Our team has enought talent to go to the superbowl.

[schnarfer]

There is one common denominator for all championship teams. You have to have the horse, yes, but you also have to have the breaks go your way. Injuries, good game calls by refs, and biggest is the ball has to bounce in your favor. In many of our losses last year we got beat by bad bounces, official calls and obviously our defense was destroyed by injuries. We put more people on IR last year on defense than the past 5 years. That has a lot to do with consistancy on defense. As long as we stay healthy this year our defense will be better and as long as number 9 is behind center, we are in every game offensivly. This season will be up to the football gods, but I won't be shocked when we are playing in late January. Who dey

[bwillycuse]

There is one common denominator for all championship teams. You have to have the horse, yes, but you also have to have the breaks go your way. Injuries, good game calls by refs, and biggest is the ball has to bounce in your favor. In many of our losses last year we got beat by bad bounces, official calls and obviously our defense was destroyed by injuries. We put more people on IR last year on defense than the past 5 years. That has a lot to do with consistancy on defense. As long as we stay healthy this year our defense will be better and as long as number 9 is behind center, we are in every game offensivly. This season will be up to the football gods, but I won't be shocked when we are playing in late January. Who dey

Right with you Schnarf. This team healthy is as good as any. Just need to see how the young lbs and dl will step up.

Its going to be an interesting season to say the least. We do have potential.

I like the optimism.

[schnarfer]

There is one common denominator for all championship teams. You have to have the horse, yes, but you also have to have the breaks go your way. Injuries, good game calls by refs, and biggest is the ball has to bounce in your favor. In many of our losses last year we got beat by bad bounces, official calls and obviously our defense was destroyed by injuries. We put more people on IR last year on defense than the past 5 years. That has a lot to do with consistancy on defense. As long as we stay healthy this year our defense will be better and as long as number 9 is behind center, we are in every game offensivly. This season will be up to the football gods, but I won't be shocked when we are playing in late January. Who dey

Right with you Schnarf. This team healthy is as good as any. Just need to see how the young lbs and dl will step up.

Its going to be an interesting season to say the least. We do have potential.

I like the optimism.

I do not even feel like it is being optomistic..it is reality..teams would kill to have our offensive talent and bringing in utech will help us dramatically in the redzone which we need to be more consistant.Being able to run 2 tightend sets with a legit tightend outlet will make us substantially better...Our offense should move the ball and any improvement in the running game should make us scary good. If our defense can atleast manage a game and protect an early lead will put our defense in to many passing downs where we can bring pressure and create more turnovers(05' int..lead the nfl with an average defense)..as long as we have better luck in the IR department we are going to be above 500. with our destiny in our own hands

[cincyhokie]

There are 3 things that I am worried about:

The center position

Our DL play

Bob Bratowski

I hope all 3 are improved this year.

I think the defense can make huge improvements with Zimmer. Will the changes on the DL stop the bleeding against the run? Bratowski shouldn't be as limited with the improvements on the offense, Utech, a healthier OL, etc. Guy-check? I don't know.

If they aren't I see a 6-10, 7-9 season.

[HoosierCat]

Talent is important, injuries are important -- and yes, we have plenty of the former and too much of the latter -- but what this team really lacks is poise. It stands up to adversity about as well as a piece of tissue paper stands up to a hurricane. The signature example is Chad's flip-out at halftime during the 2005 playoff game, but that's just one incident among many.

Until this team learns how to take a punch and keep fighting, all the talent and health in the world won't matter.

[cincyhokie]

Talent is important, injuries are important -- and yes, we have plenty of the former and too much of the latter -- but what this team really lacks is poise. It stands up to adversity about as well as a piece of tissue paper stands up to a hurricane. The signature example is Chad's flip-out at halftime during the 2005 playoff game, but that's just one incident among many.

Until this team learns how to take a punch and keep fighting, all the talent and health in the world won't matter.

Good point. The fight in this team in 2003 and 2004 was actually better than the foritude they showed in 2005. The last 2 years have just been a train wreck.

