Steelers wanted Jerome Simpson?

[BlainThePain]

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/art...PT02/804280355/

The Steelers were said to have been enamored with Simpson and were prepared to take him seven slots later at No. 53 overall, where they instead drafted Texas receiver Limas Sweed.

[Kazkal]

But but he was horrible! and we should have took Sweed!!! the guy played at a small college so theres not a chance hes a good WR!

/sarcasm off I really love this pick more and more by the hour.

[duus]

I could have sworn I saw someone comment on this board that picks like Simpson were exactly what separates us from teams like the Steelers. Who was that that said that? Hmmmm.

[ChadJohnson-85]

IMHO this is my favorite pick next to Rivers. Simpson will become just as good or better then CJ. Can't wait until pre-season!!!

Who Dey!!!

[HAPPYJAQ]

I LOOOOOVE this pick! How can you not like taking a WR, who will be catching passes from Carson Palmer. Factor the fact that we will be a best ATHLETE (by measurables) on the team that includes two Pro-Bowlers and has excellent offensive coaches and how can you not?? The greatest part is he is not just an athlete but has produces over 40 touchdowns in his collegiate career....and despite talent, that is an increidble number for a wideout. The part I might like even better is this: Issac Curtis. Carl Pickers, Darney Scott, Chad Johnson are examples of Wr's that this team has taken over the years in the 2nd round.

WHO DEY!

[HoosierCat]

I don't have a problem with Simpson, I just have a problem with taking him where they did. They could have trumped NO's offer to move up by swapping this pick with NE's pick at the top of the third. Despite the rumor out of Pitt I have a tough time believing he wouldn't have lasted 20 more picks, and even if he didn't...what, we end up with Sweed? He best turn out well, because the Bengals' desire to grab him cost us Ellis...and if we got him, we probably don't have the much-agonized over "Sasquatch" to boot.

Time will tell.

[duus]

Despite the rumor out of Pitt I have a tough time believing he wouldn't have lasted 20 more picks, and even if he didn't...what, we end up with Sweed?

I think the best we have to go with right now is that he would have been gone by the time the Bengals picked again. That is news. Big news for the critics. What is most interesting, assuming the story is correct, is that the Steelers must have therefor ended up with their 'next best' receiver ... Sweed. You have to also assume that that was likely the Bengals 'next best'. So ... as you say ... time will tell. Were these two teams correct in that Simpson is better than Sweed? If so, Bengals win. If they were both wrong ... then the Steelers were lucky. And the so-called Bengal curse continues.

[Kazkal]

So Simpson is the reason we didn't get Ellis eh?

[HAPPYJAQ]

Call that the Marques Colston affect. Teams are more willing to scout just as heavy the smaller schools, which likely helped in boosting Simpson's stock. That said though , I think that at that place in the board, Simpson was the correct choice. Consider this, Donnie Avery was the 1st receiver off the board and a month ago was considered, at best, a 3rd round pick. The coaches and staff must know something about Sweed and Kelly that we don't. The knock on Sweed is that he does not play to his 4.4 speed. If we can retain Chad, I think the 3 receiver combo of TJ. Chad and Simpson/Caldwell will again be the best in the league. One of the favorite plays of Coach Bresh's is the bubble screen, whick Florida used several times a game. I can see Caldwell running that play from the slot. Simpson will be everything that they hoped Tab Perry will be on 3rd down and is clutch. He has UNBELIEVABLE hands and forget what you saw at the Combine; The NFL combine is best used to obtain and vaidate measurables, as the WR's have no familiarity with the QB's and no formal practices in the drills in routines. Just my thoughts.

WHO DEY

[HoosierCat]

So Simpson is the reason we didn't get Ellis eh?

Close. The Bengals' not wanting to slide down 20 or so spots from the mid-second to the top of the third is the reason we don't have Ellis. Whether Simpson would have been there...I think so but you are free to differ.

[GregCook]

So Simpson is the reason we didn't get Ellis eh?

Close. The Bengals' not wanting to slide down 20 or so spots from the mid-second to the top of the third is the reason we don't have Ellis. Whether Simpson would have been there...I think so but you are free to differ.

Yeah, the article quotes "Mr. Some One" as saying the steelers where interested. Maybe they were, maybe not. Obviously they are very confident in Simpson to lavish a round 2 contract on him, the kid must have shown plenty in his workouts. Now those of you that go to training camp will have some offensive studs to watch.

