Front office showdown coming?

[HairOnFire]

I just finished watching Chris Mortensen's review of the "coaches on the hot seat" segment and he mentioned that Marvin Lewis is pushing for some big front office changes including the scouting staff. Mort said Marvin is in a safe position but it sets the stage for a possible showdown with MB and Co. should the refuse his requests.

What do you think Hair? Do you think your uncle Mike will go for that? How dare he criticize the organizational skills of your kin. Let him have it!

I will answer it for him...(just as the person who answers Mike Brown's office phone says):

"You should just be happy to still have an NFL team, we could've moved."

Correction: "Should have moved."

As for the rant, by all accounts Marvin and Mikey have as solid a relationship as any Bengal head coach has ever had, and I'm sure Marvin is no stranger to lobbying for changes. In fact, the theme of his first season at the helm was changing everything...so if he wants additional changes then I'm sure Lewis will not only voice his concerns but already knows the strongest way to make his case.

That said, I seriously doubt there will be a "showdown".

[Pidge]

Ford & Millen may be boobs, but at least their goal is to win a Super Bowl. I do believe the only time SOP has uttered Super Bowl was in relation to how much it costs to go. His big word is competitive.

lol. True, their intentions are pure. Not sure sure which is worse. Ineptitude or cynicism.

Millen is a mentally constipated f*ckrag who, regardless of his goal, should be chased out of Detroit !!!

Sort of like what should be happening with Chuckie here. They could be related...

WHODEY !!!

[Bengals44]

I think the root of this goes way back to when Art Modell got hold of the Browns team and eventually fired Paul Brown even though he was one of the founders of the franchise. The corporate line with the Bengals is to trust no one outside of the family because of what Modell did even though the Brown family now owns the Bengals. I think one of the reasons Bill Walsh was passed over was because they were afraid that somehow he would become too powerful. They have some kind of family pact to never let the Modell thing happen again.

good point, total control is always the issue...

[Big Hugg]

I don't know how the hell Bill Rabinowitz managed to get this out of Marvin Lewis:

Q: Five years as coach probably puts you in the top half of the league in terms of longevity. Are you as energized as ever?

A: Oh yeah, I am. Every year is a new year and provides new challenges. They all become the history of the last one. You've got to use it and move forward and move on. It's time for us to blow the whole thing up and start from scratch. We need to empty these shelves, empty these offices and start from scratch.

Q: Really?

A: Yeah, because we haven't been good enough. We're not going to sit here and be complacent with it, and guys have to understand that. It hasn't been good enough.

Q: When you say blow it up…

A: We've got to start from scratch. We have to blow it up and empty everything. Just like new people walking in this door and go from there. That's the only way we're going to shake away from the cobwebs. We've established a certain plateau or work ethic and we've got to move beyond that.

He says a lot more too: http://dispatch.com/live/content/bengals/s...JK.html?sid=101

[Pidge]

Says some interesting stuff there. Let's hope it isn't just talk and and some feathers are ruffled. Please don't re-sign Justin. Just not worth the money. League minimum ok, anything more is overpaying for a DE who can't f&*%ing rush the QB.

[Bobcat Bengal]

Well, if there was anytime to do it, it would be this year.

We have quite a few draft picks, so hopefully we will be able to shake things up.

I don't know about blowing the whole thing up though, there are definitely pieces for building a foundation.

[BengalChamps]

I really dont trust Marvin to do what he says he will do anymore. These comments seem motivated by trying to keep ticket holders interested. Does anyone really trust him to deal with the cancers on this team? or to be able to attract free agents? or to STOP SPENDING HIGH DRAFT PICKS ON RUNNING BACKS!?

He wouldnt have had to make these comments if he had drafted more wisely.

[bengalboomer7]

I really dont trust Marvin to do what he says he will do anymore. These comments seem motivated by trying to keep ticket holders interested. Does anyone really trust him to deal with the cancers on this team? or to be able to attract free agents? or to STOP SPENDING HIGH DRAFT PICKS ON RUNNING BACKS!?

He wouldnt have had to make these comments if he had drafted more wisely.

It's not that he's drafted so poorly, he's just had some bad luck with it. Pollack =career over? Thurman=same thing? perry,, Irons, Henry. blah blah. We just lost too many top picks

[GregCook]

Well, if there was anytime to do it, it would be this year.

We have quite a few draft picks, so hopefully we will be able to shake things up.

I don't know about blowing the whole thing up though, there are definitely pieces for building a foundation.

Carson Palmer in his media appearances takes all the blame for the offense's offensive play whereas Marvin largely shields Carson from blame. Marvin singles out Chad and Henry for blame of not running correct routes or blocking the right guy or not knowing enough on game day. When asked if Chad would be a off-season problem he said he's signed thru 2011; when asked if Henry will be back, he said "I don't know" even though he's signed thru 2009. Definitely doesn't look good for the kid. Definitely means a WR could be a first day pick in 2008.

