He's Got the Moobs Like Jagger

[HoosierCat]

So...Andre Smith. Among the question marks surrounding the 2012 Bengals, he ought to be one of the most intriguing. Since the Bengals declined to pick up his option, Moobs has been on a tear. He was the Bengals' most improved player last year, according to PFF, and even put on one of the top 5 most dominating RT performances last season against the Cardinals. Now the Hobsonator brings us up to speed.

Right tackle Andre Smith's offseason picked up right where the last one left off.

In the gym.

Smith continues to look in terrific shape and Monday, when the Bengals began their fifth week of conditioning he reported he's at 330 pounds with the hopes of getting to 325 at some point.

"Last year I wasn't in as good (of) shape as I could have been, but it was the smallest I'd been in the NFL so I was able to maintain it playing the game," Smith said. "This year I want to be in tip-top shape. Put together strength and wind so I can breathe."

Smith knows what happens if he has a breathtaking year. The Bengals didn't pick up a $6 million option back in August to expand his deal for two more years, so this is a contract year.

"They made the decision and I had a good season so I'm just going for the snowball effect and get even better this year," Smith said. "It's a big year for me and the Bengals organization. We've got a good schedule with a lot of tough teams and I'm just going to play and let my film speak for itself."

Save for a lapse or two during a game, Smith had a solid season in '11. Particularly considering it was the first one he was healthy enough to play one more game than he had played his first two seasons combined by starting 14 games.

"I want to be a dominant run blocker. I want to get back to what I was in college," he said. "Disciplined at all times."

He has certainly been that in the offseason, even with his wedding approaching. Smith and his fiancée teamed up and worked out together at a gym near their home in Birmingham, Ala.

"I'm happy and healthy," Smith said. "The goals are to get deep into the playoffs, not just make it, but get in and win, and personally just trying to stay healthy."

So what do they do if Smith stays on his current trajectory? What happens if he has that breathtaking year? Do two good years out of four make it worth backing the Brinks truck up to his door? What's the most they should pay? OL franchise coin is over $10 million a year. I'm not saying Smith deserves that, but even an average starting RT in FA is going to command at least $5 million/year minimum. Do you say no to Smith at $7 million? $8 million?

If you let him walk, what do you do? FA? Another 1st round pick? Collins (or Zeitler???) at RT in 2013?

My own take: if Smith does well -- and barring injury I think he will -- there's no way except for a blockbuster deal (not happening) that Smith doesn't at least test the water next March. And at that point it's a coin flip whether we get him back.

[volcom69]

Good for him, I thought he did pretty good last year! Can't wait to see him this year.

[ArmyBengal]

Hard to say, the organization tends to take care of it's own for the most part, but then again, do they trust they are going to get the guy from 2011 and beyond or the guy with floppy tits ?? It wouldn't surprise me to see them pay him or let him walk and draft a new RT in 2013. Collins is also going to be an option as well. Time will tell. Lets see what he brings this season.

[HoosierCat]

Lets see what he brings this season.

Normally I would agree, but remember we're up against the Cruel God of 2014. If the Bengals are going to give Smith a big deal, sooner is better. Maybe not right now, but if it gets to November 1 and he's looking like a stud, we might hope some urgency kicks in.

[BengalPimp]

If he plays as well or better than last year, I say pay him. First 2 years he was out of shape and injured, I would be much more confident in thinking "the light finally came on" with 2 solid seasons (last year and this) than if he had just done it in 1 (a contract year).

Also, I'd hate to see another 1st Rd pick on a RT this soon.

[BengalPimp]

He has certainly been that in the offseason, even with his wedding approaching. Smith and his fiancée teamed up and worked out together at a gym near their home in Birmingham, Ala.

Rumor has it, his Fiance's one condition was that his boobs not be bigger than her's on their wedding day......

[Stripes]

If he plays as well as I expect him to, I'd love to see him brought back. The price does figure to be steep, but if they don't do it then they'll be forced to pursue a tackle in the very early rounds of the draft. I have less faith in the current depth at tackle than many seem to.

[ArmyBengal]

Lets see what he brings this season.

Normally I would agree, but remember we're up against the Cruel God of 2014. If the Bengals are going to give Smith a big deal, sooner is better. Maybe not right now, but if it gets to November 1 and he's looking like a stud, we might hope some urgency kicks in.