To me the big news in the draft wasn't the defense but 3 WR's including that rnd 7 pick, he looks very TJ to me, only much bigger. Bengals went from dirt poor in WR's to deep again, all in two days.

[HAPPYJAQ]

So Simpson is the reason we didn't get Ellis eh?

Where I differ from many Bengals fans is this. To me, DT and LB were EQUALLY the problem with the run D last year. Anytime you start a game with Schlegal (waiver pick up), Jones (unwanted....no matter how good he played) and Jeanty (CFL refugee....and injured), you have to want to upgrade that position, as well. Why trade for just the #2 DT in the draft when you can have the consensus #1 LB and #3/#4 DT (at worst) and fill two positions. Not only that, if you do trade that third, then given the Bengals WR situation and have them has them pegged for a WR in Rd. 2. That leaves you with Beau Bell, Bryan Kehl, Xavier Adibi and Stanford Keglar (4th round OLB's) to come in an play for your team in the base defense, along with Ellis on DT defense. If you then take BPA at DT versus LB at the Bengals 3rd pick in the draft, I without question take Pat Sims (1st team all SEC as a Junrior, along with Dorsey) over Adibi (undersized LB in a scheme where Zimmer likes big LB's).

WHO DEY

[HoosierCat]

Where I differ from many Bengals fans is this. To me, DT and LB were EQUALLY the problem with the run D last year. Anytime you start a game with Schlegal (waiver pick up), Jones (unwanted....no matter how good he played) and Jeanty (CFL refugee....and injured), you have to want to upgrade that position, as well. Why trade for just the #2 DT in the draft when you can have the consensus #1 LB and #3/#4 DT (at worst) and fill two positions.

Well, I think we go a little lower than the No. 3-4 DTs. I understand what you're saying, but I was far less concerned with LB than DT. Jones, Odell, Jeanty, Brooks, we have some weapons there. But Ellis-Sims beats Sims-Sasquatch in my book. You have better quality and at least one sure thing versus two guys with question marks.

Again, we'll see. If three years from now Rivers and Simpson are studs and Ellis is just a guy, we win. If it's the other way around...oops.

[Thurmanation]

Where I differ from many Bengals fans is this. To me, DT and LB were EQUALLY the problem with the run D last year. Anytime you start a game with Schlegal (waiver pick up), Jones (unwanted....no matter how good he played) and Jeanty (CFL refugee....and injured), you have to want to upgrade that position, as well. Why trade for just the #2 DT in the draft when you can have the consensus #1 LB and #3/#4 DT (at worst) and fill two positions.

Well, I think we go a little lower than the No. 3-4 DTs. I understand what you're saying, but I was far less concerned with LB than DT. Jones, Odell, Jeanty, Brooks, we have some weapons there. But Ellis-Sims beats Sims-Sasquatch in my book. You have better quality and at least one sure thing versus two guys with question marks.

Again, we'll see. If three years from now Rivers and Simpson are studs and Ellis is just a guy, we win. If it's the other way around...oops.

I believe Simpson will turn out to be a taller, non-criminal Chris Henry. lol

[HAPPYJAQ]

Where I differ from many Bengals fans is this. To me, DT and LB were EQUALLY the problem with the run D last year. Anytime you start a game with Schlegal (waiver pick up), Jones (unwanted....no matter how good he played) and Jeanty (CFL refugee....and injured), you have to want to upgrade that position, as well. Why trade for just the #2 DT in the draft when you can have the consensus #1 LB and #3/#4 DT (at worst) and fill two positions.

Well, I think we go a little lower than the No. 3-4 DTs. I understand what you're saying, but I was far less concerned with LB than DT. Jones, Odell, Jeanty, Brooks, we have some weapons there. But Ellis-Sims beats Sims-Sasquatch in my book. You have better quality and at least one sure thing versus two guys with question marks.

Again, we'll see. If three years from now Rivers and Simpson are studs and Ellis is just a guy, we win. If it's the other way around...oops.

I understand, Hoosier, and I've observed this board for over 2 years and believe you are extremely insightful, I am just not as sure that Ellis is a much as a "sure thing" as many. He is short and has short arms, which are not good for DE's. The only one I can think of in recent memory that had that combination and was dominant is John Randle and Warren Sapp. I somehow don't believe that he is in their class. I think Dorsey MIGHT be, but by most accounts was graded much higher than Ellis. If Ellis has a similar grade to Rivers, you almost have to take Rivers and keep the 3rd. If you look at the draft from a talent standpoint, this year, the Lions thought that Shaun Rogers (argurably a Top 5 DT in the NFL) is worth only a 3rd and Leigh Bodden, which might be equivalent to a 3rd and a 4th.

