Shayne Graham is one and done--and why that is bad for the Bengals

[Kazkal]

Hard to argue with anything you wrote there.

I'll argue with every bit of it since the entire piece is based upon Graham leaving after this season...an outcome I'll bet won't happen.

They'll tag him again. And if they do they'll actually pay the same or slightly less over the two year span than they'd pay if there was a long-term agreement. And on that last point, I'm guessing the Bengals want a long-term deal but simply won't match Opie's salary demands.

So let's all agree to meet back here in a year, ehh?

Nice thing about tag too is if he doesn't sign it by the draft if they have best kicker available in the 6th round maybe they take him then pull the tag off shayne.

The good news? NO MALE OFFSPRING that I know of! Yessssssssssss! The Brown name will finally die off!!!!!

Well it would be a Blackburn if they did & Doesn't Mikey have a brother with a son?

[Kazkal]

Second, it just doesn't make sense football-wise to use the tag twice on a kicker. Didn't make a lot of sense the first time, really. However, it's not like tagging 32 or 33 year old Palmer twice just to milk him for what would likely be the last two years of his career.

Wouldn't make sense unless we don't have anyone else to franchise which atm Opie seems the most likely...

[Pidge]

I concur with everything Hair has said in thread wrt Graham.

/brownnose

[gregstephens]

Second, it just doesn't make sense football-wise to use the tag twice on a kicker. Didn't make a lot of sense the first time, really. However, it's not like tagging 32 or 33 year old Palmer twice just to milk him for what would likely be the last two years of his career.

Wouldn't make sense unless we don't have anyone else to franchise which atm Opie seems the most likely...

Well, they don't have to tag anybody. I think only 12 teams tagged this year? That number surprised me actually.

[Passepartout]

Well when you are at that age of Mason, they are looking for youth over experience it seems.

[Kazkal]

Second, it just doesn't make sense football-wise to use the tag twice on a kicker. Didn't make a lot of sense the first time, really. However, it's not like tagging 32 or 33 year old Palmer twice just to milk him for what would likely be the last two years of his career.

Wouldn't make sense unless we don't have anyone else to franchise which atm Opie seems the most likely...

Well, they don't have to tag anybody. I think only 12 teams tagged this year? That number surprised me actually.

They don't have too but if they go in to draft with no kicker on team would make it pretty easy for team to jump us more so since they know were willing burn a 5th on a punter ....Atleast if they have Shayne tagged they still have kicker available incase the right one in draft isn't available.

[semiotter]

Gonna miss Shayne-o-matic

[ArmyBengal]

I think Shayne will be back one way or another. Either a new contract or tag.

No, the tag wouldn't suprise me again either for all the reason Hair gave, so I don't need to repeat them.

[Bearcat1975]

Still, I wish we could get an Ozzie Newsome type in here.

Let's look at what Ozzie Newsome is doing in Baltimore right now.

OK. That's a great idea. Let's just look at the highlights from the past 5 years, shall we?

Lets see here...

2003-2008 Ravens - went to the playoffs 3 out of those 6 seasons, Flacco rookie of the year last year; Ed Reed Defensive player of the year 2004; Terrell Suggs - NFL Rookie of the Year Award 2003, Ray Lewis - NFL Defensive Player of the Year Award 2003, Jamal Lewis - NFL Offensive Player of the Year Award 2003

Boy is that some CRAPPY drafting, eh? Now how bout our lovable losers:

2003-2008 Bengals - One and done in 2005. Don't even get started on the drafts. You already know. Actually, in your case, you probably don't.

So you wouldn't want someone with Newsome's track record here either?

I can't believe you are even trying to debate from that angle. Maybe you deserve what you get from the Bengals.

[Ickey44]

Still, I wish we could get an Ozzie Newsome type in here.

Let's look at what Ozzie Newsome is doing in Baltimore right now.

OK. That's a great idea. Let's just look at the highlights from the past 5 years, shall we?

Lets see here...

