2005 NFL Draft Overview

[not-another]

Some of you people, for the love of God, need to be Browns fans.

I give the draft a A, because I know Marvin has a plan. If he didnt need the players drafted today, he would not drafted them. He must seen something in them..

[BengalNation1281]

Is anybody else glad that we didn't grab a running back?

[jjakq27]

I don't follow the college scene very closely so I am not as well versed as most of the folks here. However, I was impressed with what I have seen and learned about Pollack and THurman since yesterday. They look like solid picks if not great picks. Guys like Hardy and even Caleb Miller may not be around with these two around.

The Chris Henry pick looks like it could be a steal but we heard the same thing about Kelly Washington two years ago and I am still waiting. In fact KDub should be concerned as well as PDub. The kid seems to have all of the tools but you know how that goes.

As for the other guys, it is hard to judge. I thought the center looked like a solid pick based on the fact that he is a three year starter. Obviously the guy has some skills if he has started since a sophomore. Alexander's cryptic quote stating he may be closer to starting than you realize might be the handwriting on the wall for Braham or Moore. However, I would not want to start the year with a rookie at center. Remember we are trying to get off to a quick start.

I think they should have nabbed Shazor based off of what's been stated here for months and I think Munoz has got to be better than Sulfsted or whoever else is at the bottom of the OL list. I have a feeling people are very concerned, including the Bengals, about his health. For sentimental reasons alone they should have selected him. I am also surprised, even after what Marvin said, that we didn't draft a D-lineman higher.

I will be anxious for rookie camp to get started so we can get some feedback on the newbies. Also I wonder who the FA guys might be. Perhaps they can bring Munoz in. I am sure we will probably find out early this weeka bout the list.

In Marvin we trust! :player:

[BengalszoneBilly]

Uhh, Perry was the best player available on the bengals board last year when we took him, that should be good enough for you guys.

Best player on the Bengals board is one thing. The best player available overall is quite another. It's just not near good enough for me...personally.

[BengalszoneBilly]

3. Chris Perry is a significant improvement over Washington. (plus he adds someone besides CJ to provide "bulletin board material")

How many times are we gonna draft this guy anyway?

*Just kidding Paw! I'm sure you meant "Tab," not "Chris."

I definitely feel better about this year's draft than I did after last year's.

      :player:

Incredible the difference, ain't it?

[redsfan2]

Wow ........... some of you guys are wound up tighter than guitar strings.

Anyway ... to the draft.

Pollack - likeable enough .. hope it translates into production on the field ... I know I saw the films too ... but that's why they call them " HI lights " . Feel a lot better about him as a pretty good sized LB as opposed to a kinda small DE.

Thurman - Not too much doubt that he'll be able to tackle the rb's as long as he can shed the blocks .. ???? He and Pollack should be OK once they get over their shyness problem.

Henry - Big target .. and coach Lewis says he's dealt with far worse. Not an overwhelming endorsement, but I believe him when he says it. Either he works out or he gets out. It's up to him at this point.

Ghiaciuc ( how the hell do you pronounce that anyway .... did I get it right ? ) and Kieft - We found out the hard way that we needed depth on the line, so I guess this is it. Back ups this year and starters next ??? The coach has said he'd just as soon not rush the rookies.

Perry - Big enough as well .... also from the films not that easy to tackle ( yards after catch producer ? ) Also noted as return man. Between this one and Henry ( as long as he stays on his medication ) We should have productive receivers ... whether they are these guys or these guys motivating the ones we already have, it should produce results.

Fanene - He's a 7th rounder ... so who the hell knows ?????

If .... If we move one of our linebackers to SS, that explains why we didn't take one here. Big wide body to plug the middle ????? Supposedly that's what we got last year according to Askews profile. He was projected as a high first rounder had he waited til this year, so we'll see. He's also had a year to heal and learn the system.