Whatever Marvin had them doing the first 2 years, they need to get back there and do it again this year.

[HAPPYJAQ]

My hope is that the team is not complacent, as this could possibly cause Marvin Lewis his job. A 6-10 finish or worse would mark the 3rd straight season of lesser wins than the previous and may not be enough for Mike B. to retain him. I am a huge Marvin fan and think his biggest mistake was letting Leslie Frazier go. I hope that Marv can motivate this team to peform better consistently, as he has all the tools in place to do so.

[kingwilly]

There is one common denominator for all championship teams. You have to have the horse, yes, but you also have to have the breaks go your way. Injuries, good game calls by refs, and biggest is the ball has to bounce in your favor. In many of our losses last year we got beat by bad bounces, official calls and obviously our defense was destroyed by injuries. We put more people on IR last year on defense than the past 5 years. That has a lot to do with consistancy on defense. As long as we stay healthy this year our defense will be better and as long as number 9 is behind center, we are in every game offensivly. This season will be up to the football gods, but I won't be shocked when we are playing in late January. Who dey

Right with you Schnarf. This team healthy is as good as any. Just need to see how the young lbs and dl will step up.

Its going to be an interesting season to say the least. We do have potential.

I like the optimism.

Based solely on talent, yes, they can make the playoffs...yes. GO to the suberbowl, based on current talent...hmmmm...no.

Here is why, and it is simple. D-line.

This team has an All-Pro QB several Pro Bowl level players in TJ, Levi and Willie (When both healthy) but not a single, high-level player on defense...and please don't say Odell.

Hall, J-Joe, Brooks, Geathers are all decent but not among the league elite. Our starting DT rotation is THornton, Peko, Titus Adams and two rookies. THat means we'd need Pro Bowl level LB's to make up that deficiency, which we don't have.

As much as I'd like to say it is possible, the actual possibility is so very low as not to be worth discussing. As a matter of talent, I feel good about the ceiling for these players but I just don't see it happening this year in Zimmer's first crack at their new D. I could see them close out the year with a 4-0 or 5-0 run and be rady to jam in 09, like a 14-2 or 13-3 season once the new guys get rolling.

10-6 IF we get all the calls, bounces and avoid the injury bugs...7-9 if we get the average of each and 5-11 if we get the shaft of each...especially considering the schedule we play.

not trying to be the negative nancy, just trying to manage expectations.

Also, here is how I see the AFC North:

11-5/10-6 Cleveland: As long as Joe Thomas and Steinbach give Anderson 3-5 seconds, he will find Braylon, WInslow or Lewis/Cribbs out fo the backfield. THier D is net-zero with the gains if Williams and Rogers (better v the run) but will be dramatically worse v the pass with loss of Bodden, one of the most highly underrated CB's inthe NFL.

10-6/7-9 Cincy: Revised O will suffer until Brat learns how to 1) pass to Utecht and 2) name Rudi the "not-the-man". THis will occur around game 5. The D will flash and win a game they have no business winning and losing a couple of gimmees. I think our lack of CB depth will be exposed vs solid passing teams like NYG, Dallas, heck, even Houston.

7-9/5-11 pitt: Ben gets exposed behind a poor line, Hines loses hs last step, Holmes and Sweed cannot carry the team. The D keeps them in games but playing from behind is not their strength.

6-10/3-12 ratbirds: what can you say...the D is just worn out. Suggs is a malcontent, Lewis will be IR'd, and like pitt, they do not play well from behind. Between Flacco, Boller and SMith, Smith ends up starting once the season is blown.

[agreen_112]

There is one common denominator for all championship teams. You have to have the horse, yes, but you also have to have the breaks go your way. Injuries, good game calls by refs, and biggest is the ball has to bounce in your favor. In many of our losses last year we got beat by bad bounces, official calls and obviously our defense was destroyed by injuries. We put more people on IR last year on defense than the past 5 years. That has a lot to do with consistancy on defense. As long as we stay healthy this year our defense will be better and as long as number 9 is behind center, we are in every game offensivly. This season will be up to the football gods, but I won't be shocked when we are playing in late January. Who dey

I said it all through the season, Odell being suspended REALLY hurt this team. Add all the injuries at LB to the equation and you're looking at a deminished squad... The Bengals were decimated at just about every position last season.

