Bengals Vs Falcons

[volcom69]

How these coaches aren't getting more flack for this absolute piece of sh*t product is beyond me.

How about being flagged TWICE for 12 men on the field in the same game? If you can't count, how can you be expected to run an NFL team?

How about the complete failure to prepare your team for a game when you have two weeks to do so ??

How about that failure being so bad, your players are now making comments to the fact ??

Well, before we completely bury the coaching staff -- and I'm not saying they don't deserve a dirt nap (employment wise, not really, of course) -- let me echo again something brought up in the gameday thread (by volcom I think but feel free to scroll through and check) that at some point you have to expect the players to, y'know, be the pros they are paid to be.

The coaches aren't the only ones who know who is supposed to be on the field for what plays.

The coaches aren't out there missing tackles, dropping balls, making poor throws, fumbling footballs, missing blocks, etc.

I mean, we've seen week after week of this. I'm not sure how much more "coaching" can do. At a certain point, you either suck it up and do your job...or you cash your check and wait for the season to end.

Yep i agree with this!! I agree that the coaches need to improve big time, but at some point the players need to just play. So far from what i have seen is alot of thinking and not enough doing.

Week in and week out its always somthing differnt, they need to learn to play a complete game. This is the same team as last year so we all know that this team can win. Right now they have no confidence, there is no spark its like there just DEAD! Hell that first half was like they were sleep walking, second half they came out and actully looked like they had confindence, and it looked like they wanted to win.

They need to wake up in the first half, and just go out and have fun and play dont think. Its like this team is scared to be good, its time they actully believe in themselves, and start playing like a team!!!

[ArmyBengal]

How these coaches aren't getting more flack for this absolute piece of sh*t product is beyond me.

How about being flagged TWICE for 12 men on the field in the same game? If you can't count, how can you be expected to run an NFL team?

How about the complete failure to prepare your team for a game when you have two weeks to do so ??

How about that failure being so bad, your players are now making comments to the fact ??

Well, before we completely bury the coaching staff -- and I'm not saying they don't deserve a dirt nap (employment wise, not really, of course) -- let me echo again something brought up in the gameday thread (by volcom I think but feel free to scroll through and check) that at some point you have to expect the players to, y'know, be the pros they are paid to be.

The coaches aren't the only ones who know who is supposed to be on the field for what plays.

The coaches aren't out there missing tackles, dropping balls, making poor throws, fumbling footballs, missing blocks, etc.

I mean, we've seen week after week of this. I'm not sure how much more "coaching" can do. At a certain point, you either suck it up and do your job...or you cash your check and wait for the season to end.

While I agree with that, I think more importantly it comes down to who keeps the players accountable? Coaching is about preparation and more importantly leadership and direction. A team full of 25 year old athletes needs good ones.

It's one big glass filled hand of a circle jerk. It's the players fault, but it's not the players fault. It's the coaches fault, but it's not the coaches fault. The players are now saying they aren't focused and they don't don't execute as well as they should. That's on the coaches. There is severe miscommunication between the players on the field and they appear to continue making the same boneheaded mistakes during the games.

Chad already said they ran the same exact gameplan in the second half as they did in the first, so whoever is saying Brat should get credit for making adjustments at halftime, just stop. That's on both the players and coaches. They players need to execute when they are suppose to and the coaches should be trying to make any and all adjustments they can when facing the hole they were headed in at half.

I'm with Hokie in there being absolutely NO accountability whatsoever from top to bottom.

It's been a while since I've seen this team fail to this degree. It shouldn't be happening.

However, I assume the status quo will be maintained...

[cincyhokie]

How these coaches aren't getting more flack for this absolute piece of sh*t product is beyond me.

How about being flagged TWICE for 12 men on the field in the same game? If you can't count, how can you be expected to run an NFL team?

How about the complete failure to prepare your team for a game when you have two weeks to do so ??

How about that failure being so bad, your players are now making comments to the fact ??

Well, before we completely bury the coaching staff -- and I'm not saying they don't deserve a dirt nap (employment wise, not really, of course) -- let me echo again something brought up in the gameday thread (by volcom I think but feel free to scroll through and check) that at some point you have to expect the players to, y'know, be the pros they are paid to be.

