Initial AFCN impressions

[derekshank]

The Bengals Offense is as good as advertised. Don't give me the crap about Carson's couple of bad plays. Watch any football game all the way through. Every QB makes a few bad plays (case in point: Peyton Manning threw a ball right to Chris McAllister Sunday night that should have been a 100 yard INT return.)

The Bengals O-Line gave Palmer all day long. Let's hope it wasn't just the competition. The Bengals D-Line didn't get nearly enough pressure on Dilfer. Our DB's and LB's played really well, but we need more QB pressure when we play Culpepper.

The Browns are better that 2-14... but not much. They will be fighters, but will simply be outmatched nearly every week.

The Steelers are still really good. I know the Titans aren't the class of the league... but that 3rd string RB looked great... will probably make Pittsburgh fans forget about Staley... not to mention that I could probably gain 100 yard behind their O-Line. Unfortunately it looks like there will not be a need for Roethlisberger to actually win games for the Steelers again this year. That defense, and running game are devastating.

The Ravens Defense is better than advertised... they just got worn out against the leagues best Offense, because Boller sucks, and left them on the field too long.

That said, Boller, if possible, is actually worse than I thought he was. Their additions at WR are going to be meaningless with no QB. It will be a long season for Ravens fans, wondering what this season "could have been" if they had signed Trent Dilfer at QB.

All in all, looks like the Steelers could win the division again. I doubt another 15-1 season, but they looked strong enough this week to go 12-4, 13-3.

The Bengals Defense looks to have a lot of potential, and could be playing really well by mid season. If we can get through these first 6 games going 5-1 or 4-2, (a very real possibility) we could see a very nice 10-6 or 11-5 season. If we don't keep winning these early games though, 9-7 will be lucky.

The Ravens will still win games with that D, but I don't believe that it was the Colts Defense that held then to 0 points late in the 4th... even with Corey Simon and Dwight Freeney (have you ever seen Ogden so scared?) Jamal Lewis will still get some big yards against weaker competition, and they will finish with a decent record. I see them as an 8-8 team, maybe 9-7.

The Browns are simply not competitive yet. I think they can be later on this season, and could finish at best 6-10.

Biggest Disappointment: The Steelers don't seem to have been a fluke last year.

Greatest Pleasure: The Ravens have been over-hyped again.

Biggest What-If: If the Bengals Defense can get through week 6, and play up to potential, Cincy will see the playoffs.

[Stripes]

All in all, looks like the Steelers could win the division again. I doubt another 15-1 season, but they looked strong enough this week to go 12-4, 13-3.

I'm not yet convinced the Steelers are that good of a team. Given Pittsburgh's offensive line and scheme, and Tennessee's terrible run defense, any back of marginal ability could have a big game.

For me to believe they are a superbowl contender, I need to see Roethlisberger win some of the tougher games when he's under all the pressure. Eventually, the run game will stagnate when Willie Parker has to face real defenses, while Bettis and Staley continue to be injury prone.

Their defense certainly looks as mean as it did last year, and it will be a force to be reckoned with. The secondary still appears to be a weakness (except Polamalu), and that is a recipe for disaster against our Bengals.

I think this is an overrated football team, just like the Ravens, and I'll be reluctant to change my view until I see that they can still win when Roethlisberger is more of a factor. I say we'll beat them at least once, probably at home, and we're more than capable of doing the same to Baltimore. We could very feasibly sweep Baltimore as well.

But First things first. We need to get business taken care of this Sunday. The Vikings are a very beatable team. We're at home. We have to pull out a win.

[San Antonio Bengal]

I have to agree that I need to see more out of Pittsburgh before thinking of them so highly. Are they a good team? Definitely. Are they going to be as good as last year? No. I wouldn't be surprised to see Cincy and Pittsburgh finish the season in a dead heat followed by Baltimore, who'll have about a 9 - 7 season or maybe even 8 - 8. Cleveland will get outmatched each week, but I do expect them to win a couple games... 4 - 10 or 5 - 11.

[skyline]

Yeah, the jury is still out on the Steelers. That's not anything against them as much as it is a lot against the Titans. They are a bad team this year. If the Bengals lose another game to the Titans this year, I'll be sick...

Still, you've got to call the Steelers the division favorites until they prove themselves not to be.

