Overall Draft Grade

[Stripes]

I will put $10,000 on Chad staying with the team this year.

I won't, but the more convinced everyone becomes of his departure the more terrified I become he'll stay.

[BengalszoneBilly]

I will put $10,000 on Chad staying with the team this year.

I will put $10,000 on Chad staying with the team this year.

I won't, but the more convinced everyone becomes of his departure the more terrified I become he'll stay.

My gut feeling is he'll still be wearing stripes this year.

[HoosierCat]

IMHO, the longer the lockout drags on, the better the chance that Chad stays. Teams can't sign draft picks, so if this mess drags on into the late summer and early fall before being resolved, then we're looking at highly abbreviated camps and preseason. Imagine that a deal is finally struck mid-September and the season starts first weekend in October. Anyone here think that the front office can get a deal done with the No. 4 overall in 2 weeks? History says: fat chance. So they hang on to Chad as insurance in case they don't have time to get Green in and up to speed.

OTOH, if the Eighth Circuit ends the lockout next week and the teams can get the offseason program going still basically on time, I look for them to try and deal Chad, maybe to a team like the Pats with whom they have a history and which always has plenty of excess picks to toss around. I wouldn't expect much but I think they could get something.

[derekshank]

A final exam is worth more than a standard homework assignment. Likewise, counting off significant points because of the 6th and 7th round picks are weighing those picks far too heavily.

I always like to consult the draft pick value chart to determine how heavily each individual pick should go toward my overall grade. So... here goes:

Pick #4: A.J. Green. Grade: A

The only reason I don't give this an A+ is because I'm trying not to be a homer (although my analysis will give me away). WR was a huge need and Cincy nabbed the best offensive player in this draft... allowing them to say goodbye to Chad. Addition by subtraction AND a superstar in the making. Win/Win. 96% = 1728pts.

Pick #35: Andy Dalton. Grade: B-

I like Dalton a lot... so it's not his fault the grade isn't higher. I simply wouldn't have taken a QB in the 2nd round. That said, it's the guy Gruden loves, he's got good intangibles, will likely be ready to start sooner than later... and most importantly allows all of us scorned girlfriends to get on with life. So, I can't complain much. 83% = 456.5pts.

Pick #66: Dontay Moch. Grade: B-

I'm not going to knock the pick much, because the guy clearly is a freak. I'm just not sure where he fits in the current scheme. I feel like we already have a guy just like this in MJ (and he doesn't see the field all that often). With every passing draft, I get a little more suspicious that Zimmer wants to run the 3-4... because we keep taking all sorts of front-7 tweeners (Dunlap, Atkins, MJ, Moch). 83% = 215.8pts

Pick #101: Clint Boling. Grade: A+

I love this pick. I don't even feel a need to talk much about it. The Bengals were very lucky a guy this good fell to them in the 4th round. Because of his versatility, he can man the LG spot... but also be an upgrade in passblocking at RT if A.Smith continues to bust. A huge value pick who should contribute immediately. Not too shabby 100+ picks into the draft. 100% = 96pts.

Pick #134: Robert Sands. Grade: A-

Another very good pick. If I were running the war room, my philosophy from the 5th round on would be to take guys who will be good depth and can contribute immediately on STs. Sands certainly meets that description. Plus, he's big, fast, and has a reputation as an enforcer. Zimmer has said that Roy Williams is a perfect fit for his scheme... so Sands should fit in well too. 93% = 36.3pts

Pick #167: Ryan Whalen. Grade: C+

My initial reaction on this was that it was a wasted pick like Briscoe last year. But the WR cupboards were full last year. What a difference a year makes... WR is shallow now. Unlike Briscoe, I expect Whalen to earn a spot on the roster. Better yet... this doesn't have the familiar (Mike Brown) feel of a raw but talented project. I'm giving Gruden credit for this pick. And if I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt that Dalton is a good fit in his WCO, why not Whalen? I'm not pumped about the pick... but I'm not pissed anymore either. 79% = 20.2pts

