Taking a CB?

[schweinhart]

Cromartie looked great. The 40 time won't help him but it it won't kill him either because he's got top range speed after 20 yards with the stride he has. Plus, he looked sharp in the positional drills showing he can turn his hips and cut as quick as any one into his speed. If teams liked the medical part, he helped himself in the combine given that the nature of his injury and his relative inexperience had teams in the dark. He did well just to show up and will get more opportunities to show teams what he can do in the month ahead.

Hands down, though, the CB who helped himself the most was Johnathan Joseph. Besides being the 2nd fastest cat at the combine, he showed he's a cut above the CB pack -- not just speed, but his reaction on drills and his physique. The best thing about the combine is seeing these players on the same field at the same time or at least doing the same things on a level playing field. Joseph definitely separated himself from the pack and looks like a 1st round CB who will have a leg up with his size vs. the run.

Tye Hill also helped himself with his leap and proving again how fast he is. No other CB in the draft have feet as good as him and he did nothing but solidify himself as a 1st round cover corner who also can hang with the quickest of WRs out of the slot.

If the Bengals wait until the 2nd round for CB, they'd probably be picking between Alan Zemaitis, Richard Marshall, Demario Minter, Devin Hester and Dee Webb.

[Stripes]

It's good to hear Cromartie has done well, but I fear all that may do is lessen the Bengals' chances of getting him... Before his injury he was the undisputed best NFL prospect at corner, and we don't want him anywhere near that title again, or we'll see him gone long before we pick.

[HairOnFire]

Tye Hill also helped himself with his leap and proving again how fast he is. No other CB in the draft have feet as good as him and he did nothing but solidify himself as a 1st round cover corner who also can hang with the quickest of WRs out of the slot.

Not only is he fast, look at the way he's put together. He's as muscular as Mighty Mouse, and that surprising power allows him to successfully jam much bigger wideouts. He did all week long at the Senior Bowl. Plus, his outstanding leaping ability allows him to negate ta bigger wideouts size when the ball is in play.

The only negative that I can see in Hill's game is when he's backed off the line and forced to play zone coverage. That gives the wideout enough space to use his size and take advantage of Hill's marginal tackling ability. But that's it as far as negatives go, and a team that uses Hill exclusively in man coverage eliminates the problem.

Frankly, the only thing that prevents me from officially pimping Tye Hill as my 1st round guy is the nagging suspicion that even if he's available, and the Bengals target a CB at that spot, they'll pick a bigger, slower, and sloppier zone corner.

[kingwilly]

With 9 DB's going sub 4.40...I think we can all agree that there is plenty of speed to go around. Here are my takes on the guys who worked at the combine.

Tye Hill - If his game tapes show his tackling ability in space, I'm certain he'll be gone in r1..I;d rather have a guy who excels at man-to-man and have to learn/improve his zone coverage. With his speed he can get a break on the ball or an angel on a WR, no matter the size of the WR

J. Jospeph - yes, he's fast. Yes, he's got proto size...and has made plays..the only knocks on him is inexperience and inconsistency. whn he is "on" he is as good as anyone...when he is not, he's susceptibe. If all it takes to address this is better coaching and discipline, then here is your guy to be tutored by Tory/Deltha.

Cromartie - depsite a comparably slow 40, he has amazing control and agility for his size. Knocks here would be ?marks about his recovery and overall lack of experience at the college level. I consider him a Madieu type...versatile enought o play any of the DB spots.

Hester...a bit on the small size but adds value with his KR/R abilities...will be a fine nickel back for a team that needs depth...aka, the Bengals.

I think if jason Allen's hip checks out he jumps into r1...

Ko Simpson showed well and will be an early r2 guy.

Daniel Bullucks will start right away wheever he goes, hopefully not pittsburgh.

Some sleepers:

Derrick Martin - Wyoming - decent 40 time but excelled in the shuttle and cone drills...flashed very good athleticism, I thought.

Darrell Hunter -Miami (OH) - 6' 205...strong, fast, & the MAC is no longer a slouch conf.

Marcus Demps - very talented guy with good speed, ability...maye a r4-5 steal.

[schweinhart]

There's a surplus of speed at CB this year...no question. IMO it's the wrong year to burn a Day 1 pick on a zone corner like Alan Zemaitis.