Marvin also said this "It's been (that way) all the time. We've struggled with guys who are too much worried about what they make or what the next guy makes. That's hard to overcome, and we've had to deal with it for two years now. "

So what Bengal has been bitchin for 2 years? In early 2006, these players signed extensions:

Chad Johnson

Jeremi Johnson

Tony Stewart

Bobbie Williams

Antonio Chatman

Dexter Jackson

Rashad Jeanty

I'd think its Chad and Dexter and I wouldn't be surprised if neither is with the Bengals next season.

[Pidge]

Dexter is welcome to leave. I'll help him pack.

[Kirkendall]

To me, this is Marvin's most revealing, if not best, interview. He's bluntly honest about things he's been implying for the past two seasons -- players being selfish. He finally goes into detail without saying names. While I know the cloak and dagger type of comments he's made in the past, I get the impression that Lewis truly is as frustrated -- if not more -- than we are.

I don't usually put much weight on what Lewis says. This? Yea, I'm believing more about this than I have with Lewis in the past.

But talk is easy. Let's see it.

[bengalboomer7]

Overall, I liked it. Despite PFT reports, Chad isn't going anywhere, in fact, marvin made it a point to state Chad had a longer contract than him. Henry's case is another story. I like how he put it on his football too.

At least so far he's saying the right things

[Kirkendall]

Overall, I liked it. Despite PFT reports, Chad isn't going anywhere, in fact, marvin made it a point to state Chad had a longer contract than him.

To be fair, they've never said he's leaving. Just connecting the dots of what Chad is saying along with their own impressions. I don't think anyone is saying that he is leaving. Just that it could happen with all the knowns and many assumptions.

Personally, I think he should go.

[AMC]

Bengals starters next year

QB: Palmer

RB: Rudi Johnson

FB: J. Johnson

WR: Chad Johnson

WR: TJ

TE: Kelly

LT: Levi Jones

LG: Whitworth

C: Guy-check

RG: B. Williams

RT: Andrews

DE: V. Gholston

DT: Thornton

DT: Peko

DE: Geathers

LB: Landon

LB: Brooks

LB: Jeanty

CB: Hall

CB: Joseph

S: Marvin White

S: Ndukwe

Not that much change, and not that much of a stretch. Youth in the secondary and continuity on the O-line....

[Oldcat]

Overall, I liked it. Despite PFT reports, Chad isn't going anywhere, in fact, marvin made it a point to state Chad had a longer contract than him.

To be fair, they've never said he's leaving. Just connecting the dots of what Chad is saying along with their own impressions. I don't think anyone is saying that he is leaving. Just that it could happen with all the knowns and many assumptions.

Personally, I think he should go.

I think the person referred to is Deltha O'Neill.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Overall, I liked it. Despite PFT reports, Chad isn't going anywhere, in fact, marvin made it a point to state Chad had a longer contract than him.

To be fair, they've never said he's leaving. Just connecting the dots of what Chad is saying along with their own impressions. I don't think anyone is saying that he is leaving. Just that it could happen with all the knowns and many assumptions.

Personally, I think he should go.

I think the person referred to is Deltha O'Neill.

I believe you are correct on Deltha.

Marvin can scapegoat certain players all he wants though, that happens here every year. Players change, results stay the same. Therefore I'm led to believe, as most of us know and have talked about ad nauseum, the problems with being consistent, respectable winners in the NFL lies in the PBS offices, ownership to scouting to coaching. Why do you trade for Deltha if he's such a problem Marvin? It was a good trade based on talent/need and what he gave up ultimately, but geesh he's the one drafts idiots like Henry and Odell, and trades for Deltha. Then he does nothing but complain about those players' attitudes and effort constantly. When does Marvin hold himself accountable for his mistakes?

Go ahead, bring in more/new mediocre players and bad draft picks (along with a few good ones per the norm), they'll get sick of it here in a few years just like everyone else.

[Kirkendall]

Overall, I liked it. Despite PFT reports, Chad isn't going anywhere, in fact, marvin made it a point to state Chad had a longer contract than him.

To be fair, they've never said he's leaving. Just connecting the dots of what Chad is saying along with their own impressions. I don't think anyone is saying that he is leaving. Just that it could happen with all the knowns and many assumptions.

Personally, I think he should go.

I think the person referred to is Deltha O'Neill.

I believe you are correct on Deltha.

See, I don't. I think he's talking about more than one player. Especially when he's talking about groups of people. You don't say "blow the whole thing up" while admitting that players are more concern about getting hurt and comparing salaries thinking they should receive more money. That's not something to be said about one guy.

[Bengals44]

Overall, I liked it. Despite PFT reports, Chad isn't going anywhere, in fact, marvin made it a point to state Chad had a longer contract than him.

To be fair, they've never said he's leaving. Just connecting the dots of what Chad is saying along with their own impressions. I don't think anyone is saying that he is leaving. Just that it could happen with all the knowns and many assumptions.

Personally, I think he should go.

I think the person referred to is Deltha O'Neill.

I believe you are correct on Deltha.

See, I don't. I think he's talking about more than one player. Especially when he's talking about groups of people. You don't say "blow the whole thing up" while admitting that players are more concern about getting hurt and comparing salaries thinking they should receive more money. That's not something to be said about one guy.

