Chris Carter - Is this Chad's last year in Cincy?

[Bengals1]

Chris Carter - It wouldn't surprise me if this was Chad Johnson's last season with the Cincinnati Bengals. It's clear that quarterback Carson Palmer is their franchise player and I don't see him going anywhere anytime soon. And if there's a situation in which key players aren't on the same page – whether it's an altercation, disagreement or a failure to communicate – then it's not of the question that someone gets released or traded. In this case, it definitely would be Chad and not Carson.

In terms of teams that are in dire need of a wide receiver, the Atlanta Falcons instantly come to mind. In addition, the Tennessee Titans have the worst receiving corps in the league; and of course, the Minnesota Vikings are lacking a marquee guy at wide receiver

[CJBestInAFC]

Any chance the Titans franchise Haynesworth and the Bengals trade CJ straight up for him? That would be a nice deal and then draft Kenny Phillips in the first round. Shawn Crable, Xavier Adibi, or Ali Highsmith in the second round. Then take DE Kendell Langford of Hampton 6'6" 290lbs in the third. I think that upgrades the defense considerably, and gives the Bengals a good foundation for the future. It upgrades the middle of the defense, DT, LB, and S all need to be upgraded. Your thoughts?

[AMC]

If they somehow trade CJ I hope they don't get fleeced....

[agreen_112]

Any chance the Titans franchise Haynesworth and the Bengals trade CJ straight up for him? That would be a nice deal and then draft Kenny Phillips in the first round. Shawn Crable, Xavier Adibi, or Ali Highsmith in the second round. Then take DE Kendell Langford of Hampton 6'6" 290lbs in the third. I think that upgrades the defense considerably, and gives the Bengals a good foundation for the future. It upgrades the middle of the defense, DT, LB, and S all need to be upgraded. Your thoughts?

My thoughts.... Keep dreaming, Chad ain't going nowhere.

[akiliklingler]

It would be nice if we could trade CJ. However, not for Haynesworth, he's trouble - suspended 5 games last year and now the AP is reporting that he and Pacman Jones had a confrontation this past weekend.

Is Chad replaceable? No!. Do I want to depend on Chris Henry? No! However, if we could get let's say the Falcons first and third round picks and draft some defensive guys then, although the offense suffers the defense would be improved and therefore the team would be improved.

Reasons to trade Chad:

1. He's a leader of the team and a headcase - which means the team's a headcase.

2. He does not show up during big games.

3. MOST IMPORTANT REASON TO TRADE CHAD:

IF TRADING CHAD ENABLES OUR DEFENSE TO BE ONE OF THE TOP 10 D- UNITS, CARSON IS GOOD ENOUGH TO KEEP OUR OFFENSE IN THE GAME.

Look at the Ravens teams of the past several years (not this year). If only their offense was average, look how many games they would have won with the defensive talent they had.

Defense wins championships. A strong D can carry an average O. I think we can all attest that a high-powered O cannot carry a porrous D.

[Kazkal]

Any chance the Titans franchise Haynesworth and the Bengals trade CJ straight up for him? That would be a nice deal and then draft Kenny Phillips in the first round. Shawn Crable, Xavier Adibi, or Ali Highsmith in the second round. Then take DE Kendell Langford of Hampton 6'6" 290lbs in the third. I think that upgrades the defense considerably, and gives the Bengals a good foundation for the future. It upgrades the middle of the defense, DT, LB, and S all need to be upgraded. Your thoughts?

I'd fire you as a gm on the spot for this move.

[HoosierCat]

Trading Chad Johnson is only going to get you one thing: a vastly increased chance that this guy is our first round pick next April:

[BZoner]

Trade Chad to the Falcons?, I bet Hue will just love that. LOL

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Trade Chad to the Falcons?, I bet Hue will just love that. LOL

Right now, I imagine Hue would take Rae Carruth if he can still catch.

[BengalszoneBilly]

Trade Chad to the Falcons?, I bet Hue will just love that. LOL

Right now, I imagine Hue would take Rae Carruth if he can still catch.

Rae Carruth is learning a whole new method of "catching" in prison!

[kingwilly]

I have been against the idea of moving Chad since the discussion started. I opposed this idea based on the fact that CJ is one of the finest players in this league, he works very hard and could be an emotional spark for the offense.

Since then, I have seen Chad whine, moan, quit on plays and generally drag this team down. He may not be talking to the media but he is also not playing to his ability on the field. Is it coaching? That is probably a big contributor but I do not see this getting better.

Why does Chad disappear in big games? double covered? sometimes...but he also has dropped many many passes he needed to catch.

How many false starts on 85? at least 5...and I consider this a lack of discipline...a result of a coaching staff that allows Chad to "be Chad".

I would now welome CJ getting traded, as long as the value was there in return. When CJ fumbled that pass vs the cards and then sat there like a total loser child, it sealed it for me.

This team does not need that. F-ing quitter.

[Kirkendall]

Is Chad replaceable?

Every player is replaceable.

[Kirkendall]

Something else to think about. Won't we get a nice compensation pick for losing Eric Steinbach? Third round? I say we go and trade most of our guys and rebuild. It's quick and the surest way at the quickest turn around.

Then, the realization of Lewis historical picks dawns on me forcing me to conclude: That's the WORST idea of all time.

Though I do think we get a first-day (well, third round, if that's the first day anymore) compensation pick.

Yea, no?

[HoosierCat]

Something else to think about. Won't we get a nice compensation pick for losing Eric Steinbach? Third round? I say we go and trade most of our guys and rebuild. It's quick and the surest way at the quickest turn around.