Pick #207: Korey Lindsey. Grade: B+

I like this pick for the same reason I like the Sands pick. He has all the tools to succeed, should provide good depth in a pinch, and ought to contribute on STs. In a league that is becoming more and more pass happy, I like the risk/reward factor here. You can never have too many talented CBs... and the Bengals CB depth is beginning to look downright nasty. 89% = 8.5pts

Pick #246: Jay Finley. Grade: D

Meh. That's all I got. Meh. Is he going to be the 3rd down RB to replace Leonard? Maybe. Whatever. Meh. There were a couple picks that would have made me reasonably more happy here... but when you're getting dangerously close to Mr. Irrelevant - it's hard to muster much outrage. 66% = 0.6pts.

Total Grade: 2,561.9pts out of a possible 2781.1pts = 92%. Solid A- Grade.

[TJJackson]

I will put $10,000 on Chad staying with the team this year.

Display Name History For: JOB
From 	        To 	Change Date
Whur CHad At? 	JOB 	Today, 01:13 PM

With Chad soon to leave the team, it seems entirely appropo' for WhurChadAt to assume the name of the once happy and rich then long suffering Job from the Old Testament

WCA, Chad Johnson was a truly great player right up til the 2005 playoff game. Got to give him that. But starting with that game, even though the name change had not yet been legally made, he was Ochocinco, and he sucked.

[derekshank]

Anyone here think that the front office can get a deal done with the No. 4 overall in 2 weeks? History says: fat chance. So they hang on to Chad as insurance in case they don't have time to get Green in and up to speed.

The rookie wage scale is going to end rookie holdouts as we know them. The owners want the payscale... the players want it even more.

Getting Green up to speed won't be any different than any of the other players. Every WR on the team is learning the new system. So, Chad doesn't offer much in the way as "insurance" since A.J. Green currently has Gruden's playbook. And I'll bet dollars to doughnuts Chad doesn't have one... and wouldn't so much as glance at it if he did.

Most importantly, Chad and Marvin can't unscramble these eggs. That relationship is over. Chad is done as a Bengal.

[HoosierCat]

Nice analysis, shanks. Well done.

[kingwilly]

And then there is Army, who makes it somehow all okay. Thanks again for your work, Army.

As usual Mark did a terrific job in organizing and running our yearly draft threads. You gotta go with a military guy to get results like that.

A big salute to ArmyBengal for another mission completed!

Hoo-Ra!

My grade, not that anyone cares.

r1 - A

Serious talent, position of need, addition by subtraction...etc. Great pick. Would not have been upset with Peterson or Dareus, either.

r-2 - B-

Still not sold. Guy is just average. Bit of a reach, in a draft that was weak on QB's but lots of teams had the need. Earlier, I called it a "desperation" pick but softened it to an "insurance" pick.

r-3 - B

Bit of a reach for a very good athlete. What he can do that MJ can't is run in coverage AND rush the passer. He is a mismatch in a division filled with mismatches (Ray Rice, Hillis, TE's...)

r-4 - A

Good pick, lots of versatility and plenty of upside. No complaints. High marks for not reaching for a RB.

r-5 - B

No complaints. Big fast guy. Think a faster Corey Lynch who hits like Williams. What's not to like.

r-6 - D-

Wasted selection. There were several Oline/Dline players hanging around. Don't need another WR, despite what the roster looks like. Would be better to snag a vet to come in a give Green some guidance (still could). Overall, a wastd pick.

r7a - C

r7b - C

Can't complain but can't praise. Talented guys but really not enamored.

Overall: Solid B.

I agree with much of the praise here, save for the Dalton jock-riding going on. Time will tell, and willing to give Dalton a chance. He's a Bengal now (sort of) so we'll ride our sweet ginger to the promise land.

[BengalszoneBilly]

I will put $10,000 on Chad staying with the team this year.

Display Name History For: JOB
From 	        To 	Change Date
Whur CHad At? 	JOB 	Today, 01:13 PM

I wouldn't blame PalmerForPresident for changing his name either. FYI for all members... DO NOT tie your identity to any player, because you'll never know when things will go south for them, and in turn, you.