Grade wise ??? overall, I like this hatching better than last seasons ..... but the one thing I agree with the talking heads about is that it takes about 2 or 3 years to really find out how you did in the draft .......... I'll get back to by then.

[gajake15]

2 - Thurman A for football talent, F for character

(anyone who beats up women is a poop noggin)

He didn't beat up a woman. The woman he had his altercation with was his ex-girlfriend who was also a forward on the UGA womens basketball team. She was punching him because of another girl. She split his lip and his part was that he pushed her away after being hit several times. There were several witness' to this incident.

Really, if he had hit a woman he would have been arrested and kicked off of the football team. Bottom-line, the cops showed up and Odell was bleeding and the man-woman was still trying to get at him. This incident was not the reason he was suspended for 3 games this past season either. He was suspended for violating team rules and he had violated these rules before the incident with the ex-girlfriend.

Odell will not have character issues.

[schweinhart]

3. Chris Perry is a significant improvement over Washington. (plus he adds someone besides CJ to provide "bulletin board material")

How many times are we gonna draft this guy anyway?

*Just kidding Paw! I'm sure you meant "Tab," not "Chris."

I definitely feel better about this year's draft than I did after last year's.

      :player:

Incredible the difference, ain't it?

I dunno.....Take the first part of Chris Henry and the second part of Tab Perry and you get......Chris Perry

[schweinhart]

Ghiaciuc ( how the hell do you pronounce that anyway .... did I get it right ? ) and Kieft - We found out the hard way that we needed depth on the line, so I guess this is it. Back ups this year and starters next ??? The coach has said he'd just as soon not rush the rookies.

Both from Central Michigan Maybe that's good.

The bio on Kieft at Bengals.com says Kieft's hobbies include eating and sleeping.

I only saw him play in the Hula Bowl and he looked decent at LT. Hobson wrote that the Bengals plan to move Kieft from LT where he played at college to RT and shift Stacy The Giant over to LT. Good to see ML has that kind of confidence in Big Stacy because he sure looked good enough at RT in pre-season to get seriously considered for the other side.

As for Ghiaciuc, it'd be hard for any pick to come in and start at center unless they're Baas or Spencer. Last year a couple Big Ten centers did with the Bolts and Zona out of the 3rd and 4th rounds.

[bengalsfan33]

I think we had a very slod draft overall but I really didn't like the Kieft pick. I'd much rather had Michael Munoz who played against much stiffer competition and more NFL ready. But ML and company did an outstanding job IMHO.

Pollack- I feel he was the most versatile defensive player in this draft. He gives us a guy that can play DE or OLB when needed but will most likely play OLB the most. He's also a huge upgrade over Hardy.

Thurman- Big steal in the second round and I really thought he'd be a late first round pick. He'll just make our LB core much better.

Henry- I really hated the pick at first because of his character issues, but I truly think he's going he's going to be something big once Lewis gets ahold of him. He'll just provide us with another deep threat along with CJ.

Ghiaciuc- Not a bad pick at all. The center position needed addressed and ML liked this kid the most so we got him.

Kieft- Well, an okay pick, but he'll probably never start. He'll add much needed depth, though.

Perry- Gives us a solid kick returner and a possesion receiver.

Fanene- Don't know a single thing about him, but I hope he adds depth to the d-line.

Overall, I think this is the best draft of the Marvin Lewis era!

[Marvin's Maniax]

Solid Solid Draft with 4 possible starters with your first 4 picks, The Georgia boys are just what this defense needs, Leaders who are going to give 100 percent on the field. At georgia Pollack had to be tamed down in practice because he was so intense. I love that and the fact that he looked genuinely excited about being a Bengal. The last 3 rounds if you get a kick returner out of it and possible backups great if not oh well. We sign and cut guys with similar talents all the time. Overall great draft for the Bengals. :player:

Pollack

[redsfan2]

The bio on Kieft at Bengals.com says Kieft's hobbies include eating and sleeping.

