HoosierCat Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 A few of you are working into an awesome pre-disappointment lather.Au contraire, it's no work at all. As little as a click over to the .com and the jokes write themselves. For instance, in today's piece, Geoff details the impoverished shape of our poor team.If the average cap hit in 2012 for those 14 players [the Bengals's own free agents] is in the $2 million range, that accounts for about $30 million. Throw in an estimated $7 million rookie pool that includes two first-round picks and a couple or more restricted agents at more than $1 million each and that's about $40 million. Plus, the Bengals usually keep a $4 million pad for injuries and possible extensions.And among those 14 FAs are Pacman, Nate "everyone's favorite lineman" Livings and just maybe Rome, too.Good times, good times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea Ray Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 How is it other teams manage to hold onto thier probowl talent, but we only have enough for 2nd tier or less players?The short answer is that you aren't looking very closely at the way other teams are behaving. The Steelers have been cleaning house and renegotiating contracts with anyone who will listen to make enough money to keep Wallace, and prevailing wisdom is he'll still be gone. And they'll be the exact same position next year with Antonio Brown.The Ravens had to choose between Rice and Grubbs.Houston is letting Mario Williams walk... and just cut one of the best RTs in the NFL.The Saints are losing Nicks, and potentially both Colston and Meachem in the same season.The Chiefs are willingly giving up one of the best CB combos in the NFL by not even attempting to keep Carr.According to Finnegan, the Titans didn't even attempt to bring him back.Meanwhile, teams like the Raiders, Redskins, and Bears ignore the draft and focus all their energy in free agency. The Bears are rumored to be in Mario Williams and Vincent Jackson sweepstakes. And I'm sure there will be whispers of a Super Bowl if they get those guys... just like when they traded for Cutler, and signed Peppers... and still sucked. Ask an Eagles fan how it feels to win Free Agency.In other words... there are plenty of teams losing their top talent. And there are plenty of teams that will break the bank with disappointing results. The Bengals are trying to avoid both trends."Trying", yes. Arguably Reggie Nelson is their top FA especially where need is factored in. We'll see how they do keeping guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
volcom69 Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 That's what I don't understand they all this time to sign there own guys and hardly gotten anything done. They could have signed Nugent to a long term deal instead of using the tag on him, and tagged Nelson for not that much money. They want to keep there own, but yet have not even started to talk to some and are willing to let Nelson walk. I'll wait and see what happens but not really understanding what there gameplan is here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekshank Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 "Trying", yes. Arguably Reggie Nelson is their top FA especially where need is factored in. We'll see how they do keeping guysNelson is ok... but hardly the top tier type FA that is being discussed in this thread. Specifically guys like Nicks, Grubbs, Mike Wallace, Mario Williams and Eric Winston.I like Nelson, and I'd like to see him return. But he's hardly a building block like Atkins or Dunlap. Those are the guys the Bengals are planning to give the money to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Not disappointed Mem ?? Cool, i'm not asking anyone to join in. I'm merely pointing out that being 49.9 million under the cap and then releasing a story about how they won't be able to do much except Fanene and Rucker due to the fact they are worried about something 3 years down the road that may or may not ever happen is a joke. For all the importance of getting back those "key pieces" to last seasons success, why aren't they getting something done to ensure the teams continued success ?? Are those deals done for both Fanene and Rucker ?? No, both are said to be looking forward to testing the FA market. So the team is hoping the do just that and hope they come crawling back for the low end offer they are surely offering. So much for "key pieces".I have seen the other teams letting some guys go, but they also aren't standing pat. The Chiefs letting Carr walk was only a possibility due to them ensuring they had a replacement in Rhoutt, who they signed from the Raiders. While he may not be right there with Carr talent wise, many here would have been more than happy to see Rhoutt in our secondary. We had more of a need than KC, but here we are.The Texans are said to be clearing space in attempts to bring Mario Williams back.The Saints are working hard to get Colston in on a new deal before FA and they won't look at Meachem as a loss.The Steelers have had this coming for quite sometime, but that also tends to happen to teams that win multiple Super Bowls in a handful of seasons and are stacked full of talent. And if some team does grab Wallace, they now have two first round picks and are looking at a draft chock full of #2 WR talent with speed.I'm not all doom and gloom here with this, just irritated with the story about how they are so hamstrung.I'm also not asking for them to get Nicks or Williams either. I was at one time, but gave up on that a while ago. Grubbs will still cost more, but it's not out of the question and not Nicks type money. Meachem ?? Bush ?? Both would also help this team moving forward in the draft.Maybe they get this done and the story is crap. If that's the case, I will be very happy.I'm still very much looking forward to the draft... