Guys Who Need to Step Up in 05'

[bengalboomer7]

Corey Dillon needs to step it up this year Wait a minute.......... I;m confused

Way to hijack another thread, genius

[DontPushMe]

He tied Dillon`s record for most 100 yard games

in a season...plus he had 95 yards against Dallas, 89

against the Pats, and 99 against the Eagles.

They didn`t have any1 else to had the ball to...

so he broke the frachise record for carries in a season

and he had LESS fumbles than Dillon did and scored MORE

TD`s than Dillon EVER did as a Bengal....

Rudi averaged 1 fumble for every 90.25 carries.

Dillon averaged 1 fumble for every 69 carries with a

Super Bowl MVP as his QB.

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/235094/splits/2004

Oh and you want to talk about avg yards per carry ?

Dillon`s last 3 years as a Bengal

2001: 3.9 yards per carry

2002: 4.2 yards per carry

2003: 3.9 yards per carry

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/1681

But for some reason you keep lapping on his man bag ...

The offense RJ got to play with the past 2 years were far better then anything CD ever got when playing here. And in 03 dillon was injured most of the year. Stop acting like RJ is even close to CD's equal before you embarrass yourself.

Last post to the Rudi vs Dillon hi-jack.

The Bengals had the 18th ranked Offense this year.

They had the 18th ranked Offense in 2002 too.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/OFF-...ar?sort_col_1=4

Gross yardage

2001: yards passing 3291 | rushing 1712

(312 yards a game)

http://www.bengals.com/team/pdfs/2001.pdf

2002: yards passing 3732 | rushing 1730

(341 yards a game)

http://www.bengals.com/team/pdfs/2002.pdf

2003: yards passing 3591 | rushing 1967 (Rudi had the majority)

(347 yards a game)

http://www.bengals.com/team/pdfs/2003.pdf

2004: yards passing 3520 | yards rushing 1839

(334 yards a game)

http://www.bengals.com/team/pdfs/2004.pdf

Looks to me like they averaged about the same yards per game

but had more passing yards and less rushing yards when Dillon was the RB.

Anyway in Rudi`s 21 starts he has 2478 yards and 21 TD`s.

Dillon after 21 starts had 2259 yards and 14 TD`s.

Rudi has 4 fumbles in 593 carries = 1 fumble every 148.25 carries.

Dillon has 25 fumbles in 2210 carries = 1 fumbles every 88.4 carries.

And no, RJ didnt tie DILLON's record for 100 yard games, he tied the bengals record. Dillon's personal record, 10, is far out of RJ's reach.

more stats , im starting to wonder if you even watch football. Im starting to think that you just sit at your computer looking at stats all day. The offense will look comparable in 02 to 04 BECAUSE of Corey Dillon. Im refering to the supporting cast though in my previous post, Dillon has Akili Smith, Gus Fergotte, Jon Kitna when he sucked bad, and other crap at QB. RJ Has had Kitna in his lone good year of his nfl career, and palmer, who while he didnt have great stats ( ) he still had the long ball to keep safetys back. The o-line now is far better then it was when Corey was the star here. We have Chad Johnson now, compare to Darnay Scott back then. Back then, CD was the only true threat on the team, yet he still set records and performed amazingly.

They should build a Corey Dillon statue outside of paul brown stadium.

[oldschooler]

more stats , im starting to wonder if you even watch football. Im starting to think that you just sit at your computer looking at stats all day. The offense will look comparable in 02 to 04 BECAUSE of Corey Dillon. Im refering to the supporting cast though in my previous post, Dillon has Akili Smith, Gus Fergotte, Jon Kitna when he sucked bad, and other crap at QB. RJ Has had Kitna in his lone good year of his nfl career, and palmer, who while he didnt have great stats ( ) he still had the long ball to keep safetys back. The o-line now is far better then it was when Corey was the star here. We have Chad Johnson now, compare to Darnay Scott back then. Back then, CD was the only true threat on the team, yet he still set records and performed amazingly.

They should build a Corey Dillon statue outside of paul brown stadium.