Saw that. It also read that his lifes goal was " to have fun ". Gotta like a guy who has such lofty ambitions .

[chrishcovga]

This hand wringing and panty bunching over the end of the draft is silly, IMO.

We simply can't easily project late round picks at this point. Period.

What we CAN project easier are rounds 1-3. And we nailed those.

B+ draft for me. Looking forward to seeing the new players at camps.

I disagree wholeheartedly here.

This is the whole purpose of the draft; to find players that can come in and contribute right away, or atleast be seen as fill in for a need in the future. -

It's the whole purpose of scouting. It's easier to get the day one picks right, it actually takes a lot of work, film watching and interviewing to get guys on day 2 that can make a roster !!

This is exactly what I'm talking about, people not getting it. It takes months, hell really a year to prepare for these two days, and when it comes you say " We simply can't project late round picks "..??

Game film doesn't lie ! Guys are given grades throughout the year, culminating with the combine and individual interviews. If a guy can play, he can play, PERIOD !

[BengalPappaw]

3. Chris Perry is a significant improvement over Washington. (plus he adds someone besides CJ to provide "bulletin board material")

How many times are we gonna draft this guy anyway?

*Just kidding Paw! I'm sure you meant "Tab," not "Chris."

I definitely feel better about this year's draft than I did after last year's.

      :player:

Incredible the difference, ain't it?

My mistake!!!

Difficult to type and think (a problem I share with others on this board)

I meant Chris Henry -- on tape he looks like an excellent receiver. He may turn out to be head case -- but I think ML has it under control.

[andybren]

1. First 2 picks - awesome. Immediate contributors.

2. Chris Henry - a risk, but in the 3rd round, not a very big one. He's growing on me.

3. Picks 4-7 are all projects. As they should be. Somebody please point out to me the last 2nd day pick that contributed as a rookie. Yes, we had needs that didn't get met (SS for example), but which 2nd day pick that we passed on was going to take care of that?

4. Shazor and Munoz didn't get drafted. By anybody. So after all the hand-wringing from watching our favorites get passed up, let's remember that maybe Marvin knows more about football than Mel Kiper. And the rest of us, too.

5. We can expect to see more veterans available on June 1. We should remember that Rich Braham was acquired off waivers in the middle of his rookie season.

[HairOnFire]

Shazor and Munoz didn't get drafted. By anybody. So after all the hand-wringing from watching our favorites get passed up, let's remember that maybe Marvin knows more about football than Mel Kiper. And the rest of us, too.

For the most part I think Mel has learned the same hard lessons as many of us have. Do your homework as best you can, pimp your favorites, and then forget them just as fast as it becomes clear that the entire NFL is trying to tell you something.

[kevnz]

Man some of you guys need to just calm down. The Bengals had a great draft. Just because they didn't take the guy you got a stiffy for doesn't mean it was a bad pick. Players take time to develop even the best ones. I just can't get over how some you want to flush the whole draft because you didn't like the day 2 picks! You don't tend to draft starters in the lower rounds, hell those are the guys that are gonna have a hard time making the team to begin with. This team is a bit deeper than in years past when getting drafted meant staying on the team. Just like everybody else, not all of our draft picks will make this team....You want to rag on the team and have your day ruined by that, well feel free too. But you must take yourself a little too serious.

[chrishcovga]

Man some of you guys need to just calm down. The Bengals had a great draft. Just because they didn't take the guy you got a stiffy for doesn't mean it was a bad pick. Players take time to develop even the best ones. I just can't get over how some you want to flush the whole draft because you didn't like the day 2 picks! You don't tend to draft starters in the lower rounds, hell those are the guys that are gonna have a hard time making the team to begin with. This team is a bit deeper than in years past when getting drafted meant staying on the team. Just like everybody else, not all of our draft picks will make this team....You want to rag on the team and have your day ruined by that, well feel free too. But you must take yourself a little too serious.

