Is it possible that our D will be good?

[The Big Orange]

Was it just a little tweaking that was needed and cut out a little cancer...not that Rogers Beckett, Tony Williams, nor Kevin Hardy were particularly cancerous.

So far what I've seen is a new line..even though it has 2 of the same starters none of them are playing the same position...

Linebackers keeps only Brian Simmons at the same position, with Nate and Hardy gone or not much of a factor. Whoever the odd man out is will be giving a constant and serious push

Safeties we solidify Madieu and not bounce him around...let Kim and Anthony have an honest fight over one position and both prepare for that one...

Corners are the same with a serious push from Keiwan to stay really, really good

Simplify the playbook and add a firey coach...is that what we needed to do on D? I guess that is kinda a lot...after the show Friday, it might just work

[derekshank]

It's not my intention to burst any bubbles here, but offense is very much dependant on timing. It is almost certain that the O doesn't have its timing down yet. On that note, it should be a relief to us that the Offense was unable to score regularly despite frequent red zone appearances. There should be nothing to worry about there.

On the flip side, I also think the defense is improved (it just about has to be). Defense many times will look better than offense this early, and the fact that the offense dominated last year at this time really shows how bad our defense was.

But I really doubt our defense will be dominant. I think our offense will continue to be our means to winning games regularly, but just steady defensive improvement will be enough to boost our win totals by a few. Don't look for us to become a top 5 defense just because our offense lacked timing, but I will look for us to allow far fewer points with a "bend but don't break" mentality.

[Spain]

This d was kinda hinging on primadonna Pollak , teams are going to run right at that spot just like they did last year! So nk the lil piece of s**te is screwing us hard!

[CantStop85]

This d was kinda hinging on primadonna Pollak , teams are going to run right at that spot just like they did last year! So nk the lil piece of s**te is screwing us hard!

Landon Johnson would be better at OLB than Pollack anyway, at least for the first few games.

Anything besides Kevin Hardy is an improvement.

[derekshank]

Chill out bro... Landon Johnson played MLB last year quite well, so he should be able to hold down that spot much better than Hardy.

What really hurts us not having Pollack is that we need him to disguise the 4-3 from a 3-4. LJ isn't going to be able to do that like Pollack will... but Pollack will be in camp soon enough to be a positional player for sure, so Bresnahan's plan isn't shot to hell just yet.

I agree that I get pissed off everytime I get on here and see that Pollack hasn't signed yet, but given the fact that I don't have any LEGITIMATE information on what he has been offered, or what he is asking for, I have no idea which side is being unreasonable.

Our reaction is always to blame the player, because he should want ot be there helping his team, but often the front office of a team will take advantage of the players desire to want to win. (ala Hines Ward).

Hell, even T.O. has a point when you look deeper into his contract. The Eagles gave him a deal that made him easy to cut him after this season with very few consequences regarding the cap. That's killer for a WR in his mid-30's.

I'm not defending what T.O. is doing... I'm just saying that maybe Pollack is trying to be smarter than him and sign a good contract the first time, rather than just sign whatever is in front of him, and then look back in 3 years and realize he got screwed.

Anyway... this thread isn't about Pollack... it's about our defense, and LJ will be fine until Pollack is ready. ML seems to think we had enough depth to cut Abdullah, so I'm not too worried just yet, just disappointed that Pollack might not be our opening day starter.

[jjakq27]

Last year we were concerned about the D since the scrimmage. I can remember some of us blasting the D and some saying to wait and see.

I will take yesterday's results as a positive thing compared to last years performance. Anyone other than Kevin Hardy will be an upgrade on the field.

I think Coach B's passion and enthusiasm has also made a big difference. I never got the impression that Les Frazier was held in high regard by any of the players or coaches. I think that is different with Chuck.

They will not be the 2000 Ravens but could be as good as upper third.

I am not worried about the offense either. I'll reserve judgement until after the second game.

[The Big Orange]

I think what has happened in the additions and shifting to our line is as significant as anything which has happened with our line backers. When the guys see what is going on ahead of them on the line, it gives them confidence to do their part behind the line such as backers and backs.

Tony Williams was such a lush and Clemmons was so inconsistent that we were always playing catch up with our backers which were forever rotating starters...same goes with our backs.

To be honest, we have no idea how good this D could be...comparing it to last year is fruitless since it is a near totally different group...we can compare our defensive backs, but even those guys (especially safeties) didn't end up where they started...

So more 2/3'ds of our D is incomparable to last year...except perhaps the end of the year, which is when our D played a lot better...much more like a top 10 D

[walshfan]

Is our defense going to be better than last season? ...yes

more experience, better conditioning, addition of Thurman, Pollack and Robinson.

Our offense will carry us just as Indy's does....nature of the beast....

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

This d was kinda hinging on primadonna Pollak , teams are going to run right at that spot just like they did last year! So nk the lil piece of s**te is screwing us hard!

