2nd Round: Kenny Irons

[HoosierCat]

I just see this as a panic pick. Durant was the player they wanted and he goes one pick in front of them and they paniced. They were all set up to pick Durant. I can't understand this pick and hope somebody good falls to them in round 4

Well, under that theory, if it was a panic pick, they would have reached for a LB, or at least another defender, right?

[Spor_tees]

I just see this as a panic pick. Durant was the player they wanted and he goes one pick in front of them and they paniced. They were all set up to pick Durant. I can't understand this pick and hope somebody good falls to them in round 4

Well, under that theory, if it was a panic pick, they would have reached for a LB, or at least another defender, right?

Tim Crowder would not have been a reach...in fact he went just a few picks later to the Broncos, and will probably start on one of the top defenses in the AFC.

[Tasher]

I just see this as a panic pick. Durant was the player they wanted and he goes one pick in front of them and they paniced. They were all set up to pick Durant. I can't understand this pick and hope somebody good falls to them in round 4

Well, under that theory, if it was a panic pick, they would have reached for a LB, or at least another defender, right?

Right! It is not last year when we were looking at guys that were rated several round lower or undrafted FAs.

You can make some of the people happy some of the time...

[duus]

I just see this as a panic pick. Durant was the player they wanted and he goes one pick in front of them and they paniced. They were all set up to pick Durant. I can't understand this pick and hope somebody good falls to them in round 4

Well, under that theory, if it was a panic pick, they would have reached for a LB, or at least another defender, right?

You beat me to it. That's exactly how I see it as well. If they truly did 'panic' then it would have simply been next defender down the list. I see this as them having the guys they wanted, then they went right before them, then next on the agenda was to attempt a trade, and that didn't work out. So the next option was BPA in key positions that have some level of need. RB is that position. Irons is that pick. Makes perfect sense.

[hrod382]

After looking it over there wasn't much for defenders that made sense at that spot.

My only beef is not taking Ryan Kalil instead... Unfortunate but it's hard for me to really complain given I don't have any defensive guys that I would've rather seen.

[Kirkendall]

One thing everyone here is debating, which is very very good, isn't the talent or who Kenny Irons is... just the logic of taking a RB in the second. I think that's a good sign. It means that, with most people saying if we're going after a RB in the second, then Kenny Irons is fine by me.

Resident "sunshine guy"

[HoosierCat]

I just see this as a panic pick. Durant was the player they wanted and he goes one pick in front of them and they paniced. They were all set up to pick Durant. I can't understand this pick and hope somebody good falls to them in round 4

Well, under that theory, if it was a panic pick, they would have reached for a LB, or at least another defender, right?

Tim Crowder would not have been a reach...in fact he went just a few picks later to the Broncos, and will probably start on one of the top defenses in the AFC.

It's not a matter of a reach -- just that if they really were focused on Durant and the D, Irons would not have been the pick. In fact, you can argue that if they had panicked after Durant, Crowder would have been far more proof of that than Irons.

[Spor_tees]

I just see this as a panic pick. Durant was the player they wanted and he goes one pick in front of them and they paniced. They were all set up to pick Durant. I can't understand this pick and hope somebody good falls to them in round 4

Well, under that theory, if it was a panic pick, they would have reached for a LB, or at least another defender, right?

Tim Crowder would not have been a reach...in fact he went just a few picks later to the Broncos, and will probably start on one of the top defenses in the AFC.

It's not a matter of a reach -- just that if they really were focused on Durant and the D, Irons would not have been the pick. In fact, you can argue that if they had panicked after Durant, Crowder would have been far more proof of that than Irons.

How would it be a panic when your starting DE is franchise tagged and unless you sign him to a long term contract could put you in cap hell or force you to let him leave? So come next year the Bengals will be stuck looking for a guy to start right away instead of having Crowder who could have matured for a year and started full time next year. I will bet all my Zone points that Irons doesn't start next year unless Rudi has an injury. As long as Rudi is healthy, Irons will not start.

[hrod382]

One thing everyone here is debating, which is very very good, isn't the talent or who Kenny Irons is... just the logic of taking a RB in the second. I think that's a good sign. It means that, with most people saying if we're going after a RB in the second, then Kenny Irons is fine by me.

Yeah that's a good thing for sure.

I think he's a good player and I've been afraid of Rudi being hurt since opening day next year, we would be screwed. However my beef is that there are plenty of guys day 2 that could provide that.

But as I said earlier, I'm really just complaining because it was offense and I really don't have a defender that I think should've been the pick so I'm just complaining.

EDIT: Hoosier... We've yet to see Frostee play and Marvin/other players are very high on him. Regardless of whether or not you think he'll be good the only guy that matters does think he will be good. With that being the case there just wasn't much motivation to take Crowder given he wasn't BPA. I personally don't see much that's impressive with him and I don't see any real upside, I really doubt he ever becomes a solid starter.

