Lewis on Rogers Fiasco

[HoosierCat]

From Ludwig @ the DDN...

Bengals' trade falls apart over roster-bonus issue

By Chick Ludwig

Staff Writer

Sunday, March 02, 2008

CINCINNATI — The Cincinnati Bengals' proposed trade for Detroit defensive tackle Shaun Rogers fell apart late Friday night, Feb. 29, because of salary cap issues.

The NFL office in New York, which must approve all trades, didn't like the way the Lions and Bengals had arranged the deal. So it was nixed, opening the door for the Lions to trade Rogers to Cleveland for cornerback Leigh Bodden and the Browns' third-round draft pick.

Rogers was owed a $1 million roster bonus at 12:01 a.m. Saturday, March 1. That's why the Lions were aggressively trying to trade him.

It's believed a league interpretation over roster bonus allocations led the NFL to invalidate the trade.

Bengals head coach Marvin Lewis was asked for some insight on how the trade fizzled.

Lewis said it had to do with "how Detroit had to count cap figures, and the timing (of it). It's more in legality terms of league (rules) and how Detroit tried to execute it, and when they did it, it was too late, and so they (the league) just disallowed it."

Full story here: http://www.daytondailynews.com/s/content/o...208bengals.html

So basically, DETROIT tried some sort of crap, it didn't fly, and in the meantime the Clowns swooped in. Figures. Matt Millen can suck my balz.

[Bengals1]

So basically, DETROIT tried some sort of crap, it didn't fly, and in the meantime the Clowns swooped in. Figures. Matt Millen can suck my balz.

If Detroit screwed up and I admit that's how that article makes it sound, how come they get the benifit of trading him to someone else while we're left holding our d*cks?

[ShulaSteakhouse]

From Ludwig @ the DDN...

Bengals' trade falls apart over roster-bonus issue

By Chick Ludwig

Staff Writer

Sunday, March 02, 2008

CINCINNATI — The Cincinnati Bengals' proposed trade for Detroit defensive tackle Shaun Rogers fell apart late Friday night, Feb. 29, because of salary cap issues.

The NFL office in New York, which must approve all trades, didn't like the way the Lions and Bengals had arranged the deal. So it was nixed, opening the door for the Lions to trade Rogers to Cleveland for cornerback Leigh Bodden and the Browns' third-round draft pick.

Rogers was owed a $1 million roster bonus at 12:01 a.m. Saturday, March 1. That's why the Lions were aggressively trying to trade him.

It's believed a league interpretation over roster bonus allocations led the NFL to invalidate the trade.

Bengals head coach Marvin Lewis was asked for some insight on how the trade fizzled.

Lewis said it had to do with "how Detroit had to count cap figures, and the timing (of it). It's more in legality terms of league (rules) and how Detroit tried to execute it, and when they did it, it was too late, and so they (the league) just disallowed it."

Full story here: http://www.daytondailynews.com/s/content/o...208bengals.html

So basically, DETROIT tried some sort of crap, it didn't fly, and in the meantime the Clowns swooped in. Figures. Matt Millen can suck my balz.

Uh yeah, that changes everything.

[BengalszoneBilly]

The bright side of this equation? Cleveland lost their best pass defender.

[HoosierCat]

Uh yeah, that changes everything.

Of course not. Facts be damned, let the Emikuel Brownstein Two Minutes' Hate begin!

[membengal]

It blows. Whole thing blows. The Lions blow. Goodell blows. The god who clearly s**ts on my favorite team for fun blows.

[HairOnFire]

Uh yeah, that changes everything.

Of course not. Facts be damned, let the Emikuel Brownstein Two Minutes' Hate begin!

KidSteakhouse must be in heaven. Think about it, when the Bengals look like they've made a solid trade he trashes it. When the trade falls through he quickly blames the Bengals. Finally, when the evidence begins to roll in showing the breakdown occured on Detroits side he simply ignores the evidence. Throughout it all he manages to be completely wrong about everything, but never stops blaming the team he claims to be a fan of.

[HoosierCat]

From a few more details that have dribbled out in the Detroit papers, it looks like the trade originally included an agreement for the Lions to pay the $1 million roster bonus. That was apparently the sticking point for the league -- I'm guessing they said they couldn't do that until it was actually due, which would have been 12:01 March 1. That created the time for another team to come in at the last minute, and Cleveburg did.

[Bengals1]

From a few more details that have dribbled out in the Detroit papers, it looks like the trade originally included an agreement for the Lions to pay the $1 million roster bonus. That was apparently the sticking point for the league -- I'm guessing they said they couldn't do that until it was actually due, which would have been 12:01 March 1. That created the time for another team to come in at the last minute, and Cleveburg did.

