Kazkal Posted January 31, 2007 Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 Our defense is going down hill yet chucking keeps his job after 3 years...but frazier had less to work with and was let go after 2 "shrug" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted January 31, 2007 Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 Well...Frazier's coaching in the SB this Sunday and Chucky...isn't.Too bad he and Marvin apparently didn't mesh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted January 31, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 I'd perfer marvin not meshing if it ment getting rid of chucky /crybut I guess were just gonna have to stick it out with raider trash.PS,I guess marvin likes when you blitz it's the same blitz over and over and over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC_Bengals_Fan Posted January 31, 2007 Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 I'd perfer marvin not meshing if it ment getting rid of chucky /crybut I guess were just gonna have to stick it out with raider trash.PS,I guess marvin likes when you blitz it's the same blitz over and over and over.Yeah, it always works when the line and QB know exactly where the pressure is coming from. It wouldn't really be honorable otherwise, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted January 31, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 Yup not suppossed fool QB's in the nfl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stripes Posted January 31, 2007 Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 Leslie is in the Superbowl with one of the worst defenses in the NFL (and the worst YPC run defense in NFL history). They're on a hot streak, but they still suck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairOnFire Posted January 31, 2007 Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 Their schemes and methods may have differed, but the end results haven't. Too many big plays surrendered at the worst possible time. Personally, I prefer a defense that attacks as if it's collective hair was on fire, but despite my love for stunting and blitzing it's fair to say Frazier's units were rarely in the right position and couldn't tackle at all. In contrast, a Bres defense doesn't attempt to do as much, and as a result doesn't accomplish much. Pretty hard to feel much love for either coach, ehh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sportsdoc Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Yep, I would not hire either of them. With Marvin being a defensive guru, it seems like we have made little improvement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalByTheBay Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 I've asked myself this question more than a few times this season. In a way though, I think both DC's have left a lot to be desired. While Frazier got me more pumped with the aggressiveness of the plays -- they at least looked like they were doing something out there -- the poor tackling was as evident then as it is now. I would think that reflects poorly on the position coaches first and then on the side of the ball as a whole. Moreover, the odd ability to turn the ball over last year in the secondary and the equally-odd complete inability to do that this year leaves me scratching my head as to exactly WTF is going on at any particular time. Some continuity in personnel couldn't hurt next year - injuries were brutal - but I agree that this doesn't explain everything. Baffling really. I continue to hope we're just a young team that may someday learn how to tackle and play with discipline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whur CHad At? Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Leslie Frazier is coaching one of the worst defenses in NFL History Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted February 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Do you expect them have top 10 run defense when their entire front 7 is undersized? I was talking more about what he did for us then the colts...ya colts run defense sucks bt so does our pass he also only had total of 2 years...plus we went defensive heavy on drafts after he left so he had abunch crap FA's and few decent players like Bsimms and Jsmith to work with...I wonder if defense starts out stinking next season if marvin takes control ala ravens with offense last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stripes Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Do you expect them have top 10 run defense when their entire front 7 is undersized? I was talking more about what he did for us then the colts...ya colts run defense sucks bt so does our pass he also only had total of 2 years...plus we went defensive heavy on drafts after he left so he had abunch crap FA's and few decent players like Bsimms and Jsmith to work with...I don't think Marvin axed Leslie because of the defense's performance so much as his disagreement with Leslie's defensive philosophies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted February 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Ya makes me wonder about marvin though if he has same philosophies. as chuck prevent prevent prevent blitz package 1 prevent prevent prevent prevent blitz package 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spain Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Marvin took over playcalling at mid season ehan he was here. NO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted February 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Vikings | Colts' Frazier could be candidate for def. coordinator jobWed, 31 Jan 2007 08:38:36 -0800Sean Jensen, of the St. Paul Pioneer Press, reports Indianapolis Colts defensive backs coach and assistant to the head coach Leslie Frazier could be a candidate for the Minnesota Vikings defensive coordinator vacancy. However, the Vikings would have to wait until after the Super Bowl Sunday, Feb. 4, to ask for permission to speak to Frazier, who is under contract with the Colts for 2007. "I'd like to get that opportunity one day, to advance," Frazier said. "Like most coaches in our profession, you want to advance, and my goal is to one day be a head coach in the NFL, and one of those steps will probably be being a coordinator (again). Hopefully, the right opportunity will come." Frazier served as the Cincinnati Bengals defensive coordinator in 2003-04. Frazier and Vikings head coach Brad Childress worked together as Philadelphia Eagles assistants from 1999-2002. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Congrats to Leslie on his second SB ring. Yah, Marv might have pulled the triger just a touch too soon... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairOnFire Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 The thing I found most interesting was the idea that Lovie Smith and Ron Rivera, two of the most respected defensive minded coaches in the NFL, chose to attack the Colt's offense in exactly the same manner that Marvin and Bres did this year....with almost identical results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stripes Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 The thing I found most interesting was the idea that Lovie Smith and Ron Rivera, two of the most respected defensive minded coaches in the NFL, chose to attack the Colt's offense in exactly the same manner that Marvin and Bres did this year....with almost identical results.Yup. I thought the Bears biggest problem on defense was their inability to create a pass rush with the front four (sounds familiar). Manning had plenty of time to find checkdown receivers underneath all game long (sounds familiar) and hence the Colts were able to establish incredible offensive balance.My initial and predictable thoughts regarding Marvin's/Bresnehan's scheming against the Colts was that it was outright stupid... but meh. We couldn't execute the gameplan effectively without a pass rush, and nor could the Bears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjakq27 Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Ron Meeks is the D-coordinator for Indy not Frazier correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted February 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Aye I think so...if I'm not mistaken fraz is just a assist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Frazier I believe wears 2 hats, DB coach and "special assistant to the head coach" or something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalszoneBilly Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Aye I think so...if I'm not mistaken fraz is just a assist.Even if he did ride this guy's coat tails to his second Superbowl ring, it's still something special. Just ask Dan Marino! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirkendall Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 I'm going to take a different approach. Personally, I think it's the talent (or lack thereof). You can have the best schemes of all-time if you don't have the talent to cover them. Look at our cornerbacks. Deltha O'Neal is starting to be known as a guy that just doesn't give two s**ts about football. Tory James is... well... just awful. Ratliff, IMHO, has been disappointing as hell. JJ looked good in '06...... so there's one.Linebacker? Look, I like some, but the finalist for '05 defensive rookie of the year was suspended for '06 and we know Pollack's story. Most of our linebackers that played all season were backups. Two were rookies that weren't acquired through the traditional draft or post FA-draft (supplemental draft, CFL experience). Our d-line has been known to be very average to below average. No one, except maybe Geathers who only played partially, really stood out among everyone else.I think there's justification for blaming coordinators until you're blue in the face. But keep these two things in mind.1. The talent isn't all that great. 2. Injury is a valid excuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted February 7, 2007 Report Share Posted February 7, 2007 Frazier up for the Vikings' DC job:http://www.startribune.com/510/story/985739.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonboat Posted February 8, 2007 Report Share Posted February 8, 2007 I'm going to take a different approach. Personally, I think it's the talent (or lack thereof). You can have the best schemes of all-time if you don't have the talent to cover them. Look at our cornerbacks. Deltha O'Neal is starting to be known as a guy that just doesn't give two s**ts about football. Tory James is... well... just awful. Ratliff, IMHO, has been disappointing as hell. JJ looked good in '06...... so there's one.Linebacker? Look, I like some, but the finalist for '05 defensive rookie of the year was suspended for '06 and we know Pollack's story. Most of our linebackers that played all season were backups. Two were rookies that weren't acquired through the traditional draft or post FA-draft (supplemental draft, CFL experience). Our d-line has been known to be very average to below average. No one, except maybe Geathers who only played partially, really stood out among everyone else.I think there's justification for blaming coordinators until you're blue in the face. But keep these two things in mind.1. The talent isn't all that great. 2. Injury is a valid excuse. I couldn't agree more ! Bengal by the bay brought up something I've been thinking of too which is despite different DC's we continually hear the same things year after year about not lining up right, not making the tackles, not doing your job etc. I realize this year they had alot of rookies playing but at what point do they start to look @ the position coaches most of which has been the only constant on the defensive side of the ball? D Simmons did a good job turning around the Special teams they should look @ changing the LB & DL coaches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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