[membengal]

Oops. Didn't see this thread when I bumped the other one.

No, hoosier, he would not have lasted 20 more picks. It wasn't just the Steelers, by all accounts, who were aiming for him at the end of the 2nd. For those who constantly worry about the Bengals mis-reading the skill-set of their picks, perhaps it is some comfort that they selected a player who a bunch of teams were aiming for in that round...

[walzav29]

If you think about it, just because we didn't get a guy we heard of doesn't mean anything. It's been pointed out before, but there is a loooooong list of guys that are popular and suck. Just look at good old 1985 2 popular receivers from big schools Wisconsin and Miami were selected before the guy from little Mississippi Grand Valley. Not to say Simpson will be Jerry Rice, but I agree with the idea of Brat has a nice record of finding good receivers. CJ, TJ, and even Henry (talent, but an idiot). I like Jerome Simpson.

[BengalPappaw]

I like Jerome Simpson.

Tremendous physical abilities.

This is one of the few positions (running back is another) where I have confidence that the Bengals staff can develop those abilities into production on the football field.

While Pat Sims made the draft for me -- I'm excited (again) about seeing how Simpson and Caldwell do in mini camp.

[HoosierCat]

Oops. Didn't see this thread when I bumped the other one.

No, hoosier, he would not have lasted 20 more picks. It wasn't just the Steelers, by all accounts, who were aiming for him at the end of the 2nd. For those who constantly worry about the Bengals mis-reading the skill-set of their picks, perhaps it is some comfort that they selected a player who a bunch of teams were aiming for in that round...

Again, my problem isn't with Simpson, it's with the guy they picked before him. If the price of moving up to get Ellis was that we heard the Bengals call Earl Bennett's name in the early third versus Simpson's in the second, I would have been more than OK with that.

[kingwilly]

Where I differ from many Bengals fans is this. To me, DT and LB were EQUALLY the problem with the run D last year. Anytime you start a game with Schlegal (waiver pick up), Jones (unwanted....no matter how good he played) and Jeanty (CFL refugee....and injured), you have to want to upgrade that position, as well. Why trade for just the #2 DT in the draft when you can have the consensus #1 LB and #3/#4 DT (at worst) and fill two positions.

Well, I think we go a little lower than the No. 3-4 DTs. I understand what you're saying, but I was far less concerned with LB than DT. Jones, Odell, Jeanty, Brooks, we have some weapons there. But Ellis-Sims beats Sims-Sasquatch in my book. You have better quality and at least one sure thing versus two guys with question marks.

Again, we'll see. If three years from now Rivers and Simpson are studs and Ellis is just a guy, we win. If it's the other way around...oops.

But Hoosier, that's not the equation since we'd have had to give up one (or both) of our thirds (Sims or Caldwell) or r3a+r4 to move up.

so, equate:

Elllis + Caldwell (Simpson constant) + Shirley

vs

Rivers + Sims + Caldwell (Simpson Constant) + Collins + Shirley

I am equally upset about not getting Ellis. Maybe they really did try tomove up and found the other teams treating them like plague? Who's to say? The ML explanation kind of jives but, yes, there were no shortage of creative ways to grab te pieces needed even if it meant losing one or two picks. What is also reflects is the foreshadwoing of the unwillingness to get a FA to complete a "plan"...for that we will need to wait and see.

Another approach we've gone over is to have done the trade option with DC and then have made the moves for Ellis. Dump the malcontent. Pick up the soon to be lost picks and have just about the same type draft, maybe even better, AND have disposed of Mr. Menstruality.

So, get Ellis, another r1 for a RB, Simpson, Sims, Caldwell, +another r3 (maybe a safer DT or better OT), Collins, Shirley, etc.

blah, blah, blah, as I ramble....

I am satisfied with what they came up with not knowing what they were really facing in trying to move up. As it is, clearly they show again complacency and a lack creativity/vision to make things happen and the result might spell the end of ML if this draft does not yield immediate improvement.

[Wraith]

It isn't Rivers/Simpson but Rivers/Sims vs. Ellis. the Bengals would have still drafted Simpson in the second round if we had traded up. We would have given pick #77 to trade up to #7.