You don't tend to find starters on day 2..??? did you just hear yourself say that stupid sh*t !!

The Patriots had 6 starters playing in the Super Bowl all from Day 2, and one of them just turned out to be a 2 time MVP Tom Brady !

I asked it before, I'll ask it again, If we were drafting for depth in rounds 5,6, and 7, then why couldn't we draft guys that were rated much higher and went in those same rounds. Some of those guys were College All Americans.

I would have loved to have Chris Kemeoatu G, Utah come in here to challenge Bobbie Williams over Adam Kieft. Pete McMahon from Iowa as well, I don't have a problem with the picks, but there were still much better players at the same positions that could challenge right away, that we shy-ed away from and that's what I have a problem with.

Shazor too slow, fine, Hawthorne too fat and high, fine, but don't tell me that what I saw on Game film was the Matrix 4 !

[bengalindian]

How can you be disappointed in the Kieft pick? Its a smart idea to draft teammates that already know each other and have those instincts down. If Keift and Ghaicuic are gonna start for the Bengals in the future, it already gives them the edge that they've played together and know each others skills.

Also, the Patriots' late round GEMS didn't start their rookie seasons and amaze us all. It took a year or two, and who can tell right now how good the late round picks were? That's what I thought....CALM DOWN.

[ArmyBengal]

I'm not going to analyze anything about each pick, as I don't know about some of those guys outside of what I've read. Overall, I liked the draft and give it a B+. First day was awesome. Second day was solid enough and I'll trust in our scouting department and what our position coaches saw in practices and in game film to make their choices. I must say, I'm disappointed we didn't address the Safety position during the first 7 rounds, but alot went undrafted, so who knows ?? The undrafted Safety we brought in looks unreal by what was posted, but once again, who knows ?? Did anyone happen to look at what the future of our O-line looks like ?? Dem some biiiiiiiiig boys !!!

WHODEY !!!

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

I disagree wholeheartedly here.

This is the whole purpose of the draft; to find players that can come in and contribute right away, or atleast be seen as fill in for a need in the future. -

I think you are a fool if you think the WHOLE purpose of the draft is to find players who can ocme in and contribute right away. That's just plain myopic. For the dumbass in you, that's nearsighted!

The purpose of the draft is to sign the players of the future. Not the now, the future. Free agents are the now, draftees are the future.

Pollack and Thurman are IMMEDIATE upgrades to the linebacking core, a force against the run and two guys who will work together to provide leadership on the field when Hardy is gone. They will be the guys in the locker room that fire everyone up, because they are both extremely passionate about the game as well as damn fine prospects.

Gooey is a guy who will spend this year backing up Richie Braham and start for us next year. That's the way good centers are brought into the league. Just like Palmer, he will have a year to learn at the pro level before he is given the task of calling the blocking schemes, snapping the ball, and running the o-line. It's a great move to pick a guy who can be coached up this year and has more raw talent than any other center in the draft besides Spencer who went on day 1 while we were attacking our BIGGEST need with two guys that were far from being a reach.

Kieft is a guy who is an immediate upgrade to our backup linemen. We saw last year what happens when you don't have quality backups and have to go out and sign a 90 year old free agent lineman to come in and play. It wasn't pretty. He is also a pick looking forward to the off season (after 2006) when we have to resign Big Willie Anderson, Eric Steinbach, Bobbie Williams, and Levi Jones. Like it or not, keeping all of our linemen is going to be damned tough. Besides, he's a definate upgrade over Sulfsted, Lougheed, Kooistra, and Belton Johnson. So, even if he NEVER starts, we are better off with him in round 5 than any of these guys on our roster.

The Chris Henry and Tab Perry picks are first and foremost a signal that Warrick is not going to be resigned after this season, and may be let go before the season starts if he can't get it done. They are a smack in the ass to Kelly Washington, a prod to make sure he comes in and gets it done this year. If he doesn't, Henry will be our #3.