Then, the realization of Lewis historical picks dawns on me forcing me to conclude: That's the WORST idea of all time.

Yup.

Though I do think we get a first-day (well, third round, if that's the first day anymore) compensation pick.

Yea, no?

We ought to get a 3rd for Steiny. TJ Jackson was doing a thread back in March on the NFL board, based of the extensive work of some guy on the 'net who has sussed out the NFL's arcane formula for awarding comp picks. Bottom line is we could end up netting the max 4 comp picks, including IIRC an extra 4th as well as a 3rd.

EDIT: here's TJ's thread: http://forums.bengalszone.com/index.php?showtopic=14829

[HairOnFire]

TJ's guesstimate:

Pick 1 - r3 - comp for the loss of Eric Steinbach (Cleveland) - no offsetting FA signed by Bengals

Pick 2 - r4 - comp for the loss of Tory James and Kelly Washington (New England) - no offsetting FA signed by Bengals

Pick 3 - r6 - comp for the loss of Kevin Kaesviharn (New Orleans) - no offsetting FA signed by Bengals

Pick 4 - r7 - comp for the loss of Anthony Wright (NY Giants) - no offseting FA signed by Bengals

My take? Everything feels right except for the 2nd pick...which feels way too high.

[HoosierCat]

Yeah, the 4th is a question mark. Tory James is out of the equation since he didn't make the roster in NE. Kwash, however, did. In the end, the biggest determinant for comp picks appears to be the size of the contract signed, and Washinton signed a 5-year, $22 million deal. However, that was heavily backloaded and had just a $300k signing bonus. I have no idea how that will count re: comp picks -- do they judge it by the "real" money or the BS cash?

[sparky151]

AdamJT13 of KFFL is the guy who has the formula down. It's officially a secret but his predictions are extremely accurate. It's based on number of players lost minus players signed. The round is determined mainly by the amount paid in the first season with some modification for playing time and post season honors.

Steinach signed a big contract, will start every game (unless he gets hurt), and with their upgraded line might be in line for pro bowl consideration. That should get us a 3rd rounder. Washington won't get us much but Kaesviharn should get us another pick.

[ArmyBengal]

I to, have been against trading Chad and would still rahter have him than not, but you have to think that something has to give and can't rule out anyone getting traded if it means an overall upgrade to this team...

WHODEY !!!

[ShulaSteakhouse]

What about Kevin Walter? He's a starter and putting up noticeable #'s.

When you look at all these guys the Bengals' lost, and replaced them with basically no one, I guess it shouldn't be a suprise they're worse than last year and it's snow balling, based on that alone almost.

No depth and a couple of key injuries and they're doomed. Not built to win or withstand a full season.

Poor management per the norm.

[Kirkendall]

What about Kevin Walter? He's a starter and putting up noticeable #'s.

That's misleading Shula. Walter doesn't have CJ, TJ and Henry to battle for the ball in Houston. Even so, his '07 numbers are misleading. In a 17-37 loss to Jacksonville, he caught 12 passes for 160 yards. That's 26-27% of his season totals in one game.

I know you're point is that we would have had a #3 WR during the eight-game stretch. But I doubt Walter would have been with us after '06 anyway. Going into this season, we still had the talent, not to just be good, but to have another powerful and potent offense. The pieces were in place. Then the injuries to our line and ineffective play by others took over.

I still think this team's biggest issue is simply effort.

[Kirkendall]

I to, have been against trading Chad and would still rahter have him than not, but you have to think that something has to give and can't rule out anyone getting traded if it means an overall upgrade to this team...

WHODEY !!!

Exactly AB. I made this point on my blog about a month ago.

The team needs to start figuring out what to do for 2008.

If they...

...decide to rebuild. Then trading Chad might work out. Gives you a better chance to rebuild with whatever philosophy the team decides to go in. A balanced team. Defense oriented? Whatever. If the team chooses now that they need to rebuild -- something I'd be more than willing to support -- then no one is safe... well, except Carson.

If this is the case, then I would support keeping Lewis on hand. The Bengals is his first effort as head coach. With one project under his belt, he may have learned how to do it and might do it better. And remember, this team improved BIG TIME after Lewis' rookie head coach run. As with every position, experience is added and perhaps it's done better.

...decide to go for another playoff run. Then you have to keep CJ. We would get nothing to replace him in terms of production and talent for '08. But that's where the Marvin Lewis argument comes in. Lewis has struggled to get this team righted in the past year and a half WITH the personnel we have -- which is why the point above would be vastly different from this argument. Perhaps we need someone that can managed this team better? Who knows.

But it's getting close for this team to start thinking which direction they need to go in 2008.

[TJJackson]

They won't trade Chad because

a) Mike Brown's primary goal is asses in seats

and

Mike Brown has final say on everything

and

c) Chad puts asses in seats

When Chad stops putting asses in seats, he'll be tradeable.

[BengalszoneBilly]

Exactly AB. I made this point on my blog about a month ago.

The team needs to start figuring out what to do for 2008.

If they...

...decide to rebuild. Then trading Chad might work out.

Blasphemy! Heresy! Why? Because I just bought his damn Jersey!

[HoosierCat]

They won't trade Chad because it would be stupid beyond words. Period. End of story.

[Bengals1]

They won't trade Chad because it would be stupid beyond words. Period. End of story.

Far be it for the Bungles to do anything stupid, huh Hoosier?