That's actually exactly what I was referring to.

Don't give him anything until you see what he brings this season. If by midseason, he's the "dominant" RT everyone hoped he would be, yep get hot in getting something done. Something more than they would have paid had they picked up the option, but a little less than the higher end of things.

I'm sure one could argue that he could just as easily wait to see what the FA market brings to him, but if the offer is decent and not real late in the season, it may present a better option than risking injury and getting nothing. Anyway around, i'm happy for Big Dre and hoping he really can manage to realize his potential here as opposed to some other team.

I don't think they would spend another 1st round pick for a RT, but I could certainly see one of the two 2nd rounders to go that way should they let Dre walk away. I also think Collins would be looked at as an option, but I can't say as I would be overwhelmed with that decision either.

[princeton]

as I said at the time: Bengals screwed up by not picking up Andre's option.

[ArmyBengal]

as I said at the time: Bengals screwed up by not picking up Andre's option.

You could certainly argue that point, but I think it's also possible to argue that the organization still wasn't sold on him at that time and figured they would make sure. They probably were figuring they would have the money to get him done and would rather take the wait and see approach, as opposed to paying him and then seeing him not have the motivation to drop the weight and get better if that was truly their thought from the start.

[derekshank]

as I said at the time: Bengals screwed up by not picking up Andre's option.

The Bengals made the move on the information they had at the time. Andre had conditioning issues, work ethic issues, and injury issues. He only started 5 games in his first two seasons.

Given those concerns, it's hard to argue that he had earned the extra 2 years at more than $8 million/year (For reference, Whitworth's contract extension was for around $6 million/year... and the franchise tag is only about $2 million/year more than Andre's option).

Frankly, even though I liked what I saw from Andre last year, he still missed 2 games with injury.... and he is now openly talking about how he didn't have the conditioning he needed.

While it's a good sign that he is trying to lose the weight and be in football shape... it's still 3 years in and $21.5 million later. It disappointing to think about how much money he essentially stole from the Bengals... and I think they made the right move to decline his option. If they had agreed to it, the Bengals would be on the hook to give him another $16+ million over the next two seasons. If the Bengals want to extend him right now, they could probably get him for 3 extra years at that around that price.

Andre might have taken a big step forward last season... but he hasn't earned top tier OT money yet.

[ArmyBengal]

as I said at the time: Bengals screwed up by not picking up Andre's option.

And he is now openly talking about how he didn't have the conditioning he needed.

This is why I tend to question the talk about the light coming on for him in 2011.

While he did play better, it would now appear he could have done far more.

How does a professional athlete ignore conditioning ??

I know he's probably not the first to do that, but a guy that big just can't afford that lapse.

I still like him and hope he does well, but question his motivation.

Is it him really wanting to be dominant or get paid ??

[BengalszoneBilly]

as I said at the time: Bengals screwed up by not picking up Andre's option.

And he is now openly talking about how he didn't have the conditioning he needed.

This is why I tend to question the talk about the light coming on for him in 2011.

While he did play better, it would now appear he could have done far more.

How does a professional athlete ignore conditioning ??

I know he's probably not the first to do that, but a guy that big just can't afford that lapse.

I still like him and hope he does well, but question his motivation.

Is it him really wanting to be dominant or get paid ??

How many NFL players have you seen seem to kick it up a notch in their year/s approaching a new contract?

[UK Bengal]

Every single one of them unless they want out and tank like c****n p****r

[HoosierCat]

as I said at the time: Bengals screwed up by not picking up Andre's option.

And he is now openly talking about how he didn't have the conditioning he needed.

This is why I tend to question the talk about the light coming on for him in 2011.

While he did play better, it would now appear he could have done far more.

How does a professional athlete ignore conditioning ??

Well, because he's only now becoming a professional athlete. Professionalism is something that assumes experience. I know that my first couple years out of college, I wasn't a pro. And I became a pro in large part because of the pros around me who showed me the ropes and slapped me down when I got out of line. If money is part of the equation for Smith, that's fine. You don't earn the big bucks if you aren't a pro.