I think the Ravens are better than they appeared Sunday night. They were playing the best offense in the NFL, and they have a lot of new players on their roster that haven't had enough time to really click together just yet. They'll improve as the year goes along. I think the Bengals can figure out the Ravens offense just like they did last year, but I don't think we're going to see Baltimore collapse into a sub .500 season.

The Bengals...who knows. I'm cautiously optimistic that they can keep pace with the Steelers, but we'll see. Too many years of history to allow me to be overjoyed and confident.

The Browns suck. They may not suck quite so much next year, but this year they still smell of soggy, moldy, 10-year-old tennis shoes.

[HoosierCat]

Well, as for the Steelers, remember Parker is also the guy who ran for 100+ yards against Buffalo when Pitt's scrubs knocked the Bills out of the playoffs last year. That kid is for real, IMHO, which means Pitt still has a rushing attack, which mean Cheesy can still be successful while not having to do a whole hell of a lot. So I think P{itt remains the team to beat in the division.

The Ravens were the Ravens: all D, no O. Boller actually did not play that badly, but when Wright came in the difference was obvious. Where Wright takes the snap, drops back, and fires off the pass, Kyle gets the snap, drops back, and then has to figure out what to do with it. Looks to me like the game still hasn't slowed down for him. And it didn't help that Ogden was getting owned by Freeny. Deion got burned a couple times, too. Jamal and Taylor couldn't do much. Hard to tell much from just one game -- and one game against one of the league's best teams -- but they didn't look playoff-caliber at all.

The Browns...I continue to think they're going to win some games. Two fewer key penalties and they might have celebrated Romeo's first win Sunday night. At least it would have been a much closer game. And they didn't have Suggs. If they can get the mistakes under control they still look like a team that can pile up 6 or so wins, and maybe kick ours, Balti's, or Pitt's playoff hopes in the crotch with an upset late in the year.

As for the Bengals, they did good. Fundamentals were good, breakdowns were few, a lot of players made contributions on both sides of the ball. Work remains to be done, but I think the D will tighten up as players get more comfortable with each other and Breshnahan's system, and the offense just needs to take that final step from "knocking 'em down" to "knocking 'em out."

[walshfan]

Steelers are good...real good... they focus on the basics ( linemen) year in year out.. it all starts in the trenches..

Ravens have a great defense... Boller maya the worst starting QB in the NFL.

too one dimensional to win the division this year imo.

The Browns are rebuilding .. 5 wins would seem a decent goal this year.

[buck3y3d]

The steelers looked real good. I think they could run away with the division again, depending on how much Rothleisburger has to throw.

Not sure about the Bengals. Schedule is reasonable the 1st 6 games, but could be a disaster the last 6. The defense must shore up, and Rudi probably needs 20 to 25 carries a week (supplemented by Perry)

Ravens appear to be the Bengals of the last 2 years. Near .500, but they still could be good as they played possibly the best team in the league.

Browns- offense looks better than expected, but they have huge problems with run defense. In a run happy division they cannot succeed. Still better than i expected (5-11).

[Stripes]

Ravens appear to be the Bengals of the last 2 years. 

I agree, if their great defense suddenly becomes crapola, and Kyle Boller can complete more than a 40 yard pass!

In other words, I wouldn't compare those two teams in any way except potential win total.

[ArmyBengal]

To think the Steelers aren't the frontrunners of the division is crazy. They torched the Titans (I know I know) they are suppose to, whatever !!! They will be right there come the end of the season.

To think the Ravens D blows is crazy as well. They held the Colts to 3 points in the first half and if it weren't for Indy figuring it out and Manning executing like a mad man, it could have been different. Boller sucks and to tell you the truth, Wright concerns me more than him.

To think the Brown are going to win more than 5 this year is rediculous...

THE BROWNS SUCK !!! Give them a couple more years and maybe they won't.

The Bengals should be right there as well, but we need a consistent effort on the part of our D, our offense to put at least 24 on the board every week, avoid injuries, and the most important one of all... Carson not make bad decisions when the game is still in the balance. No int's in the redzone when we are down by 3 at the end of the game type of S**T...

I'm still way excited about this year and love the fact we are 1-0 in the Division to start the year.

WHODEY !!!