IF Chad and the Bengals get their s**t together, the O-Line can get back to '05 form, and the defensive blowing up has anything to do with our cause; The Bengals should be a force in '08.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Look, I hope the team's good, but this team has a lot of problems.

D: Little talent at DT and DE isn't that much better (especially against run), all of our LBs are unproven, and there are question marks at S (though I'm pretty confident in Dookie).

O: The line is a disaster everywhere except for Bobbie, we've lost 1 or 2 of our top 3 receivers, we have a running back by committee and are praying that Rudi comes back - and if he doesn't, we're screwed.

Here's the list of positions where I'm really confident about the Bengals right now:

QB, WR(TJ).

Here's the list of positions where I'm highly optimistic:

S (Dookie), G(Williams), DE (Geathers), CB(Joseph and Hall).

Outside that, it's a crapshoot at best. For those reasons, I think it's waaaaaay premature to start talking Super Bowl. There are a lot of "if"s, and if a lot of them go our way, this could be a playoff team. Rudi has to be healthy, Guychick has to come around, Levi has to be healthy and motivated, Willie needs to find the fountain of youth, we need a rookie WR or two to step up (or Chad to get sane), Odom needs to be useful, Rivers needs to be the real deal, Odell needs to stay on track, somebody needs to play S opposite Dookie, etc.

Could a lot of those happen? Sure. But given that laundry list of questions, I have to agree with willy and Vegas, the odds don't look great - but I'm giving them a bump just for getting rid of Chucky.

Hope they're good in '08, but not counting on it.

[walzav29]

I think it is obvious that the team was busting the backs trying to turn it around in 03, and 04. In 2005 they thought they were over the hump, and then the spotlight hit and heads started to swell. There was an obvious over-confidence displayed by the team (we all know who) and injuries last year were crazy. I don't care what anyone says, 2006 was inches away from being a playoff team.

[Wraith]

JJoe, Hall, Brooks, Thurman, Rivers, Ndukwe may not be pro bowl level talent YET but they are young, Thurman has one year, Brooks has 15 games, JJoe is going into his third year, Hall his second, NDukwe his second, Rivers his first. Past performance is not always indictive of future results and while that can be good or bad the capability is there for these players to be much better than they have proved on the field as of the last game of last season.

One of the biggest issues I have with the defensive side of the ball is a lack of consistency and a single voice, hopefully Marvin has learned from his mistakes and will let Zimmer build the defense he wants to build rather than the defense Marvin wants him to build.

[truthteller]

This team could be fighting Baltimore for the basement in the division. The Steelers always was and always will be the team to beat if you want to win this division. Cleveland is smoke and mirors and will have a huge rift over which sub-par qb should start. Baltimore is past old. They may play 1 or 2 good games this year but they will wear out. Also without a QB they are toast.Their best offseason move was getting rid of the dumbest coach in the NFL. As for Pittsburgh, Hines Ward hasn't lost a step and Holmes led the league in yards per reception. Sweed was a first round talent that dropped to them in the second. Mendenhall was another gift that should have been gone earlier in the draft. Our biggest concern should be is that TJ cannot carry this team while being double and triple covered. It's evident that CJ will not play. Henry is a huge loss also. I agree that our defense will be somewhat improved but the offense has suffered greatly. There will be no wild card from this division due to the brutal scheduling. To make the playoffs this year we must beat the Steelers. Can we? Not if the coaching staff takes the Steelers as lightly as most posters here.