So do we know whether the Lions gave us a chance after the deal fell apart to agree to pay his 1mil bonus if that would satisfy the league?

Did Cleveland end up paying it? Is that why their deal went through and ours didn't?

It would be nice to place all the blame on Detroit here but it also wouldn't shock me to find out in the coming days that Mikey boy had the chance to alter the deal at the last minute and save the trade by agreeing to pay his bonus and refused. Did we not offer to pay his bonus because it's true we didn't have the 1mil remaining under our 2007 cap? Has that ever been verified?

I won't attack him for that until we know and I agree it looks right now that the blame here lies with the Lions. Just ask'n is all.....

[WKRP]

Yeah, it appears the $1 million goes against Browns 07 salary cap. Does that mean the Browns had to pay the $1 million up front?

If Browns paid $1 mill + their best CB + 3 rounder for Rogers. Wow, a lot out the door for a risky pickup!

[HoosierCat]

Did Cleveland end up paying it?

I would assume so. If the league said the Lions couldn't pay it for us, then they couldn't pay it for Cleveland, either.

It would be nice to place all the blame on Detroit here but it also wouldn't shock me to find out in the coming days that Mikey boy had the chance to alter the deal at the last minute and save the trade by agreeing to pay his bonus and refused.

I don't know if Mikey offered to pay the bonus or not, but even if he had, the Browns' offer would have still trumped ours. Reporting out of Cleveland is that the browns had been in contact with the Lions about Rogers since the combine. And the Lions best-case scenario for trading Rogers supposedly included a starting corner.

[Bengals1]

Did Cleveland end up paying it?

I would assume so. If the league said the Lions couldn't pay it for us, then they couldn't pay it for Cleveland, either.

It would be nice to place all the blame on Detroit here but it also wouldn't shock me to find out in the coming days that Mikey boy had the chance to alter the deal at the last minute and save the trade by agreeing to pay his bonus and refused.

I don't know if Mikey offered to pay the bonus or not, but even if he had, the Browns' offer would have still trumped ours. Reporting out of Cleveland is that the browns had been in contact with the Lions about Rogers since the combine. And the Lions best-case scenario for trading Rogers supposedly included a starting corner.

Okay, well if we couldn't pay the 1mil because of salery cap restraints and that was the only way we could get the deal than that's that I suppose.

If Cleveland swung in right afterward and had the money then what are you gonna' do?

I suppose in a weird way this does make me feel better. I am curious about one thing though, if Cleveland had been so interested in him from waaaaay back how come the Lions were dealing with us first?

[HoosierCat]

I am curious about one thing though, if Cleveland had been so interested in him from waaaaay back how come the Lions were dealing with us first?

It sounds like the Browns were interested, but I would bet they dropped out of the conversation after getting Williams from GB. But once the deal got held up, the Lions, knowing they used to have an interest, called to offer them one more shot. Do you really want a division rival to get a Pro Bowl caliber DT for basically nothing? Hey, we really like that Bodden kid and he's fallen on your depth chart...how about him and your third?

So in the end the Bengals get used to leverage a better deal elsewhere...not exactly an unusual occurance.

[HairOnFire]

I don't know if Mikey offered to pay the bonus or not, but even if he had, the Browns' offer would have still trumped ours.

Under the salary cap scenario you passed along earlier it seems almost certain the Bengals couldn't agree to pay the bonus because it had to count against last years cap, which they had already exceeded. And there's the rub because once the NFL made that ruling the Bengals were prevented from making any trade for Rogers, regardless of whether or not they were willing to improve their offer.

[Bengals1]

It sounds like the Browns were interested, but I would bet they dropped out of the conversation after getting Williams from GB. But once the deal got held up, the Lions, knowing they used to have an interest, called to offer them one more shot. Do you really want a division rival to get a Pro Bowl caliber DT for basically nothing? Hey, we really like that Bodden kid and he's fallen on your depth chart...how about him and your third?

So in the end the Bengals get used to leverage a better deal elsewhere...not exactly an unusual occurance.

Yeah, I can see all that happening. Heh, maybe we are cursed?

[HoosierCat]

I don't know if Mikey offered to pay the bonus or not, but even if he had, the Browns' offer would have still trumped ours.

Under the salary cap scenario you passed along earlier it seems almost certain the Bengals couldn't agree to pay the bonus because it had to count against last years cap, which they had already exceeded. And there's the rub because once the NFL made that ruling the Bengals were prevented from making any trade for Rogers, regardless of whether or not they were willing to improve their offer.