2003-2008 Ravens - went to the playoffs 3 out of those 6 seasons, Flacco rookie of the year last year; Ed Reed Defensive player of the year 2004; Terrell Suggs - NFL Rookie of the Year Award 2003, Ray Lewis - NFL Defensive Player of the Year Award 2003, Jamal Lewis - NFL Offensive Player of the Year Award 2003

Boy is that some CRAPPY drafting, eh? Now how bout our lovable losers:

2003-2008 Bengals - One and done in 2005. Don't even get started on the drafts. You already know. Actually, in your case, you probably don't.

So you wouldn't want someone with Newsome's track record here either?

I can't believe you are even trying to debate from that angle. Maybe you deserve what you get from the Bengals.

That had nothing to do with the argument you started. You said that nobody in the front office knew how to negotiate and implied that Ozzie Newsome did. COB countered that the front office DOES know how to negotiate, hence being one of the lowest revenue teams in the league but with one of the highest profit margins.

You came back with player of the year awards and playoff appearances as your counter-argument. Do you see why everyone here thinks you're a dumbass?

[Bearcat1975]

That had nothing to do with the argument you started. You said that nobody in the front office knew how to negotiate and implied that Ozzie Newsome did. COB countered that the front office DOES know how to negotiate, hence being one of the lowest revenue teams in the league but with one of the highest profit margins.

You came back with player of the year awards and playoff appearances as your counter-argument. Do you see why everyone here thinks you're a dumbass?

Katie, Troy, and Mike negotiate with NFL players and agents the way they negotiate with Hamilton County. Cutthroat and ruthless. That's why they suck at negotiating NFL contracts. And the proof is in the results, which I also provided.

Keep telling yourself that Katie, Troy, and Mike do a better job than Ozzie Newsome, and I'll keep showing you results that say otherwise.

Shrewd negotiators? Sure. Totally counter-productive and self-handicapping in an NFL environment? Abso-f'n-lutely.

Still totally laughable that you would even try to say otherwise, but then again, not surprising coming from you.

By the way, you keep rooting for the Bengals profit margins...I prefer rooting for them to actually win. Laughable that you can't see a difference between the two.

And as far as you calling me a dumbass... coming from a guy with Butthead as his avatar who claims to be the "lone voice of reason..." Again, laughable.

But don't take my word for it. The Bengals annual proof is just around the corner.

[HairOnFire]

The new board allows one name change per year. Looks like Groundhog Day again this year so I made the change. Same avatar, profile and everything else though.

So, are you still using the ruined Bearcat tag when posting mothering tips on MomsLikeMe.com?

No one can be this stupid and be that big of a douche. It has to be an act.

Well, you got me on the douche thing because I do sometimes deliberately act like a douche around here. And I'm fairly certain it happens from time to time even when I'm not trying to act in the manner of the douche.

I have a gift for it, ehh?

But I'm probably not stupid. Or rather, I'm not so stupid as to claim the Bengals will now have to pay twice as much for Opie's services now that the deadline to extend has passed. And there's the proverbial rub because that sort of stupidity was uttered by you, not me. Yet only a day or two after popping off about such nonsense we find your dumbass agreeing with my numbers showing how the Bengals can tag Opie two years in a row yet still pay only his fair market price OR even slightly less.

But here you are again, calling other people stupid while conveniently ignoring your own rant about how allowing the deadline to pass will result in the Bengals being forced to pay twice the going rate....which would be somewhere around 5 million per.....about two million more than any realistic figure.

And yet despite all of this your dumb ass still feels compelled to offer criticism of a Bengals front office that obviously has a firmer grasp on the situation than you could ever hope to?

Ha!

[Bearcat1975]

The new board allows one name change per year. Looks like Groundhog Day again this year so I made the change. Same avatar, profile and everything else though.

So, are you still using the ruined Bearcat tag when posting mothering tips on MomsLikeMe.com?

No one can be this stupid and be that big of a douche. It has to be an act.

Well, you got me on the douche thing because I do sometimes deliberately act like a douche around here. And I'm fairly certain it happens from time to time even when I'm not trying to act in the manner of the douche.

I have a gift for it, ehh?

But I'm probably not stupid. Or rather, I'm not so stupid as to claim the Bengals will now have to pay twice as much for Opie's services now that the deadline to extend has passed. And there's the proverbial rub because that sort of stupidity was uttered by you, not me. Yet only a day or two after popping off about such nonsense we find your dumbass agreeing with my numbers showing how the Bengals can tag Opie two years in a row yet still pay only his fair market price OR even slightly less.