[cincyhokie]

This team could be fighting Baltimore for the basement in the division. The Steelers always was and always will be the team to beat if you want to win this division. Cleveland is smoke and mirors and will have a huge rift over which sub-par qb should start. Baltimore is past old. They may play 1 or 2 good games this year but they will wear out. Also without a QB they are toast.Their best offseason move was getting rid of the dumbest coach in the NFL. As for Pittsburgh, Hines Ward hasn't lost a step and Holmes led the league in yards per reception. Sweed was a first round talent that dropped to them in the second. Mendenhall was another gift that should have been gone earlier in the draft. Our biggest concern should be is that TJ cannot carry this team while being double and triple covered. It's evident that CJ will not play. Henry is a huge loss also. I agree that our defense will be somewhat improved but the offense has suffered greatly. There will be no wild card from this division due to the brutal scheduling. To make the playoffs this year we must beat the Steelers. Can we? Not if the coaching staff takes the Steelers as lightly as most posters here.

It's ok if you're a Steelers fan. Just say so. You gave yourself away with the "Henry was a huge loss" and the over-the-top endorsement of Sweed and Mendenhall. If you are a Bengals fan you pretty much know that the draft made up for the loss of the one dementional Henry. No mentioning of adding a proven TE in Utech? You want speed to stretch the field? How about Simpson and Caldwell. For the "loss" of Henry, this offense has made many more improvements thru getting healthy on the OL to having a pretty solid draft. Speaking of the OL. What did the Steelers do exactly to improve in that area?

Also, no matter how much you give the Steelers the rightful credit they deserve, you always always make sure you at least acknowledge that you hate them and hope you are wrong with picking them to finish first in the division! Nice try, bud

[BengalChamps]

This D stinks and anyone who is thinking SB has their head in the sand. You dont turn a D around in one year.

We will continue to be frustrated by a D that can not stop the run. Tell me... who on this D has ever stopped the run consistantly before? Where are the probowl players on D? Where are the double digit sackers? Where are the David Fulcher enforcers? Any intimidators? Any inspirational leaders? And no one who can impose their will on an outcome.

Carson is awesome but the NYGiants showed how you win a Superbowl and we dont have one.

Who dey!

[truthteller]

Watch it Bengal Champs. Only kool-aid served here.

[Ickey44]

This D stinks and anyone who is thinking SB has their head in the sand. You dont turn a D around in one year.

We will continue to be frustrated by a D that can not stop the run. Tell me... who on this D has ever stopped the run consistantly before? Where are the probowl players on D? Where are the double digit sackers? Where are the David Fulcher enforcers? Any intimidators? Any inspirational leaders? And no one who can impose their will on an outcome.

Carson is awesome but the NYGiants showed how you win a Superbowl and we dont have one.

Who dey!

Did it ever occur to you that maybe the players weren't at fault, but that the idiot defensive coordinator is? Bresnahan is a moron and I'm glad he's gone. I think we'll be fine if Zimmer's all he's hyped up to be.

[Sandwedge]

This D stinks and anyone who is thinking SB has their head in the sand. You dont turn a D around in one year.

We will continue to be frustrated by a D that can not stop the run. Tell me... who on this D has ever stopped the run consistantly before? Where are the probowl players on D? Where are the double digit sackers? Where are the David Fulcher enforcers? Any intimidators? Any inspirational leaders? And no one who can impose their will on an outcome.

Carson is awesome but the NYGiants showed how you win a Superbowl and we dont have one.

Who dey!

Actually our DC Zimmer, when he was with Dallas turned their D around in 1 season..... I'm not saying SB, but I'm also not saying we are going to stink up the joint either.... I think the addition of Utech is bigger than we fans imagine... I felt our problem lastyear was, we kicked to many damned FGs!! Add in a threat at TE and maybe we score a boatload more TDs.....

[BengalPimp]

This D stinks and anyone who is thinking SB has their head in the sand. You dont turn a D around in one year.

Where are the double digit sackers?

I look for Geathers to get close to if not exceed double digit sacks, and many people don't yet realize the pass rush Antwan Odom will bring. I can very easily see 20 sacks between the 2. 10/10...11/9..12/8...something like that.