Something I haven't heard anyone mention is the fact that Patriots moved themselves out of position by taking the Saints deal. No One will ever be able to convince me that they didn't have Rivers rated much higher than Mayo and by doing the deal with New Orleans they missed out on their top available prospect.

To the question at hand I am comfortable with Rivers/Sims over Ellis. And we likely would have missed out on Caldwell because we would have been forced to take a linebacker at the end of the third most likely Beau Bell or Xavier Adibi. Lets say they took Ellis and Bell would you have been ok with that over Rivers, Sims, and Caldwell? The way I see it is that we passed up the best DT prospect and a middle round Linebacker prospect for the best Linebacker prospect, a second round DT prospect who dropped and a second round WR prospect who slipped only because of the logjam at the position in the second. I would have loved to get Ellis he was my target throughout the draft but if it means downgrading two other positions of need I think we did the right thing.

[HoosierCat]

But Hoosier, that's not the equation since we'd have had to give up one (or both) of our thirds (Sims or Caldwell) or r3a+r4 to move up.

No, we wouldn't have. We had pick 46 in the mid-second. The Pats had pick 69 up at the top of the third. The difference in value, per the trade chart, between those two picks is 200 points. The difference in value between the 7 and 9 is 150 points. All we would have had to do is swap those picks, so we don't lose a single selection. That's what NO and the Pats did, except that they swapped a NO 3rd for a Pats 5th. NO didn't give up a pick, they just slid down two rounds.

[HAPPYJAQ]

Oops. Didn't see this thread when I bumped the other one.

No, hoosier, he would not have lasted 20 more picks. It wasn't just the Steelers, by all accounts, who were aiming for him at the end of the 2nd. For those who constantly worry about the Bengals mis-reading the skill-set of their picks, perhaps it is some comfort that they selected a player who a bunch of teams were aiming for in that round...

Again, my problem isn't with Simpson, it's with the guy they picked before him. If the price of moving up to get Ellis was that we heard the Bengals call Earl Bennett's name in the early third versus Simpson's in the second, I would have been more than OK with that.

I like Earl Bennett, too, in that scenario. The only problem is, then we still have a hole at LB. We cannot count on Odell coming in and immediately being the same type of player he was in'05 and Brooks has not yet shown he can stay healthy. That leaves your top 3 LB's as Jones, Jeanty and Blackstock/Johnson. In that same scenario I would rather have Jones, Jeanty and Rivers with Pat Sims and Peko/Thornton as tackles, as opposed to Jones, Jeanty and a castoff or later round pick and Ellis, Peko/Thornton at DT. Not even mentioning that I think that Simpson will be a better pro than Bennett, in the long run.

Also, a potential LB corp of Brooks (healthy), Thurman ('05 form) and Rivers could be dominating and I think Sims is the steal of the draft, in round 3 (1st team all SEC over Harrison and next to Dorsey as a true Junior).

[kingwilly]

But Hoosier, that's not the equation since we'd have had to give up one (or both) of our thirds (Sims or Caldwell) or r3a+r4 to move up.

No, we wouldn't have. We had pick 46 in the mid-second. The Pats had pick 69 up at the top of the third. The difference in value, per the trade chart, between those two picks is 200 points. The difference in value between the 7 and 9 is 150 points. All we would have had to do is swap those picks, so we don't lose a single selection. That's what NO and the Pats did, except that they swapped a NO 3rd for a Pats 5th. NO didn't give up a pick, they just slid down two rounds.

Well, then either the Bengals did not "want" (complacency/lack of creativity) to make a deal, or NE was not receptive to the offer from a conference opponent who they might not want to get better. There were others who we could have engaged trade talks with.

I am disappointed in not getting Ellis. Rivers is a good player and will be a good player. This draft will be judged on the Simpson, Sims and Shirley picks...

[mgilgris]

Whether the Steelers were interested or not I do not care. As long as the run defense is somehow shored up, I will admit my error on the Simpson pick. If it is not shored up I will say that the Simpson pick was not the correct pick. Not bc of his abilities but bc of the NEED that we have had on defense for the past 3 seasons. I for one am tired of having a good offense and a horrible defense. I am tired of teh best player available when we continue to struggle with the same problems.

Regardless, it is not the Simpson pick that threw a lot of people for the loop. It was the position that was picked with the second pick.