The coaches aren't the only ones who know who is supposed to be on the field for what plays.

The coaches aren't out there missing tackles, dropping balls, making poor throws, fumbling footballs, missing blocks, etc.

I mean, we've seen week after week of this. I'm not sure how much more "coaching" can do. At a certain point, you either suck it up and do your job...or you cash your check and wait for the season to end.

Yep i agree with this!! I agree that the coaches need to improve big time, but at some point the players need to just play. So far from what i have seen is alot of thinking and not enough doing.

Week in and week out its always somthing differnt, they need to learn to play a complete game. This is the same team as last year so we all know that this team can win. Right now they have no confidence, there is no spark its like there just DEAD! Hell that first half was like they were sleep walking, second half they came out and actully looked like they had confindence, and it looked like they wanted to win.

They need to wake up in the first half, and just go out and have fun and play dont think. Its like this team is scared to be good, its time they actully believe in themselves, and start playing like a team!!!

And it's up to the coaching staff to provide an atmosphere that is conducive to winning. It's also up to the coaching staff to put the players in position to win.

Maybe I spent too much time in the Army, but without a firm system of accountability, things go to hell. A bunch of players that are talented without a concerted direction. That's a coach's job and responsibility.

[HoosierCat]

It's one big glass filled hand of a circle jerk. It's the players fault, but it's not the players fault. It's the coaches fault, but it's not the coaches fault.

I hear you. All I am saying is let's not pretend that all the problems are off the field. If the players don't get their crap together, we can replace Marvin with Jesus and it won't matter.

You tell me: are the Pittsburgh Steelers a good team because Mike Tomlin is the best coach evah...or because they are a bunch of guys who just won't quit?

[wpeldios]

When they huddled and brat called the plays we had a failure wrapped in a crispy failure tortilla with failure sauce on the side.

I think that's my new sig...

Yeah if you couldnt figure out the people I watched the game with had mexican today.

[HoosierCat]

It was the "crispy" that did it for me. Nice touch.

[cincyhokie]

It's one big glass filled hand of a circle jerk. It's the players fault, but it's not the players fault. It's the coaches fault, but it's not the coaches fault.

I hear you. All I am saying is let's not pretend that all the problems are off the field. If the players don't get their crap together, we can replace Marvin with Jesus and it won't matter.

You tell me: are the Pittsburgh Steelers a good team because Mike Tomlin is the best coach evah...or because they are a bunch of guys who just won't quit?

The Steelers are a good team because they have an organization with an identity, plan, and purpose. With that they hire coaches who fit that plan. Those coaches, and scouts, draft players who fit the system. The same coaches are the ones who probably have alot of influence in who gets drafted, signed, or cut.

All I am saying is that accountability for this team has to start somewhere. I don't trust MB with it.

As much as I can't stand Rex Ryan, that's a head coach that has grabbed his team and taken control over it. Good coaches and leaders take responsibility, put their players in position to win, and lead. Mediocre coaches complain about the players they have and want "better" players to coach so they can look and feel better about being coaches.

[cincyhokie]

It's one big glass filled hand of a circle jerk. It's the players fault, but it's not the players fault. It's the coaches fault, but it's not the coaches fault.

I hear you. All I am saying is let's not pretend that all the problems are off the field. If the players don't get their crap together, we can replace Marvin with Jesus and it won't matter.

You tell me: are the Pittsburgh Steelers a good team because Mike Tomlin is the best coach evah...or because they are a bunch of guys who just won't quit?

We had some "crap" players in that 2002 2-14 season and Marvin did pretty well in 2003 with those same players.

[ArmyBengal]

It's one big glass filled hand of a circle jerk. It's the players fault, but it's not the players fault. It's the coaches fault, but it's not the coaches fault.

I hear you. All I am saying is let's not pretend that all the problems are off the field. If the players don't get their crap together, we can replace Marvin with Jesus and it won't matter.

You tell me: are the Pittsburgh Steelers a good team because Mike Tomlin is the best coach evah...or because they are a bunch of guys who just won't quit?

I actually haven't been vocal about the coaches very much outside of the misguided media rants as of late and have always been a defender of Marvin. I have always thought this team (which I think has talent) simply isn't executing. For that, I certainly blame the players on the field. Things is, this has continued far longer than it should have and against the teams we needed and should have beaten when looking at the schedule. For that, at some point in time the leadership has to come under scrutiny for how they go about getting the talent the team has to make it happen when it matters most.