[SkinneymulleT]

How about mangini pulling the cock-a-doodle block on us 2x's? That was a bunch of crap. Irons will be a change of pace and was impressive from the limited clips, but i agree with upgrade evaluation rather then true need. We were like 8 in total offense, 30 defense. If we drafted all defense we still have no real need on offense and stay in the top 10. I guess chris perry will be getting a visit from barbaro's Dr. soon. Only issue with the pick is why not take one of those trades for someones 2nd and 3rd and just get a similar quality back later in the 2nd round? Same thing they messed up on drafting C. Perry.

[kingwilly]

Let's consider this as a cirteria when assessing a pick:

"Does ________ do the Team well to step up for ________ who has just been sidelined with serious injury?"

If I insert "Irons" and "Johnson" into that equation, I feel better than I did than before the draft.

[Spor_tees]

Let's consider this as a cirteria when assessing a pick:

"Does ________ do the Team well to step up for ________ who has just been sidelined with serious injury?"

If I insert "Irons" and "Johnson" into that equation, I feel better than I did than before the draft.

I wouldn't use that argument because a person could say:

"Does Brady Quinn do the Team well to step up for Carson Palmer who has just been sidelined with serious injury?"

Brady was available for the Bengals first round pick....

[HoosierCat]

How would it be a panic when your starting DE is franchise tagged and unless you sign him to a long term contract could put you in cap hell or force you to let him leave?

Well, I didn't suggest it was a panic move, you did. So if you are now saying it wasn't, OK, I agree.

So come next year the Bengals will be stuck looking for a guy to start right away instead of having Crowder who could have matured for a year and started full time next year. I will bet all my Zone points that Irons doesn't start next year unless Rudi has an injury. As long as Rudi is healthy, Irons will not start.

The Justin issue obviously has to be dealt with. But even if you assume he is gone, you've got Geathers and a 3rd rounder in Rucker long-term, plus DE/OLB Eric "the next Adalius Thomas" Henderson and swing guy Fanene -- and Pollack, who it seems to me is sending the message that if he comes back it will be (only) to play DE. I would have had no problem with Crowder, but let's face it, there's far more depth at DE than RB. As for Irons starting, hell, if he can just stay healthy and give us a solid No. 2 he'll be worth it.

[Spor_tees]

How would it be a panic when your starting DE is franchise tagged and unless you sign him to a long term contract could put you in cap hell or force you to let him leave?

Well, I didn't suggest it was a panic move, you did. So if you are now saying it wasn't, OK, I agree.

So come next year the Bengals will be stuck looking for a guy to start right away instead of having Crowder who could have matured for a year and started full time next year. I will bet all my Zone points that Irons doesn't start next year unless Rudi has an injury. As long as Rudi is healthy, Irons will not start.

The Justin issue obviously has to be dealt with. But even if you assume he is gone, you've got Geathers and a 3rd rounder in Rucker long-term, plus DE/OLB Eric "the next Adalius Thomas" Henderson and swing guy Fanene -- and Pollack, who it seems to me is sending the message that if he comes back it will be (only) to play DE. I would have had no problem with Crowder, but let's face it, there's far more depth at DE than RB. As for Irons starting, hell, if he can just stay healthy and give us a solid No. 2 he'll be worth it.

I didn't say it was a panic move, someone else up there did ^ Wraith.

[HoosierCat]

EDIT: Hoosier... We've yet to see Frostee play and Marvin/other players are very high on him. Regardless of whether or not you think he'll be good the only guy that matters does think he will be good. With that being the case there just wasn't much motivation to take Crowder given he wasn't BPA. I personally don't see much that's impressive with him and I don't see any real upside, I really doubt he ever becomes a solid starter.

I'm not saying they should have taken Crowder over Irons, or anything about Rucker other than that he's on the team. I would have been cool with Irons or Crowder. All I'm saying is that Irons isn't some nutty pick. Obviously there are those that disagree. Which is cool...all will be revealed in time.

I didn't say it was a panic move, someone else up there did ^ Wraith.

Cool.

[mjm47]

I like this pick's implications more than I like its substance. As has been mentioned above, I think that it reflects good organization as well as a good level of confidence in a lot of the defensive players that are question marks.

Turk McBride was available and would have been reasonable, as well as Charles Johnson. I think that the Irons selection belays Marvin's confidence that Sam Adams will show up in better shape this year, that Peko will continue to develop and that the loss of Justin isn't the end of the world.

[Stripes]

I just got home from work, and I'm genuinely shocked at this Kenny Irons pick. I don't disapprove, but I really didn't see this coming at all. I don't think he was brought in to replace Perry, because he isn't as versatile. He's a better downhill runner though, and should make a very serviceable backup to Rudi Johnson.

I'm excited to see him getting some carries. Wow.

[kingwilly]

Let's consider this as a cirteria when assessing a pick:

"Does ________ do the Team well to step up for ________ who has just been sidelined with serious injury?"

