they want to keep. I'd much rather see the Bengals continue their strategy of re-signing their own important free agents, while hopefully extending core players like Chad and Carson early, rather than attracting additional help from the outside by offering the type of bloated back loaded contracts that the writer suggested Mike Brown suddenly embrace now that the team is having some onfield success.

I say don't do it. Continue building through the draft. Lock up your own talent while adding the occasional piece in free agency, but never overpay. Simply put, resist the temptation for a quick fix that demands you change your long term cap strategy for a short term gain.

Again, I found it strange that the writer would suggest the Bengals suddenly adopt the type of cap strategy that he just suggested had had crippled the long term goals of three of the AFC West teams. Why not continue building in the manner of the Patriots, Eagles, and Chargers?

[HoosierCat]

I say don't do it. Continue building through the draft. Lock up your own talent while adding the occasional piece in free agency, but never overpay. Simply put, resist the temptation for a quick fix that demands you change your long term cap strategy for a short term gain.

Again, I found it strange that the writer would suggest the Bengals suddenly adopt the type of cap strategy that he just suggested had had crippled the long term goals of three of the AFC West teams. Why not continue building in the manner of the Patriots, Eagles, and Chargers?

Even if you do, you still come up against the issue eventually. Take the Pats, who this year have the highest payroll in the league. They're something like $25 - $30 million cash-over-cap this year thanks to big deals given to current players (like Dillon, for example).

Also, circumstancs can come to make you regret resigning your own guys as much or more than signing a FA bust (ask the Jets if theyd like to take back Pennington's extension now...).

Bottom line, I woould argue that locking up your own talent and adding FAs amount to the same thing. An FA is an FA is an FA. And your own have just as much chance of going kerblooey as the ones you bring in.

For me, the issue isn't internal v. external signings, it's the nature of the signings. Keeping your own talent is well and good, but if it means you can't fill in holes elsewhere with outside FA talent, it may not be the best choice. It may...but it also may not.

[HairOnFire]

[quote post=

For me, the issue isn't internal v. external signings, it's the nature of the signings. Keeping your own talent is well and good, but if it means you can't fill in holes elsewhere with outside FA talent, it may not be the best choice. It may...but it also may not.

If all things are equal I greatly prefer retaining your own top talent since there are no questions about how well it will perform in your schemes and with the surrounding players. You're way ahead of the game in regards to chemistry, knowledge of the playbook, understanding your role and the coaches desires, etc.

[ckj414]

If all things are equal I greatly prefer retaining your own top talent since there are no questions about how well it will perform in your schemes and with the surrounding players. You're way ahead of the game in regards to chemistry, knowledge of the playbook, understanding your role and the coaches desires, etc.

But there can be questions. Some players work their tail off for the big free agent contract...and then start mailing it in once the big signing bonus has been cashed.

[alleycat]

We haven't seen that yet on this team though. Housh has come out for real this year again and so has Rudi. I think you can spot those types.

[alleycat]

I completely agree with Hair that building through the draft is the way to go, especially given ML's obvious talents at finding diamonds in later rounds (Madieu, Kiewan, Geathers, Henry, Guycheck, etc.). I just wonder about the places where we still need to get stronger if we are going to go all the way next year. I love the team this year and I think they will be really exciting and competitive, but frankly, with that defense, I don't see us going all the way. I've posted queries on a couple of different threads hoping to get some response about strategy with the upcoming draft and Free agency (we lose some, get some) because I really have fun with the draft and scouting college talent, but no one has put any ideas forward so I'm going to take a stab at it.

Defense:

Safeties - ML likes them to be interchangeable, so no primary run-stoppers without coverage skills will do.

Madieu - Rock solid, will recover from offseason shoulder surgery. Thank god we have him a while.

Other safety - we don't currently have anyone on the team who's up to snuff at this position. This should either be a first or second round pick or our highest profile FA move.

Corners

Deltha - will keep getting better, can work more on tackling.

Kiewan - will take over the starting spot (PLEASE!) from Tory, who's just too old, slow and afraid to lay the wood.

Nickel - Tory here. Greg Brooks will also challenge soon.

LB's - Assuming the 4-3 continues

Pollack - SSLB - he will perform in this position once he gets some experience. After seeing him playing DE, LB for him is preferable.

Odell - Another Rock that will be a star.

WSLB - Landon? Brian Simmons can't disappear fast enough, as far as I'm concerned. He doesn't even run hard in pursuit after the RB's blow past him. He has given up and is just cashing his checks. I think getting someone like Bobby Carpenter in the draft (2nd round?) might be a good choice. There's good talent at outside backer this year and someone should fall to us.

DLINE

LDT - B. Rob is a great addition and we should extend him for another year or two.

RDT - Thorton's time is up. Shaun Smith is flashing. I hope that Askew can turn into the player ML keeps telling us that he can be. Believe it or not, I don't think this is a high priority (FA or draft), because I think one of those two will step up all the way. However, there is good talent at this position in the draft this year.