Yet here you are again, calling other people stupid while conveniently ignoring your own rant about how allowing the deadline to pass will result in the Bengals being forced to pay twice the going rate....which would be somewhere around 5 million per.....about two million more than any realistic figure.

And yet despite all of this your dumb ass still feels compelled to offer criticism of a Bengals front office that obviously has a firmer grasp on the situation than you could ever hope to?

Ha!

He has completely lost it now, folks.

To review though... Opie Part 1: Bengals lowball then have to match Jags offer that, to quote Opie, ended up being "much higher than I ever would have dreamed of asking for."

Opie Part 2: Can't negotiate end up paying him top 5 money. You say "fair market price." You must have no idea what tagging him actually meant. TOP 5 KICKER MONEY.

They just don't understand that you don't negotiate with NFL players/agents like you negotiate with the rest of the world. Not if you want them to play for you, you don't. Every single one feels "disrespected" because they get lowballed and taken to Rally's for lunch. Its not the way the other 31 teams do business but I'm sure they all have it wrong and the Brown family is right on track as usual, "as evidence by their profit margin."

Decide which you are rooting for. The Bengals, or the Bengals profit margin.

Queue the Dere-lick-my-balls-shank idiot response in 5...4..3..2..1..

[Ickey44]

That had nothing to do with the argument you started. You said that nobody in the front office knew how to negotiate and implied that Ozzie Newsome did. COB countered that the front office DOES know how to negotiate, hence being one of the lowest revenue teams in the league but with one of the highest profit margins.

You came back with player of the year awards and playoff appearances as your counter-argument. Do you see why everyone here thinks you're a dumbass?

Katie, Troy, and Mike negotiate with NFL players and agents the way they negotiate with Hamilton County. Cutthroat and ruthless. That's why they suck at negotiating NFL contracts. And the proof is in the results, which I also provided.

Keep telling yourself that Katie, Troy, and Mike do a better job than Ozzie Newsome, and I'll keep showing you results that say otherwise.

Shrewd negotiators? Sure. Totally counter-productive and self-handicapping in an NFL environment? Abso-f'n-lutely.

Still totally laughable that you would even try to say otherwise, but then again, not surprising coming from you.

By the way, you keep rooting for the Bengals profit margins...I prefer rooting for them to actually win. Laughable that you can't see a difference between the two.

And as far as you calling me a dumbass... coming from a guy with Butthead as his avatar who claims to be the "lone voice of reason..." Again, laughable.

But don't take my word for it. The Bengals annual proof is just around the corner.

You offered no proof of anything except further proof of your stupidity. At no point did I say that Katie, Troy, and Mike were better GM's than Ozzie. They negotiate better. That's all I said. It's their job to make sure that their franchise doesn't spend more money than it earns. Again, as has been said here before, breaking the bank doesn't win championships. The Redskins and Cowboys have tried, but it hasn't happened. The model the Bengals, and every other team for that matter, should be following is the model of the Patriots and Steelers.

And at no point have you ever offered even a hint of the fact that you root for the Bengals to win. You've repeatedly stated that you can't wait for them to lose so you can come in here and say "i told you so" which is more proof of your lying and stupidity.

But then again, I'm arguing with someone who thinks he's a mom, so I may as well be talking to a wall. It'd be a more intelligent conversation I think.

[Ickey44]

The new board allows one name change per year. Looks like Groundhog Day again this year so I made the change. Same avatar, profile and everything else though.

So, are you still using the ruined Bearcat tag when posting mothering tips on MomsLikeMe.com?

No one can be this stupid and be that big of a douche. It has to be an act.

Well, you got me on the douche thing because I do sometimes deliberately act like a douche around here. And I'm fairly certain it happens from time to time even when I'm not trying to act in the manner of the douche.

I have a gift for it, ehh?

But I'm probably not stupid. Or rather, I'm not so stupid as to claim the Bengals will now have to pay twice as much for Opie's services now that the deadline to extend has passed. And there's the proverbial rub because that sort of stupidity was uttered by you, not me. Yet only a day or two after popping off about such nonsense we find your dumbass agreeing with my numbers showing how the Bengals can tag Opie two years in a row yet still pay only his fair market price OR even slightly less.