If I insert "Irons" and "Johnson" into that equation, I feel better than I did than before the draft.

I wouldn't use that argument because a person could say:

"Does Brady Quinn do the Team well to step up for Carson Palmer who has just been sidelined with serious injury?"

Brady was available for the Bengals first round pick....

Ok, here goes...F Quinn, especially since he is now in the division.

[Kazkal]

Charles Johnson went a full rnd after.

[Spor_tees]

Let's consider this as a cirteria when assessing a pick:

"Does ________ do the Team well to step up for ________ who has just been sidelined with serious injury?"

If I insert "Irons" and "Johnson" into that equation, I feel better than I did than before the draft.

I wouldn't use that argument because a person could say:

"Does Brady Quinn do the Team well to step up for Carson Palmer who has just been sidelined with serious injury?"

Brady was available for the Bengals first round pick....

Ok, here goes...F Quinn, especially since he is now in the division.

Scarey thought with Quinn throwing to Edwards, Jurivicious, and Winslow. If Jamal Lewis can give them one good year so they can draft a great RB next year to go with the improved line...they could be dangerous. Imagine that group of skill players with a guy like Steve Slaton, Ray Rice, or Darren McFadden.

[kingwilly]

Way of topic but Crennel will gum it up somehow. He is overrrated, a la Belichick effect. Turds are no worry.

[Whur CHad At?]

Let's consider this as a cirteria when assessing a pick:

"Does ________ do the Team well to step up for ________ who has just been sidelined with serious injury?"

If I insert "Irons" and "Johnson" into that equation, I feel better than I did than before the draft.

I wouldn't use that argument because a person could say:

"Does Brady Quinn do the Team well to step up for Carson Palmer who has just been sidelined with serious injury?"

Brady was available for the Bengals first round pick....

Ok, here goes...F Quinn, especially since he is now in the division.

Scarey thought with Quinn throwing to Edwards, Jurivicious, and Winslow. If Jamal Lewis can give them one good year so they can draft a great RB next year to go with the improved line...they could be dangerous. Imagine that group of skill players with a guy like Steve Slaton, Ray Rice, or Darren McFadden.

Dont forget, Cleveland doesnt have a 1st rounder next year

[derekshank]

Scarey thought with Quinn throwing to Edwards, Jurivicious, and Winslow. If Jamal Lewis can give them one good year so they can draft a great RB next year to go with the improved line...they could be dangerous. Imagine that group of skill players with a guy like Steve Slaton, Ray Rice, or Darren McFadden.

Not that this is the appropriate thread for this discussion... but I want to respond. I'm not afraid of Brady Quinn... especially for the next 2 years. Get back to me in 2009.

I've also seen nothing that would cause me to be worried about either Winslow or Edwards... and as for Slaton, Rice, McFadden... they traded next years 1st round pick to get Brady. If any of the aforementioned RB's were there in the 2nd, then they have only a 3rd round pick to work on that joke of a defense.

Frankly, even if Brady Quinn works out as their franchise QB, it's just the first step in a rebuilding process that is going to take them several years. They are still no threat for a playoff spot in teh AFC North.

-------------------

Now... back to the Kenny Irons pick:

Could this pick be in any way a desire to lengthen Rudi's career? Think about Bettis with the Steelers. Willie Parker got a lot of the carries... not as just a change of pace back, but as part of the 2 RB system that so many NFL teams run.

The NFL, more and more requires a team to have more than one quality RB (Dunn/Norwood; Jones-Drew/Taylor; Dillon/Maroney; Addai/Rhodes). For the last several years the Bengals have been going to battle with Rudi as the only RB that can really carry the load. It would be nice to have a guy to split carries with, keeping both of them fresh for the entire season... and having Rudi with fresher legs in the 4th quarter with a lead could be devastating to an opposing defense.

Just trying to be optimistic with a pick I don't entirely understand... but hey, maybe he ends up being a stud and we're all really happy with a pick that didn't at first make sense (i.e. Whitworth).

[HoosierCat]

Could this pick be in any way a desire to lengthen Rudi's career? Think about Bettis with the Steelers. Willie Parker got a lot of the carries... not as just a change of pace back, but as part of the 2 RB system that so many NFL teams run.

Ahhh...someone else gets it.

[Stripes]

The NFL, more and more requires a team to have more than one quality RB (Dunn/Norwood; Jones-Drew/Taylor; Dillon/Maroney; Addai/Rhodes). For the last several years the Bengals have been going to battle with Rudi as the only RB that can really carry the load. It would be nice to have a guy to split carries with, keeping both of them fresh for the entire season... and having Rudi with fresher legs in the 4th quarter with a lead could be devastating to an opposing defense.

Agreed.

I think the most similar offense to the Bengals' in the league resides in New Orleans, and we saw how well the Deuce/Reggie tandem worked for them last season. It's absurd to complain about Rudi Johnson considering his production here , but giving him some help can't hurt.