would marvin lewis be fired this offseason

[cantonbengal]

I am darn tired of all this crap from the bengals. losing to the clowns what the f**k was that.

I have been a bengals fan since 1986. Alot of losing seaons in there .

i was real happy when the bengals hired in marvin lewis because of his past being a great defensive coordinator. What the hell happen to him bringing his skills to the bengals.

marvin having taken us to one playoff experenice was awesome.

But i truely believe there is lot more talent on this team than marvin lewis has them playing at.

so what i am saying is that if the bengals do anything less then the playoffs i beleive marvin lewis should be fired.

because i belive we are here to contend fo the superbowl.

not just 8-8 seasons every year

your number 1 canton ohio

bengals fan

[membengal]

Sam Wyche survived the 1987 debacle and took the team to the SB the following year.

I think ML is safe, even if this season is a total disaster. Mike B just doesn't cast coaches aside very quickly.

[James_Brooks21]

Sam Wyche survived the 1987 debacle and took the team to the SB the following year.

I think ML is safe, even if this season is a total disaster. Mike B just doesn't cast coaches aside very quickly.

Marvin Lewis will definately not be fired this offseason for on field issues, but if the Bengals continue to get in trouble off the field this year he will be in trouble. Marvin deserves better even if we have a bad season this year, but I do expect for the Bengals to pick it up after this weekend debacle.

[GregCook]

Sam Wyche survived the 1987 debacle and took the team to the SB the following year.

I think ML is safe, even if this season is a total disaster. Mike B just doesn't cast coaches aside very quickly.

Marvin Lewis will definately not be fired this offseason for on field issues, but if the Bengals continue to get in trouble off the field this year he will be in trouble. Marvin deserves better even if we have a bad season this year, but I do expect for the Bengals to pick it up after this weekend debacle.

Marvin did a good job getting the Bengals off Jay Leno's bumbling joke routine. But he hasn't built a good defensive team, now in his 5th season, so when will he? Last weekend's game was textbook for why coaches get fired. How many more will Mike Brown live with? I don't know, but Marvin Lewis defenses continue to embarrass themselves year after year. Its coaching.

[Bengals1]

I wonder though if SoP would have the balls to tell Marvin he had to change DC's? And I wonder still what Marvin's reaction would be to such a demand?

[The PatternMaster]

Sam Wyche survived the 1987 debacle and took the team to the SB the following year.

I think ML is safe, even if this season is a total disaster. Mike B just doesn't cast coaches aside very quickly.

Marvin Lewis will definately not be fired this offseason for on field issues, but if the Bengals continue to get in trouble off the field this year he will be in trouble. Marvin deserves better even if we have a bad season this year, but I do expect for the Bengals to pick it up after this weekend debacle.

Marvin did a good job getting the Bengals off Jay Leno's bumbling joke routine. But he hasn't built a good defensive team, now in his 5th season, so when will he? Last weekend's game was textbook for why coaches get fired. How many more will Mike Brown live with? I don't know, but Marvin Lewis defenses continue to embarrass themselves year after year. Its coaching.

So because Leon Hall can't remember if he's playing man or zone the coaches need to be fired, because our d-line and lb's can shed blocks and make plays the coaches need to be fired.

Acquiring talented players is no small task, during Marvin's tenure as HC he has tried to build "his" defense but for whatever reason it hasn't worked out that way, yet.

Considering how he restored respectability to the franchise you would think the fans would be grateful and not call for the man's head everytime things get rough, but whatever. How many losing seasons have the Bengals had since he was the HC? None, wtf is the problem. Marvin is the reason why people expect to go to the SuperBowl, before he arrived most of you "fans" came to the game with paper bags on your heads, now you want to fire the man. It's ridiculous.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

It won't change consistently here, until a GM is brought in who can run the ship and manage the cap and roster every year, and given the same room to play with as every other similar franchise.

Until then, which will be never, or until Mike kicks it, just hope for that one lucky season to occur.

Free Agency and the cap basically killed Paul Brown's model, and Mike Brown is still living in the 60's and 70's, along with his success.

The Steelers, Packers and Colts are proof that small market franchises can be some of the most successful if you have good football brains in-place to manage rosters and scouting in the cap era (along with a franchise QB or the ability to develop a great defensive system year in and year out).