Yet here you are again, calling other people stupid while conveniently ignoring your own rant about how allowing the deadline to pass will result in the Bengals being forced to pay twice the going rate....which would be somewhere around 5 million per.....about two million more than any realistic figure.

And yet despite all of this your dumb ass still feels compelled to offer criticism of a Bengals front office that obviously has a firmer grasp on the situation than you could ever hope to?

Ha!

He has completely lost it now, folks.

To review though... Opie Part 1: Bengals lowball then have to match Jags offer that, to quote Opie, ended up being "much higher than I ever would have dreamed of asking for."

Opie Part 2: Can't negotiate end up paying him top 5 money. You say "fair market price." You must have no idea what tagging him actually meant. TOP 5 KICKER MONEY.

They just don't understand that you don't negotiate with NFL players/agents like you negotiate with the rest of the world. Not if you want them to play for you, you don't. Every single one feels "disrespected" because they get lowballed and taken to Rally's for lunch. Its not the way the other 31 teams do business but I'm sure they all have it wrong and the Brown family is right on track as usual, "as evidence by their profit margin."

Decide which you are rooting for. The Bengals, or the Bengals profit margin.

Queue the Dere-lick-my-balls-shank idiot response in 5...4..3..2..1..

Every team starts negotiating low and the player (agent) starts high. That's how negotiating works. Do you really think the other 31 teams just agree to every player who walks in the front office and demands a certain amount of money?

The way you put things the only free agents every year would be former Bengals, because all other teams just give their players what they want.

Everyone in this forum roots for the Bengals to win, save you. You repeatedly point out only how they will lose, never looking at the positive this team has done and look at how they might win. There is a lot of talent on this team regardless of the morons running it in the front office.

And before you start saying anything stupid.....AGAIN......I'm not predicting a Superbowl or even a playoff berth for this team. But they are nowhere near as horrible as YOU think they are.

[HairOnFire]

To review though... Opie Part 1: Bengals lowball then have to match Jags offer that, to quote Opie, ended up being "much higher than I ever would have dreamed of asking for."

Which explains why after finding himself in exactly the same position Camp Opie refused to sign a long-term contract offer despite OVERWHELMING evidence proving the Bengals willingness to pay a guaranteed salary of 2.48 million. Simply put, Camp Opie must have been salivating for another opportunity to earn more than they would have once dreamed of, and were in no hurry to accept any contract offer the Bengals made prior to being franchise tagged. And since being tagged the Bengals have absolutely to motivation to bid against their own offer.

Opie Part 2: Can't negotiate end up paying him top 5 money. You say "fair market price." You must have no idea what tagging him actually meant. TOP 5 KICKER MONEY.

The Bengals have already proven their willingness to pay top 5 money, and will almost certainly agree to do so again next season....implying a commitment to pay Opie an average salary of at least 2.7 million per. But that hasn't been enough has it? So at what point in our story do you begin asking yourself what figure Opie is demanding and whether or not it might be fair?

Actually, that's a trick question because I know a pinhead like you will never question the players salary demands, preferring a habit of always second guessing the team you pretend to be a fan of.

Every single one feels "disrespected" because they get lowballed and taken to Rally's for lunch.

They've agreed to pay Opie Top 5 money, fully guaranteed. So how is that lowballing?

Its not the way the other 31 teams do business but....

It's the way all 32 NFL teams do business, including your beloved Ozzie Newsome....who s**tkicked your boy Jason Brown to the curb without so much as a second thought simply because Brown found himself with more leverage than Ozzie could easily counter.

[COB]

Katie and Troy negotiate like old people f**k.

Katie, Troy, and Mike negotiate with NFL players and agents the way they negotiate with Hamilton County. Cutthroat and ruthless.

Either you believe old people f**k in a cutthroat and ruthless manner, or, more likely, you blatantly contradicted yourself. And you did so because the guiding principle behind everything you write isn't truth, it's your hatred for the Brown family and everything Bengal. As long as it makes them look stupid, you'll say it, whether it's accurate or not.