DE's - It's hard to evaluate Geathers as a pass rusher when he's playing DT all the time. Smith is solid, but not an elite end. Let's face it, regardless of what the coaches tell us, the lack of Pass rush is a MAJOR problem. Unfortunately, but for a couple, there isn't much talent at DE this year in the draft. Should this be our big off-season free agent pick up? Perhaps we trade Smith for a high pick?

OFFENSE

Everything's in place except for the FA sitiuation coming up, so I'll only address those. Also, our Oline is not quite as good as they hype themselves to be. They don't open lanes like a lot of teams in this league.

Willie - his body is definitely not holding up, though I'd like to keep him the most because of his grit and leadership. He sets a real example.

Steiny - If he cuts down on his penalties he's very dependable and we should work hard to keep him.

Levi - lots of Penalties as well, but also seems to get beat off the edge quite a bit. I'd most like to see him go if one has to, but the age trade-off with Willie favors Levi, and is the Stacy Andrews project ready to fill in? If Kieft comes back healthy, he looks good for the future along with Kooistra as a fill in (and you'll hate me for saying it but I think Wilkerson will end up being a helluva guard).

Of course, the fly in the ointment here is that we don't have multiple early round picks (could we trade someone for that?) and unlimited cap space. So we can't fill all of our holes/needs. I'm never happy making draft decisions (I want seven first round picks), but I guess right now my thinking is this (assuming a late slot in the draft because we will go to the playoffs this year):

1st round - Safety - if one of the premier guys is available, we take him.

2nd - Linebacker - we can get a beast here.

3rd - DE

4th - RB - need someone who can move the pile on short yardage.

5th - DT

6th - O-line

7th - BPA

If we have enough cap space to sign all of our own and still be competive in the future, I would most prefer that, but assuming we don't, who do we lose? As much as I hate to say it, I see it being Willie.

It'd be great to get a premier DE in FA. Go for only one big off-season addition and keep building through the draft.

Again, my reason for writing all of this is that I'm a big follower of the draft. I'm not as familiar with the FA situation (cap, etc) as a lot of you and would like to hear others thoughts about where we should be concentrating on college players to watch this season to fill our needs.

My one darkhorse candidate in the draft is Will Allen from Tennesee. He dislocated his hip and will be heavily downgraded as an unknown, but someone could get top 15 talent in the late second or third round with him because of it.

[ckj414]

We haven't seen that yet on this team though. Housh has come out for real this year again and so has Rudi. I think you can spot those types.

True dat, alleycat. I like to think that Marvin Lewis has a good eye for whats going on in a player's head. He certainly seems to be a good motivator.

[turningpoint]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/4966370

see last paragraph...so, after we win the Super Bowl and FAs flock to our door who do we sign?

Corey Dillon

Now that would be a sight to see...

Leon slinking back up to Marvin, trying to be buddy buddy, acting as if he DIDN'T chuck his gear into the stands. I would love it.

They need to use some of that to sign Big Willy, Jones, "G/C" STINNNNNIE !!!!!!!! and get Chad a new contract .

Chad doesn;t need a new contract, he got 10.5 million 2 years ago, and is making 3 million a year until 2009.

If that's not enough that's pathetic.

Only thing i could see the bengals doing is upping his base salary to maybe 4 million a season.

[HoosierCat]

Good thoughts, alleycat. Right now, the Bengals have lots of cap room left for '05 (about $5 million at last count) which needs to be filled in. My top 2 targets would be redoing Palmer's deal to lower the future cap hit, and extending Steinbach.

Beyond that they are probably going to have to pick one between Willie and Levi. Tough choice. Willie is a great player but is old and injury-prone; Levi is younger and tougher but only average. In the end I think they go with Levi and look to bring Andrews up behind Willie.

Justin Smith is the other question mark. He is a good player but the big question is his demands. If he wants top dollar, that's hard to justify, and even an average DE (like an average LT) will draw interest in FA.

And of course there's always Chad. If he has a good year do you give him more money? Rosenhaus will be asking...

In terms of outside FAs or the draft next offseason...letting one of the tackles or Smith go would obviously impact that. SS remains a big need. A complete TE remains a need. Gotta wonder if Larson might wear out his welcome. Both weak and strong side linebacker spots have more questions than answers. Robinson and Clemons are getting old. Even WR could be in the mix if Washington continues to underwhelm and no one else steps up.

[HairOnFire]

It's way too early for me to have my draft hat on, but in regards to Bengal FA's I think re-signing Steinbach is a priority, as is Levi. I'd love to hold onto Big Willie, but assuming Andrews isn't ready to assume a starters role that's the spot I'd be willing to address with a high draft pick if his demands are too high. As for Justin, he's a personal favorite and I think it would be a huge setback to lose him under any circumstances.

[semiotter]

Yeah the Bengals will start getting alot of F/As wanting to play here. We used to couldnt even get them to want to come visit. I bet Sapp is kicking himself in the ass right now.

[AMC]

Gotta sign your own first, if your good!

Throw money at Levi and Steinbach first....