Mike Wallace anyone?

[membengal]

As for the rest, Derek, as usual, has the right take. There is no downside to this, either the Bengals force Pittsburgh to meltdown their roster to keep Wallace and stay under the cap, or the Bengals end up with the best receiver combo in the league.

Win. Win.

I hope to god the Bengals are seriously ready to put the Steelers to the question with a front-loaded offer to Wallace. Despite Hobson's usual whining about how they don't have space, the fact is, they have crazy amounts of space. They could do this and still pursue other FAs. And this would be the fruits of the Palmer trade, allowing them to risk their own #1 while still retaining a better #1 in the Raider pick.

I am stunned at the overall negative reaction in this thread to this potential occurrence.

Like I am in bizarro Bengalszone.

[membengal]

I have been advocating dealing with the need for a running mate for Green from FA all along. Better that than hoping a 2nd or 3rd round receiver pans out.

[ArmyBengal]

Again, if we have the money to do this and still get at least one other FA to help offset the draft, you would have to be crazy to NOT (at a minimum) force the Steelers into making a poor decision with their own cash strapped situation. It's not like just because we sign him to an offer sheet that he's going to be a Bengal. If the Steelers match, they paint themselves into a corner for this coming seasons and ones to follow. That in and of itself would be nice considering the amount of holes they have to fill as well.

In regards to wanting Wallace, I would be in great favor of what he would bring to the WR corps. I've already been advocating spending one of our 2 firsts on the WR position, so this would be a no brainer. He's the perfect compliment to Green and would make things much easier for the offensive side of the ball. 5 million per year for a pro bowl WR ?? I honestly think that number would be higher, but I think that would be a steal.

If not, yes, i'm still in favor of Floyd and think he will be a great NFL WR for years to come. Maybe the best route runner in the WR class, size and speed, great hands and leaping ability and has produced consistently regardless of what sh*tty QB Notre Dame has put in the huddle. I'm not a Notre Dame fan by any stretch, but this kid will be a good WR.

[membengal]

I dont in any manner want them spending another first round pick on a receiver. Green was awesome and as close to a sure thing as you could get. Floyd isnt in that class.

I will take a G at that spot hopefully, and let them replace simpson from a deep FA receiver class.

[ArmyBengal]

I could see it both ways there Mem. If the Bengals were to go spend the big coin on a FA Guard (see Carl Nicks) then that opens things up a bit for that other first rounder. While I wouldn't be upset with them NOT going WR in the first, I don't think it can simply be scratched off as a dumb decision. Another direction in the first would be a better pass rushing option at DE, but others will say it's not needed either. DT ?? OLB ?? Safety ?? Like I said, there are many ways they could go that would warm my heart, but I certainly won't take WR off that list.

Bringing it back on topic:

If you support the idea of Wallace, then you are spending a first rounder on a WR.

A more proven commodity that hurts a division rival, but still...

[w8th]

Whatever happened with Whalen ?? I remember seeing him for a while and then not. Was there an injury ??

Looks like he played the last 3 games plus the playoff game. No much before that.

/>http://www.nfl.com/player/ryanwhalen/2495245/gamelogs

[derekshank]

If you support the idea of Wallace, then you are spending a first rounder on a WR.

A more proven commodity that hurts a division rival, but still...

That is the real issue for me.

Floyd might end up being great. He seems pretty good... but we just don't know for sure. 1st round WRs have the highest bust rate of any position outside of QB.

With Wallace, yes you're spending the #21 pick, but it's on a player who has already proven himself to be a top 5 NFL WR. No rookie learning curve, no concern about him being a bust, no off field concerns, and no diva personality.

There's no real comparison in my mind.

[membengal]

Right. There is no player in the draft at #21 more sure than wallace.

[cHaD711Johnson]

If you support the idea of Wallace, then you are spending a first rounder on a WR.

A more proven commodity that hurts a division rival, but still...

That is the real issue for me.

Floyd might end up being great. He seems pretty good... but we just don't know for sure. 1st round WRs have the highest bust rate of any position outside of QB.

With Wallace, yes you're spending the #21 pick, but it's on a player who has already proven himself to be a top 5 NFL WR. No rookie learning curve, no concern about him being a bust, no off field concerns, and no diva personality.

There's no real comparison in my mind.

I hate to nitpick, but Mike Wallace is not a Top 5 WR in the NFL.

[derekshank]

I hate to nitpick, but Mike Wallace is not a Top 5 WR in the NFL.

He is regarded as the fastest WR in the NFL and the best deep threat in the NFL. So that alone probably puts him in that class.

How about a top 7 WR? Is that palatable?

[HoosierCat]

and let them replace simpson from a deep FA receiver class.

And that deep FA WR group is why I have no interest in breaking the bank for Wallace. If they feel the need to make a big splash in FA go get me Carl Nicks. All the wideouts in the world won't help if Dalton doesn't get protection.

As for the whole "we'll screw Pitt" angle, Pitt is already screwed. Chances are they lose Wallace anyhow. And you can make the argument that the Bengals would actually be helping them by removing a big cost from their books while giving them an extra pick to stockpile cheap young talent, which Pitt badly needs.

[ArmyBengal]

Carl Nicks is still #1 on my wish list for FA's I want to see in stripes.

I've been beating that drum for a while now.

He will cost a ton, but if we can front load one contract, we can front load another.

He would bolster the o-line and not force us to give up a first round pick.

That and he would free up one of those two first rounders to go in another direction.

Then again, Nicks AND DeCastro should be enough to take care of Dalton.

I still won't turn my nose up at Wallace.

[membengal]

Get Nicks and Wallace. They have plenty of money. No reason for us to be miserly in looking at it.