In regard to the Steelers, it's like comparing apples to oranges. That is a top notch organization from top to bottom and any way you choose to look at them. They build a solid foundation from all aspects and I think that is a reason they have such a huge fanbase as well. You look at what they do and it just commands respect. Looking at the Bengals just makes me shake my head. No discipline from the players and lack of leadership from the coaches.

[HoosierCat]

It's one big glass filled hand of a circle jerk. It's the players fault, but it's not the players fault. It's the coaches fault, but it's not the coaches fault.

I hear you. All I am saying is let's not pretend that all the problems are off the field. If the players don't get their crap together, we can replace Marvin with Jesus and it won't matter.

You tell me: are the Pittsburgh Steelers a good team because Mike Tomlin is the best coach evah...or because they are a bunch of guys who just won't quit?

We had some "crap" players in that 2002 2-14 season and Marvin did pretty well in 2003 with those same players.

Well, that's the point. We can argue over this all day. Did they improve in 2003 because Marvin & Co. were the best coaches evah...or because the players sucked it up and played?

When Coslet quit, the Bengals started playing better. Was that because of LeBeau or because they figured out which was their ass and which was their elbow?

[Stripes]

I have no reason to be optimistic, but for some reason I am. They are 2-4. Let's say a miracle happens and the Bengals win next week against Miami and the Saints beat Pitt. That sets up a Monday night game vs Pitt that if won would make us. 4-4 and Pitt 5-3. Marvin has turned the Bengals around after slow starts. I'm not saying Super Bowl. No Chance, but I think they can still make the playoffs. The team has talent and will now relax with the idea of nothing to lose.

I like the 'tude, walzav. I think 11-5 will be needed for a playoff berth though, and this team ain't going 9-1 the rest of the way.

[walzav29]

I'm just saying there's a chance.

[BengalszoneBilly]

I'm just saying there's a chance.

Sure there is. No better than this one though...

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX5jNnDMfxA

[Trevor]

0-3... Thats my going to bengals game record.... It was awesome watching the comeback, but watchin turners fatazz run us over and roddy white destroy our rectums and T.O not putting his effin foot down in bounds i am so pissed, when we want to our offense can kick ass.... we reaaaallly missed jjo out there...

And mike zimmer needs to figure something out about this D... Its crazy, we are absolutely aweful and we cant stop anyone,.. AAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH DX

[cincyhokie]

It's one big glass filled hand of a circle jerk. It's the players fault, but it's not the players fault. It's the coaches fault, but it's not the coaches fault.

I hear you. All I am saying is let's not pretend that all the problems are off the field. If the players don't get their crap together, we can replace Marvin with Jesus and it won't matter.

You tell me: are the Pittsburgh Steelers a good team because Mike Tomlin is the best coach evah...or because they are a bunch of guys who just won't quit?

We had some "crap" players in that 2002 2-14 season and Marvin did pretty well in 2003 with those same players.

Well, that's the point. We can argue over this all day. Did they improve in 2003 because Marvin & Co. were the best coaches evah...or because the players sucked it up and played?

When Coslet quit, the Bengals started playing better. Was that because of LeBeau or because they figured out which was their ass and which was their elbow?

I don't think that Marvin is the best coach ever, not in 2003 and not now. Coaching does make a huge difference, however. I'm just not a big believer in 53 people randomly concerting their efforts at one time. Good teams HAVE to have good coaching and leadership. There's plenty of bad teams with alot of talent and no leadership.

[kingwilly]

I'm just saying there's a chance.

Sure there is. No better than this one though...

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX5jNnDMfxA

Hahaha!

Perfect!

I called this one>>>>

/>http://forums.bengalszone.com/topic/22284-time-to-talk-about-the-falcons/page__st__40__gopid__337200#entry337200

They will lose this game similar to the way they lost in NE.

Slow start, outclassed, outcoached.... Then roar back in the second half to lose by 3.

Season will seem lost, then they will go on a 3 or 4 game run, only to re-vert down the stretch.

It is such a familiar formula....