I tend now towards believing that salary cap explanation was wrong -- how could a 2008 roster bonus have to count in 2007? -- but there may be some quirk in the NFL's salcap Rube Goldberg machine that says that.

Here's an interesting timeline, from a Free Press reporter's blog...some emphasis added.

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article...ORTS01/80301040

A little after 4 p.m. – after the NFL had made the transaction official, when there was no chance it could fall through – the Lions finally announced they had traded Shaun Rogers to Cleveland.

President Matt Millen and coach Rod Marinelli were unavailable for comment. But Browns coach Romeo Crennel said it all a few hours earlier at a news conference in Cleveland.

“Hey, this is the NFL,” Crennel said, “and sometimes crazy things happen.”

This was crazy.

The Lions agreed to trade Rogers to Cincinnati for third- and fifth-round draft picks Friday. But the deal fell through, and the Lions turned around and got a better deal.

They traded Rogers to Cleveland for a third-round pick and cornerback Leigh Bodden, a 26-year-old, five-year veteran who started 16 games and intercepted six passes last season.

Here’s how it all went down:

The Lions were listening to offers from several teams for Rogers, the immensely talented but often underachieving defensive tackle. Cleveland general manager Phil Savage said he talked to Millen repeatedly at the scouting combine in Indianapolis and continued talking to him after they returned to their respective cities.

The Browns traded a second-round pick to Green Bay for defensive tackle Corey Williams on Friday. Savage said he continued to talk to Millen but “just kind of wavered a little bit” about trading for Rogers, too.

The Lions agreed to trade Rogers to Cincinnati. The Lions confirmed the news about 3 p.m. The Bengals did not confirm it, but their Web site reported it along with many media outlets.

“Ultimately they found a different trading partner, and we essentially thought it was over with,” Savage said. “I texted Matt and said, ‘Hey, congratulations. If something changes or something were to happen, you know, let us know.’

“And about 5 o’clock last night he called me back and said that the trade had not worked. It had fallen through. Would we still be interested? And we were.”

Details are sketchy.

The Browns’ Web site gave this account of what happened: The NFL office rescinded the Lions-Bengals trade, and the Lions called the Browns to say Rogers was still available.

The Bengals’ Web site said this: “Apparently during the delay after the trade was turned into the league office, the Lions went to the Browns to get a deal and got the player they wanted, cornerback Leigh Bodden, instead of the two picks.”

The Cincinnati Enquirer reported the sticking point with the Bengals deal was an NFL interpretation of the $1 million roster bonus Rogers is due today. The league would not confirm that.

“This is team business and not appropriate for us to comment,” NFL spokesman Greg Aiello wrote in an e-mail.

Whatever went wrong, the Lions made a new deal with the Browns.

“It was a crazy day yesterday, as crazy as we’ve had since I’ve been here,” Savage said.

Apparently it was bittersweet for Millen, but sweet for Savage.

Asked about Rogers’ problems in Detroit, Savage said: “That’s a lot of talk out there. Obviously we’ve talked to Shaun about him coming to Cleveland, that possibility. He seemed to be excited about it. I think the situation, the environment, this will be a fresh start, a new lease on life for him.

“Matt Millen would say the same thing. He loves Shaun Rogers, and he told me yesterday, ‘I’ve already told my people, “Now that they’ve added Shaun Rogers and Corey Williams together, wow.” ’ Because he really thinks a lot of Shaun. But unfortunately it wasn’t going to work out there for him, so he needed a change of scenery.”

Meanwhile, Yahoo! Sports reports the Lions have already begun looking for Rogers’ replacement and are slated to host two Seattle defensive tackles – Chuck Darby and Ellis Wyms. Darby will visit Tuesday, Wyms on Thursday.

[Bengals1]

Nice find Hoosier, that explains a lot.

[HoTbOy]

If the case is that the Bengals didn't want to pay the bonus that another team is supposed to pay, well I don't know if I can blame them for that...The Cleveland deal sounded a little better giving up LBodden, but if you stop the run and put pressure on the QB it does not matter who is covering to get an INT...So even though I would have loved to get SRogers, I think I would have waited for 12:01 also, and let Detroit pay his roster bonus...

[Pidge]

See now, if a 2008 bonus counts against the 2007 cap then that is f**ked up. What kind of half assed system is that? Total bulls**t happenings. Nevermind, we tried, got screwed and we'll move on.

*sigh*