Fanene is a 7th round guy at a position of need that might be a practice squad prospect, but he might be a starter in a year or two as well.

By the way, does everyone remember that Geathers played with Pollack and Thurman?

[jjakq27]

It is kinda nice to not have to hope and pray that each guy that you draft is able to start right away just to make your team respectable. This is part of MLs philosphy of guys "cycling through the system" over a period of years.

[HoosierCat]

Here's Chick's writeup from the DDN...

Bengals report card

By Chick Ludwig

Dayton Daily News

OVERALL GRADE: B

The Queen City loves ESPN football analyst Chris Mortensen. He called the Bengals a threat to dethrone the New England Patriots as AFC champions "if they get the defense fixed." The Bengals upgraded their biggest problem area — the 26th-ranked run defense — with the addition of Georgia linebackers David Pollack and Odell Thurman. The club addressed a need at center with unheralded Eric Ghiaciuc, and gave Chris Henry, a talented but troubled wide receiver, a chance. They reached on Day 2, but didn't get a safety. It was the Bengals' only glaring error.

DRAFTEES

1. David Pollack, OLB, Georgia — Pollack (6-2, 261) is a relentless pass rusher with versatility. He'll play rush end in the nickel defense and get the chance to beat out Kevin Hardy as a starter.

2. Odell Thurman, MLB, Georgia — Thurman (6-1, 237) is a nasty, explosive hitter who is built to stop the run. An effective blitzer, he'll compete to be Landon Johnson's top backup.

3. Chris Henry, WR, West Virginia — The 6-4, 197-pounder has the talent to be a game-breaker, but must overcome immaturity and attitude issues. A deep threat to complement Chad Johnson.

4. Eric Ghiaciuc, C, Central Michigan — His wrestling background is a plus. Ghiaciuc (6-4, 302) is strong, smart and physical. He's also a good character guy, but is raw and needs development.

5. Adam Kieft, OT, Central Michigan — A monster (6-7, 337) with a long reach and wide wingspan, Kieft shows strong hands and power at the point of attack. He's strictly a backup for now.

6. Tab Perry, WR, UCLA — This big, fast, physical receiver (6-3, 229) presents mismatch problems for defenders with his speed and toughness. He'll unseat Cliff Russell as the kickoff returner.

7. Jonathan Fanene, DE, Utah — The 6-3, 290-pounder is a fluid, flexible athlete who can also play tackle. He needs experience and will likely get it as a member of the practice squad.

BEST VALUE

With his size, speed, athleticism and versatility as a receiver and kick returner, Perry was a sixth-round steal. He'll pile up yards after the catch because one man can't bring him down.

BIGGEST REACH

Fanene (Fa-nay-nay) is very raw. He could've been had as a college free agent. The club should've drafted OT Michael Munoz or QB Gino Guidugli to increase the competition at both positions.

READY TO START

Pollack is natural leader who will make an immediate impact with his nonstop motor and incredible desire. He'll help shut down the run, pressure the QB and make plays all over the field.

UNFINISHED BUSINESS

The club needs to fill a massive void in the heart of its secondary with a big-hitting strong safety. Kim Herring, Anthony Mitchell and Kevin Kaesviharn are solid veterans, but they aren't enforcers.

BEST QUOTE

"I'll be honest. I'm not here to sit the bench. I'm here to play football, and I'll go crazy if I have to sit." — David Pollack.

[jjakq27]

Mark Curnutte from the Enquirer:

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/art...SPT02/504250351

Monday, April 25, 2005

Dawgs are key to draft's success for Bengals

NFL Draft analysis: Ex-UGa. stars expected to shore up 'D'

By Mark Curnutte

Enquirer staff writer

Even if none of the Bengals' seven picks other than David Pollack and Odell Thurman play this coming season, the team's draft will have been a success.