I`ve been watching football probably longer than you have been alive.

And they keep track of stats for a reason.

Do they tell the WHOLE STORY ? no....but I already pointed out the

QB that never started a game, top 10 defenses and banged up O-line....

You just keep giving excuses for Leon and over-looking FACTS

that support Rudi.

I didn`t add that Dillon was notorious for taking his sef out of games.

I didn`t add that Willie Anderson said that Rudi "knows where to run

unlike some other RB".

I didn`t mention when Dillon was stuffed on ALOT of short 3rd downs

or when he tripped over his own lineman agaist the Titans.

Or how Rudi is a team player and rather than bitching when they drafted

a RB last year all he did was take the damn ball when it was handed to

him and break Dillon` s record...

[Indycat]

Back to the thread topic

1 any tight end - someone has to step it up and be a consistent, reliable, catch the ball in traffic 3rd down target to keep drives alive!!

2 Robninson/Thortdon - stop the run - keep blockers off the linebackers

3 Smith/Geathers - rush the passer - make stops in the backfield

4 Herring - if you're the starter, tackle somebody - play like you belong there

5 Hardy - if your the starter, shoot yourself in the foot so we have to use someone else

[jjakq27]

They should build a Corey Dillon statue outside of paul brown stadium.

Make sure it has a lid and a seat in case I have to sit down.

[HairOnFire]

They should build a Corey Dillon statue outside of paul brown stadium.

Make sure it has a lid and a seat in case I have to sit down.

[DontPushMe]

I didn`t add that Dillon was notorious for taking his sef out of games.

I didn`t add that Willie Anderson said that Rudi "knows where to run

unlike some other RB".

I didn`t mention when Dillon was stuffed on ALOT of short 3rd downs

or when he tripped over his own lineman agaist the Titans.

Or how Rudi is a team player and rather than bitching when they drafted

a RB last year all he did was take the damn ball when it was handed to

him and break Dillon` s record...

before i de-hijack this thread, quick question, Do you think that Rudi Johnson is a better football player than Corey Dillon?

[HairOnFire]

Has anyone seen the new South Park episode where the guys ignore Cartman so completely that he thinks he's died? It's really funny how they refuse to acknowledge him in any way until he stops acting like a really stupid child.

Sorry, just a little curious. Not exactly sure what made me think of that episode.

[DontPushMe]

Has anyone seen the new South Park episode where the guys ignore Cartman so completely that he thinks he's died? It's really funny how they refuse to acknowledge him in any way until he stops acting like a really stupid child.

Sorry, just a little curious. Not exactly sure what made me think of that episode.

I know why you brought that up , but imo that was the worst episode this season.

[bengalboy40]

tj and rudi need to step up to justify marvin's faith...i like justin smith but i expected a little more outta him...kelley washington gets the gold, though. that dude should be ahead of tj on the d.c. by now...he's stronger and faster, and had better hands than tj in their respective rookie years...tj's worked hard on his game and has surpassed kelley, while dude's just been sittin around perfectin that ridiculous "squirrel". he's gotta be the crappiest player in the league with his own dance....

[schweinhart]

Back to the thread topic

1 any tight end - someone has to step it up and be a consistent, reliable, catch the ball in traffic 3rd down target to keep drives alive!!

2 Robninson/Thortdon - stop the run - keep blockers off the linebackers

3 Smith/Geathers - rush the passer - make stops in the backfield

4 Herring - if you're the starter, tackle somebody - play like you belong there

5 Hardy - if your the starter, shoot yourself in the foot so we have to use someone else

No doubt there's some serious stepping up needs to be done on D if the Bengals want to go anywhere this year.

But their TE situation is definitely screwed up. They need to find an all-downs TE who can block and catch and stay in the game w/o telegraphing the playcall. Matt Schobel would be great if he ever decides that's what he wants to be.

[BengalszoneBilly]

They need to find an all-downs TE who can block and catch and stay in the game w/o telegraphing the playcall. Matt Schobel would be great if he ever decides that's what he wants to be.