[derekshank]

As for the whole "we'll screw Pitt" angle, Pitt is already screwed. Chances are they lose Wallace anyhow. And you can make the argument that the Bengals would actually be helping them by removing a big cost from their books while giving them an extra pick to stockpile cheap young talent, which Pitt badly needs.

I don't think people understand how good Wallace is.

Only Calvin Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald, and Roddy White have more yards than him over the last two seasons. Only Calvin Johnson has more TD catches than him over the last two seasons.

The Steelers won't be able to replace Wallace with equal talent at the #21 pick... and the Rooney's have stated publicly that bringing back Wallace is priority #1. If that's true, than run the price up. If the contract is too rich for them, they are left with Antonio Brown as their best playmaker... a guy who produced a lot last year because Wallace drew constant double teams.

Take away Wallace... and they are ordinary. If they keep Wallace, their defense pays the price with even more roster cuts. Either way, the Bengals win.

[ArmyBengal]

Get Nicks and Wallace. They have plenty of money. No reason for us to be miserly in looking at it.

That's what i'm talking about Mem !!!

[HoosierCat]

Get Nicks and Wallace. They have plenty of money. No reason for us to be miserly in looking at it.

Get Nicks and Mario Williams.

Or if everyone is so anxious to dump one of the first round picks, Osi Umenyiora can likely be had.

Shoot, you want to stick in to a division rival? Get Ray Rice.

[membengal]

I see you are going to be obstinate about Wallace, Hoosier. Fine. It is what it is.

As for Wallace, Derek has it right, he is ridiculously good, and, in this current version of the NFL, where QBs can't really be hit and receviers are uber-protected, with its pass-happy rules enforced to the limit, Wallace is worth his weight in gold.

[cincyhokie]

If the Bengals were to somehow get Wallace and screw over the Steelers, can you imagine the reaction of the fanbase in Cincinnati? That alone would sell a TON of tickets for MB. It would also show other FA's that this team is serious about winning.

It would then be a win, win, win. Even if we didn't get Wallace, but tried, it would still have some of that effect.

[ArmyBengal]

Well, I would have to agree with the whole get Nicks and Mario Williams if we are talking about the best way to improve the team overall.

Then again, get Nicks, Williams, AND Wallace. Sh*t, throw in Rice as well. Maybe even Arian Foster for a nice 2 back set.

Seriously though, i've said many times how just one top tier FA will make a world of difference come draft time and impact this team.

They have enough money to do more than that, but we will have to wait and see, but I get sick of the "we won't have enough money to sign our own FA's" talk. Here's clue.... Some of our own FA's suck balls and shouldn't be brought back.

[Sea Ray]

I'm hearing some talk that the Steelers will franchise Wallace. Anyone know how much that'd count towards their cap? Can they afford to do that? I'm thinking their over the cap numbers that we've been reading about don't include any money towards Wallace

[Scottishbengal]

It would also show other FA's that this team is serious about winning.

Ahhhh, and there-in lies the crux.

Historically the Bengals have been unable to attract any FA in his prime :frustrated: . Although I'd love to see this situation change I won't be holding my breath about it.

[derekshank]

I'm hearing some talk that the Steelers will franchise Wallace. Anyone know how much that'd count towards their cap? Can they afford to do that? I'm thinking their over the cap numbers that we've been reading about don't include any money towards Wallace

The franchise tag for a WR is around $9 million I think.

They might be concerned about exactly the kind of thing we've been talking about... and $9 million is easier to handle than $20 million. Especially if it buys them time to work out a manageable long term deal.

But the short answer is, no. They can't afford it. They can't even afford the guys they currently have under contract... and they are asking Ben and Harrison to restructure their contracts, and are going to be forced to part ways with Hampton and Foote before even dealing with Wallace. Meanwhile, Antonio Brown is going to be a FA next year, so they'll be in the same situation again.

They've been mortgaging their future for a few years now, trying to win as many Super Bowls as possible. And it worked... for a while. But the bottom is going to fall out any minute now.

[membengal]

What derek said. I am fine with the Steelers franchising him, as that cripples them in the short term. They will need to cut several players (good ones) to put the full tag on Wallace.

In short, it will cause them pain.

Or, they can only put a 1st round tender on him, let him be a RFA, and let the Bengals or others inflict a different kind of the same pain.

Steelers have really effed themselves with their cap management for 2012.

[HoosierCat]

Yeah, the WR tag is $9.6 million. And even with the contract restructurings they've already done, cuts they've already made and cuts they will likely make (Wines Hard) the Steelers will still be several million over the cap. It's tough to see how they squeeze out space for a franchise tag. It will be difficult just finding the $2-3 million for the top RFA tag.

EDIT: Here's a good look at the kind of stuff they would have to do to tag Wallace.

/>http://www.steelersdepot.com/2012/02/fitting-mike-wallace-under-the-steelers-2012-salary-cap-while-wearing-franchise-tag/comment-page-1/

[derekshank]

Yeah, the WR tag is $9.6 million. And even with the contract restructurings they've already done, cuts they've already made and cuts they will likely make (Wines Hard) the Steelers will still be several million over the cap. It's tough to see how they squeeze out space for a franchise tag. It will be difficult just finding the $2-3 million for the top RFA tag.

EDIT: Here's a good look at the kind of stuff they would have to do to tag Wallace.

/>http://www.steelersdepot.com/2012/02/fitting-mike-wallace-under-the-steelers-2012-salary-cap-while-wearing-franchise-tag/comment-page-1/

I was just getting ready to post that link.

Most of what they would have to do doesn't fix the problem. It just delays the inevitable judgement day to a future year. But it's coming. And the longer they put it off, the more likely they are to find themselves in full rebuild mode.