Observations/Thoughts Following Pre-season Game 2

[membengal]

1. Since I didn't get too low following the o-line's performance after the Dallas game, I won't get too high after the way it performed against Denver. Regardless, it was a step in the right direction in terms of pass protection.

2. I heard in passing in a few articles this off-season that BScott had worked hard on his conditioning and stamina. Those two quick bursts and the way he finished the two long plays last night made me giggle. Potentially a huge weapon to go with Ced.

3. I am thrilled with what I saw from Jordan Shipley. I don't remember the last time a receiver showed up in camp as a rookie with those kinds of skills ready to plug and play. Actually, now that I think about it, I do. Chris Collinsworth in 1981. Different players, but Shipley looks ready to make an immediate impact. Great field awareness, nice moves in space, and a nice burst. And all the QBs already seem comfortable looking for him.

4. I would be thrilled to see a line-up with CJ on one side, Owens on the other, and Shipley in the slot with Gresham at TE. More please.

5. Geez, Gresham is a big man. And apparently posesses soft hands. His second catch in traffic was noteworthy, and with his third catch he abused a LB in coverage. More, please.

6. Liked Carson's accuracy, 12 of 15 with one of the three misses a drop from Owens and the other two good coverage from Champ Bailey.

7. D's effectiveness betrayed by the two third down penalties. That's two weeks now that a roughing has kept a drive alive, they need to re-visit those rules. I thought the PI on Hall was ticky-tack, but, beyond that, Hall had a not great night. No worries from me with regard to Hall though.

8. I saw some references to lack of pass rush in game thread, and from the ones, it definitely wasn't there consistently. Still, not sure how much to read into that as Zim didn't run a lot of packages at the Broncos. I will need to see more games with more rush looks to know if it has a chance to be more consistent than last year.

9. I remain enthralled with Geno Atkins. Huge motor, another 1 1/2 sacks and real active on the interior. I would be curious about seeing him on some packages next to Peko against first teamers.

10. Sounds like they came out of the game relatively healthy too.

11. Overall, nice to see them move the ball, and glad there are some more positives to build on this week heading into the game against Philly on Friday.

Thoughts from the rest of you?

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

4. I would be thrilled to see a line-up with CJ on one side, Owens on the other, and Shipley in the slot with Gresham at TE. More please.

I think you'll be seeing rather a lot of that package this year, since those four are miles above the pack. The only thing that would hinder that is Gresham's ability to pick up the blocking game. He looked a little weak there, and it could get him pulled out in 3 WR sets. But I agree - if you can keep those four on the field, *somebody* will have a hideous mismatch.

Other things of note:

*Bernard Scott looked scary good. He's definitely showing more than just being Ced's backup. This should be a 1-2 punch.

*The PR battle is brutal. Quan's certainly in a position where he could be fighting for his job, and he's staying with it. What did they average, 28 yards per or something? Fantastic. I never thought we'd have this back in the dark days of Kiewan Ratliff.

*I want to see more pass rush out of the first team. The 2nd/3rd looked great against their opposites from the Donkeys, but we have to get more out of the first team.

*Rough game by Leon Hall. Thankfully it's preseason.

*It's the little things with this D - they're aggressive while staying on their responsibilities. Like how they're money about blowing up screen passes, which is something that Chucky Bresnehan never could teach. I still have flashbacks to Brian Simmons getting completely doped on screens. Now? Forget it.

[derekshank]

1. Since I didn't get too low following the o-line's performance after the Dallas game, I won't get too high after the way it performed against Denver. Regardless, it was a step in the right direction in terms of pass protection.

They did look better in pass protection... but they weren't facing the Cowboys pass-rush either. Still... not a ton to complain about there, because it appears to be progress.

The run blocking hasn't looked as good to me though. Last year, many times the O-Line would just outmuscle the opposing D-Line and impose their will. I haven't seen that very much in these two games.