Cincy fans mistake the stats accumulated during a prevent defense phase for progress... idiots.

[BengalszoneBilly]

I'm just saying there's a chance.

Sure there is. No better than this one though...

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX5jNnDMfxA

Hahaha!

Perfect!

I called this one>>>>

/>http://forums.bengalszone.com/topic/22284-time-to-talk-about-the-falcons/page__st__40__gopid__337200#entry337200

They will lose this game similar to the way they lost in NE.

Slow start, outclassed, outcoached.... Then roar back in the second half to lose by 3.

Season will seem lost, then they will go on a 3 or 4 game run, only to re-vert down the stretch.

It is such a familiar formula....

Cincy fans mistake the stats accumulated during a prevent defense phase for progress... idiots.

Aside from the 3 points, you pretty much nailed down how the game would go . Personally kingwilly, I didn't think the game would be as close as it ended up to be.

[HoosierCat]

Coaching does make a huge difference, however.

This is where we fundamentally disagree. In the NFL, I think coaching is severely overrated. Coaches talk about this all the time: how do you motivate a grown man who's being paid 10 times what you are? This isn't high school or even college, where coaches have a lot more freedom to sit guys down and where kids are more susceptible to rah-rah speeches. NFL players laugh at that kind of thing. Heck, when the Bengals had Adalius Thomas in a couple weeks ago, I was reading something Josh dredged up about how how he was one of the guys in NE who was late to a meeting and got sent home by Belichick. Did that fire him up and motivate him? Nope, he just thought it was bush-league BS.

The bottom line to me is that if you've got 53 guys in the locker room waiting for some guy with "coach" written across his sweatshirt to show up and get them motivated to play, then you have a big problem before that guy ever walks through the door, and it isn't a problem that he's likely to be able to solve.

[cincyhokie]

Coaching does make a huge difference, however.

This is where we fundamentally disagree. In the NFL, I think coaching is severely overrated. Coaches talk about this all the time: how do you motivate a grown man who's being paid 10 times what you are? This isn't high school or even college, where coaches have a lot more freedom to sit guys down and where kids are more susceptible to rah-rah speeches. NFL players laugh at that kind of thing. Heck, when the Bengals had Adalius Thomas in a couple weeks ago, I was reading something Josh dredged up about how how he was one of the guys in NE who was late to a meeting and got sent home by Belichick. Did that fire him up and motivate him? Nope, he just thought it was bush-league BS.

The bottom line to me is that if you've got 53 guys in the locker room waiting for some guy with "coach" written across his sweatshirt to show up and get them motivated to play, then you have a big problem before that guy ever walks through the door, and it isn't a problem that he's likely to be able to solve.

I think that's because, fundamentally, we are defining coaches and their responsibilities with different meanings.

I don't know what coaching you've ever seen be nothing but "rah-rah" speeches. Coaching is far more than that.

Coaching isn't all about motivating. It's about providing leadership and direction. If you're drafting guys that are that unmotivated to begin with then the coaches doing the evaluating need to be reconsidered. So if you've got a coaching staff with no shared vision or direction, how do you expect 53 players to pick up and carry a certain way?

The players HAVE to execute the coaches gameplan. It's in their contract to obey the coaches. However, if the coaches aren't playing to players strengths and settting them up for success, then they are failing at their job.

You have to have a good foundation of leaderhip and coaching. It was that way when I played sports and it was that way when I was in the Army. It is critical. Again teams can have talent and fall short, teams that are successful have to have talent and leadership.

[HoosierCat]

I think that's because, fundamentally, we are defining coaches and their responsibilities with different meanings.

I don't know what coaching you've ever seen be nothing but "rah-rah" speeches. Coaching is far more than that.

I didn't mean to suggest it wasn't. I was only pointing out that the tactics and options available to an NFL coach are a lot more limited than those of, say, the guy coaching the local high school team.

You have to have a good foundation of leaderhip and coaching. It was that way when I played sports and it was that way when I was in the Army. It is critical. Again teams can have talent and fall short, teams that are successful have to have talent and leadership.

I agree that you need leadership, but in the case of an NFL team I believe it has to come from the locker room. How much do we hear about "locker room leaders"? Pretty much all the time. Finding and cultivating those guys is (IMHO, of course) the most important thing a head coach can do. Marvin hasn't had much luck at that, though the team's habit of drafting/signing troubled players hasn't helped.