[James_Brooks21]

A final exam is worth more than a standard homework assignment. Likewise, counting off significant points because of the 6th and 7th round picks are weighing those picks far too heavily.

Pick #35: Andy Dalton. Grade: B-

I like Dalton a lot... so it's not his fault the grade isn't higher. I simply wouldn't have taken a QB in the 2nd round. That said, it's the guy Gruden loves, he's got good intangibles, will likely be ready to start sooner than later... and most importantly allows all of us scorned girlfriends to get on with life. So, I can't complain much. 83% = 456.5pts.

Good examination on everything except Andy Dalton, if you wouldn't have taken a quarterback in the second round than when would you? Please let me know when and who the hell you had in mind? Please don't say a free agent either because with this collective bargaining agreement stuff going on, it handcuffs teams on what they can do this year. This is the wrong year to wait on a free agency to fill a spot unless the free agent came from your organization like Ced Benson. The best free agent quarterback the media is hyping this year has for his career 11TD's and 14INT (Kevin Kolb). The Bengals had in my opinion already waited to long to get some real good competition in here at that position. Excellent pick Bengals, they didn't over rehttp://forums.bengalszone.com/index.php?app=forums&module=post&section=post&do=edit_post&f=2&t=22790&p=350422&st=20act in the first round and they didn't wait until free agency which is far from a sure thing. Some dumb team is going to sell the farm for the concussed Kevin Kolb thanks goodness it's not us.

[princeton]

I think that the Bengals got a lot of guys that can step right in and be decent, which was really needed for this roster. so I give them a B-

goes to an A+ if Andy Dalton shows that he's more Ken Anderson than Jon Kitna.

[derekshank]

Good examination on everything except Andy Dalton, if you wouldn't have taken a quarterback in the second round than when would you? Please let me know when and who the hell you had in mind?

I've made my opinion on this well known, but I'll repeat it for you.

The bust rate for QBs in the mid 1st round is remarkable. The 2nd round is even worse. The only successful 2nd rounder I can think of is Drew Brees... and him, only after the Chargers had drafted his replacement.

I just think that with as many teams that needed a QB, if a guy fell to the 2nd round, it was because he wasn't really starter material. And if you're going to draft a back-up... I'd prefer McElroy in the 6th.

That said, Gruden was gushing about Dalton from the get-go... so while I think it's risky, it makes sense to give the OC the QB he wants. That's why I'm reasonably happy with the pick, despite it going against my instincts.

[Stripes]

Nice analysis, shanks. Well done.

seconded, great post

[princeton]

The only successful 2nd rounder I can think of is Drew Brees...

Boomer was a good 'un.

[TJJackson]

After further consideration

I still hate the WR in 6 and the running back at 7b

and

I still am not a big fan of Green. I hope he changes my mind, and will be quite happy to be wrong about him.

and

I still think they had a HUGE miss (one that no one else really seems to concerned about) with not drafting a K, since this year (unlike previous years) they CANNOT sign UDCFAs right after the draft. This miss factors heavily in my grade.

but

I have warmed considerably to the CB in 7a due to the fact that he was unfairly labeled as a health risk. I really hate health risks.

and

I have warmed somewhat to the conversion project at 3, tho I still maintain that if you want a linebacker, you draft a linebacker; and I wonder how they will work him in. Heavy special teams and obvious passing downs, I would hope.

so

I am raising my grade to a C+ that dropped to a C with the selections at 6 and 7b. You just cant waste opportunities to improve your roster, no matter how late the selections are

[jbengals1]

FYI for all members... DO NOT tie your identity to any player, because you'll never know when things will go south for them

What About Naming There Kids CARSON Like I Did ???? Can I Change His Name ???? What was i Smoking That Day, Instead Of Carson Palmer my son is Carson Parker and yes @ 6yrs Old has Quite A good Throwing arm

[TJJackson]

What About Naming There Kids CARSON Like I Did ???? Can I Change His Name ????

