A General Observation

[membengal]

There has been a lot of hand wringing over how appropriate it is to be excited about the team/how high to get hopes up...which is really silly in my estimation. Even in the decade of despair, you could work up hope and excitement in June/July, even if you knew it was whistling in the dark. Hope and excitement is part and parcel of being a fan. It's perfectly OK to be hopeful and excited about this team in any circumstances anytime, but it's nice to have that hope and excitement bolstered this time around with signs that things are a little better and the future is looking brighter.

Observation #2, people seem concerned that the football community in general is saying nice things about the Bengals? Why be concerned over that? For my part, it is a massive relief to pick up preview mags etc. and NOT have the Bengals be the designated way station for sarcastic comments. If the general football community sees the strides we have all been seeing, that is nice to read. It helps to support the notion that hopes and expectations are not simply whistling in the dark this time around. That leads to...

Observation #3. Inevitably, when people are discussing what next year will bring, someone often writes something like "well, we have not seen it yet" as a way of arguing against optimistic projections/expectations for the D/Palmer/whoever. That's true, we have not seen it yet. That does not stop the hypothesizing from being fun, however. As with all things, until the rubber meets the road, it is all conjecture. The proving ground is NFL stadiums starting the second weekend of September, everything before then is talk. Which is fine.

The fact is, the team's play in the past two years coupled with some of the changes made and additions of this past off-season has given us all reason to hope. That includes the team itself. I cannot wait to see how it plays out and am thankful they have made it so I am genuinely looking forward to football without flinching in fear. I am also heartened that some of the more vehement disagreements on this board of late have had to do with the tail end of the roster and roster fights for 5th/6th positions on units. That's a nice place to be for a change---a helluva lot better than what we are used to worrying about.

One month 'til camp opens. Cannot wait.

[derekshank]

Observation #2, people seem concerned that the football community in general is saying nice things about the Bengals? Why be concerned over that? For my part, it is a massive relief to pick up preview mags etc. and NOT have the Bengals be the designated way station for sarcastic comments. If the general football community sees the strides we have all been seeing, that is nice to read. It helps to support the notion that hopes and expectations are not simply whistling in the dark this time around.

I couldn't agree with you more on this one. People are worried that because we are getting some respect, we're not going to sneak up on anyone. Does anyone actually believe that coaches from opposing teams care one bit what the media thinks about the Bengals? They have all the game footage they need to study, so there will be no sneaking up an anyone anyway, regardless of what fantasy football magazines say.

The only people we have a chance of sneaking up on are fans of other teams that don't care about the Bengals. Who cares? They aren't the ones preparing to play on Sundays, so it has no impact on the outcomes of any games.

There will be no head coaches looking past the Browns or 49ers in the NFL, let alone the Bengals. That's why there is a saying "Any given Sunday" nothing to fear here.

[ArmyBengal]

Being the long time Bengal fan I am, I feel what you are speaking of in regards to being optimistic. I love looking forward to the possibility of the ever elusive winning season and God forbid, the playoffs. Am I concerned about the nice things being said ?? No, but what does concern me is the fact that the youth of this team has yet another thing to be concerned with and that would be the expectations to make it to the playoffs and even the Superbowl.

I would hate to see the youngsters crushed going into their first season with expectations of playoffs only to finish 7-9. I don't think 7-9 is going to happen personally, but then again, "Any Given Sunday" things can happen.

I'm not trying to argue why they won't be good this year, just trying to keep things level headed. I personally think they will be much improved this year, but have to be slightly reserved before saying the two new "rookies" on D are the answer to all of our prayers. Which leads me to say again, when we show we are better than what level we have played at, then we will be better than the teams in the AFCN.

I think alot of this will be coaching controlled, but it is quite the task the coaches have this year of keeping the team focused on their goals and not let them lose that focus as the season goes on. Just my two cents...

Oh yeah, when the run D shows that they won't get ran the F**K over and give up 130 yards on the ground each week, then I'll feel comfortable. Forgive the concern if I'm the only one without a warm and fuzzy about the run D...

WHODEY !!!

[HoosierCat]

There has been a lot of hand wringing over how appropriate it is to be excited about the team/how high to get hopes up...which is really silly in my estimation.

Of course it's really silly.

However, it isn't nearly as silly as what will happen around here if they pull one of their patented 0-3, 0-4, 1-5 type of starts.

In such a case, feel free to volunteer for the "temporary moderator corps," as we will need everyone we can get to deal with the 8,907,452,116 posts entitled "F**K YOU BUNGLES SUCK MIKE F**KING BROWN CAN KISS MY A** I'M NEVER GOING TO A GAME AGAIN AND i'M BURNING ME F88KING SEASON TICKETS."

[membengal]

There has been a lot of hand wringing over how appropriate it is to be excited about the team/how high to get hopes up...which is really silly in my estimation.