Couldn't you equally blame the Offensive Coordinator who's calling the sets, the personnel on the field to run the assigned plays, and most importantly the variety (if there is any!) of the plays run from that set, for said "telegraphing?"

I don't share all the concern others have here about the Bengals and their tight ends. I think the low output last season from the position can be attributed more to Carsons 1st year starting, and the "keep it simple" play packages he was using. I honestly don't think Bratkowski had a wealth of plays at Palmers disposal where the play was designed to go to that position. It's largest job seem to be to me was the 3rd look downfield for a saftey valve.

[HairOnFire]

I don't share all the concern others have here about the Bengals and their tight ends.

I agree. TE is a position I'd like to see upgraded but it's a really weak draft crop that offers little hope of an immediate upgrade. So it wouldn't bug me a bit if the draft came and went without the Bengals dipping into the shallow TE pool.

[schweinhart]

They need to find an all-downs TE who can block and catch and stay in the game w/o telegraphing the playcall. Matt Schobel would be great if he ever decides that's what he wants to be.

Couldn't you equally blame the Offensive Coordinator who's calling the sets, the personnel on the field to run the assigned plays, and most importantly the variety (if there is any!) of the plays run from that set, for said "telegraphing?"

I don't share all the concern others have here about the Bengals and their tight ends. I think the low output last season from the position can be attributed more to Carsons 1st year starting, and the "keep it simple" play packages he was using. I honestly don't think Bratkowski had a wealth of plays at Palmers disposal where the play was designed to go to that position. It's largest job seem to be to me was the 3rd look downfield for a saftey valve.

Very true about Brat simplying the O for CP. In 2003, Schobel and Stewart combined for 45-544 from Kitna. That shrank last year to 31-249.

Even so, there should be concern about the TEs. Schobel has lots of potential as a pass catching TE but can he play himself onto the field more to get the chance to flourish.

Both Schobel and Stewart's contracts are up after this season so this year might be the year to draft TE project like Matt Jones and Brandon Jacobs, who have the skills for other positions and situations in the meant time.

The bottom line is that the TEs need to be more involved to force defenses to stay honest. The best example I saw of this last year was the game-winning drive the Bengals had vs. Fins when they threw short to Schobel three times and forced a CB to come up in coverage, which led to Chad getting a long catch on an out where the CB would've otherwise been.

[BengalszoneBilly]

Very true about Brat simplying the O for CP. In 2003, Schobel and Stewart combined for 45-544 from Kitna. That shrank last year to 31-249.

The bottom line is that the TEs need to be more involved to force defenses to stay honest.

Dang Schweiney! You can crunch the numbers with the best of 'em can't you?

Well they can't call plays to themselves you know. Last season the Bengals tight ends were basically utilized by the coaches as not a whole lot more than extra blindside pass protection or a good target to save yourself with when trying avoid the flag for intentional grounding when you're just throwing away the ball.

Many here seem to have forgotten, so let me refresh the collective memory. The Bengals overall offensive focus in 2004 was for our young QB to get comfortable running the teams offense, systematically learning the job "hands on," while also not getting him killed or shell-shocked by all the blitzes he was going to see coming at him, and come they did! We weren't making an all out run at the playoffs, or even to go above .500! Would anyone care to argue this?

They'll get more involved once the coaching staff feels Palmer is comfortable in the pocket, and mentally ready to utilize the position in his playcalling. Then that over 50% reduction in throws to the tight end will return to it's former level, and everyone who's complaining now will wonder why our tight ends suddenly aren't so marginal anymore. :player:

[oldschooler]

Has anyone seen the new South Park episode where the guys ignore Cartman so completely that he thinks he's died? It's really funny how they refuse to acknowledge him in any way until he stops acting like a really stupid child.

Sorry, just a little curious. Not exactly sure what made me think of that episode.

I know why you brought that up , but imo that was the worst episode this season.