I'm really - really - sorry to hear you did that, but what the original post was about was your board identity, not your (or your children's) actual names

[HoosierCat]

The rookie wage scale is going to end rookie holdouts as we know them. The owners want the payscale... the players want it even more.

I agree that everyone (except for the agents) wants it, but whether it happens remains to be seen. And I have no idea what its structure might look like. What about escalators, incentives and if teams want to put in player-specific clauses, like the weight clauses in Smith's deal? It's that, not total money, that the Bengals FO loves to dicker over.

Finally, even if they go with a rookie salary scale, there's no guarantee it ends up in place for this year. So far, the owners' strategy doesn't seem to be working very well. We could easily end up playing this year under 2010 rules while the two sides continue to argue.

[BengalszoneBilly]

FYI for all members... DO NOT tie your identity to any player, because you'll never know when things will go south for them

What About Naming There Kids CARSON Like I Did ???? Can I Change His Name ???? What was i Smoking That Day, Instead Of Carson Palmer my son is Carson Parker and yes @ 6yrs Old has Quite A good Throwing arm

My brother named his cat "Palmer". It's been seeing a lot of shoe leather lately.

[Kazkal]

The rookie wage scale is going to end rookie holdouts as we know them. The owners want the payscale... the players want it even more.

I agree that everyone (except for the agents) wants it, but whether it happens remains to be seen. And I have no idea what its structure might look like. What about escalators, incentives and if teams want to put in player-specific clauses, like the weight clauses in Smith's deal? It's that, not total money, that the Bengals FO loves to dicker over.

Finally, even if they go with a rookie salary scale, there's no guarantee it ends up in place for this year. So far, the owners' strategy doesn't seem to be working very well. We could easily end up playing this year under 2010 rules while the two sides continue to argue.

I didn't like sound of the Legnth of rookie contracts from what was reported on it so far..

4 years for 1st rounders

3 years for everyone else

Bengals don't seem to resign players early so I could see shorter contracts being bad.

[TJJackson]

I'm weighing the decision to name a cat versus the decision to name a son

Hmm

[Kazkal]

and wouldn't so much as glance at it if he did.

Chad would probably post it on his twitter.

r-3 - B

Bit of a reach for a very good athlete. What he can do that MJ can't is run in coverage AND rush the passer. He is a mismatch in a division filled with mismatches (Ray Rice, Hillis, TE's...)

I dunno when given chance I was impressed with MJ in coverage,I think this pick simply has do with coaches like idea of MJ and Dunlap being on field at same time as Ends then throwing Moch in as the wildcard...With Dunlap,MJ,Geno and Moch on the field at the same time that can be some scary passrush.

The bust rate for QBs in the mid 1st round is remarkable. The 2nd round is even worse. The only successful 2nd rounder I can think of is Drew Brees... and him, only after the Chargers had drafted his replacement.

Well Dalton was almost a 1st rounder since Bengals did attempt trade up for him....I get what yer saying though 2nd-3rd QB's I can recall as of late mainly have been busts...

goes to an A+ if Andy Dalton shows that he's more Ken Anderson than Jon Kitna.

I'd be happy with a Kitna Truthfully if our Defense returns to top 10 unit.

[derekshank]

Do you guys ever read through previous "Draft Grades" threads?

Interesting and fun. Reading draft reactions from the past based on what we know now.

My love for Dunlap and Shipley has been vindicated. My dislike of MJ and Bernard Scott has shown to be uninformed... and my love for Andre Smith appears moronic.

Also funny to see how almost nobody liked the Andrew Whitworth pick back in the day. Looking forward to reading this thread a year from now.

[ArmyBengal]

And then there is Army, who makes it somehow all okay. Thanks again for your work, Army.

As usual Mark did a terrific job in organizing and running our yearly draft threads. You gotta go with a military guy to get results like that.

A big salute to ArmyBengal for another mission completed!

Thanks guys. It's a well known fact I love doing that on the board here. I know not everyone can watch it or have the ability to check what's going on except for coming here, so it's cool. That and the conversations are usually pretty good when it's set up this way. It's nice, neat, and user friendly.