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 I am waiting to see what actually happens. Hobson and reedy write those same stories every year, and most years the bengals are active in free agency anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 I mean, in fairness, they signed three starters last year and two pretty valuble backups. And that was in a year where the accelerated time to make decisions I thought would work against them. As for the "big splash" signings that has an uneven nfl track record. See, for instance, philly last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 I am waiting to see what actually happens. Hobson and reedy write those same stories every year, and most years the bengals are active in free agency anyway.Yeah, i'm hoping all my ranting was for not.It's been one of those days for like 2 weeks now and it's bleeding onto the board.Hoping for the best... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea Ray Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 "Trying", yes. Arguably Reggie Nelson is their top FA especially where need is factored in. We'll see how they do keeping guysNelson is ok... but hardly the top tier type FA that is being discussed in this thread. Specifically guys like Nicks, Grubbs, Mike Wallace, Mario Williams and Eric Winston.I like Nelson, and I'd like to see him return. But he's hardly a building block like Atkins or Dunlap. Those are the guys the Bengals are planning to give the money to.Your thoughts centered on keeping their existing FAs and in that sense he is top tier. If they lose him he'll have to be replaced Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 The Steelers have had this coming for quite sometime, but that also tends to happen to teams that win multiple Super Bowls in a handful of seasons and are stacked full of talent. I think it's worth adding that this is precisely the opposite situation that the Bengals are in. While the Steelers have been staring at a looming cap wall for a couple years now, the Bengals' horizon is remarkably uncluttered.Just looking ahead to next year, 2013, right now the Bengals only have about 20 guys under contract, and half of those are minimum-wage types. For 2014, the year that seems to be striking so much fear into the hearts of the FO, just 10 players are under contract. Add in that the new TV money hits that year and the cap is expected to rise sharply (I've seen estimates as high as $165 million) and the Bengals' current free cap space for 2014 is someplace north of $100 million.2015? They have precisely two players, Kyle Cook and Leon Hall, in the final year of their deals under contract for that year.So while I agree that it's smart to budget for the future costs of key young guys like Dunlap, Atkins, Green and Dalton, there's no reason to think it's going to be a problem, at least from a cap perspective. Yes, the Bengals could create problems down the road if they went nuts and signed Nicks, Wallace, Grubbs and Mario Williams to $250 million worth of contracts this week, but no one is calling for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekshank Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 I think the thing that getting lost here is that the Bengals have been very active in free agency in recent years. And Mike Brown carried over the unused cap space from last season... a number that was essentially Carson Palmer's salary. So the Bengals spent the vast majority of their allowance last year, and I expect them to do so again.If guys like Bush and Cotchery are all you're asking for, be prepared to be dazzled. The Bengals have always gone after these types of free agents. Last year, in addition to bringing back a ton of their own guys, they also brought in Gradkowski, Clements, Lawson, Howard, Scaife... and traded for Jennings and Mays (after losing out on Whitner).The year before they went and got Antonio Bryant, T.O., Pacman, Gibril Wilson, Nugent, and traded for Reggie Nelson. These are the same types of moves I expect from them again this year. So if the complaint is that they won't go get those types of guys, I think the hand-wringing is for nothing. Just be patient.But the complaint I'm hearing is that the Bengals aren't planning on going after a guy like Nicks. A guy who has said he wants to be the highest paid OG in history. These are signings that I don't expect and won't endorse. Don't tell me about the $50 million in cap space. The Bengals have at least 23 roster spots to fill. That works out to just over $2 million per contract. Nelson, Fanene, and Sims all feel they deserve significant increases in