I'm slightly worried that perhaps much of the Bengals rushing success last year was a result of the jumbo gimmick. Without it, perhaps this isn't truly a run-first team, Benson isn't a 1,200 yard RB, and the offense isn't the ball-control/TOP dominating style I grew to love last year.

Hopefully that isn't the case.

[volcom69]

Im not sure what to think at this time on the pass rush. Its one thing that bothers me it looked like they were getting pushed over. When they did blitz it just didnt get there. They have been practing the pass rush and they said it was looking good in camp, but so far i have not seen it. I hope its just because Zim has not unleashed the fury lol lol.

I have noticed they have been picking on Hall alot this year so far, i hope Hall soon knocks off that rust and gets back to his form from last year. With Adam Jones in there its a very good CB field.

O-Line did great i was very impressed with Reggie Stephans also at center. I agree Run block still needs some work also, the pass block looked good tonight though.

I think they just need to get physical on both sides of the ball, but they have some more games to work on that.

Shipley and Gresham.....wow very impressed

[kingwilly]

I liked seeing Carson play with some confidence. His numbers were good but it was his poise and vison that I saw as the change. He stood and never once looked rushed or flustered. Keep him standing tall in th pocket and he will make all the throws. His arm could be a wee bit sharper but this is close to "in-season" form.

Benson and Scott will be lethal. Scott is showing more patience, possibly from watching Benson's style. Scott is waiting till the play/hole develops and then getting through and to the outside. Really smart work.

Gresham will be a factor all year. The Bengals were never real shy about throwing to Coates and Kelly but now they have a guy the defense HAS to worry about. Mismatches will abound.

Ownens, Chad, Shipley, Bryant, Caldwell and whoever else makes it will provide the most serious WR corp ever for Carson. Carson could have a career year.

The defense is flashing some improvement but have some work to do.

I really like Dhani. I hope he considers coaching in his future because he can pass on so much knowledge. I just wish that what he was passing on to Rey was being more applied. It seemed like Dhani came out and Rey looked a bit lost from play to play.

Adam Jones is a baller. Teams will be hard pressed when having to choose who to throw on: Hall, Joseph, or Jones. Hall struggled but a couple of the throws were really well thrown balls and the other two plays (the crossing catch and the TD hitch) he was just playing too soft, so maybe it was the coverage? Not really worries about Hall.

Pass rush is still under construction. They played guys in several spots, my guess is in tring to figure out how and where to align folks.

On ST, aside from Rayner's miss and Huber's flub, things looked very solid. What a dilemma to have, in having to probably cut a guy who could return punts on any team in the league. My gut tells me unless they carry 6 WR's, Quan will be cut. That is a shame but I gotta believe he'll end up somewhere like NE or Dallas.

[derekshank]

Pass rush is still under construction. They played guys in several spots, my guess is in tring to figure out how and where to align folks.

Put me in the camp that is not yet worried. Zimmer said in an interview a while back that they have a ton of pass rushing weapons, and he's just trying to tinker with them and find how they'll be most effectively used.

I imagine he'll continue using some different (but fairly vanilla) things to get a feel for what will work best. I don't expect the pass rush to be the strength of the defense... but I think there will be steady improvement with Zimmer continuing to add new wrinkles. I think the pass rush will be serviceable this season.

[Wraith]

Don't need to echo the superlatives thrown onto Gresham, Scott, Palmer, and Shipley.

Preseason means nothing so I will reserve my comments until New England. Best thing about the game, no serious injuries.

[cincyhokie]

On ST, aside from Rayner's miss and Huber's flub, things looked very solid. What a dilemma to have, in having to probably cut a guy who could return punts on any team in the league. My gut tells me unless they carry 6 WR's, Quan will be cut. That is a shame but I gotta believe he'll end up somewhere like NE or Dallas.

If the Bengals go with 2 QB's instead of 3, which has been speculated, Cosby stays in my opinion. Shipley's a starter. Adam Jones is a 3rd CB. Cosby is our return guy. No brainer.