[kingwilly]

I'm just saying there's a chance.

Sure there is. No better than this one though...

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX5jNnDMfxA

Hahaha!

Perfect!

I called this one>>>>

/>http://forums.bengalszone.com/topic/22284-time-to-talk-about-the-falcons/page__st__40__gopid__337200#entry337200

They will lose this game similar to the way they lost in NE.

Slow start, outclassed, outcoached.... Then roar back in the second half to lose by 3.

Season will seem lost, then they will go on a 3 or 4 game run, only to re-vert down the stretch.

It is such a familiar formula....

Cincy fans mistake the stats accumulated during a prevent defense phase for progress... idiots.

If I was Benson, I'd have my agent on the phone with Green Bay, Washington, NE and Indy paving the way for me to

Aside from the 3 points, you pretty much nailed down how the game would go . Personally kingwilly, I didn't think the game would be as close as it ended up to be.

I turned it off before the half, took my 2 boys and daughter to the park by the school and played with them instead. Much better time.

As for the game, it as pathetic.

[HoosierCat]

This, from Marvin today about the troubles on D, caught my eye:

“I talked to the coaches about it this morning and I talked to the defensive players about it,” Lewis said. "I pointed it out to them where things are different, and things that they did very well last year. They were ahead of the curve and were proactive on some things that went beyond us coaching every step and every move. They understood and took the initiative to get themselves in the right leverages and the right spots.”

That's what I'm talking about. Proactivity. Going beyond. Taking initiative. Last year's team didn't wait for Lewis & Co. to show up and draw them pretty little pictures of what was wrong; they stepped up and fixed things themselves. In other words, last year they were that rare sight in Cincinnati football, professional athletes (emphasis on professional). This year, not so much.

[jjakq27]

This, from Marvin today about the troubles on D, caught my eye:

"I talked to the coaches about it this morning and I talked to the defensive players about it," Lewis said. "I pointed it out to them where things are different, and things that they did very well last year. They were ahead of the curve and were proactive on some things that went beyond us coaching every step and every move. They understood and took the initiative to get themselves in the right leverages and the right spots."

That's what I'm talking about. Proactivity. Going beyond. Taking initiative. Last year's team didn't wait for Lewis & Co. to show up and draw them pretty little pictures of what was wrong; they stepped up and fixed things themselves. In other words, last year they were that rare sight in Cincinnati football, professional athletes (emphasis on professional). This year, not so much.

I know we were down a few guys (RoyW, JJoe, Sims and Odom) but it's basically the same bunch as last year. What's troubling is that Coach Z said he dialed down the details after the New England game and they played pretty good against the Ravens but what have they done after that? Now they reviewed basic stuff with them again?

My frustration is that we were told that the repeat of 2006 wasn't gonna happen with this group because they were more mature than the guys five years ago but these kind of comments make be believe that nothing has changed.

[cincyhokie]

I think that's because, fundamentally, we are defining coaches and their responsibilities with different meanings.

I don't know what coaching you've ever seen be nothing but "rah-rah" speeches. Coaching is far more than that.

I didn't mean to suggest it wasn't. I was only pointing out that the tactics and options available to an NFL coach are a lot more limited than those of, say, the guy coaching the local high school team.

You have to have a good foundation of leaderhip and coaching. It was that way when I played sports and it was that way when I was in the Army. It is critical. Again teams can have talent and fall short, teams that are successful have to have talent and leadership.

I agree that you need leadership, but in the case of an NFL team I believe it has to come from the locker room. How much do we hear about "locker room leaders"? Pretty much all the time. Finding and cultivating those guys is (IMHO, of course) the most important thing a head coach can do. Marvin hasn't had much luck at that, though the team's habit of drafting/signing troubled players hasn't helped.

Fair enough but I don't think luck has much to do with it. Have you noticed that alot of the players just aren't smart? Forget being leaders, at least draft guys that have the intellect for the game. Poor job drafting self sufficient players. I will completely agree with that.

[HairOnFire]

Marvin Lewis DeathWatch: Day 16

Employment Status: No change

Action/Response: Take Immediate Nap