Defense or Offense

[Indycat]

From reading this forum you get the impression that Defense is the main concern in order to get to the playoffs.

I'm more concerned with lack of attention being given to the Offense.

The Defense went from the 28th overall in 2003 to 19th in 2004 and if you just calculate the last 9 games when L Johnson was moved to MLB than we would have been ranked 10th. With healthy linebackers, a year experience for our rookies and first year players, and coaches Lewis and Bresnahan being on the same page, there is good reason to be optimistic that the Defense will be in the top 10 in the NFL at worst.

2003 NFL total defense

2004 NFL total defense

The Offense on the other hand dropped from 13th in 2003 to 18th in 2004. There has been only 2 significant additions the last 2 years in Palmer and Steinbach. Our starting center has not been re-signed and is coming off knee surgery. Our "best" TE ranked 33rd in the NFL. Warwick is questionable to return to form and TJ is a year removed from cronic hamstring problems.

2003 NFL total offense

2004 NFL total offense

We need a starting Center, WR depth, and a TE that opposing defenses actually have to worry about or we're liable to wind up with an 8-8 team that stops people but can't score.

[Whur CHad At?]

Problem is in this draft there isn't any "scarry" tight ends out there. All of the 1st round WR's could be gone by the time we pick. I honestly think our offense is fine except for the TE and C situation. But the reason it dropped was because we had a rookie quarterback, and you can't expect him to lead the offense to #1 in the league. Defense is a key issue we need to address in the draft because of all the uncertianty and injuries.

[oldschooler]

The Bengals Offense was 10th in scoring (that`s what REALLY matters)

They were 21st in scoring Defense....the biggest factor to giving up

points on Defense was that they were 26th against the run.

We gave up 123 rushing 1st downs and had 93 rushing 1st downs ...

http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/OFF-...ar?sort_col_1=4

(Offensive scoring)

http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/DEF-...ar?sort_col_1=4

(Defensive scoring)

We have playmakers on Offense...we need a Center (Braham was only

healthy for 9 games last year) but we really need some playmakers on

Defense to stop the run and create turnovers for our HIGH scoring Offense...

[Indycat]

With healthy linbackers and the addition of Robinson I believe that the run defense will improve significantly (I would like to see us add a Safety).

Depth on the WR corps is a concern and we don't really need a "scarry" TE just one that can catch the ball in traffic and Bratkowski could use any down without giving away whether it's a pass or run play.

[Whur CHad At?]

Robinson isn't really anything Special.

He is terrible at pass-rushing, and decent at run-stopping. I doubt he will evn start this year. You need to Draft, DL or LB. We need upgrades at that postions!

[HoosierCat]

They will take a center no later than the third round, more likely the second, and maybe even the first (esp. if they manage to trade down). This is a pretty deep draft at WR, and it would not surprise me to see a day 1 wideout (again, esp. if they trade down in the first) but if they have just 3 day 1 picks I think WR probably waits until day 2. Chad/TJ/Warrick/Washington is a helluva lineup. I'd love to see a TE, but there's no compelling guy out there, we have other more pressing needs, Brat never uses one extensively anyhow, and with Warrick back I doubt there are enough balls to go around to justify the pick.

The biggest reason the offense slipped last year was the change at QB and injuries on the o-line and to Warrick. The first half of the season was a mess, with Palmer struggling to find his rhythym, receivers either not there (Warrick) or not on the same page (Chad, remember all his drops in the first Cleveland game?) and an o-line featuring a gimpy Big Willie, the player-of-the-week at center, and a noodle-armed Steinbach at LG.

[schweinhart]

Another reason for the slip on offense was the caliber of D the Bengals faced. Even then, when Carson got his roll on, it was lights out.

The coninuity on O should translate into better #s and hopefully more wins. But the Bengals have got to get a center -- and I'm not convinced any of the draft prospects other than David Baas would be ready to step in and start.

Defensively, the Bengals have to stop the power running games of their division rivals. The secondary can hold its own fairly well, but the run D is weak. Ways to improve it are more logjam in the middle w/ DTs that don't have to stunt so much and won't get moved out of the way at will. Also, better speed and contain at LDE and better point-of-attack skills from the strongside backer would go a long way to improve the run D. Obviously a SS in the box who isn't undersized would also help vs. power running.

[BeyondTheJungle]

So far I've posted pre-draft positional outlooks for DT and DE on the blog. I'll have the other defensive positions posted in the next day or so. Admittedly. I haven't looked super in-depth at the offensive positions, but I still think we need to focus on defense on day one. As much as a speed receiver or TE would be nice, I think center is the only offensive position that deserves a day one pick.

It would be really interesting to see what we do if Travis Johnson, Erasmus James, and Thomas Davis are all available at #17.

[ArmyBengal]

It would be really interesting to see what we do if Travis Johnson, Erasmus James, and Thomas Davis are all available at #17.

Davis without question. I would be pissed with the other two, well, maybe not pissed, but unhappy knowing we left Davis on the board.

WHODEY !!!

[BeyondTheJungle]

I really like Davis too. I guess I was just thinking in terms of those others being the best DE and DT that could be available at 17. I know Marvin talks about going for the best player available, but I'm still curious which defensive position will get attention in round one. Personally, I'm becoming a big fan of taking Thomas Davis at #17 and if he's gone then trading back and getting Matt Roth in the mid-20s. And like I said in a post this morning, if we trade down I bet we look for picks in 2006 rather than loading up this season. I like a lot of our depth and there's just not much room left on the roster for another 10 draft picks.

[jditty47]

i wouldnt be pissed if we went oline or te wtih our first pick. i just hope we would go for a lb or a safety.