You are a fruitloop who has no freaking clue what's going on. Landon Johnson is an easy fit at "Pollack's" spot. We aren't depending on David Pollack at all. We are depending on Landon Johnson and all of the last two seasons picks to step it up. We are depending on Bresnahan to make this swap of Thornton and Smith's places on the line and the promotion of Robert Geathers and the free agent pick up of Robinson work. We are HOPING Pollack and Thurman can help.

[walshfan]

I have no doubt that Thurman is going to be the one that solidifies the middle this season... Johnson, Pollack, Simmons and Miller are nice pieces but Odell will set the tone...

[bengalsLB]

hey maybe we should move pollack back to DE smiths contract is up soon and he dominated in college. then landon wouldn't have to on the bench

[bengalboomer7]

You are a fruitloop who has no freaking clue what's going on

Last time I checked it's a free country, whether your posting from Spain or anywhere. It's comments like that , that start a pissing contest and ruins a whole thread. And a lot of the defensive matchups and scheming was very dependent on Pollack. Chuck said it himself.

[HairOnFire]

I think Coach B's passion and enthusiasm has also made a big difference. I never got the impression that Les Frazier was held in high regard by any of the players or coaches.

Beat me to it.

I can't comment on any improvement, real or imagined, until seeing the team and I won't get that opportunity till the first preseason game. But there have been enough comments made by players that make it clear that Frazier and Lewis weren't on the same page and that resulted in confusion.

I think we need to remind ourselves that after being hired Marvin had to put a coaching staff together on the fly, and he's still tweaking it.

[UK Bengal]

spain why dont u just f**koff u negative piece of poo players holdout for better contracts its a fact of the game u all of a sudden dont like pollack because he wants the best deal he can get just incase he plays 2 games and gets crippled god forbid, so just lay off him he will be in when hes in the D will play well enough until he gets ready.

i'm really gettting sick of your constant negativity

[ShulaSteakhouse]

This d was kinda hinging on primadonna Pollak , teams are going to run right at that spot just like they did last year! So nk the lil piece of s**te is screwing us hard!

Landon Johnson would be better at OLB than Pollack anyway, at least for the first few games.

Anything besides Kevin Hardy is an improvement.

I agree. It's my guess Pollack will be used as a situational pass rusher for a while. I don't see how you can keep LJ off the field, even if it means replacing Simmons sooner than you'd like - if Pollack has an impact at OLB that is. LJ is just too good to ignore, what a great draft pick that was.

[BengalszoneBilly]

Is it possible that our D will be good?

IMO, No it's not possible. It's PROBABLE! Why? Your statement here I think is the best insight into this:

Simplify the playbook and add a firey coach...is that what we needed to do on D? I guess that is kinda a lot...after the show Friday, it might just work

We all saw fleeting signs of it last year during 6 or 7 games. Especially the Monday Night Game versus Denver! The defense was just swarming the ball carrier so hard on every play, it began to remind me of an old neighborhood game of "Smear the Queer!"

The problem was that in the very next game, that kind of defense was no where to be seen. WTF happened there? I say it was a coaching letdown allowed by easy going Leslie Frazier from the emotional high they were on! And if you don't think defenses have to play with fire, and high emotion to achieve success, well go tell that to Ray Lewis. You might want to be sure he's standing around no cutlery first! You'll end up looking like one of those "Spiral Hams!"

I will look for us to allow far fewer points with a "bend but don't break" mentality.

I hate that f**kin' mentality so much that I consider it akin to mental retardation! Bend but don't break" is the approval of mediocrity.

Well I don't know about you guy's, but I'm tired of it!

:player: I want to see a try not to bend or break defense!

:player: I want to see a mean ass, hurting them bad, see fear in the other teams QB's eyes because he's been sacked so many times kind of defense!

:player: A "3 plays & out," get the ball back for Cincy on their FIRST series of downs defense!

:player: I want to see other teams mostly throwing the ball for two reasons: They're behind by over two TD's, and they can run it against the defense effectively anyway!

:player: I want to see the time of possession a huge advantage in the Bengals favor every game!

:player: I want to see at least one opposing player carted off the field with his bell rung every game!

:player: And most of all, I want to see the defense to be considered the Bengals REAL strength!

Am I asking for too much? There are a lot of high draft picks (Pollack aside) that will be starting for the Bengals on defense this season.

From the top:

Justin Smith. 1st round.

Bryan Robinson. Undrafted free agent.

John Thorton. Undrafted free agent.

Robert Geathers. 4th round.

David Pollack. 1st round.

Odell Thurman. 2nd round.

Brian Simmons. 1st round.

Deltha ONeal. 1st round.

Tory James. 2nd round.

Kim Herring. Undrafted free agent.

Madieu Williams. 2nd round.

