Bengals Defense

[buck3y3d]

Is anyone able to find a discernable difference between this year's defense and last years? The turnover margin is greater, but this is as much a credit to the offense as it is to the defense. The pass coverage is still solid but nowhere near outstanding, and the run defense is still awful.

Basically, i don't see a difference between Frasier and Bresnehan. The team still has an underachieving d-line (except for the fact that Clemons -even after his suspension- finds a way to make plays), an overaggresive linebacking core, and no ability to gain a push into the backfield. Simmons looked slow in training camp (from what i saw) and has played horribly this year. I hope that Johnson, Pollack, and Odell can turn into a stout unit, yet i still think personel is what has to make this defense improve.

I liked Frasier and i don't hate Bresnehan, but i really don't see any difference between their two defense (other than obvious formation changes) in which the end result is still the same.

[bengalboomer7]

I thought the Bengals adjusted well today in the second half. It's obvious our defense is still a work in porgress and I can inly hope it gets better as the season goes. i'd still rather have Chuck right now, but 842 turnovers will do that to ya

[CBin2k7]

I think you see less big plays with this Defense. They are making teams drive the length of the field on them, which usually means long drives and which could lead to mistakes. They don't seem to blitz as much as they did last year. I wouldn't exaclty call the d-line underachieving. I just don't think it was that good in the first place. Robinson and Thorton are average, Geathers is still very young and they play him out of position at DT on passing downs, and the extra attention seems to go to Justin Smith all the time.

Pollack is not a true speed rusher and Clemons is servicable but not great. I suspect the Bengals will upgrade their D-line a lot in the off season.

[HoosierCat]

I think you see less big plays with this Defense. They are making teams drive the length of the field on them, which usually means long drives and which could lead to mistakes. They don't seem to blitz as much as they did last year. I wouldn't exaclty call the d-line underachieving. I just don't think it was that good in the first place. Robinson and Thorton are average, Geathers is still very young and they play him out of position at DT on passing downs, and the extra attention seems to go to Justin Smith all the time.

Pollack is not a true speed rusher and Clemons is servicable but not great. I suspect the Bengals will upgrade their D-line a lot in the off season.

What he said.

[bengalsLB]

did thorton play vs the titans? it seemed liked shaun smith and B-ROB were the only DTs donig anything

i think our run D is better then last year... after odell's pick our entire D seemed to swarm to the ball on more on runs. KK played a hell of a game i now feel more comfortable with him starting for the rest of the season

[alleycat]

I thought the Bengals adjusted well today in the second half.

This has been the difference between this year and last. If they could only step up the adjustments into the first half!

Pass rush is actually substantially worse this year. I do think as Pollack improves and moves to linebacker we'll see some perimeter run contain problems cut down.

That said, the defense this year and last is remarkeably similar because most of our players on that perimeter are remarkably similar.

Landon Johnson was great at knifing through traffic in the middle and could use his speed to track down runners (though very rarely met them in the hole ala Odell). When he played the edge today he got sucked into the middle and blocked inside (allowing some runs that looked just like last week). He doesn't have the strength yet. Maybe he'll develop it, maybe not.

Brian Simmons still has some value in pass situations but he's been a liability, especially against the run. He seemed weak and slower last year and has only gotten worse. Hopefully Pollack can relieve him.

KK, as much as I am grateful for his performance in a couple of plays today, is generally late getting to the ball on run and pass plays (he also gets sucked into the box and loses contain when it's his responsibility).

Tory avoids making hits.

Madieu is great.

Deltha is good.

Our D line gets very little penatration across the board. Very few disruptions in the backfield. Again, pass rush is much worse than last year (if not for the Texan game (and their swinging door O line that everyone gets 7 sacks against) we'd have only TWO sacks on the year - worst in the league.

The biggest similarity as I see it, and the biggest problem, is that we still have a lot of people who simply aren't physical enough. Other than Odell, Madieu, Kiewan, Deltha (not always), B Rob and Smith, the rest of the team seems to wait for ball carriers and blockers to come to them rather than taking the hit to the opponent.

[BengalszoneBilly]

Is anyone able to find a discernable difference besides this year's defense and last years?

You have got to be kidding me. Ray Charles and Stevie Wonder both could see the difference between this years squad and last years!

Last years defensive squad would show up and play one week, and flat out disappear the next. Tell me you cannot have noticed THAT!

[alleycat]

One other observation:

Odell is doing great but still has a long way to go. He's still blowing right by ball carriers sometime. He can break down and square up a little more often, keeping the little jukes from working. As he gets better, the D will improve overall markedly.