Shrewd negotiators? Sure. Totally counter-productive and self-handicapping in an NFL environment? Abso-f'n-lutely.

You're so right. I really want a front office that negotiates stupidly and naively. Speaking of stupid, keep posting. After a long search, I finally found someone I can get the better of in these back and forth cut and paste battles.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Katie and Troy negotiate like old people f**k.

Katie, Troy, and Mike negotiate with NFL players and agents the way they negotiate with Hamilton County. Cutthroat and ruthless.

Either you believe old people f**k in a cutthroat and ruthless manner, or, more likely, you blatantly contradicted yourself. And you did so because the guiding principle behind everything you write isn't truth, it's your hatred for the Brown family and everything Bengal. As long as it makes them look stupid, you'll say it, whether it's accurate or not.

Shrewd negotiators? Sure. Totally counter-productive and self-handicapping in an NFL environment? Abso-f'n-lutely.

You're so right. I really want a front office that negotiates stupidly and naively. Speaking of stupid, keep posting. After a long search, I finally found someone I can get the better of in these back and forth cut and paste battles.

If only shrewd negotiating and saving a few hundred thousand on a kicker meant winning more often...

[Ickey44]

Katie and Troy negotiate like old people f**k.

Katie, Troy, and Mike negotiate with NFL players and agents the way they negotiate with Hamilton County. Cutthroat and ruthless.

Either you believe old people f**k in a cutthroat and ruthless manner, or, more likely, you blatantly contradicted yourself. And you did so because the guiding principle behind everything you write isn't truth, it's your hatred for the Brown family and everything Bengal. As long as it makes them look stupid, you'll say it, whether it's accurate or not.

Shrewd negotiators? Sure. Totally counter-productive and self-handicapping in an NFL environment? Abso-f'n-lutely.

You're so right. I really want a front office that negotiates stupidly and naively. Speaking of stupid, keep posting. After a long search, I finally found someone I can get the better of in these back and forth cut and paste battles.

If only shrewd negotiating and saving a few hundred thousand on a kicker meant winning more often...

Looks like Bearcat/Groundhog Day has a clone running around here. Or is it the other way around?

[ArmyBengal]

The difference is Shula makes good points on some things (in my opinion) and doesn't continually come back for the sole purpose of being an ass.

I don't have any issues with him and can disagree with some of the things he says, but it doesn't have an assh*le feel to it.

[HairOnFire]

The difference is Shula makes good points on some things (in my opinion) and doesn't continually come back for the sole purpose of being an ass.

Well let's hope Kid Steakhouse starts making points, good or bad, sometime soon because the entire post he just pinched off and left steaming in the middle of the thread was a single whining sentence that was as pointless as anything MamaBear has uttered.

[ArmyBengal]

The difference is Shula makes good points on some things (in my opinion) and doesn't continually come back for the sole purpose of being an ass.

Well let's hope Kid Steakhouse starts making points, good or bad, sometime soon because the entire post he just pinched off and left steaming in the middle of the thread was a single whining sentence that was as pointless as anything MamaBear has uttered.

I said, "on some things". I wouldn't call the one you are referring to as one of those...

[Bearcat1975]

The difference is Shula makes good points on some things (in my opinion) and doesn't continually come back for the sole purpose of being an ass.

Well let's hope Kid Steakhouse starts making points, good or bad, sometime soon because the entire post he just pinched off and left steaming in the middle of the thread was a single whining sentence that was as pointless as anything MamaBear has uttered.

As opposed to your latest contribution.

Pot, meet kettle.

[Bearcat1975]

The difference is Shula makes good points on some things (in my opinion) and doesn't continually come back for the sole purpose of being an ass.

I don't have any issues with him and can disagree with some of the things he says, but it doesn't have an assh*le feel to it.

Is it lonely up there on your high horse?

[ArmyBengal]

The difference is Shula makes good points on some things (in my opinion) and doesn't continually come back for the sole purpose of being an ass.

I don't have any issues with him and can disagree with some of the things he says, but it doesn't have an assh*le feel to it.

Is it lonely up there on your high horse?

Are you happy being regarded as the dumbest motherf*cker on this board ??