salary. So if the Bengals bring back their own guys at significant salary increases, or simply replace them with similarly priced talent, there simply isn't much left over to give a $10+ million/year contract to a guy like Nicks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekshank Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 http://blogs.nfl.com/2012/03/13/salary-cap-numbers-for-all-32-nfl-teams/Looks like the updated cap number for the Bengals is $39 million. Tampa Bay and Denver both are in the $40s... so the Bengals currently rank 3rd in cap space.I don't think that includes the $1.6 million bump (teams can apply it this year or next). Not sure where the $10 million went. I doubt Pressley's contract was very much. The other three signings were at league minimum which should have added up to about $1.8 million. Perhaps the are including Nugent's franchise tag... but that's only $2.6 million. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShulaSteakhouse Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 There's really no excuse for NOT signing the top FA at a particular position this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Can we quit pretending some of these players can't or won't be replaced with players we have been bringing along.I'm not a fan of Otis Hudson and never have been, but others seem enamored. With that thought in mind, he could certainly be looked at as being capable of filling McGlynn's backup spot right ?? That's just an example. Fill his spot on the practice squad ?? How about one of those 2 fifth rounders we have ??Then there are other players that won't be back anyway around and there are plans to replace them via the draft.Some of our FA just flat suck or are broke. Again, I look to the late rounds for those replacements. I've also said many times the Bengals won't be making Nicks the highest paid Guard in the NFL under any circumstances. Grubbs should still be doable and think a line with him and our first round pick at Guard would be taking care of a priority of protecting Dalton.Whitworth, Grubbs, Cook, DeCastro, SmithYes please... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekshank Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Grubbs is looking for a $40 million deal. That's up with Mankins salary... and while Grubbs is good, he's not elite like Nicks, Mankins... or Yanda for that matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Scratch Coleston. 5 years, $40 million from the Saints. Doesn't appear likely they will manage to sign Nicks as well before 4 eastern, but apparently he foes into FA with a "respectable" offer from NO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 And there's Colston getting his deal done. 40 million with 20 guaranteed ?? Wow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Also, I think it says a lot when players are willing to restructure their contracts.Both Will Smith and Jahri Evans restructured their deals.With all of that and PRIOR to the Colston deal, the Saints weren't even 10 million under the cap.Hmmm... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekshank Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Does that include Brees and his current $14.4 million cap hit? I imagine that number will come down drastically with a long term deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Not sure, I was waiting to see what the final numbers were and how it affected them.It should be interesting to see how they made that happen... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
volcom69 Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Ok now we sit and wait wonder if they will do something tonight or I guess we will be with the leftovers. How they could not look at Mario Williams is beyond me! A lot of these guys are young players good guys to build a team around just like the draft, why so afraid to take a chance is beyond me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Mario Williams will end up at around 15 million per year. Won't happen.On a side note, the Bears traded their 3rd rounder this draft and next to Miami for Brandon Marshall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
volcom69 Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Garçon is going to Washington looks like all the decent wr are getting looks everywhere bengals better hurry if they want to sign a decent wideout.I know they wouldn't sign Williams but damn give the guy a look he is young and a game changer just what this team needs in free agency Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 I was never really thrilled with Garcon and Meachem is still one WR I would like them to bring in.That being said, other teams are also looking his way and that means the Bengals will probably take the wait and see approach.For what it's worth, the official site says they will be contacting dozens of free agents.Headed to class, catch up later... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
volcom69 Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Rucker looks to be visiting other teams according to reedy, so guess they couldn't get a deal done yet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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