[redsbengalsbucks]

On ST, aside from Rayner's miss and Huber's flub, things looked very solid. What a dilemma to have, in having to probably cut a guy who could return punts on any team in the league. My gut tells me unless they carry 6 WR's, Quan will be cut. That is a shame but I gotta believe he'll end up somewhere like NE or Dallas.

If the Bengals go with 2 QB's instead of 3, which has been speculated, Cosby stays in my opinion. Shipley's a starter. Adam Jones is a 3rd CB. Cosby is our return guy. No brainer.

I'd like to see Simpson play against some #1's next week. Let's see if he can play that well against actually NFL players.

[HairOnFire]

I defy any poster to list even one thing Jerome Simpson could have done better last night.

Sharp decisive routes, hard cuts, routinely open almost instantly after making his break, and he didn't drop a pass. Confident aggressive body language. Plays like he wants the ball and frankly....deserves it more than he's getting it. Even when standing still looks fast. quickest Bengal WR off the snap. Aggressive willing blocker. Ran completely across the field just to hit a pursuing defender on numerous running plays run away from him. Consistently walled of a defender on all running plays directed towards his side. Worked the sideline like a veteran on the 25-yard PI penalty.

Stats? Produced 64 yards of offense in a tick more than one quarter of play.....and could easily had more if given as many opportunites as the Ship-head got. Big play after big play after big play....producing gains of 18, 21, and 25 yards on the only three balls thrown his way.

And of course, big hands.

[kingwilly]

I defy any poster to list even one thing Jerome Simpson could have done better last night.

Sharp decisive routes, hard cuts, routinely open almost instantly after making his break, and he didn't drop a pass. Confident aggressive body language. Plays like he wants the ball and frankly....deserves it more than he's getting it. Even when standing still looks fast. quickest Bengal WR off the snap. Aggressive willing blocker. Ran completely across the field just to hit a pursuing defender on numerous running plays run away from him. Consistently walled of a defender on all running plays directed towards his side. Worked the sideline like a veteran on the 25-yard PI penalty.

Stats? Produced 64 yards of offense in a tick more than one quarter of play.....and could easily had more if given as many opportunites as the Ship-head got. Big play after big play after big play....producing gains of 18, 21, and 25 yards on the only three balls thrown his way.

And of course, big hands.

100% agree.

Let's get him in with Carson working a starting NFL corner. Guy is showing he can do it, give him the chance. Also, no need to risk getting Chad or TO injured, so it seems like an easy one.

If they cut Simpson, Purify and Quan, I'd wager all three will be on a 53-man roster come Week 1.

[whizzo]

If they cut Simpson, Purify and Quan, I'd wager all three will be on a 53-man roster come Week 1.

not so sure about purify (unless someone needs the ST help badly), but simpson and quan, yeah. also, i fear we'll cut simpson (who really looked AWESOME yesterday) for matt jones.

Bengals WRs this season:

- Ochocinco

- T.O.

- Shipley

- Caldwell

- Quan? Simpson? Bryant, if he's not on IR? Matt Jones?

what are the odds of keeping 6 WRs?

[cincyhokie]

If they cut Simpson, Purify and Quan, I'd wager all three will be on a 53-man roster come Week 1.

not so sure about purify (unless someone needs the ST help badly), but simpson and quan, yeah. also, i fear we'll cut simpson (who really looked AWESOME yesterday) for matt jones.

Bengals WRs this season:

- Ochocinco

- T.O.

- Shipley

- Caldwell

- Quan? Simpson? Bryant, if he's not on IR? Matt Jones?

what are the odds of keeping 6 WRs?

The Bengals kept 6 WR's last year.

Chad

Coles

Caldwell

Henry

Cosby

Simpson

The question is: Will they keep 7? If they only go 2 QB's, they can.

[HairOnFire]

Let's get him in with Carson working a starting NFL corner. Guy is showing he can do it, give him the chance. Also, no need to risk getting Chad or TO injured, so it seems like an easy one.