But we still need a pass rush

[bengalindian]

I think it's just hard to compare, because how well your defense plays is majorly affected by how your offense plays and field position, both of which have improved GREATLY since last year. Carson hasn't thrown a pick since forever, and other teams are getting the ball around their own twenty instead of at midfield. The defense isn't amazing, but they're doing a pretty damn good job of containing, and how many big plays has this defense given up? There is always someone around the ball, and though teams are moving, as it may seem, at their will, this defense has greatly improved, and with the offense of the Bengals, I'm pretty satisfied. :player:

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

did thorton play vs the titans? it seemed liked shaun smith and B-ROB were the only DTs donig anything

i think our run D is better then last year... after odell's pick our entire D seemed to swarm to the ball on more on runs. KK played a hell of a game i now feel more comfortable with him starting for the rest of the season

Thornton played early, but was replaced by Smith in the second half.

[San Antonio Bengal]

One difference is that Frasier seemed to be a fan of the "blitz early, blitz often" approach, which would yield good results at times, but was often inconsistent and would allow the big play to happen to us from time to time. Bresnehan only does situational blitzing and that forces the other team to methodically move the ball up the field and there's less chance of the big play. More plays in a drive = more opportunities for them to make a mistake, especially turnovers.

[smith288]

One noticable difference is the half time adjustments.

1st Half

Chris Brown 55 yards

2nd Half

Chris Brown 29 yards

Total 84 yards

[Columbusbengal]

One difference is that Frasier seemed to be a fan of the "blitz early, blitz often" approach, which would yield good results at times, but was often inconsistent and would allow the big play to happen to us from time to time. Bresnehan only does situational blitzing and that forces the other team to methodically move the ball up the field and there's less chance of the big play. More plays in a drive = more opportunities for them to make a mistake, especially turnovers.

Absolutely! That's the difference in our rushing ypc given up this year versus last year. We give up four or five yards per play, but very few 25 yard rushes.

[jjakq27]

Simmons looked slow in training camp (from what i saw) and has played horribly this year.

Wait now, Don Criqui said that Simmons is one of the underrated LBs in the league. Having Madieu out there makes a big difference but I am concerned about his health. Brian Robinson has been a nice upgrade and Shaun Smith is a nice addition also but I have been real disappoined in the lines overall play. I am really down on Geathers. I really thought that this might be his breakout year but to date he hasn't shown much.

Pollack and Thurman have six games under their belt and still have alot of growing to do. LJohnson, Geathers, Ratliff and Madieu are early in their second year so they haven't seen everything yet. The experience factor is mainly with the DBs in James, ONeal and KK.

Is it me or does Justin Smith get held on every play? I have seen more of his belly and lower back this year than I thought was possible.

I remember snickering to myself back in 2002 when Marvin was at Washington. I said, oh yeah, the great D-coordinator does to DC and now he's not so great. Early on they sucked on defense. However by the end of the year they were one of the top defensive teams in the league. I think we haven't seen everything they've got to offer yet.

As long as there is improvement throughout the year and adjustments at half time and O-coordinators keep trying to pass rather than run, then I think we will have a chance in every game. We can score quickly and this defense can get the turnovers as opposed to years past.

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

This is what has made our defense better. Aggression and awareness.

Deltha O'Neal #1 in INTS with 4

Tory James, Kevin Kaesviharn, Keiwan Ratliff, Odell Thurman, all tied for 6th in the afc with 2 INTS.

Madieu with 1, but missing time to get more due to injury.

Brian Simmons 1 INT

Of our starters in the secondary, everyone has brought in at least one INT, and the only slackers at linebacker is that SS combo of Landon Johnson and David Pollack. Neither has picked one off yet.

Combine that with Palmers accuracy and lack of thrown INTs and our #1 turnover ratio wins.

[HairOnFire]

One difference is that Frasier seemed to be a fan of the "blitz early, blitz often" approach, which would yield good results at times, but was often inconsistent and would allow the big play to happen to us from time to time. Bresnehan only does situational blitzing and that forces the other team to methodically move the ball up the field and there's less chance of the big play. More plays in a drive = more opportunities for them to make a mistake, especially turnovers.

DING!!!!!!!

I remember snickering to myself back in 2002 when Marvin was at Washington. I said, oh yeah, the great D-coordinator does to DC and now he's not so great. Early on they sucked on defense. However by the end of the year they were one of the top defensive teams in the league. I think we haven't seen everything they've got to offer yet.

My best bud is a Raven fan that I like to make miserable, and I usually so this by pointing out that his team's head coach won a Super Bowl due entirely to his defensive coordinator...ala Mike Ditka and Buddy Ryan.

Billick = Ditka

[walshfan]

I think you see less big plays with this Defense. They are making teams drive the length of the field on them, which usually means long drives and which could lead to mistakes. They don't seem to blitz as much as they did last year. I wouldn't exaclty call the d-line underachieving. I just don't think it was that good in the first place. Robinson and Thorton are average, Geathers is still very young and they play him out of position at DT on passing downs, and the extra attention seems to go to Justin Smith all the time.

Pollack is not a true speed rusher and Clemons is servicable but not great. I suspect the Bengals will upgrade their D-line a lot in the off season.

What he said.

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what he said he said...