Brat

[USMC203]

Has anyone noticed that of all the Head Coach changes, at no time did anyone say they wanted to talk with Brat. It is a shame that we can"t get a OC that will try to put new looks in the game. This O is one of the best in the NFL and it is going to continue to do the same old base plays another year. We need a OC that can use all the weapons that this team has and a DC that will give teams a different look.

[BengalsOwn]

Yeah, I agree.

Having one of the best offenses in the NFL isn't good enough.

[jjakq27]

Run the ball!!!!!!

[Stripes]

Having one of the best offenses in the NFL isn't good enough.

The question is, to whom do you credit most of that success? To Bratkowski, or to the talented players he coordinates?

If we stick with Brat (as seems to be the likelihood) then I am sure we'll have a top 5 offense again next year. We'll also be inconsistent on third downs and be forced to bear his bad short yardage calls and lack of devotion to a running game.

If not, we either get someone even worse that drags the offense down even more, or we find someone better suited to our players. Crap shoot.

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

Teams did show interest in Brat. Didn't you notice how many teams were noted as looking at him? At least 3 or 4.

[BengalsOwn]

We have one of the best pass protecting O-lines in the NFL.

We have the best WR corp in the NFL.

We have one of the best 5 QB's in the NFL.

And despite having all of those ingredients for a spectacular passing offense, we were 14th in the NFL in rushing attempts, at 459. The Steelers were first with 559 attempts. If we wanted to have the most attempts in the NFL, all it would've taken is 6 more rushes per game.

Sure we choked in the Steelers game by not calling enough running plays, but to say that Brat consistently doesn't call running plays is laughable.

And besides, shouldn't you be criticizing Carson for that? He calls whether or not it will be a run or pass...

[turningpoint]

We just need a TE, and this argueing will stop.

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

We just need a TE, and this argueing will stop.

Absolutely, we need a tight end so there are fewer runs.

WE DO NOT NEED A TIGHT END. WE COULD LINE STACY THE DANCING BEAR UP AT TIGHT END, AND IT WOULDN'T CHANGE ANYTHING.

[BengalsOwn]

I hope we sign that CFL DE guy and convert him to a TE!!!11

[rwalling]

Having one of the best offenses in the NFL isn't good enough.

The question is, to whom do you credit most of that success? To Bratkowski, or to the talented players he coordinates?

If we stick with Brat (as seems to be the likelihood) then I am sure we'll have a top 5 offense again next year. We'll also be inconsistent on third downs and be forced to bear his bad short yardage calls and lack of devotion to a running game.

If not, we either get someone even worse that drags the offense down even more, or we find someone better suited to our players. Crap shoot.

Brat or the players? The other element to this discussion is the position coaches. Personally, I think if Brat walks, so be it. The front office should be grooming Zampese as his replacement and working to keep other teams, especially ones with young QBs, from grabbing him as the offensive coordinator.

[bengalsfansince68]

[sure we choked in the Steelers game by not calling enough running plays, but to say that Brat consistently doesn't call running plays is laughable.

Laughable?

Rudi should consistently get the ball 25 to 30 times every game. He touched the ball less than 20 times in 8 of our 17 games which produced a record of 2 - 6. The record was 9 - 0 in games where Rudi runs 20 or more times.

Running the ball 13 times in a playoff game against the Steelers would be laughable if it were not so damned sad.

Running the football is important.

Get a clue Brat.

[BengalsOwn]

[sure we choked in the Steelers game by not calling enough running plays, but to say that Brat consistently doesn't call running plays is laughable.

Laughable?

Rudi should consistently get the ball 25 to 30 times every game. He touched the ball less than 20 times in 8 of our 17 games which produced a record of 2 - 6. The record was 9 - 0 in games where Rudi runs 20 or more times.

Running the ball 13 times in a playoff game against the Steelers would be laughable if it were not so damned sad.

Running the football is important.

Get a clue Brat.

of course, I guess it wouldn't be possible, that in the games where Rudi ran less than 20 times, that was because we were losing and couldn't afford to run the ball anyways...

[HoosierCat]

All I know is that I was browsing bengals.com a couple days back when I came aross this Hobson piece, in which he talks to Brat about how to beat Pitt: http://www.bengals.com/news/news.asp?story_id=5033

And I got down to this comment, which had me grinding my teeth by the time I reached the end:

“You have to generate big plays because it’s just so hard to run the ball against them down after down,” Bratkowski says. “You’re just not going to get those 10- and 12- and 14-play drives against them. You have to get yards in big chunks. You have to throw it over their heads a few times. And, yeah, we had planned to do it a few times (in the Wild Card Game).”

Which made me wonder who was edting game tape for the team since they must have left out the 17-play scoring drive in the playoff game or the 12-play drve before the missed FG, or Carson's 11- and 10-play scoring drives in the win at Pitt. Yes, going downfield is a part of the game you need to have. But the way he just brushes off long drives, which usually include a healthy done of the run, is IMHO just one more indication of his pass-happy mentality.

[bengalsfansince68]

[

of course, I guess it wouldn't be possible, that in the games where Rudi ran less than 20 times, that was because we were losing and couldn't afford to run the ball anyways...