They tend to spend their money wisely, because they have to, and put a premium on scouting and drafting, and frugal free agent spending for the right players. They don't just skimp on everything and ignore the defense, while over-paying offensive skill players and drafting them in the 1st two rounds every year.

I actually don't have a big problem with Marvin, it's his boss that holds him back, and Marvin does a good job of biting his lip every year.

But I could do without the lame press conferences and attitude he carries with him.

[The PatternMaster]

It won't change consistently here, until a GM is brought in who can run the ship and manage the cap and roster every year, and given the same room to play with as every other similar franchise.

Until then, which will be never, or until Mike kicks it, just hope for that one lucky season to occur.

Free Agency and the cap basically killed Paul Brown's model, and Mike Brown is still living in the 60's and 70's, along with his success.

The Steelers, Packers and Colts are proof that small market franchises can be some of the most successful if you have good football brains in-place to manage rosters and scouting in the cap era (along with a franchise QB or the ability to develop a great defensive system year in and year out).

They tend to spend their money wisely, because they have to, and put a premium on scouting and drafting, and frugal free agent spending for the right players. They don't just skimp on everything and ignore the defense, while over-paying offensive skill players and drafting them in the 1st two rounds every year.

I actually don't have a big problem with Marvin, it's his boss that holds him back, and Marvin does a good job of biting his lip every year.

But I could do without the lame press conferences and attitude he carries with him.

If Marvin was perfect his name would be Jesus Christ, obviously the man has somethings to work on.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Sam Wyche survived the 1987 debacle and took the team to the SB the following year.

I think ML is safe, even if this season is a total disaster. Mike B just doesn't cast coaches aside very quickly.

Marvin Lewis will definately not be fired this offseason for on field issues, but if the Bengals continue to get in trouble off the field this year he will be in trouble. Marvin deserves better even if we have a bad season this year, but I do expect for the Bengals to pick it up after this weekend debacle.

Marvin did a good job getting the Bengals off Jay Leno's bumbling joke routine. But he hasn't built a good defensive team, now in his 5th season, so when will he? Last weekend's game was textbook for why coaches get fired. How many more will Mike Brown live with? I don't know, but Marvin Lewis defenses continue to embarrass themselves year after year. Its coaching.

So because Leon Hall can't remember if he's playing man or zone the coaches need to be fired, because our d-line and lb's can shed blocks and make plays the coaches need to be fired.

Acquiring talented players is no small task, during Marvin's tenure as HC he has tried to build "his" defense but for whatever reason it hasn't worked out that way, yet.

Considering how he restored respectability to the franchise you would think the fans would be grateful and not call for the man's head everytime things get rough, but whatever. How many losing seasons have the Bengals had since he was the HC? None, wtf is the problem. Marvin is the reason why people expect to go to the SuperBowl, before he arrived most of you "fans" came to the game with paper bags on your heads, now you want to fire the man. It's ridiculous.

And after 16 consecutive years with only one playoff loss to show for it, fans are sick and tired of the excuses, or settling for mediocrity. Whether it was Marvin who was brought in or anyone else, they'd get the same treatment.

In this day and age you can turn around a team in one season as long as you have a good QB - fans recognize that.

As I noted above, people need to recognize the real problem though - it's not so much Marvin as his public perception and the way he carries himself at times, the media is on him because he talks down to everybody and gives no insight and plays games. He's not making it easy on himself, whether he cares or not.

The FANS in this town deserve more than what they've been given for 16 years, period. They've stepped up to the plate, gave them a new stadium, sell out games, etc..., it's way past due for Mike Brown to step up and produce a consistent winner in return.

I don't think it's too much to ask, nor are we being too hard on the Bengals. They need to step up and start winning more consistently, regardless of who the coach is.

[The PatternMaster]

Sam Wyche survived the 1987 debacle and took the team to the SB the following year.

I think ML is safe, even if this season is a total disaster. Mike B just doesn't cast coaches aside very quickly.

Marvin Lewis will definately not be fired this offseason for on field issues, but if the Bengals continue to get in trouble off the field this year he will be in trouble. Marvin deserves better even if we have a bad season this year, but I do expect for the Bengals to pick it up after this weekend debacle.