[andybren]

There seems to be a bunch of D-lineman projected in the first round so it stands to reason that somebody good will be available in the second round. Bottom of the first round (you know ML will trade down with somebody) should be used to get Thomas Davis.

A good center would be great too, but there's no reason to use a first or second round pick on one. Richie Braham was a third round pick who was picked up off waivers mid-season. Obivously you want a good guy in that position, but there's no need to get desperate.

[walshfan]

They will take a center no later than the third round, more likely the second, and maybe even the first (esp. if they manage to trade down). This is a pretty deep draft at WR, and it would not surprise me to see a day 1 wideout (again, esp. if they trade down in the first) but if they have just 3 day 1 picks I think WR probably waits until day 2. Chad/TJ/Warrick/Washington is a helluva lineup. I'd love to see a TE, but there's no compelling guy out there, we have other more pressing needs, Brat never uses one extensively anyhow, and with Warrick back I doubt there are enough balls to go around to justify the pick.

The biggest reason the offense slipped last year was the change at QB and injuries on the o-line and to Warrick. The first half of the season was a mess, with Palmer struggling to find his rhythym, receivers either not there (Warrick) or not on the same page (Chad, remember all his drops in the first Cleveland game?) and an o-line featuring a gimpy Big Willie, the player-of-the-week at center, and a noodle-armed Steinbach at LG.

Center is the postition that they will focus on in the first Joisey...

Chris Spencer C will be taken in the first round..future probowler for years to come

Luis Castillo DT in the second to help stop the run and rotate with Robinson for awhile. ( Moore and Thornton would rotate as well..Thornton or Robinson may go to DE to seal the outside on runs).

AJ Antogwe SS in the third.. versatile, hard hitter, intelligent..good motor

Marcus Lawrence MLB in the fourth..can drop back or stop the run ..gifted

Scott Young G in the fifth...anyone any stronger? Bobby's replacement oneday

Tab PerryWR in the sixth...Bengals have worked him out and like what they saw

Jerone Collins TE in the seventh.....Good hands and can block well!!!!

there you are Joisey....Thats the draft for 2005 and a good one it is!

Those are also value board picks as well... Don't be surprised to see many of those players on our team next year....

1. Spencer C

2. Castillo DT

3. Antogwe SS

4. Lawrence MLB

5. Young G

6. Perry WR

7. Collins TE

Ill update my second round pick since Castillo's stock is rising so fast..

2. Antaaj Hawthorne possibly ..I also like Chris Canty at DE...a beast when healthy. 6'7 290lb DE that can seal the ouside......

[HoosierCat]

Center is the postition that they will focus on in the first Joisey...

Chris Spencer C will be taken in the first round..future probowler for years to come

Luis Castillo DT in the second to help stop the run and rotate with Robinson for awhile.

They do appear to like Spencer a lot, they've had him in & given him the royal treatment. But if they're at 17 I dunno...that's awfully high for him and there should be multiple impact defensive players available.

I wouldn't be surprised if they took a defensive player at 17 and then packaged some picks to move back up into the bottom of the first or top of the second to grab Spencer. One rumore this a.m. has the Broncos at 25 wanting to trade out of the first all together...

Castillo has been shooting up the boards. I've seen him going as high as, well, 17, to us. I don't think he'll be there when we pick in round 2.

[cover2]

The Center position is important for more ways than one. Whoever is drafted at center (Hopefully Spencer) is probably going to be asked to play tackle from time to time.

Willie played hurt last year big time. I don't know how long he will be able to do that? This could be his last year. In any event we need a viable player to come off the bench and play tackle without the huge drop off. The tackle position could be a big problem for us this year. I don't think we can take chances on hoping a player is going to be there in a certain round. There is just too much at stake!

We can't play games with the Center postion.

The Bengals have several project players in place. We really need these guys to come through......

[Indycat]

if we can't trade down then a center will be drafted in the second round (Spencer or Baas). I think Andrews and Kooistra are the backup Tackles and Moore is the backup C/G

[Kirkendall]

From reading this forum you get the impression that Defense is the main concern in order to get to the playoffs.

One of the most telling stats about championship teams is that no team that's won has had a defense rated 10th or worse for the past 20 or so years.

[HairOnFire]

Castillo has been shooting up the boards. I've seen him going as high as, well, 17, to us. I don't think he'll be there when we pick in round 2.

I agree. In Mike Mayochs most recent rankings he's moved Castillo ahead of Travis Johnson and claims he's now considered a certain 1st round pick....most likely to one of the teams looking for a 3-4 NT. He may be sniffin' glue but it should be noted that last year Mayoch was the first draft guru to laugh at the idea of Randy Starks as a potential 1st rounder and as the draft approached he continued to slide him down his rankings until Starks fell completely out of the 2nd round. Predicted Darnell Dockett would fall as well. Best, he predicted both players would actually play better than their final draft rankings would indicate. Both did. Last, Mayoch isn't alone in his praise of Castillo as PFW graded Castillo higher than any other interior defensive lineman.

[BengalszoneBilly]

From reading this forum you get the impression that Defense is the main concern in order to get to the playoffs.

Not exactly. It is possible to make the playoffs with a sub-caliber defense. More than a few teams in recent years come to mind. Thing is, these teams usually aren't there for too long.

But to go THROUGH the playoffs, and into the Super Bowl, then yeah, you do. It's obvious. Look at Philly and New England. A pretty good balance between the offenses and the defenses. Now look at Indy. Way too far towards the offense. IMHO, Peyton is never going to get a ring if he doesn't get some help defensively.

[Indycat]

2004 ranking

NE offense 7th, Philly 9th

NE defense 9th, Philly 10th

I agree blance is important and with the playmakers added on defense the last 2 years it is a lot closer to being in the top 10 than our offense.

Offense needs attention in this draft if we are going to finish the year with both in the top 10.