There's a couple more sleepers to throw in the mix, who might be there for the Benglas early in Day 2 if they don't pull the trigger on a CB before then:

1. Danieal Manning: Physical, quick, with decent straight speed (4.46), who is also a retuner.

2. David Pittman: Got a late invite to the Senior Bowl and showed some impressive coverage skills. Also had decent speed (4.44) at the combine.

There might also be some decent talent that drops to Day 2:

1. Will Blackmon: Terrible showing in the Senior Bowl after not playing CB for a year and also looked awful handling punts. Worked the combine with the WRs and ran a 4.46. But he could fit the zone corner bill and returns much better than he showed at the Senior Bowl.

2. Charles Gordon: Another CB/WR return man: Right around 4.5 at the combine and showed he's plenty athletic. He looks like he could slide into Day 2 given the competition he's up against.

[Kazkal]

what was ratliff's 40?

[kingwilly]

4.60

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/keiwan_ratliff

plus it is that from some other web sources, as well...

Keep in mind P-Body *supposedly* ran some sub 4.30 40's before....

[Whur CHad At?]

If we pick any corner on Day 1 it will be Hester. The Bengals seem to be high on him, plus he fills a couple of needs. He will def. be an electrifying Punt Returner, and a decent nickel corner.

[HairOnFire]

I can't remember where I stumbled across it, but I read that the Bengals told Hester that if they drafted him they intended to use him on both sides of the ball. Punt returner, dime corner, occasional reps at wideout.

[Whur CHad At?]

I can't remember where I stumbled across it, but I read that the Bengals told Hester that if they drafted him they intended to use him on both sides of the ball. Punt returner, dime corner, occasional reps at wideout.

Not Quarterback or Dlineman?????!

[TJJackson]

If they want a two way athlete that can return kicks/punts that they can get possibly even as late as round 4, they should go with Will Blackmon of BC rather than Hester

[kingwilly]

I disagree...I think Blackmon is a decent WR/CB but not so good on the KR...Hester is a CB then KR...then a PINCH WR....

Blackmon is a far superior ST coverage player, though...

[BengalPappaw]

IMHO The 40 times are a good signal for the Bengals -- it means we will have plenty of opportunities to get a good CB in the draft. Whether it is round 1, 2 or 3.

I'm still rooting for getting Ko Simpson in Rd 1 -- but would be happy if the best player available when the Bengals draft is Donte Whitner or Jason Allen or Antonio Cromartie.

These good 40 times by the DB may be a real blessing -- the Bengals wont waste a first round pick on one of the DT, because there are better players at the DB positions.

[ArmyBengal]

Hester would not bother me in the least as his speed is far more than adequate and he fills a BIG need at punt returner. I would love to see him back there to return. However, that being said, I would absolutely LOVE to see Teddy Ginn back there in 2007 !!! To bad we won't be picking high enough to get him !!!

WHODEY !!!

[schweinhart]

IMHO The 40 times are a good signal for the Bengals -- it means we will have plenty of opportunities to get a good CB in the draft. Whether it is round 1, 2 or 3.

I'm still rooting for getting Ko Simpson in Rd 1 -- but would be happy if the best player available when the Bengals draft is Donte Whitner or Jason Allen or Antonio Cromartie.

These good 40 times by the DB may be a real blessing -- the Bengals wont waste a first round pick on one of the DT, because there are better players at the DB positions.

I hear you Pap plugging Ko. There's a good chance you'll hit the nail on the head again.

One thing that might be against Ko is whether or not he can handle the SS position in the NFL, particularly the run. To me he looks like a pure FS who could possibly with the straightline speed he has and ball insitincts play zone corner with some man against certain receivers. I'm not sure relying on Madieu as the SS is the way for the Bengals to go. But maybe you see Ko's ability to interchange at safety and play strong different?

[Whur CHad At?]

IMHO The 40 times are a good signal for the Bengals -- it means we will have plenty of opportunities to get a good CB in the draft. Whether it is round 1, 2 or 3.

I'm still rooting for getting Ko Simpson in Rd 1 -- but would be happy if the best player available when the Bengals draft is Donte Whitner or Jason Allen or Antonio Cromartie.

These good 40 times by the DB may be a real blessing -- the Bengals wont waste a first round pick on one of the DT, because there are better players at the DB positions.

I hear you Pap plugging Ko. There's a good chance you'll hit the nail on the head again.

One thing that might be against Ko is whether or not he can handle the SS position in the NFL, particularly the run. To me he looks like a pure FS who could possibly with the straightline speed he has and ball insitincts play zone corner with some man against certain receivers. I'm not sure relying on Madieu as the SS is the way for the Bengals to go. But maybe you see Ko's ability to interchange at safety and play strong different?