[Stripes]

You're right, there should be no doubt that the current division favorite should be the Steelers. I'm just saying I have yet to see a reason to label them a 12 or 13 win team as posted to start the thread. They could very well end up that good, I'd be stupid to say they can't, but I need to see them face a better opponent before I can get an accurate prognostication.

[derekshank]

You're right, there should be no doubt that the current division favorite should be the Steelers. I'm just saying I have yet to see a reason to label them a 12 or 13 win team as posted to start the thread. They could very well end up that good, I'd be stupid to say they can't, but I need to see them face a better opponent before I can get an accurate prognostication.

Okay... I guess my only point is that the Steelers went 15-1 last season, and all I ever heard from Bengals fans was to take the "wait-and-see" approach. How long must we wait until we admit that they are becoming the class of the AFCN?

I hate it as much as anybody... especially because I don't think Roethlisberger is that great, but all they ask him to do is not lose the game. He has shown that he mostly capable of such a task.

Say you want to see it before you believe it if you want... but this was exactly the type of wishful thinking that Jets fans have had about the Patriots the last 4 years.

I'm not saying we can't beat the Steelers... I'm just saying at some point you must admit that they are done "over-acheiving" and they are just that good. Winning 17 of their last 19 games is enough for me.

Here's to hoping I'm wrong... but no matter how bad the Titans are, you have to be good to whip them that bad.

[Ox]

I'm still way excited about this year and love the fact we are 1-0 in the Division to start the year.

WHODEY !!!

And that, my friend is something we haven't had in a LOOONNGG time. I actually haven't ever seen this amount of joy and hype about the bengals since Boomer came back.

[ArmyBengal]

You're right, there should be no doubt that the current division favorite should be the Steelers.  I'm just saying I have yet to see a reason to label them a 12 or 13 win team as posted to start the thread.  They could very well end up that good, I'd be stupid to say they can't, but I need to see them face a better opponent before I can get an accurate prognostication.

Okay... I guess my only point is that the Steelers went 15-1 last season, and all I ever heard from Bengals fans was to take the "wait-and-see" approach. How long must we wait until we admit that they are becoming the class of the AFCN?

I hate it as much as anybody... especially because I don't think Roethlisberger is that great, but all they ask him to do is not lose the game. He has shown that he mostly capable of such a task.

Say you want to see it before you believe it if you want... but this was exactly the type of wishful thinking that Jets fans have had about the Patriots the last 4 years.

I'm not saying we can't beat the Steelers... I'm just saying at some point you must admit that they are done "over-acheiving" and they are just that good. Winning 17 of their last 19 games is enough for me.

Here's to hoping I'm wrong... but no matter how bad the Titans are, you have to be good to whip them that bad.

My thoughts exactly !!!

WHODEY !!!

[John Stofa]

Okay... I guess my only point is that the Steelers went 15-1 last season, and all I ever heard from Bengals fans was to take the "wait-and-see" approach. How long must we wait until we admit that they are becoming the class of the AFCN?

I hate it as much as anybody... especially because I don't think Roethlisberger is that great, but all they ask him to do is not lose the game. He has shown that he mostly capable of such a task.

Say you want to see it before you believe it if you want... but this was exactly the type of wishful thinking that Jets fans have had about the Patriots the last 4 years.

I'm not saying we can't beat the Steelers... I'm just saying at some point you must admit that they are done "over-acheiving" and they are just that good. Winning 17 of their last 19 games is enough for me.

Here's to hoping I'm wrong... but no matter how bad the Titans are, you have to be good to whip them that bad.

The Steelers got every good break possible last year on their way to that 15-1 record. They got all the calls, all the bounces, all the schedule breaks with their toughest games being played at home, etc. They got every bit of good luck you could possibly ask for. Their record was much better than they were, and they proved that in the playoffs. If the Jets had even an average kicker the Steelers would have been one-and-done in the playoffs. They'll be good this year, but they won't come even close to matching the record they had last year.

[derekshank]

Okay... I guess my only point is that the Steelers went 15-1 last season, and all I ever heard from Bengals fans was to take the "wait-and-see" approach. How long must we wait until we admit that they are becoming the class of the AFCN?

I hate it as much as anybody... especially because I don't think Roethlisberger is that great, but all they ask him to do is not lose the game. He has shown that he mostly capable of such a task.

Say you want to see it before you believe it if you want... but this was exactly the type of wishful thinking that Jets fans have had about the Patriots the last 4 years.