Marvin did a good job getting the Bengals off Jay Leno's bumbling joke routine. But he hasn't built a good defensive team, now in his 5th season, so when will he? Last weekend's game was textbook for why coaches get fired. How many more will Mike Brown live with? I don't know, but Marvin Lewis defenses continue to embarrass themselves year after year. Its coaching.

So because Leon Hall can't remember if he's playing man or zone the coaches need to be fired, because our d-line and lb's can shed blocks and make plays the coaches need to be fired.

Acquiring talented players is no small task, during Marvin's tenure as HC he has tried to build "his" defense but for whatever reason it hasn't worked out that way, yet.

Considering how he restored respectability to the franchise you would think the fans would be grateful and not call for the man's head everytime things get rough, but whatever. How many losing seasons have the Bengals had since he was the HC? None, wtf is the problem. Marvin is the reason why people expect to go to the SuperBowl, before he arrived most of you "fans" came to the game with paper bags on your heads, now you want to fire the man. It's ridiculous.

And after 16 consecutive years with only one playoff loss to show for it, fans are sick and tired of the excuses, or settling for mediocrity. Whether it was Marvin who was brought in or anyone else, they'd get the same treatment.

In this day and age you can turn around a team in one season as long as you have a good QB - fans recognize that.

As I noted above, people need to recognize the real problem though - it's not so much Marvin as his public perception and the way he carries himself at times, the media is on him because he talks down to everybody and gives no insight and plays games. He's not making it easy on himself, whether he cares or not.

The FANS in this town deserve more than what they've been given for 16 years, period. They've stepped up to the plate, gave them a new stadium, sell out games, etc..., it's way past due for Mike Brown to step up and produce a consistent winner in return.

I don't think it's too much to ask, nor are we being too hard on the Bengals. They need to step up and start winning more consistently, regardless of who the coach is.

I agree but firing the head coach isn't going to help turn this team into a winner.

Look at San Diego, they can barely score a TD with their new HC who is an offensive genius. Firing people isn't always the best move, alot of the best moves are the ones you don't make.

I think people underestimate how hard it is to coach in the NFL, if it was as easy as everyone makes it out to be then coaches wouldn't get fired every year.

[711chad]

firing marvin is certainly not the answer... at least not now

[GregCook]

Sam Wyche survived the 1987 debacle and took the team to the SB the following year.

I think ML is safe, even if this season is a total disaster. Mike B just doesn't cast coaches aside very quickly.

Marvin Lewis will definately not be fired this offseason for on field issues, but if the Bengals continue to get in trouble off the field this year he will be in trouble. Marvin deserves better even if we have a bad season this year, but I do expect for the Bengals to pick it up after this weekend debacle.

Marvin did a good job getting the Bengals off Jay Leno's bumbling joke routine. But he hasn't built a good defensive team, now in his 5th season, so when will he? Last weekend's game was textbook for why coaches get fired. How many more will Mike Brown live with? I don't know, but Marvin Lewis defenses continue to embarrass themselves year after year. Its coaching.

So because Leon Hall can't remember if he's playing man or zone the coaches need to be fired, because our d-line and lb's can shed blocks and make plays the coaches need to be fired.

Acquiring talented players is no small task, during Marvin's tenure as HC he has tried to build "his" defense but for whatever reason it hasn't worked out that way, yet.

Considering how he restored respectability to the franchise you would think the fans would be grateful and not call for the man's head everytime things get rough, but whatever. How many losing seasons have the Bengals had since he was the HC? None, wtf is the problem. Marvin is the reason why people expect to go to the SuperBowl, before he arrived most of you "fans" came to the game with paper bags on your heads, now you want to fire the man. It's ridiculous.

And after 16 consecutive years with only one playoff loss to show for it, fans are sick and tired of the excuses, or settling for mediocrity. Whether it was Marvin who was brought in or anyone else, they'd get the same treatment.

In this day and age you can turn around a team in one season as long as you have a good QB - fans recognize that.

As I noted above, people need to recognize the real problem though - it's not so much Marvin as his public perception and the way he carries himself at times, the media is on him because he talks down to everybody and gives no insight and plays games. He's not making it easy on himself, whether he cares or not.