I was very much down on Smith before last season, and I still think it's fair to call him a bust. That said, he could turn it around this year. And if he does, I would hate to see everything the Bengals invested in him go to help another team.

[Kazkal]

I'd say try keep him aslong as it's not for insane amount of money...Not looking forward Free Agency next year quite few players contracts go up.

Andre might have taken a big step forward last season... but he hasn't earned top tier OT money yet.

Ya even Whitworth doesn't make top 5? 10? OT money,If he has a great season I'd be okay with giving him as much as whit.

[ArmyBengal]

as I said at the time: Bengals screwed up by not picking up Andre's option.

And he is now openly talking about how he didn't have the conditioning he needed.

This is why I tend to question the talk about the light coming on for him in 2011.

While he did play better, it would now appear he could have done far more.

How does a professional athlete ignore conditioning ??

Well, because he's only now becoming a professional athlete. Professionalism is something that assumes experience. I know that my first couple years out of college, I wasn't a pro. And I became a pro in large part because of the pros around me who showed me the ropes and slapped me down when I got out of line. If money is part of the equation for Smith, that's fine. You don't earn the big bucks if you aren't a pro.

I was very much down on Smith before last season, and I still think it's fair to call him a bust. That said, he could turn it around this year. And if he does, I would hate to see everything the Bengals invested in him go to help another team.

What i'm getting at is due to playing professional football, he is in fact a professional athlete in name.

Now whether he has conducted himself (he hasn't) in that manner (see acting professional) is debateable.

I get what you are saying here Hoosier, but if someone claims the want to be a doctor from a young age, do all the things required of being a doctor through their young life, become a doctor, and then suck at it, they are still a doctor. With that thought in mind, i'm sure Dre wanted to be a football player from a young age, did all the things required of being a football player through his young life, and became a football player. I simply don't understand how they can all of a sudden do things that could keep them from doing the thing they love (see being out of shape).

I agree though that he hasn't acted in a professional manner.

I'm also not sold he will after getting paid.

I still root for him though and hope he figures it out in stripes.

I believe he can in fact be that "dominant" RT.

[HoosierCat]

I get what you are saying here Hoosier, but if someone claims the want to be a doctor from a young age, do all the things required of being a doctor through their young life, become a doctor, and then suck at it, they are still a doctor. With that thought in mind, i'm sure Dre wanted to be a football player from a young age, did all the things required of being a football player through his young life, and became a football player. I simply don't understand how they can all of a sudden do things that could keep them from doing the thing they love (see being out of shape).

I think that's just it: I don't think that Andre all of a sudden stated doing things that could keep him from playing football. We all remember how he got is nickname "Moobs." That's where he was coming out of school. That's all he was asked to be by his coaches and peers.

One of the things that I discovered early in my post-college career was that learning new things wasn't half as important as unlearning things that I thought I knew, but weren't so. Smith's had a lot of unlearning to do. "Moobs" was just fine in college. Moobs was talented enough. He had the raw size, strength and ability to dominate, and he could play his way into shape, etc. That doesn't cut it in the NFL and it looks like he might have finally figured that out. At least I hope so. Otherwise we can pencil in OL early in the 2013 draft.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

I was very much down on Smith before last season, and I still think it's fair to call him a bust. That said, he could turn it around this year. And if he does, I would hate to see everything the Bengals invested in him go to help another team.

Agreed. The only question is, given his history of (shall we say) motivational challenges, does he still work hard after he gets that guaranteed $25M (or whatever)?

[ArmyBengal]

Smith's had a lot of unlearning to do. "Moobs" was just fine in college. Moobs was talented enough. He had the raw size, strength and ability to dominate, and he could play his way into shape, etc. That doesn't cut it in the NFL and it looks like he might have finally figured that out. At least I hope so. Otherwise we can pencil in OL early in the 2013 draft.

This is absolutely true and you see it alot and that is when college players breakout and have a monster season, it may be because they are simply better athletes playing against inferior players. Smith kind of fits that role. He was simply the bigger, stronger guy and could handle what was given to him week in and week out. Yes, he played in the SEC, but it can't be argued that he played against the best each week either. That's simply not the case in the NFL, where you face the best day in and day out.

The only question is, given his history of (shall we say) motivational challenges, does he still work hard after he gets that guaranteed $25M (or whatever)?