I'm guessing it won't happen. Snaps with the starting QB are going to be extremely limited and the Bengals seem far too intent upon developing instant timing between Palmer and the new guys, especially Owens and Gresham.

I admit I could have missed something, but I didn't see Simpson get a single snap until the start of the 3rd quarter....so I'd happily settle for Simpson getting an earlier chance to work with JTO.

It's a loooooong preseason, right? So how about a longer look at this guy?

He's earned it, IMHO.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Watched the highlights (saw the game as well on replay last night) and was instantly annoyed by the vast majority of the "highlights" being Tebow's play-by-play B.S. At least it included a few shots of him getting his bell rung, sacked, and missing WR's due to pressure etc.., That said, he looks like their #2 guy already, Quinn is still terrible.

Young receivers starting to make Chad and TO look like has-beens, and I just hope Carson gets the ball to the guys getting open and making plays and actually catching it, instad of focusing on those two, too much. TO's drop and failure to get a 1st down on a 3rd down catch were more typical of his play the last few years - stalled two drives I believe with that stuff. Not really down on he and Chad, but they just aren't good as they used to be, and they need to realize that.

Simpson definitely looks like he's becoming the guy they wanted when they drafted him. Shipley and Gresham were of course impressive, although Gresh needs to work on his blocking quite a bit (expected).

Not reading too much into the 1st team defense or Hall getting picked on in man-to-man with little or no pass rush, very vanilla and he got a good workout. JJ is the better CB, but is fine where he is. Pac Man is rounding into form again and that will be huge for this team, Jones is a perfect #4 CB type for now.

Dhani Jones still can't cover anyone in space and looked slow - could be why they are trying to work Rey into his spot on long 3rd downs.

Stephens looked good replacing Cook - that's a big athletic dude who is hard to push around - I like that.

Palmer was in mid-season form for the most part, and proves my point that the passing game struggles are not him nearly as much as he just needs enough time to make plays, he still makes throws only a handful of Qb's in the league can make.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

I defy any poster to list even one thing Jerome Simpson could have done better last night.

Not a thing - but that's not the problem. He may end up a victim of numbers. WR has gone from the glaring weakness on the team to the deep spot. Quite frankly, if he was going to pick an offseason to get his sh!t together, it was last year - the Simpson we saw last night would have certainly been playing after Henry got hurt last year.

At this point, the question isn't just how good is he, but how does he complement the rest of the crew. Can he be a deep threat? That's the biggest weakness now, the Chris Henry route. We don't need any more possession guys or WRs in the Chad/TO bin.

Assuming they do keep Cosby - which is likely but not guaranteed - this may accelerate the "Put Bryant's useless ass on IR" discussion.

On that note, I'd also say it's safe to assume that Matt Jones will be snorting somebody else's hash marks. Simpson's surely at least gotten that much.

[whizzo]

At this point, the question isn't just how good is he, but how does he complement the rest of the crew. Can he be a deep threat? That's the biggest weakness now, the Chris Henry route.

i'm reasonably sure that's why we drafted him, no?

[derekshank]

I still say Simpson makes the team. No one has ever questioned his work ethic, so if the light is finally turning on for him, he represents an ability level that might be the very best on the whole team.

He can still represent the future #1 WR if he continues to improve and 'get it' with Caldwell and Shipley also growing into impact players.

Simpson won't jump Chad and T.O. this season... but they are both in the final year of their contracts with the Bengals.

If Simpson continues to put the work in and I would not be shocked to see Simpson, Bryant, Shipley, and Caldwell as Carson's WR corps in 2011.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

i'm reasonably sure that's why we drafted him, no?

I thought he was supposed to be more of a future Chad. Not to typecast the poor guy of course. Anyway, in the next game I'd be sending him on some deep routes and chucking it his way.

[Wraith]

Let's get him in with Carson working a starting NFL corner. Guy is showing he can do it, give him the chance. Also, no need to risk getting Chad or TO injured, so it seems like an easy one.