By drafting potential defensive playmakers in each of the first two rounds in the former Georgia teammates, the Bengals addressed two of their most pressing team needs: increasing pressure on opposing quarterbacks (Pollack) and adding an effective run stopper at middle linebacker (Thurman).

The Bengals don't need either of the drafted wide receivers to play: Third-round pick Chris Henry can spend a year maturing and getting his sometimes outlandish on-field behavior under control. And sixth-rounder Tab Perry can get a full season of work on the practice squad. The pair of Central Michigan offensive linemen - center Eric Chiaciuc and tackle Adam Kieft - can learn the pro game working behind a starting veteran quintet.

But Pollack and Thurman, they'll likely have to play and contribute. Pollack will be moved from his college position of defensive end to outside linebacker by the Bengals.

They are the fourth and fifth linebackers drafted under the Lewis regime in three years - joining Khalid Abdullah, Caleb Miller and Landon Johnson. The holdovers are veteran starters Brian Simmons and Kevin Hardy. Nate Webster, the major free-agent addition from 2004, might not be ready this season after a second operation to repair a patellar tendon tear suffered last season.

The 2005 draft is the first time since 1998 that the Bengals used their first two draft picks on defensive players (linebackers Takeo Spikes and Simmons).

And the defense, even under a defensive-oriented coach such as Lewis, has been the Bengals' weakest phase for the past two seasons.

"(Pollack's) football presence is going to make us a better team, and you need that. The sky is the limit for him," Lewis said late Sunday after all seven picks had been made. "Odell has the same kind of presence when he steps into a room. He's going to look you right in the eye and give you a hard day's work each day, and I think those things uplift us."

Lewis said the Bengals were unable to address depth on the defensive line and strong safety on Sunday.

The club had its sights set on Georgia strong safety Thomas Davis on Saturday, but he went to Carolina at No. 14 - three picks before the Bengals took Pollack.

While rookies Henry and Perry might not play much, they crowd the field at wide receiver. The Bengals now have nine on the roster. Six, Lewis said, will stick.

"I think Chris has great ability and wants to be held in high esteem," Lewis said of Henry, an early-entry junior who comes to Cincinnati with some maturity and on-field behavior issues.

Perry could earn his way onto the roster as a kickoff return man.

"(Perry and Henry) have chances right away to come in and unseat some guys who have been doing things for us," Lewis said. "If you don't get better, you're going backwards."

Like linebacker Hardy, wide receiver Peter Warrick could be a veteran roster casualty if he is unable to return to form after an injury-filled 2004 season.

There are few, if any, sacred cows on the roster heading into the third year under Lewis. Even players he drafted two years ago - "Marvin's guys" - face serious challenges to keep roster spots. The competition will be fierce come training camp.

And the rookies, drafted and undrafted, will face a tougher task of making the roster. The talent level has been raised significantly from Nos. 1 to 53 on the roster.

The goal is to end the franchise's 14-year steak without a playoff appearance, by far the longest such drought in the NFL.

Grading drafts before three seasons is an inaccurate exercise. But the 2005 Bengals draft - if for no other reason - gets high marks, an A or B, simply because they drafted defense in Rounds 1 and 2.

The defense was tied for 26th in the league against the run. It wasn't the fault of the defensive tackles, Lewis said again Sunday. Players on the perimeter missed tackles in the running lanes. Pollack and Thurman should help fix the problem.

"Those two guys will make plays," Lewis said of the first two picks. "They're going to end up where we want them to end up, and someone's going to come up and make an unblocked tackle. If you don't do that, then you're going to lose."

[schweinhart]

I think you are a fool if you think the WHOLE purpose of the draft is to find players who can ocme in and contribute right away. That's just plain myopic. For the dumbass in you, that's nearsighted!

The Great Big Idiot strikes again. You wanna talk dumbass...You got to be the biggest IGMO on this board.

And for the dumbass in you, that's Ignorant Mother f*cker

Great Big Igmo