Certainly from those words, one would have to agree with what you say... Ridding of one or two guys is not "blowing it up"...

[cincyhokie]

Bengals starters next year

QB: Palmer

RB: Rudi Johnson

FB: J. Johnson

WR: Chad Johnson

WR: TJ

TE: Kelly

LT: Levi Jones

LG: Whitworth

C: Guy-check

RG: B. Williams

RT: Andrews

DE: V. Gholston

DT: Thornton

DT: Peko

DE: Geathers

LB: Landon

LB: Brooks

LB: Jeanty

CB: Hall

CB: Joseph

S: Marvin White

S: Ndukwe

Not that much change, and not that much of a stretch. Youth in the secondary and continuity on the O-line....

I don't see next year having this little of change, here's how I see things potentially working out:

QB: Palmer

RB: Rudi Johnson- I think Rudi will be given a CHANCE. If he doesn't produce, he's gone.

FB: J. Johnson

WR: Chad Johnson

WR: TJ

TE: Kelly- I think Kelly will split time with a pass catching TE. Or I hope so.

LT: Levi Jones

LG: Whitworth

C: Guy-check- Bluto is gone. I don't know who will step in, but he is not going to be the starter

RG: B. Williams

RT: Andrews- I think Andrews leaves. Bengals start Willie and draft his replacement.

DE: V. Gholston- yeah anyone but Justin Smith.

DT: Thornton- Good lord I hope not. There's got to be a new D-line.

DT: Peko- Peko's proven he's a servicable backup, that's it. We should have 2 new starters on D-line next year.

DE: Geathers

LB: Landon- I think Landon goes.

LB: Brooks

LB: Jeanty

CB: Hall

CB: Joseph

S: Marvin White

S: Ndukwe

Good article from the Dispatch. Very surprising to see Marvin say those things about the future of the team. It actually gives me hope.

[BengalszoneBilly]

Certainly from those words, one would have to agree with what you say... Ridding of one or two guys is not "blowing it up"...

I think trading/releasing a minimum of 5 to 6 players and s**t canning both offensive and defensive coordinators would be the kind of detonation I'm hoping to see.

Who I'd like to go besides coaching staff? Bryan Robinson, (talked a good game when he was signed, rarely brought it with him to the field - looks like he's packed anyway) John Thornton, (peaked way back in 2003 with 6 sacks, with definite spotty play against the run) Rudi Johnson, (he's long in the tooth, especially for a RB) Dexter Jackson, (how this guy was ever a Superbowl MVP is beyond me) and Chris Perry. (simply not durable enough for the NFL)

[Kazkal]

LT: Levi Jones

LG: Whitworth

C: Guy-check

RG: B. Williams

RT: Andrews

I really hope they move Whitworth IMO he's best option for the position.

[GregCook]

Marvin the mad bomber? Easily done if you look at the numbers and must be done if you look at team stats.

He has maybe 10 draft picks to work with plus 4 or 5 free agent signings to allow around a 25-30% turnover from 2007 to 2008, not counting the long IR list.

Throw in the season long IR guys like Chris Perry, Irons, Brooks, Henderson, Kilmer and the Bengals in 2008 won't look anything like the 2007 edition.

Marvin could suit up about 20 players in 2008 that didn't suit up in 2007.

But Marvin is saying what must be said. Bengals rank 21 out of 32 in rushing offense; rank 25th in passing defense; rank 23rd in rushing defense. Only in pass offense do they look good, 7th. Marvin has a rebuilding job to do in 2008 and 2009 and that interview shows Marvin knows it.

In about 11 minutes the Pats play the Giants. I'm thinking there will be no perfect season in 2007, Pats lose.

[HairOnFire]

It's time for us to blow the whole thing up and start from scratch. We need to empty these shelves, empty these offices and start from scratch.

"Empty these offices..."

Maybe I'm reading too much into it but that sounds like certain members of the coaching staff....and maybe the front office....get a hand grenade lobbed into their foxhole.

[COB]

That interview amazes me. A few things I took from it:

Marvins wants a GM. When asked about it, instead of saying no, we're fine the way we are, he says it's not his department or decision or whatever. He probably figures to gain an ally in personnel debates.

Some coaches are definitely getting fired.

Was it BRob that already cleaned out his locker? I suspect he and some other D-linemen spent the season whining about how much money Smith made relative to the poverty they all have to endure. Deltha's been griping about cash since his big year. The prom queen's new agent made some noise at the start of the season about wanting to renegotiate his deal at the end of this year. Could be a TO-like move, where the new agent wants the old deal negated so he can get a piece of the new signing bonus. Tough sledding with the year Chad's had. He even lets his agent down when it's crunch time.

I'm encouraged by Marvin's candor, and the resolve embedded in some of the stuff he says. But he's been trying to rid that locker room of the selfishness and petty bulls**t for several years. Wonder who's been stopping him?

[Bengals1]

I wonder why it is Marvin chose to speak so candidly with a reporter in Columbus rather than speak like this to one of the local Cincinnati beat writers?