The FANS in this town deserve more than what they've been given for 16 years, period. They've stepped up to the plate, gave them a new stadium, sell out games, etc..., it's way past due for Mike Brown to step up and produce a consistent winner in return.

I don't think it's too much to ask, nor are we being too hard on the Bengals. They need to step up and start winning more consistently, regardless of who the coach is.

I agree but firing the head coach isn't going to help turn this team into a winner.

Look at San Diego, they can barely score a TD with their new HC who is an offensive genius. Firing people isn't always the best move, alot of the best moves are the ones you don't make.

I think people underestimate how hard it is to coach in the NFL, if it was as easy as everyone makes it out to be then coaches wouldn't get fired every year.

Thing is, we have been hearing the same excuses for the last 3 years. Players out of gap. Trying to do too much. Mental mistakes. Yet the players keep changing while the coaching remains the same(on defense). This tells me that the coaches have not been effective in correcting the same mistakes made by different people.

[HairOnFire]

In this day and age you can turn around a team in one season as long as you have a good QB - fans recognize that.

Actually, you haven't recognized it. Lewis turned this franchise around in one year, and some would argue that he managed to do it with a very mediocre QB....winning 6 games more than the previous season. In short, he's already delivered what you're asking for.

He's also developed a rookie QB into one of the elite QB's in the entire NFL, produced a division championship and a playoff appearance in his 3rd season, and it's no longer cause for national headlines when the Bengals win games in September and October. Or have you forgotten those years when this team was eliminated from the playoff race before winning its first game?

I'd also give Lewis credit for turning around the losing culture that surrounded the Bengals for decades, but I'm no longer sure he was able to do that....as too many Bengal fans continue to whine about things that happened long before Lewis arrived.

As for the GM debate, it's unfair to cherry pick by naming only teams that are currently doing well. A quick glance in enough to prove that most inept teams also have GM's....or isn't that relevant?

[Spor_tees]

In this day and age you can turn around a team in one season as long as you have a good QB - fans recognize that.

Actually, you haven't recognized it. Lewis turned this franchise around in one year, and some would argue that he managed to do it with a very mediocre QB....winning 6 games more than the previous season. In short, he's already delivered what you're asking for.

He's also developed a rookie QB into one of the elite QB's in the entire NFL, produced a division championship and a playoff appearance in his 3rd season, and it's no longer cause for national headlines when the Bengals win games in September and October. Or have you forgotten those years when this team was eliminated from the playoff race before winning its first game?

I'd also give Lewis credit for turning around the losing culture that surrounded the Bengals for decades, but I'm no longer sure he was able to do that....as too many Bengal fans continue to whine about things that happened long before Lewis arrived.

As for the GM debate, it's unfair to cherry pick by naming only teams that are currently doing well. A quick glance in enough to prove that most inept teams also have GM's....or isn't that relevant?

I'm really not sure who's side you are taking with this argument. In one paragraph you are stating all the things Marvin has done, one of which was a 6 game turn around from a 2-14 season to a 8-8 season. I wouldn't exactly call that a miracle, did you expect back to back 2-14 seasons? The second one was the division title and playoff appearance. Yeah he took the team to the playoffs, but he has been here 4 years and produced only one winning season and one playoff appearance despite having one of the most talented offenses in the league. Then in another paragraph you talk about how you think Marvin has not turned around the losing culture of the team, which is pretty essential in being a successful head coach in the NFL. This whole argument is seeming extremely redundant in several threads.

The biggest problem here is many fans, myself included are tired of settling for not being the worst anymore, and instead wanting to be one of the best. The Bengals should have the talent to be there, and all the national media outlets have been saying for the last three years that the Bengals should be there, yet they are not. Why? There is only one answer, and it is coaching.

[Kazkal]

Marvin is not the problem,

He's doing the best he can with the tools he's given.plus I'm sure part problem is not having practice bubble

did you expect back to back 2-14 seasons?

-Before Marvin got here yes I would have.

Yeah he took the team to the playoffs, but he has been here 4 years and produced only one winning season and one playoff appearance despite having one of the most talented offenses in the league.