I think Ko will handle it well. They said the same things about Ed Reed and Troy Polamalu about stopping the run and some covergae issues and they faired pretty well. Ko will be a Pro Bowler his second year in the league

[BengalPappaw]

IMHO The 40 times are a good signal for the Bengals -- it means we will have plenty of opportunities to get a good CB in the draft. Whether it is round 1, 2 or 3.

I'm still rooting for getting Ko Simpson in Rd 1 -- but would be happy if the best player available when the Bengals draft is Donte Whitner or Jason Allen or Antonio Cromartie.

These good 40 times by the DB may be a real blessing -- the Bengals wont waste a first round pick on one of the DT, because there are better players at the DB positions.

I hear you Pap plugging Ko. There's a good chance you'll hit the nail on the head again.

One thing that might be against Ko is whether or not he can handle the SS position in the NFL, particularly the run. To me he looks like a pure FS who could possibly with the straightline speed he has and ball insitincts play zone corner with some man against certain receivers. I'm not sure relying on Madieu as the SS is the way for the Bengals to go. But maybe you see Ko's ability to interchange at safety and play strong different?

I'm following what I believe is Marvin's philosophy -- i.e. the safeties on the Bengals are interchangeable.

Ko has shown me he can tackle and make the play on the passes.

I really like the idea of Madieu and Ko flying around in our defensive backfield making plays.

I'm not as convinced about Ko as I was Pollack -- but they are both playmakers.

I believe this year there are several safeties that could significantly improve the Bengals.

[cover2]

I'm with you with Ko. The guy can tackle and cover, fluid hips, good enough speed and no history of injuries....a player. He is a can't miss!

[ArmyBengal]

OK, back on topic about a CB. Got this from KFFL.

We've talked about Hester, but HOLY HELL, look at that time...

NCAA | Hester blazes in the 40

Sat, 4 Mar 2006 14:42:44 -0800

The Associated Press reports Miami CB Devin Hester ran a stunning time of 4.27 seconds in the 40-yard dash at Miami's timing day for all 32 NFL teams Saturday, March 4. He ran a 4.41 at the Indianapolis combine last month, finishing a disappointing ninth among defensive backs. Switching from an indoor surface to an outdoor field likely helped Hester.

WHODEY !!!

[Whur CHad At?]

OK, back on topic about a CB. Got this from KFFL.

We've talked about Hester, but HOLY HELL, look at that time...

NCAA | Hester blazes in the 40

Sat, 4 Mar 2006 14:42:44 -0800

The Associated Press reports Miami CB Devin Hester ran a stunning time of 4.27 seconds in the 40-yard dash at Miami's timing day for all 32 NFL teams Saturday, March 4. He ran a 4.41 at the Indianapolis combine last month, finishing a disappointing ninth among defensive backs. Switching from an indoor surface to an outdoor field likely helped Hester.

WHODEY !!!

WOW We def. need to take this guy. Indoor or outdoor this guy is electrifying! He could be a Pro Bowl ST PR his first year. Wow a 4.27 is something that you cannot pass on!

[cover2]

God I love that photo of Amanda Beard!

[TJJackson]

If drafted, Hester would also have to play corner for us at some point, and I do not think he's the guy you want back there on defensive downs.

[schweinhart]

The Hester Pro Day time is on this thread too.

Like posted on another thread, Gil Brandt had Hester clocked at 4.32 at the Pro Day and the Canes CB Hester couldn't beat out to get on the field -- Marcus Maxey -- clocked at 4.42.

This draft is loaded with speed at CB, but Hester is definitely above the pack as a returner.

[TJJackson]

I'd rather have a 4.42 guy who can cover/tackle than a 4.32 guy who can't do either nearly as well :-)

That said, I recognize the need for a new PR, as Keiwan just ain't gettin it done.....but that player in my mind has to ALSO compete for a spot on defensive or offensive snaps as well. I'm not sure Hester would be a viable alternative as a DB on this team. He's got the speed, yes, but the rest is in my mind in question.

[schweinhart]

There's other D-backs who can return but none better than Hester.

Couple others with some upside would be Danieal Manning and Justin Phinisee. Manning probably takes a 3rd or 4th round pick. Phinisee would be a late Day 2 pick or rookie free agent. Hard to imagine either being as uneventful as Keiwan has turned out to be as a returner (and DB for that matter).