Of course it's really silly.

However, it isn't nearly as silly as what will happen around here if they pull one of their patented 0-3, 0-4, 1-5 type of starts.

In such a case, feel free to volunteer for the "temporary moderator corps," as we will need everyone we can get to deal with the 8,907,452,116 posts entitled "F**K YOU BUNGLES SUCK MIKE F**KING BROWN CAN KISS MY A** I'M NEVER GOING TO A GAME AGAIN AND i'M BURNING ME F88KING SEASON TICKETS."

Yeah, but you cannot forget to enjoy the moment as you worry about the future. If we get off to a slow start, yup, it will be pretty ugly. But hand-wringing now won't change that.

1. Expectations are rather high, but they should be. Part of that is a cue taken from ML himself.

2. If expectations are not met, people will be upset, amplified by 14 years of frustration. Nothing surprising about that. ML is well aware of the stakes at least, and is doing everything in his power to get this team off to a good start. That is where I hang my hope, anyway.

[HoosierCat]

If we get off to a slow start, yup, it will be pretty ugly. But hand-wringing now won't change that.

Neither will pie-eyed blather that ignores obvious weakness in the team. Show me a man who thinks wishin'-hopin'-praying' is a viable strategy for success (and counting on two rookies and one aging DT FA singing to jump your run D out of the high 20s certainly qualifies in my book) and I'll show you a man I'll take for another case of Corona this year...

...or maybe that bottle of kick-a** scotch...what's say, Hair...?

[membengal]

If we get off to a slow start, yup, it will be pretty ugly. But hand-wringing now won't change that.

Neither will pie-eyed blather that ignores obvious weakness in the team. Show me a man who thinks wishin'-hopin'-praying' is a viable strategy for success (and counting on two rookies and one aging DT FA singing to jump your run D out of the high 20s certainly qualifies in my book) and I'll show you a man I'll take for another case of Corona this year...

...or maybe that bottle of kick-a** scotch...what's say, Hair...?

Let people be pie-eyed. It's fun for them. Most of the level-headed people have them pegged for around 10 wins. I have them at 10-6 in my mind's eye. My standard on whether the year is a success or failure will start with 10 wins. I see a lot in place that makes that reasonable. If they don't reach it, there will be plenty of time for blame assigning etc. later.

Defense is, of course, an unknown. It could trip them up. Until we see it grow as a unit, it's a worry. Doesn't mean that it is crazy to think it might be much improved.

Carson is, of course, a worry. We have not seen it over 16 games, and are hoping that the flash we saw in the last six before he got hurt is where he will pick back up. Doesn't mean it is crazy to suspect he will pick right up there, but it's something to keep an eye on.

Beyond those two areas, there is a lot to feel pretty good about on this team. Even with those two question areas, there is still a lot to feel pretty good about, hence the general good tidings from national experts and the general expectations of around 10 wins.

And, joisey, if you ever need an extra mod, don't be afraid to ask DPM... (insert smiley icon here)

[HoosierCat]

Let people be pie-eyed.

Let people? Who can stop them? Show me anyone who has been dissuaded from their ardor for the team this year by mine, or anyone else's, comments, and I'll show you someone who was never that crazy about their chances to begin with.

The pie has never been "eye-er" than it has been this year, at least not in the last 15 or so years. I sincerely doubt that any reservations I or anyone else might express could prevent the vast majority of fans from grabbing a big slice, lathering on the whipped cream, and diving in. Indeed, judging by the talk of a 10, 11, 12, etc. win season, the "easy" schedule, and the widespread confidence in what IMHO are some very dubious defensive "improvements," I would say that Sara Lee is making a killing among Cincy fans these days!

So I really don't see what your concern is, except possibly a general annoyance that not everyone is full of pie.

Me, I'm not big on pie. I'm more of a parfait guy. Everybody like parfait...

[schweinhart]

Oh yeah, when the run D shows that they won't get ran the F**K over and give up 130 yards on the ground each week, then I'll feel comfortable. Forgive the concern if I'm the only one without a warm and fuzzy about the run D...

WHODEY !!!

Same here.

Won't be convinced the DE switcheroo, adding Robinson, moving Thornton to RDT, and the rooks at LB are the answer until it happens in real time.

But the multiple looks the front 7 or 8 should be able to give does sound promising.

[HairOnFire]

...what's say, Hair...?

Huh?

Sorry, I guess I was napping and didn't notice that someone was poking me with a stick.

((Shrug))

Well, now that I'm up...did somebody say something about a bet? Because if they did I'm in even though I haven't got a clue what this thread is supposed to be about.

Oh yeah, pie.

Well, okay then. I like pie.

In fact, several years ago I actually killed a waitress over a piece of pie. As it turned out she had gotten everyones order wrong and as a result gave the last piece of pie to some other guy before serving me what looked like a parfait treat.