I have heard that same lame excuse for not running the ball for two decades. Just because you are behind 7 to ten points does not mean that you are forced to abandon the run. We were not behind to such an extent as to be forced to go pass happy in any game with the exception of the Colts game in which we were forced to score quickly in an attempt to keep up with the onslaught of points the Colts were putting up. That is really the only game in which that lame excuse is even possible.

If you are behind a touchdown in the third quarter, suddenly you have to strike immediately? PLEASE!

[Kirkendall]

Do you guys think Brat's philosophy is a lack of confidence running the ball, or in fact, a mindset to pass first, run fifth. Sometimes I think he'd rather punt on second, than run.

I do think Brat is the kind of guy that misjudges the opposing team's momentum and tries to answer the other's last scoring drive by doing something quickly on first. 2nd and 10, swing pass for two yards. 3rd and 8, TJ running an in and out for 6 yards. Punt.

Here we go.

First Downs

Palmer pass: 197 attempts

Rudi rush attempts: 189 rushes

Second Downs

Palmer pass: 171

Rudi rush attempts: 126

Third Downs

Palmer pass: 137

Rudi/Perry rush attempts: 20/6

Obviously, these stats are a little silly because of situations. But more fuel to the fire in our annual "Bratkowski needs to run Rudi more" debate -- which I think he does too!

[bengalsfansince68]

Do you guys think Brat's philosophy is a lack of confidence running the ball, or in fact, a mindset to pass first, run fifth. Sometimes I think he'd rather punt on second, than run.

I do think Brat is the kind of guy that misjudges the opposing team's momentum and tries to answer the other's last scoring drive by doing something quickly on first. 2nd and 10, swing pass for two yards. 3rd and 8, TJ running an in and out for 6 yards. Punt.

Hey Kirk

While I love our big play capability with Carson, I equally love seeing Rudi rip off 8 yards on first down. I love 2nd and two or 1. We need to see more of that.

[Kirkendall]

I agree. I think the best plays are the one's where Rudi runs full steam and comes out of the line of scrimmage untouched for a big gain. Man, that fires me up.

BTW, you need to send me an e-mail.. http://forums.bengalszone.com/index.php?showtopic=9752

[bengalsfansince68]

I agree. I think the best plays are the one's where Rudi runs full steam and comes out of the line of scrimmage untouched for a big gain. Man, that fires me up.

BTW, you need to send me an e-mail.. http://forums.bengalszone.com/index.php?showtopic=9752

Right back at ya Kirk!

[andybren]

I've been saying for a while now that I don't think Brat calls too few running plays, just that he calls them at the wrong times. And I've also been wishing that I could articulate it better. Best I figure is to look at specific scenarios...

1. First quarter, beginning of a drive - I love to see the big pass play, like the one that Carson got hurt on. Even when it's incomplete, it sets the tone and starts putting the defense on their heels. Following these kind of plays, it makes perfect sense to have a running play. Mix it up, don't give 'em a chance to figure out what's happening.

2. Rudi rips one for 10-15 yards - Do it again. I absolutely hate to see Brat go into the 'finese' game when he could be stepping on their throats. Even if you only pick up 3 or 4 yards, you're setting Carson up with more options on 2nd and 3rd downs. Luckily Carson has a good completion percentage, because to me there's nothing worse than following a great run with an incompletion.

3. Second half, playing with a small lead - Rev up the engines and get down the field as fast as you can. You've got a 6 or 7 point lead and you sit back and see what happens with a little sweep to the side? No. That's when you need to get the "explosive" pass offensive fired up. After that, the other team will press harder and be more prone to mistakes. All those interceptions against the NFC North didn't happen because we had a little 3 point lead.

4. Second half, playing with a bigger lead - Run no less than 2 rushing plays for every pass. Grind out a drive, take time off the clock, keep the opposing offense of the field. Too many times last year we let opponents determine the pace of the second half and they responded by keeping themselves in the game. Or in the Wild Card game, by re-taking the lead and finishing us off.

5. Second half, beginning of a drive, no momentum - I absolutely hate to see Brat trying to ramp up the offense with the three-yards-and-a-cloud-of-dust game. If ever there is a time not to run, it's when your team has 80 yards to go and hasn't made any noise in a while. Instead Brat seems to like calling low-percentage plays that go nowhere, starting the offensive with a 2nd and 10 (or worse) situation. It's a recipe for 3-and-out. Run a little West Coast instead. Get to the middle of the field, then pick your poison.

That's my 2 cents.

And for what it's worth, a good pass-catching tight end would have little to no effect on the running game. Though it certainly wouldn't hurt to upgrade.

[HoTbOy]

I say give Zampese the OC job and let Brat walk you guys all made good points especially about giving up the run so early. I would have like to see them go to Perry out of the backfield more on 1st down instead of 3rd when everyone knew what was coming...Maybe Marvin's fault for not telling Brat to run more. And to a certain extent if you are going to be pass happy i agree with Chad to throw it to him, just because he is doubled throw it. Steve Smith, Randy Moss TO they are all doubled to but there QB finds a way to get the ball to them....

[Tasher]