Year 1:He turns one of the worst franchises around Record:8-8

Year2:He finish .500 again but we also had carson starting his first year

Year 3:Chucky takes over Defense (it goes down hill) but Offense becauses a powerhouse 11-5 1 and done in playoffs with loss of carson

Year 4:Another season of 8-8 but without a few blown short FG's/XP's and we would have had a winning record and been in the playoffs.

Year 5:It's up in the air things aren't looking good with defense still looking like crap and Special teams going down hill with a ton of injurys.

Though things aren't looking bright but I Really don't see marvin as the problem,

[derekshank]

Marvin was a great hire to get this team out of the basement and make them a consistent contender. But I do admit that I wonder if Marvin is the guy to get this team from good to great. But here's the problem... if you fire him, you need to hire someone who can be quantifiably proven to be better than him.

I'm in real doubt that anyone who has the type of pedigree required to show Marvin the door would be available or willing to work in Cincinnati. Therefore, Marvin should be here to stay. I haven't seen enough evidence that he can't produce a champion to justify firing him yet (see Bill Cowher for what patience with a coach can produce).

[HairOnFire]

Then in another paragraph you talk about how you think Marvin has not turned around the losing culture of the team, which is pretty essential in being a successful head coach in the NFL.

Sorry, let me clarify. Marvin Lewis has done a great job of changing the losing culture that once existed within the franchise. Sadly, once you step off of the property you find yourself in Cincinnati, home to some seriously fugged up fans, many of whom still demand payback for things that happened long before Lewis arrived.

I hope that clears things up.

[HairOnFire]

Marvin was a great hire to get this team out of the basement and make them a consistent contender. But I do admit that I wonder if Marvin is the guy to get this team from good to great. But here's the problem... if you fire him, you need to hire someone who can be quantifiably proven to be better than him.

Exactly.

And for whatever it might be worth I think anyone who seriously suggests that Lewis be fired should be ignored if they can't provide a realistic short list of names who might be replacements.

So I guess I've finally defined what I'll call "The Steakhouse Challenge". That being, come up with the name of a better coach....who'll be available now or at seasons end, and last but not least......would be willing to come to Porkopolis.

[firemarvinNOW]

Marvin was a great hire to get this team out of the basement and make them a consistent contender. But I do admit that I wonder if Marvin is the guy to get this team from good to great. But here's the problem... if you fire him, you need to hire someone who can be quantifiably proven to be better than him.

Exactly.

And for whatever it might be worth I think anyone who seriously suggests that Lewis be fired should be ignored if they can't provide a realistic short list of names who might be replacements.

So I guess I've finally defined what I'll call "The Steakhouse Challenge". That being, come up with the name of a better coach....who'll be available now or at seasons end, and last but not least......would be willing to come to Porkopolis.

I believe money talks and a lot of coaches wouldnt mind having Palmer as there Qb. There is no differense to me in 4-12 and 8-8. Neither one gets you to the playoffs. The colts had a really good coach in Mora who took them from 3-13 to 13-3 but when they werent progressing he was fired and Dungy took over and they proggresivley got better.The last 2 years we have gotten worse.What I dont understand is you give him credit for turning things around the first 3 years, why dont you blame him for getting worse over the next 2 years? If we go 8-8 the next 5 years should he still be safe? The stadium is sold out the team is always in the hunt for a WC under these circumstances Brown will never fire him because Brown has what he wants a sold out stadium. Most fans will want to keep Marvin because Brown has the fans brainwashed to accept losing, everyone I know says at least were better than we were. Ive been a bengal fan since I was born in 1968 I have seen us in SBs and playoffs, before I die I want to see my team win a SB thats all I ask.I would rather win 1 SB and then have 30 straight losing seasons, than make the playoffs 30 straight years and never win the SB.

[Stripes]

The team hasn't gotten worse over the last two years. It was worse last season, and valid excuses are more than abundant to justify Marvin keeping his job.

This season?

Two football games.

[The PatternMaster]

Marvin was a great hire to get this team out of the basement and make them a consistent contender. But I do admit that I wonder if Marvin is the guy to get this team from good to great. But here's the problem... if you fire him, you need to hire someone who can be quantifiably proven to be better than him.