You also dont realize that Bresnahan NEVER gave the ends the freedom that Zimmer will. The ends under Bres had to contain, and watch for the run...not full-out rush.

Remember back to 2 years ago, in the first couple of games when J Smith and Geathers were Loving it because Bres let them go free and they both had 2-3 sacks after the first 2 games, then injuries hit(starting with Pollack,then Odell going from 4 games suspension to year) and Bresnahan has never let them roam free since. Zimmer will change that.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

What were all the devastating injuries last year again? Brooks? Irons? Henderson? An unproven LB, a rookie and a situational pass rusher that's also unproven and undrafted? How is that devastating?

Hmmm. Injuries weren't the problem last year, addressing needs in the off-season, like this year, are once again the problem.

I'm trying to be hopeful here, but with these LB's, unproven and slow safeties, a fading o-line, at least one star hold out, and a below average front 7 on D, I just don't see it right now.

That said, if a lot of things bounce their way and wiht some luck, they could win games and do something - guess we'll see - just not real hopeful. This defense isn't impressive at all right now on paper - lots of ? marks to answer.

You also have to factor in the fact there will be 1-2 major injuries early on, per the norm.

[Wraith]

Willie Anderson - injured missed 11 starts

Levi Jones - injured missed 3 starts

Rudi Johnson - injured missed 8 starts

Rashad Jeanty - injured missed 9 starts

Caleb Miller - injured missed all but 3 games

Dexter Jackson - injured missed 2 starts

Tab Perry - injured missed 14 games

Chris Perry - injured missed entire season

Ahmad Brooks - injured missed 14 games

Kenny Irons - injured missed entire season

Jonathan Fanene - injured missed 2 games

Eric Henderson - injured missed entire season

Bennie Brazell - injured missed entire season

Ethan Kilmer - injured missed entire season

Adam Kieft - injurded missed entire season

Antonio Chatman - injured missed 3 games

Eric Ghiachiuc - injured missed 4 games

Couple that with:

Chris Henry - suspended 8 games

Odell Thurman - suspended entire season

David Pollack - injured missed entire season *retired*

Thats 20 guys that were carried on the roster last season injured/suspended for more than 18% of the season.

Are you honestly making the arguement that injuries/suspensions did not tank last season? We finished 7-9 how much better would we have finished if both our starting *Pro Bowl* tackles didn't miss significant time and their impact were not diminshed by the lingering effects of that injury? How much better would we have been if our starting *Pro Bowl* RB had been healthy all season? How about losing 5 out of 8 LBers for sigificant portions of the season *including Odell*. We drafted a RB in the second round to bolster our running back corp what more would you have had them do in the offseason. Losing 3 RBs in a single season would be impossible for ANY team to overcome. Given the fact that we lost 6 starters to injuries for several games within the season including 4 Pro Bowlers 7-9 is not all that bad. Think we would have been better with a healthy Anderson, Jones, Rudi, Jeanty, Brooks? I think those injuries alone would have been worth 3 games. Wow, look at that 3 games get us into the playoffs.

As far as "aging" linemen, we drafted Whitworth, Koostra, Andrews, Ghiaciuc all within the last 5 years and all have been impact players (three will likely be starters this year and were starters last year). Levi Jones is 28 (29 in August) years old and is going into his 7th NFL season, if that is "old" then I accept your statement, he isn't old he was injured getting back to my point. Willie is old and you can argue the merits of keeping Willie over Steinbach but you must first realize, we couldn't have kept Steinbach for what we paid Willie and Steinbach was not nearly the team leader Willie. On a team that desperately needs veteren leadership we bit the bullet and extended our best veteren leader even though we knew he was not healthy. This year he says he feels better than he has in years and we now have a veteren guy behind him in Stacy Andrews who saw substantial time last year and performed exceptionally well.

Shula you need to retract that statement or risk looking like a complete doofus.

[bengalsfansince68]

Shula you need to retract that statement or risk looking like a complete doofus.

That ship sailed long ago.