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Florio on drugs


gregstephens

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Until the Ravens game we lead the league in redzone scoring and we weren't averaging 10 penalties a game. So, yeah, we're playing a lot more undisciplined now then we were then. We have issues now that we didn't have then. On top of that, we have injuries now we didn't have then. So, no, I don't think we're the same team we were a couple of months ago.

I didn't say we were the same team. Injuries happen everywhere. What I said is that we aren't as a whole playing any worse now than we have been at any other point in time. We looked bad in the first loss to Denver, even though they did to and only won by 'a fluke'. We had everyone healthy in that game except Reggie Kelly obviously.

We looked bad losing to Houston, Oakland, Minnesota. This past Sunday's game is the only game we've lost this season that I can say we actually looked good therein.

I also didn't say we weren't less disciplined now than then. Yes, the penalties are increasing. Ok. Two of our five losses we had 4 penalties. Our first win against Green Bay we had 13 penalites. Two other wins, we had nine or more penalties. We've only had four games all season with less than five penalties and lost two of those. We've had ten games this season with six or more penalties and won seven of those. Any other way you want to spin the penalty issue? Not sure it tells us anything about this season other than we've been lax in discipline pretty much all year.

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Adding to this debate, someone posted the current AFC playoff picture that currently has the Bengals at fourth seed if the season ended today. Analyze game-to-game all you want, but that makes us fourth best in the AFC. Going to Ron's point, there is no way there are six NFC teams better than the Bengals.

Just because a team gets the #4 seed in the playoffs doesn't necessarily make them the 4th best team at one particular moment in time. It's based on an entire season. You could be the #4 seed and still be the best team in the NFL at that point in the season, or at the end of the season, or going into the playoffs. Likewise, there could be the 7 or 8 teams in the conference better than you at that particular time.

Didn't you guys ever take calculus in high school? It's like the difference between average velocity over a period of time and instantaneous velocity at an exact point in time.

I don't agree with this at all. When sixteen games are finished, the top six teams go to the playoffs. That makes them the six best in their conference. There's a reason the Titans, who have won, what, seven straight, are still power ranked under 8-6, 9-5, 10-4, etc. teams. They might play one particular week better than the Pats, but are still power ranked under them. The Colts get a 1 seed, the Chargers 2. They are the top two teams in the AFC today and all season long. Over time, the law of averages will work out temporary disparities.

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I didn't say we were the same team.

I didn't realize I had to be quite so literal with you. Let me rephrase. We're not as good a team as we were earlier in the year. Earlier in the year we could overcome those penalties. Now, they're killing our drives.

You still haven't come up with anything to explain the difference in redzone scoring in the first half of the year and the second half. In the early part of the year they were scoring touchdowns instead of field goals. Now it's the other way around. In my book, that means they've regressed. I don't know what that means to you.

Obviously this 10 ranking that has so irked you was generous according to MSN. They have us at 23.

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I didn't say we were the same team.

I didn't realize I had to be quite so literal with you. Let me rephrase. We're not as good a team as we were earlier in the year. Earlier in the year we could overcome those penalties. Now, they're killing our drives.

You still haven't come up with anything to explain the difference in redzone scoring in the first half of the year and the second half. In the early part of the year they were scoring touchdowns instead of field goals. Now it's the other way around. In my book, that means they've regressed. I don't know what that means to you.

Obviously this 10 ranking that has so irked you was generous according to MSN. They have us at 23.

Them being ranked 23 there means as much to me as Fox putting them at 5 means to you. You're telling me then that the 10 ranking that has irked you as well, since you've said we're not a top ten team, makes number 23 sound about right to you??

I just found an article from October, 2005 (you may have heard of that season) where, at that point in time, the Bengals with their high powered offense were 24th in the league in redzone TD conversions at 36.8 percent.

So what's my point? Exactly. This team is 9-5 after going 4-11-1 last year. No we don't score touchdowns as often from the redzone as I'd like. A big part of your stat is the loss of Henry in week nine. Henry was the jump-ball in the endzone king. We don't have that now. Probably a big reason for your redzone scoring difference. Probably lost four or five scores with him being gone. Seems to be a direct correlation, huh?

Defense, playing about the same all year even with injuries. Even in the Viking loss, Favre, Peterson, all looked very human, especially given the defense was on the field more than usual. Offense, still running the ball about the same all year long, even when Benson went down. Offense, still lacking in the pass, which they have been all season long!

You take one stat and say we're not as good as we were in the beginning half of the season. We haven't been a big scoring team all season long, except Green Bay and Chicago. We've been a stingy team on defense, except for Minnesota and Houston, separated by seven games. We've consistently been inconsistent. We are in no way any worse now than we've ever been. If you have ever accepted the Bengals as a top five or top ten team, there is no reason not to now. It's the same performance level all season. Two of five losses have been against exceptional opponents that were, at the time of the loss, top three teams.

So, again, I don't get your fatalistic approach to this.

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Not being fatalistic. I'm being realistic. And red zone scoring is a huge stat, not a little one. I never said we were a high scoring team. What I'm saying is that earlier this year we scored touchdowns when we got to the redzone, now we don't. We were also able to overcome penalties earlier in the year, now we can't. We have the talent to be a top 10 team but they aren't executing like it.

Also, the 2005 team could score from anywhere on the field so red zone scoring wasn't as big a deal to that team as it is to this one. This is a ball control offense that rarely gets over 20 yards in a play. That means when they get to the red zone, the HAVE to score.

Bottom line is, this is a playoff team, but if they don't figure out how to score in the red zone and not commit penalties, that's all they are.

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Bottom line is, this is a playoff team, but if they don't figure out how to score in the red zone and not commit penalties, that's all they are.

That's the second thing we've agreed on today. ;)

Wow, I think we've all arrived at a very special place. Must be the season or something....

:hug:

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Bottom line is, this is a playoff team, but if they don't figure out how to score in the red zone and not commit penalties, that's all they are.

Yup, yup and yup.

They haven't been able to solve that problem all year. Now, we are hitting "now or never" time.

Figure it out, boys.

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Who give a s**t if they are blowouts or not.

I want a win against KC. Period. However that happens. A blowout would be better for my nerves, but a win above all else.

Word. I pray for a comfortable win; it does not have to be a blowout. 10-14 points would be wonderful.

Now is the time to gain some momentum for the playoffs. If Cincy loses to KC, at home, they are probably going to lose at the Jets, and miss out on the playoffs. Deservatively so.

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