Except for the three FA's, most all are first or second rounders! I think with Bresnahan getting them, and keeping them "Fired Up," the defense will finally look like a Marvin Lewis type of defense! :player:

[tibor75]

The D-lline will be our Achilles heel. Bustin Smith will have to prove himself as worthy of a number 4 pick for us to succeed.

[derekshank]

I will look for us to allow far fewer points with a "bend but don't break" mentality.

I hate that f**kin' mentality so much that I consider it akin to mental retardation! Bend but don't break" is the approval of mediocrity.

Well I don't know about you guy's, but I'm tired of it!

Well, our defense is not going to be a top 5 defense. Too many very young players. It will be much improved, but the bend don't break mentality is not mediocrity. It is all about the most important thing... points.

The Buckeyes had a bend don't break mentality when they won the national championship. They played the best offense in the country, and that offense compiled a lot of yards, but not very many points.

When every single rule in football is meant to give the advantage to the offense, there are very few defenses that truly "dominate" there is no such thing as a don't bend or break defense in this league. The Patriots, the Ravens, the Steelers, these were all defenses that Carson Palmer had his way with in stretches.

The strength of this defense is going to have to be in denying points, because it is just not going to be Baltimore's or Tamp Bay's in their superbowl runs. We're just not set up for it yet.

I agree that we have the youth, speed, and hopefully the fire to swarm, and actually intimidate for once, but the defense will not be known as our strength. I love defense... it's my favorite part of football, but I just don't see it being the Bengals strength for another year or two at least.

[Spain]

Hey Uk you wanker, Davey is hurting us on the playoff run if I get pissed Ill get pissed this guy is thinking of himself before the team! Now as a rookie alot of playas like chad, Willie , Levi wait for the money so this team can be better and this arse hole is busting our balls and we all know it! He knows we had no one signed at his position and he is milking us!

[TJJackson]

More precisely, his agent is milking us and keeping DP out of camp, and he (DP) is letting him do it.

I'm not mad at the agent, per se - agents are bloodsuckers and bootom feeders by nature, and so when they pull this kind of sh1t, it's no surprise...that's what they do.

On the other hand, DP has to realize that the agent works for him, not vice versa, and set a deadline....but he isn't. the customer (DP) should be controlling the vendor (the agent) but it appears the opposite is occurring, and I can't believe that the forceful, energetic person we have come to know in David Pollack is allowing this to happen. it doesn't seem like him to let anyone steamroller ovr him, but thats exactly what is happening. Over a matter that is probably as little as 100K or so, which he won't miss....oh darn, we could have gotten by on 9.5 million, however will we get by on a mere 9.4 million? Maybe the wife will need to pull in a second income, DP. Sorry.

[Spain]

And who hired this agent? Who can say get the deal done? This is him! Please!

[BengalszoneBilly]

It will be much improved, but the bend don't break mentality is not mediocrity. It is all about the most important thing... points.

The Buckeyes had a bend don't break mentality when they won the national championship. They played the best offense in the country, and that offense compiled a lot of yards, but not very many points.

Dude. Everyone remembers that game. I remember thinking Ohio State was lucky to leave with a win, because sooner or later Miami was going to stop screwing up! They killed as many drives themselves as OSU stopped on defense!

When every single rule in football is meant to give the advantage to the offense, there are very few defenses that truly "dominate" there is no such thing as a don't bend or break defense in this league. The Patriots, the Ravens, the Steelers, these were all defenses that Carson Palmer had his way with in stretches.

True. But the Bengals offense is chock full of weapons. Those defenses you mentioned usually did pretty well against the rest of the league. Especially New Englands (again) against the "Oh So Offensively Powerful, But Not S**t On Defense" Indianapolis Colts!

See what I'm getting at here? Having a team that can almost get you to the big game is as bad as having a girlfriend that can almost get you off. Wait. Strike that. It's WORSE! You can always find another girlfriend!

The strength of this defense is going to have to be in denying points, because it is just not going to be Baltimore's or Tamp Bay's in their superbowl runs. We're just not set up for it yet.

I agree that we have the youth, speed, and hopefully the fire to swarm, and actually intimidate for once, but the defense will not be known as our strength. I love defense... it's my favorite part of football, but I just don't see it being the Bengals strength for another year or two at least.

I think Marvin has almost got it set up, but the only missing factor will most likely be the "Experience" factor. We did alot to climb it last season with all the injuries incurred by the defensive squad, and other players found themselves in a starting role much earlier than they anticipated. Now with the addition of some new rookies, more climbing will most likely be required, although I feel Pollack and Thurman won't have to do near as much climbing as most of the others did!

Either way. I don't care...as long as it happens! :player:

[Kazkal]

billybroome WTF CHANGE YER ICON! I don't post on a bengals forum to see cats fighting only bengal icons ALLOWED OK!?!?!?!?!

PS,dangit it is bengal related

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

And who hired this agent? Who can say get the deal done? This is him! Please!

Get a freakin clue.

[bengalboomer7]

NO, don't change it Billy, that is hilarious