Right now ....no. But Dillon is going to be 31 and Rudi is going to

be 25. Dillon has 109 starts ...Rudi has 21. If you want me to

compare CAREERS...then Dillon wins hands down (so far)

But in case you didn`t know...I`m a Bengals fan. Rudi plays for

the Bengals....Dillon doesn`t. The only reason I EVER cheered

and rooted for Dillon was because of the uniform he was wearing.

He doesn`t wear it anymore...

Bottom line...the Bengals have won as many games in the 2 years

that Rudi has been starting as they did the previous 4 years

with Dillon as their starter.

Dillon is a loser with a losing history...the only way he could ever

be a winner was to ride the coat-tails of a team that had won 2 Super

Bowls WITHOUT him.

Meanwhile...back at the ranch...

[jjakq27]

Very true about Brat simplying the O for CP. In 2003, Schobel and Stewart combined for 45-544 from Kitna. That shrank last year to 31-249.

The bottom line is that the TEs need to be more involved to force defenses to stay honest.

Dang Schweiney! You can crunch the numbers with the best of 'em can't you?

Well they can't call plays to themselves you know. Last season the Bengals tight ends were basically utilized by the coaches as not a whole lot more than extra blindside pass protection or a good target to save yourself with when trying avoid the flag for intentional grounding when you're just throwing away the ball.

Many here seem to have forgotten, so let me refresh the collective memory. The Bengals overall offensive focus in 2004 was for our young QB to get comfortable running the teams offense, systematically learning the job "hands on," while also not getting him killed or shell-shocked by all the blitzes he was going to see coming at him, and come they did! We weren't making an all out run at the playoffs, or even to go above .500! Would anyone care to argue this?

They'll get more involved once the coaching staff feels Palmer is comfortable in the pocket, and mentally ready to utilize the position in his playcalling. Then that over 50% reduction in throws to the tight end will return to it's former level, and everyone who's complaining now will wonder why our tight ends suddenly aren't so marginal anymore. :player:

Didn't Schoebel have a long pass (70+yds) last year? Take that one away and the yardage total is almost nonexistent.

[HairOnFire]

The bottom line is that the TEs need to be more involved to force defenses to stay honest.

Again, I think we'd all like to see an upgrade. The question I continue to have relates to how likely that upgrade is to come by way of THIS draft. How many prospects represent a true upgrade over the potential the Bengals already have at the TE position? One? Two? So what happens if the draft doesn't come to you? How hard do you chase an upgrade at a position you've utilized poorly for years?

Look, we can argue all we want about how complete a TE like Matt Schobel really is, but is there any question that he could easily produce at a much higher level if used differently? I don't think so.

Until things change the Bengals might as well change the name of every TE on their roster to Max Protect. And if things do change...we hear they will every year...I'd argue that giving Schobel a real chance to produce as a pass catcher is the first place to start.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

I'd argue that giving Schobel a real chance to produce as a pass catcher is the first place to start.

I would agree, I think the guy can be a legitimate weapon/threat, but think his injury history has held his career back more than anything, and not sure that will ever change.

[schweinhart]

Until things change the Bengals might as well change the name of every TE on their roster to Max Protect. And if things do change...we hear they will every year...I'd argue that giving Schobel a real chance to produce as a pass catcher is the first place to start.

Well.. pass protecting and run blocking wise, there's little doubt there either that the TE position could be significantly upgraded w/ minimal expense.

Keep Schobel..fine..He can catch the ball and he has suffered hamstring problems. He'll only make $455K this year and that's worth seeing if he can develop inot the potnetial he has shown.

Stewart? For $600K? Maybe he builds on his 2003 receiving #s and he is the backup FB. Still, a Day 2 draft pick would cut about $350K off the non-rookie pool cap that could go elsewhere.

And then there's Reggie Kelly...$1.1 million in 2005 not including whatever his roster bonuses might be. The Bengals proly don't really save anything by cutting him before June 1 because he's pro-rated at $1 mill in SB. But it would open a roster spot.

I'm all for the continuity on offense, but honestly Schobel, Stewart, and Kelly can stick or not stick and I doubt it makes much difference on the field in any facets of the TE position.