I'm guessing it won't happen. Snaps with the starting QB are going to be extremely limited and the Bengals seem far too intent upon developing instant timing between Palmer and the new guys, especially Owens and Gresham.

I admit I could have missed something, but I didn't see Simpson get a single snap until the start of the 3rd quarter....so I'd happily settle for Simpson getting an earlier chance to work with JTO.

It's a loooooong preseason, right? So how about a longer look at this guy?

He's earned it, IMHO.

Bryant will make this team or be put on PUP/IR, you can write that into stone. No way Mike Brown pays guaranteed dollars to someone who won't make the team. Matt Jones showed nothing last night, there were times when he was standing at the end of his pattern rather than improvising.

If I were Jerome Simpson I would be less worried about Matt Jones than Cosby and Caldwell. Matt Jones is one screw up from a lifetime ban there if he is on the bubble he is off the bubble because of who he is. I know Caldwell has been called a lock but with Shipley emerging in the slot and Simpson emerging at the X, where exactly does Caldwell play?

Chad

T.O.

Bryant

Shipley

Cosby and Simpson would be my next two leaving Caldwell and Matt Jones off the team. If they keep Caldwell then look for Cosby to not make the squad or perhaps be a PS (he still has elibility I believe being a second year player).

[cincyhokie]

Let's get him in with Carson working a starting NFL corner. Guy is showing he can do it, give him the chance. Also, no need to risk getting Chad or TO injured, so it seems like an easy one.

I'm guessing it won't happen. Snaps with the starting QB are going to be extremely limited and the Bengals seem far too intent upon developing instant timing between Palmer and the new guys, especially Owens and Gresham.

I admit I could have missed something, but I didn't see Simpson get a single snap until the start of the 3rd quarter....so I'd happily settle for Simpson getting an earlier chance to work with JTO.

It's a loooooong preseason, right? So how about a longer look at this guy?

He's earned it, IMHO.

Bryant will make this team or be put on PUP/IR, you can write that into stone. No way Mike Brown pays guaranteed dollars to someone who won't make the team. Matt Jones showed nothing last night, there were times when he was standing at the end of his pattern rather than improvising.

If I were Jerome Simpson I would be less worried about Matt Jones than Cosby and Caldwell. Matt Jones is one screw up from a lifetime ban there if he is on the bubble he is off the bubble because of who he is. I know Caldwell has been called a lock but with Shipley emerging in the slot and Simpson emerging at the X, where exactly does Caldwell play?

Chad

T.O.

Bryant

Shipley

Cosby and Simpson would be my next two leaving Caldwell and Matt Jones off the team. If they keep Caldwell then look for Cosby to not make the squad or perhaps be a PS (he still has elibility I believe being a second year player).

Bryant can't be put on PUP because he's already practiced this year. He's not going on the IR.

Chad

TO

Bryant

Shipley

Caldwell

Cosby

Simpson

Matt Jones gets cut and Purify goes to the PS. Bengals go 7 WR's.

If for some reason Bryant goes on the IR then you keep Matt Jones.

[HairOnFire]

i'm reasonably sure that's why we drafted him, no?

I thought he was supposed to be more of a future Chad. Not to typecast the poor guy of course. Anyway, in the next game I'd be sending him on some deep routes and chucking it his way.

I give Jordan Palmer credit for doing just that on the play that resulted in PI. No a bit of hesitation shown.

O'Sullivan could learn a thing or two from that guy.

[volcom69]

Let's get him in with Carson working a starting NFL corner. Guy is showing he can do it, give him the chance. Also, no need to risk getting Chad or TO injured, so it seems like an easy one.

I'm guessing it won't happen. Snaps with the starting QB are going to be extremely limited and the Bengals seem far too intent upon developing instant timing between Palmer and the new guys, especially Owens and Gresham.

I admit I could have missed something, but I didn't see Simpson get a single snap until the start of the 3rd quarter....so I'd happily settle for Simpson getting an earlier chance to work with JTO.