So I gutted her with a coffee stirrer.

Why murder a waitress over pie, you may ask?

Well, mostly because I don't like parfait, and I don't trust the people who eat it.

Moving on, in regards to the other points made in this thread...I'd say that this is the first time in my long message board history where I've happily thrown off the cloak of Bengal negativity and fully embraced pie-eyed optimism.

Seriously, it's never happened before.

So what brought about the change?

Well, I admit the pie-eyed optimism may be a bit premature, but I figured what the heck...why shouldn't I act like a fan of a normal team?

[membengal]

...what's say, Hair...?

Moving on, in regards to the other points made in this thread...I'd say that this is the first time in my long message board history where I've happily thrown off the cloak of Bengal negativity and fully embraced pie-eyed optimism.

Seriously, it's never happened before.

So what brought about the change?

Well, I admit the pie-eyed optimism may be a bit premature, but I figured what the heck...why shouldn't I act like a fan of a normal team?

Eggs-actly.

Even the Walterboyz nod in approval...

[HoosierCat]

Moving on, in regards to the other points made in this thread...I'd say that this is the first time in my long message board history where I've happily thrown off the cloak of Bengal negativity and fully embraced pie-eyed optimism.

Seriously, it's never happened before.

Oh, come now. I distinctly remember you diving deep into the Kool-Aid back in '01, just after the Bengals beat the Ravens to start 2-0. We had "turned the corner," you enthusiastically declared -- an assessment which sadly proved premature. And then, of course, there was 2002, when a putrid Bengals squad so throughly crushed your hopes that you declared a self-imposed posting ban (I think you managed to last about 3 weeks). Heck, it took years for me to drag out of you a concession that Mike Brown (by creating, to use your words, a "toxic work atmosphere") may have contributed in some small part to the horrors of the Nineties.

No, amigo, you have been, and remain, many things, ranging from insightful to funny to (of course) a butthead -- but the cloak of negativity has never wrapped itself around your shoulders. Mostly, of course, because it's long been firmly planted on mine. But that's what makes our discussions so fun.

Hopefully, this season I can hang the damn thing in the closet for good. :player:

[HairOnFire]

Oh, come now. I distinctly remember you diving deep into the Kool-Aid back in '01, just after the Bengals beat the Ravens to start 2-0. We had "turned the corner," you enthusiastically declared -- an assessment which sadly proved premature. And then, of course, there was 2002, when a putrid Bengals squad so throughly crushed your hopes that you declared a self-imposed posting ban (I think you managed to last about 3 weeks).

Well, you have the advantage over me due to the fact that you actually read and remember what I've written. I can't seem to do that...mostly because I consider myself to be such a headcase that I long ago put myself on my own ignore list.

Sadly, I don't recall making the 2001 "turning the corner" remark or the context in which it might have been uttered. If I were to guess it probably had something to do with Takeo picking off Elvis Grbac, an event that triggered a brief period of mass hysteria in my pants. In fact, I probably made the turning the corner remark in a moment of pure Kantou-ism.

It happens. Suffice to say that I've been proven wrong more than once and I'm sure it'll happen again. So if you don't mind let's just assume that I was very drunk or incredibly high when I wrote those words. Possibly both.

As for 2002, I remember very well what prompted my self imposed posting ban and it wasn't a case of crushed optimism. No, I'm dead certain I began that season deep in negativity after predicting a mediocre 6 win season, and that was under my best case scenario. In fact, I think I was down for just 4 wins on the most official of prediction threads. After watching the Bengals implode against Atlanta on national television I decided that I'd step away for awhile if the Bengals didn't make an immediate change at head coach during the bye week. They didn't, so I spent my Sundays getting high and surfing naked until much later in the season. And even then I returned only when the Bengals hiring of a new coach had become a foregone conclusion.

All things considered my previous behavior hardly seems like examples of pie-eyed optimism to me, but I realize it may appear that way to someone whose blanket has always been far wetter than my own. That said, it's a brave new day and I believe strongly that this team has finally turned the corner, and if you're asking...Yes, I do believe I'll have another piece of pie.

[HoosierCat]

Well, you have the advantage over me due to the fact that you actually read and remember what I've written. I can't seem to do that...mostly because I consider myself to be such a headcase that I long ago put myself on my own ignore list.

I like that idea.

In fact, I probably made the turning the corner remark in a moment of pure Kantou-ism.

Whoa! Now there's a blast from the past. Good ol' kantou...

I was very drunk or incredibly high when I wrote those words. Possibly both.

We need to get together one of these days...

That said, it's a brave new day and I believe strongly that this team has finally turned the corner, and if you're asking...Yes, I do believe I'll have another piece of pie.

I hope you're right, I really do. All I'm waiting to see is if another year of big talk translates to something more than big disappointment in September.