That's my concern as well. I want to believe he's got himself in shape and doing all these things because he truly wants to help the Bengals win and be that dominant RT he is capable of being. However, I can't say as i'm anywhere near sold that is in fact the situation.

[Sea Ray]

I hate to do this but let's face it, this is what the internet does...

I will report to you all that I "have a source" close to a starting O-lineman that says that this guy does not think Smith "is worth a s**t". This O lineman says that he's lazy and doesn't work hard enough. Now I know you folks are rolling your eyes now but please feel free to PM me and I'll give you all the specific details

The reason I'm throwing this out there is to give you an idea of how he is perceived by his teammates. My own opinion is that this rep comes from their first impressions of him and I do think it's possible for Smith to change their minds if he has a great 2012. If he comes out and improves as much in 2012 as he did in 2011(such as becoming a good run blocker and the Bengals running game benefits accordingly) then I think we can can put our first impressions of him in the rear view mirror but I thought those comments were interesting seeing as how they came to me after the season

[derekshank]

I would hate to see everything the Bengals invested in him go to help another team.

I understand your concern... but are we really concerned that another team out there is going to give Andre a huge contract?

He's a RT. The best 3 RTs in the NFL all signed contracts in the last two years. Eric Winston signed a 4 year $22 million contract this offseason. Bryan Bulaga signed a 5 year $14.75 million contract last offseason. Tyson Clabo signed a a 4 year $25 million contract last offseason.

These are the 3 best RTs in the NFL right now, they all signed contracts in the last two years for an average of of less than $5 Million/year. The idea that teams are out there waiting in the wings to give fat Andre a fat contract is laughable. Usually it is only the Bengals who take these kinds of risks.

Even if Andre Smith lives up to his potential in 2012, his resume still shows that he missed 21 games in his first 3 seasons with injuries, has documented work ethic, weight, and conditioning issues, and. He's not going to get a block-buster deal from another team. If he turns into the beast he was at Alabama this year, he will might be worth $5 million/year... but that is best case scenario. And frankly, I think Mike Brown would be willing to pay him something in that ballpark since they've already invested this much work into him.

I think he's staying with the Bengals - and I don't think there is much to worry about on that front.

[ArmyBengal]

I would hate to see everything the Bengals invested in him go to help another team.

I understand your concern... but are we really concerned that another team out there is going to give Andre a huge contract?

He's a RT. The best 3 RTs in the NFL all signed contracts in the last two years. Eric Winston signed a 4 year $22 million contract this offseason. Bryan Bulaga signed a 5 year $14.75 million contract last offseason. Tyson Clabo signed a a 4 year $25 million contract last offseason.

These are the 3 best RTs in the NFL right now, they all signed contracts in the last two years for an average of of less than $5 Million/year. The idea that teams are out there waiting in the wings to give fat Andre a fat contract is laughable. Usually it is only the Bengals who take these kinds of risks.

Even if Andre Smith lives up to his potential in 2012, his resume still shows that he missed 21 games in his first 3 seasons with injuries, has documented work ethic, weight, and conditioning issues, and. He's not going to get a block-buster deal from another team. If he turns into the beast he was at Alabama this year, he will might be worth $5 million/year... but that is best case scenario. And frankly, I think Mike Brown would be willing to pay him something in that ballpark since they've already invested this much work into him.

I think he's staying with the Bengals - and I don't think there is much to worry about on that front.

Nice breakdown Derek...

[Passepartout]

Hope that he can work hard for $25M as he seems to be really good. And wants to help as he seems to be a hard worker.

[HoosierCat]

He's a RT. The best 3 RTs in the NFL all signed contracts in the last two years. Eric Winston signed a 4 year $22 million contract this offseason. Bryan Bulaga signed a 5 year $14.75 million contract last offseason. Tyson Clabo signed a a 4 year $25 million contract last offseason.

These are the 3 best RTs in the NFL right now, they all signed contracts in the last two years for an average of of less than $5 Million/year.

I think you should check your math. Winston is making $5.5 milliion and Clabo is over $6 million.

The idea that teams are out there waiting in the wings to give fat Andre a fat contract is laughable.

Yep, just as laughable as a team dumping a big pile of money of Frostee Ruc...oh, wait.