It's a loooooong preseason, right? So how about a longer look at this guy?

He's earned it, IMHO.

Bryant will make this team or be put on PUP/IR, you can write that into stone. No way Mike Brown pays guaranteed dollars to someone who won't make the team. Matt Jones showed nothing last night, there were times when he was standing at the end of his pattern rather than improvising.

If I were Jerome Simpson I would be less worried about Matt Jones than Cosby and Caldwell. Matt Jones is one screw up from a lifetime ban there if he is on the bubble he is off the bubble because of who he is. I know Caldwell has been called a lock but with Shipley emerging in the slot and Simpson emerging at the X, where exactly does Caldwell play?

Chad

T.O.

Bryant

Shipley

Cosby and Simpson would be my next two leaving Caldwell and Matt Jones off the team. If they keep Caldwell then look for Cosby to not make the squad or perhaps be a PS (he still has elibility I believe being a second year player).

Bryant can't be put on PUP because he's already practiced this year. He's not going on the IR.

Chad

TO

Bryant

Shipley

Caldwell

Cosby

Simpson

Matt Jones gets cut and Purify goes to the PS. Bengals go 7 WR's.

If for some reason Bryant goes on the IR then you keep Matt Jones.

Theres a good chance Bryant will be on the IR. What good is he doing right now none, i can see if he is not ready for the opener they will place him there.

[kingwilly]

Bryant can't be put on PUP because he's already practiced this year. He's not going on the IR.

Chad

TO

Bryant

Shipley

Caldwell

Cosby

Simpson

Matt Jones gets cut and Purify goes to the PS. Bengals go 7 WR's.

If for some reason Bryant goes on the IR then you keep Matt Jones.

I could see that, keeping 7.

Honestly, I am beginning to prefer Jordan to JTOS, if that meant we could keep that extra WR. At a minimum, Jordan has a stronger arm to heave the rock around.

I'd like to see Jordan in with the second line.

[cincyhokie]

Let's get him in with Carson working a starting NFL corner. Guy is showing he can do it, give him the chance. Also, no need to risk getting Chad or TO injured, so it seems like an easy one.

I'm guessing it won't happen. Snaps with the starting QB are going to be extremely limited and the Bengals seem far too intent upon developing instant timing between Palmer and the new guys, especially Owens and Gresham.

I admit I could have missed something, but I didn't see Simpson get a single snap until the start of the 3rd quarter....so I'd happily settle for Simpson getting an earlier chance to work with JTO.

It's a loooooong preseason, right? So how about a longer look at this guy?

He's earned it, IMHO.

Bryant will make this team or be put on PUP/IR, you can write that into stone. No way Mike Brown pays guaranteed dollars to someone who won't make the team. Matt Jones showed nothing last night, there were times when he was standing at the end of his pattern rather than improvising.

If I were Jerome Simpson I would be less worried about Matt Jones than Cosby and Caldwell. Matt Jones is one screw up from a lifetime ban there if he is on the bubble he is off the bubble because of who he is. I know Caldwell has been called a lock but with Shipley emerging in the slot and Simpson emerging at the X, where exactly does Caldwell play?

Chad

T.O.

Bryant

Shipley

Cosby and Simpson would be my next two leaving Caldwell and Matt Jones off the team. If they keep Caldwell then look for Cosby to not make the squad or perhaps be a PS (he still has elibility I believe being a second year player).

Bryant can't be put on PUP because he's already practiced this year. He's not going on the IR.

Chad

TO

Bryant

Shipley

Caldwell

Cosby

Simpson

Matt Jones gets cut and Purify goes to the PS. Bengals go 7 WR's.

If for some reason Bryant goes on the IR then you keep Matt Jones.

Theres a good chance Bryant will be on the IR. What good is he doing right now none, i can see if he is not ready for the opener they will place him there.

He can do alot of good if he's healthy week 4 and on, for example. No need to put him on IR if he can play and contribute this year.