Exactly.

And for whatever it might be worth I think anyone who seriously suggests that Lewis be fired should be ignored if they can't provide a realistic short list of names who might be replacements.

So I guess I've finally defined what I'll call "The Steakhouse Challenge". That being, come up with the name of a better coach....who'll be available now or at seasons end, and last but not least......would be willing to come to Porkopolis.

I believe money talks and a lot of coaches wouldnt mind having Palmer as there Qb. There is no differense to me in 4-12 and 8-8. Neither one gets you to the playoffs. The colts had a really good coach in Mora who took them from 3-13 to 13-3 but when they werent progressing he was fired and Dungy took over and they proggresivley got better.The last 2 years we have gotten worse.What I dont understand is you give him credit for turning things around the first 3 years, why dont you blame him for getting worse over the next 2 years? If we go 8-8 the next 5 years should he still be safe? The stadium is sold out the team is always in the hunt for a WC under these circumstances Brown will never fire him because Brown has what he wants a sold out stadium. Most fans will want to keep Marvin because Brown has the fans brainwashed to accept losing, everyone I know says at least were better than we were. Ive been a bengal fan since I was born in 1968 I have seen us in SBs and playoffs, before I die I want to see my team win a SB thats all I ask.I would rather win 1 SB and then have 30 straight losing seasons, than make the playoffs 30 straight years and never win the SB.

Sounds like you are the contestant of the Steakhouse Challenge, please give a us a list of 3 coaches who you can prove are better than Marvin Lewis who would come to Cincy and are unemployed..

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Sounds like you are the contestant of the Steakhouse Challenge, please give a us a list of 3 coaches who you can prove are better than Marvin Lewis who would come to Cincy and are unemployed..

That's interesting. First, you can't prove something like that, because (as you well know) coaches with playoff pedigrees don't stay unemployed. I _don't_ think Marvin should be fired, but it's a good topic nonetheless, and I'm bored.

I'm not saying I'd take any of these guys over Marvin, but here are some general candidates for next year's coaching carousel:

* Marty Schottenheimer - sure he hasn't had postseason success but neither has Marvin.

* Bill Cowher - if he is pissed at the Rooneys, he might decide to pull a Pitino and come coach one of their rivals

* The Brothers Ryan - each will get attention, especially the one with the Raiders (is that Rex?) because of the low talent level there. Obviously they haven't been head coaches but I'd say they'll do a good job.

* Dom Capers - probably deserves another shot, Texans didn't have much when he was there.

* Jack Del Rio. I think he's a decent coach and there's a good chance he'll be fired.

* John Gruden - I thought he was going to get fired after this season, but now he probably won't with the good start. Good at taking a team to the next level. And we have a good QB, so he wouldn't fall prey to his Achilles heel, QB indecision.

* Jim Mora Jr. - probably a good coach if he decides what the heck he wants to do. May have talked his way out of the NFL though.

* Jim Fassel - might get some attention, whether he should or not is questionable

* Tom Coughlin - yeah, he's out of NY. Don't really want him. Might be done in the NFL.

* Hue Jackson - Got screwed with the timing of the Vick thing, but if he can turn that offense around he may get a shot in a few years. Deservedly so, in my opinion.

* Greg Williams - General assumption is that the Washington job is his when Gibbs retires.

[HoosierCat]

Good list, DC. I'd add Pete Carroll to the list. I thought he did a good job with the Jets given what he had to work with (nothing), and still cant understand why he only got a year. Prying him out of that cushy seat at USC would probably take more dough than the Bengals would ever consider spending on a head coach, tho.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Good list, DC. I'd add Pete Carroll to the list. I thought he did a good job with the Jets given what he had to work with (nothing), and still cant understand why he only got a year. Prying him out of that cushy seat at USC would probably take more dough than the Bengals would ever consider spending on a head coach, tho.

It would certainly take a lot to get Carroll! If I were him there's no way in hell I leave, but college coaches do get some stupid in them sometimes. If we're looking at college coaches I'd consider Rodriguez of WV too. Spread offense (don't call it the run-n-shoot!) is vogue again.

[Bengals1]

I hear Lloyd Carr might be available soon.