I'm feeling a little better today, but must admit I wasn't sure I was going to make it yesterday.

I felt like a whole bucket of sh*t...

Thanks again.

[ArmyBengal]

A final exam is worth more than a standard homework assignment. Likewise, counting off significant points because of the 6th and 7th round picks are weighing those picks far too heavily.

I always like to consult the draft pick value chart to determine how heavily each individual pick should go toward my overall grade. So... here goes:

Pick #4: A.J. Green. Grade: A

The only reason I don't give this an A+ is because I'm trying not to be a homer (although my analysis will give me away). WR was a huge need and Cincy nabbed the best offensive player in this draft... allowing them to say goodbye to Chad. Addition by subtraction AND a superstar in the making. Win/Win. 96% = 1728pts.

Pick #35: Andy Dalton. Grade: B-

I like Dalton a lot... so it's not his fault the grade isn't higher. I simply wouldn't have taken a QB in the 2nd round. That said, it's the guy Gruden loves, he's got good intangibles, will likely be ready to start sooner than later... and most importantly allows all of us scorned girlfriends to get on with life. So, I can't complain much. 83% = 456.5pts.

Pick #66: Dontay Moch. Grade: B-

I'm not going to knock the pick much, because the guy clearly is a freak. I'm just not sure where he fits in the current scheme. I feel like we already have a guy just like this in MJ (and he doesn't see the field all that often). With every passing draft, I get a little more suspicious that Zimmer wants to run the 3-4... because we keep taking all sorts of front-7 tweeners (Dunlap, Atkins, MJ, Moch). 83% = 215.8pts

Pick #101: Clint Boling. Grade: A+

I love this pick. I don't even feel a need to talk much about it. The Bengals were very lucky a guy this good fell to them in the 4th round. Because of his versatility, he can man the LG spot... but also be an upgrade in passblocking at RT if A.Smith continues to bust. A huge value pick who should contribute immediately. Not too shabby 100+ picks into the draft. 100% = 96pts.

Pick #134: Robert Sands. Grade: A-

Another very good pick. If I were running the war room, my philosophy from the 5th round on would be to take guys who will be good depth and can contribute immediately on STs. Sands certainly meets that description. Plus, he's big, fast, and has a reputation as an enforcer. Zimmer has said that Roy Williams is a perfect fit for his scheme... so Sands should fit in well too. 93% = 36.3pts

Pick #167: Ryan Whalen. Grade: C+

My initial reaction on this was that it was a wasted pick like Briscoe last year. But the WR cupboards were full last year. What a difference a year makes... WR is shallow now. Unlike Briscoe, I expect Whalen to earn a spot on the roster. Better yet... this doesn't have the familiar (Mike Brown) feel of a raw but talented project. I'm giving Gruden credit for this pick. And if I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt that Dalton is a good fit in his WCO, why not Whalen? I'm not pumped about the pick... but I'm not pissed anymore either. 79% = 20.2pts

Pick #207: Korey Lindsey. Grade: B+

I like this pick for the same reason I like the Sands pick. He has all the tools to succeed, should provide good depth in a pinch, and ought to contribute on STs. In a league that is becoming more and more pass happy, I like the risk/reward factor here. You can never have too many talented CBs... and the Bengals CB depth is beginning to look downright nasty. 89% = 8.5pts

Pick #246: Jay Finley. Grade: D

Meh. That's all I got. Meh. Is he going to be the 3rd down RB to replace Leonard? Maybe. Whatever. Meh. There were a couple picks that would have made me reasonably more happy here... but when you're getting dangerously close to Mr. Irrelevant - it's hard to muster much outrage. 66% = 0.6pts.

Total Grade: 2,561.9pts out of a possible 2781.1pts = 92%. Solid A- Grade.

Thanks for saving me time Derek.

I'll just say, I'm not as sold on those late round picks, but they aren't enough to bring down what they were capable of doing in the first 5 rounds.