I'm not saying we can't beat the Steelers... I'm just saying at some point you must admit that they are done "over-acheiving" and they are just that good. Winning 17 of their last 19 games is enough for me.

Here's to hoping I'm wrong... but no matter how bad the Titans are, you have to be good to whip them that bad.

The Steelers got every good break possible last year on their way to that 15-1 record. They got all the calls, all the bounces, all the schedule breaks with their toughest games being played at home, etc. They got every bit of good luck you could possibly ask for. Their record was much better than they were, and they proved that in the playoffs. If the Jets had even an average kicker the Steelers would have been one-and-done in the playoffs. They'll be good this year, but they won't come even close to matching the record they had last year.

This sounds almost exactly the same as the arguments against the Patriots the first year they won the superbowl.

Of course luck is a bit of a factor when you only lose 1 game in a season. Every team loses a game or two that they shouldn't... but you can't account for them "lucking out" 15 times in one season.

And if you'll notice, I never said they would match last yars record. I said 12-4. That is 3 less times that they would have to "luck-out". Point is, luck can't get you to the playoffs. Luck can't get you a win in the playoffs. They might not have been as good as 15-1, but remember... the team they lost to in the playoffs was only the Patriots... the only dynasty of the salary-cap era.

Winners find ways to win, even when everyone else says they shouldn't. The Patriots did it to the Rams in their first superbowl, and the Steelers did it all last year. Hopefully teams will learn to exploit Roethlisberger better than the Titans did, but I wouldn't expect a record of worse than 11-5. The Titans aren't San Diego State.

[duus]

The argument may sound similar to that about the Pats, but there is a much different element here ... Bill Cowher. I have made the argument since 1992, and so far I have been correct (and hope it continues!). The argument is concerning 'coaching style' or 'type of coach'. Allow me to ask a leading question ... who is the last 'great motivator' coach to win the SuperBowl? I think the closest you come is Gruden, and I think most of us know that he had Dungy's team. Seriously, look at the great coaches over the last few decades. What names come to mind? I could answer that question myself, but I'll allow folks to bring up names. You won't find many (if any) guys that were known as 'the players coach' or 'the great motivator'.

So ... the point is that motivation and yelling and spitting and whatever only goes so far. Add to that the fact that Cowher has had the luxury of sitting in a very bad AFC North over the 90's, and you can see how he gets to 'pad' his regular season record. But look at the playoffs. One win in 5 tries in the AFC Championship Game? And that one win almost never happened (remember the hail-mary by Harbaugh?).

But better yet, look at what continues to happen to Cowher in the playoffs. Simply out-coached over and over and over. No one can blame the guy for being out-coached by Belichick, but look at the others. Wasn't it Ross with the Chargers? And Shanahan with the Broncos? And, as mentioned, the Jets almost pulled it off too.

X's and O's baby. And I think Lewis has that. He is a motivator himself, but I think his calmness shows me he will win when we get there!

BTW ... another little quiz ... what other coach always seems to have great regular season records, but finds a way to blow it in the post-season? He happens to be the man who 'taught' Cowher. Hmmmm ... go figure.

Go Bengals!

[derekshank]

The argument may sound similar to that about the Pats, but there is a much different element here ... Bill Cowher. I have made the argument since 1992, and so far I have been correct (and hope it continues!). The argument is concerning 'coaching style' or 'type of coach'. Allow me to ask a leading question ... who is the last 'great motivator' coach to win the SuperBowl? I think the closest you come is Gruden, and I think most of us know that he had Dungy's team. Seriously, look at the great coaches over the last few decades. What names come to mind? I could answer that question myself, but I'll allow folks to bring up names. You won't find many (if any) guys that were known as 'the players coach' or 'the great motivator'.

So ... the point is that motivation and yelling and spitting and whatever only goes so far. Add to that the fact that Cowher has had the luxury of sitting in a very bad AFC North over the 90's, and you can see how he gets to 'pad' his regular season record. But look at the playoffs. One win in 5 tries in the AFC Championship Game? And that one win almost never happened (remember the hail-mary by Harbaugh?).

But better yet, look at what continues to happen to Cowher in the playoffs. Simply out-coached over and over and over. No one can blame the guy for being out-coached by Belichick, but look at the others. Wasn't it Ross with the Chargers? And Shanahan with the Broncos? And, as mentioned, the Jets almost pulled it off too.

X's and O's baby. And I think Lewis has that. He is a motivator himself, but I think his calmness shows me he will win when we get there!

BTW ... another little quiz ... what other coach always seems to have great regular season records, but finds a way to blow it in the post-season? He happens to be the man who 'taught' Cowher. Hmmmm ... go figure.

Go Bengals!

Fair enough. This is the first argument I can buy into as to why they won't win the superbowl... but I still see it as a fact that they are the best team in the AFCN right now. I'd love to challenge them for it, but I think a Wild Card will be the best we can do until that defense gets older, or ours grows up... a lot.

[duus]

Well, did you further know that Cowher has never won a road playoff game? Back to the motivation argument. He NEEDS homefield. That has been accomplishable so far ... but he hasn't had to worry about losing to the Bengals much. And this year there are much tougher road games (Indy, SD, Vikings, etc.). Take homefield away from him, and then I'll take my chances. So ... key is to win the North. Which is the hard part. We might still be one year away from that ... but you never know! I think the Ravens will take of themselves (meaning, lose enough). We need the Bengals to keep winning ... and just finish 1 game better than the Steelers! (or tie, and take both from them, which is very unlikely of course).

[HairOnFire]

So ... the point is that motivation and yelling and spitting and whatever only goes so far. Add to that the fact that Cowher has had the luxury of sitting in a very bad AFC North over the 90's, and you can see how he gets to 'pad' his regular season record. But look at the playoffs. One win in 5 tries in the AFC Championship Game? And that one win almost never happened (remember the hail-mary by Harbaugh?).

Duus, I agree with MOST of your points, but I think you may have gone a bridge too far. Cowher has always adapted his gameplan to fit the talent he finds himself with, and his reputation for making 2nd half adjustments ranks amongst the best. He's far more than a rah-rah head coach who relies soley on motivation.

[duus]

Don't get me wrong ... I'm not saying the guy doesn't adjust at all. Of course he does. Besides, he also has assistants that help with that. What I am suggesting is that, where other coaches might go with 80% x's and o's and adjustments, etc., and 20% motivation (or fill in whatever numbers you buy), Cowher goes much more to 50/50. My point is that when you get to the playoffs, that percentage (again, whatever you believe it to be), gets even more weighted to x's and o's and adjustments. He simply does not have the ability to meet those demands. My belief. My experience.

[walshfan]

So ... the point is that motivation and yelling and spitting and whatever only goes so far.  Add to that the fact that Cowher has had the luxury of sitting in a very bad AFC North over the 90's, and you can see how he gets to 'pad' his regular season record.  But look at the playoffs.  One win in 5 tries in the AFC Championship Game?  And that one win almost never happened (remember the hail-mary by Harbaugh?).

Duus, I agree with MOST of your points, but I think you may have gone a bridge too far. Cowher has always adapted his gameplan to fit the talent he finds himself with, and his reputation for making 2nd half adjustments ranks amongst the best. He's far more than a rah-rah head coach who relies soley on motivation.

Its that chin of his!!!! What Cowher and his staff have allways maintained is a strong offensive and defensive line... its a basic premise but allot of teams are enamored with running backs and QB's.... If you dont have a foundation set in place everything above it will crumble eventually.....

Marvin has the O-Line in place and is allways tinkering with backups to add depth...

the D-Line is probably solid right now but we havent seen enough of them in the present formation to form a solid opinion yet......I like Robinson by the way....

[HairOnFire]

Don't get me wrong ... I'm not saying the guy doesn't adjust at all. Of course he does. Besides, he also has assistants that help with that. What I am suggesting is that, where other coaches might go with 80% x's and o's and adjustments, etc., and 20% motivation (or fill in whatever numbers you buy), Cowher goes much more to 50/50. My point is that when you get to the playoffs, that percentage (again, whatever you believe it to be), gets even more weighted to x's and o's and adjustments. He simply does not have the ability to meet those demands. My belief. My experience.

I'm not going to bother arguing the percentages. However, I will say this much. I've always belived that one of Cowher's failings in the playoffs relates to his inability to develope a top QB. He's done pretty well with what he's had to work with, but facing playoff team after playoff team in must-win games has a tendency to expose your weaknesses in ways that the regular season won't.